What do you love and not love seeing when playing a foundry mission?

onlyslightlybent · October 2013

On feedback after creating a foundry mission, people find it annoying when there are lots of load screens with very little to do in the map.

What are some things you enjoy seeing and don't enjoy while playing a foundry mission?

adverbero · October 2013

Are we talking just tech or the story too?

One thing i really love is creative map design, Yesterday i played Avenging Resolution, and i saw a wonderful set of Glass Stairs which i thought was great

one thing i don't like is default mob names on Enemies, Like 'starfleet Ensign 1' i like custom stuff personally

Another is too many map changes too close , One trick i do like is the warp effect to make two maps in one go

zorbane · October 2013

Like adverbero I am also a big fan of awesome map design. ajstoner (the author of Avenging Resolution) is IMO one of the best at that.

One of the things I don't like is seeing is the "Kill x number of npcs" objectives when it doesn't really fit the storyline.

An example of this would be if the storyline wants you to get to the transporter room to emergency beam out. Why do I have to kill everyone on the map, can't I make a bee-line straight there?

An example where this is OK would be "retake the ship" where you obviously have to kill everyone.

donperk · October 2013

Here's my list of good things in descending order of importance:

A story that is actually a story. That means it has a reason for being, some basic conflict between characters that drives the plot and continuity. I don't mind a story that starts in one place and takes a major left turn (or two) as long as the turns flow logically and give me a good ride.
Dialogue that is "real" -- that reads like something that a character would actually say out loud. If a Foundry mission reads like a good play, then I'm a happy camper.
Detailed, interesting map designs. Not every map has to be cluttered, but I like seeing maps that look lived-in.
Maps that have LIFE! Beyond being lived-in, it's nice to see ships and people moving around, doing things appropriate to the situation.
NAMED NPCs AND SHIPS! I love seeing that level of care. Plus it makes the mission more interesting and immersive.
Combat that flows from and is part of the story. I like that moment of "He did me wrong -- I'm going to stun him until his own mother doesn't recognize him!"
Dialogue choices (and follow-on responses) that let me feel I'm driving the story to some degree. I like being able to have the choice between a respectful response or a disrespectful one. I like when my character can express frustration or dedication. And if there's a chance to be a bit snarky, I'm going to take it.

drogyn1701 · October 2013

What I love is when all of the elements of a good mission happen at once. When you have good writing, good map design, good combat, all the technical stuff works, etc. When all that comes together and you really stop thinking about each individual element and just play. That's what I love. Lots of missions are very good, but a great mission to me is one that evokes that feeling.

isthisscience · October 2013

I have lots of pet peeves, like too many map transitions, assumptions about the character and so on that I'd mark down on. I like to see a well designed map and for SPG to be clear but that doesn't adjust my rating much unless it is really really impressive or really really bad. When there is an issue that is easy to circumvent, it irritates me though. If it is harder to circumvent then I am more understanding. Having Fed boffs speak in an un-Starfleet manner, or reducing the number of small maps, is easy to mitigate. A massive foundry limitation in your way is not.

My main positive is a well thought out and original story. I love to see creativity (not just in story of course) and NPCs with an emphasis on the C. You can have all the fancy tech and perfect spelling you like but if the story is bare bones shooting then why am I playing it?

erei1 · October 2013

I can't say what I really like... I don't expect anything, so if it's good, I'll like it. I'll just say what I don't like, since it's a lot easier.

-I don't like when the authors "force" my character with a past life. Like "hey, I'm your friend from the Academy!".
-Having my female char called "he".
-Having my alien char being treated as a Human.
->pro tip, not every char that will play the mission will be the average human male.

-I don't like having some personal choices done for me. For example, I remember a mission where the only answer I had for a dialogue was "My God !". In an agnostic Universe, using a Betazoid, it felt really wrong.

As you can see, you can do whatever you want with the story, but how I play my characters, the way I want to answer, and deal with a situation, is my problem. A great author, IMO, will build the story, and let YOU play it. A mission I will not like will be a mission I'll play like a movie, while I'm powerless to interact with the plot.
I don't mind generic answers, but please, no religion/political/gender/whatever choices done for me.

turbomagnus · October 2013

Pretty much the same as everyone else.

A while back, I played a Foundry mission where the plot basically had my captain as a naive and easily-manipulated fool instead of a naturally-suspicious and distrustful type, which is my typical characterisation - end result, spent half the time playing the mission muttering about how it was out of character and any idiot could see something was a trap.

I don't like missions where there seems to be enemies just for the sake of having enemies, or just as bad; Dreadnought and Battleship-level ships and Captain-level NPCs pulling routine patrol or guard duty...

Missions with good storylines or where you can influence the flow of the mission are always good. I still remember laughing like mad when I discovered that the 'classified documents' I had been sent to retrieve were blackmail material on the officer who had given the mission.

And a personal pet peeve - 'series' missions that aren't marked as such can be annoying. Ones where you start playing what you think is a standard Foundry mission only to discover that it takes place after another mission you never played, so you have no idea what's going on...

zorbane · October 2013

turbomagnus wrote: »

...

I don't like missions where there seems to be enemies just for the sake of having enemies, or just as bad; Dreadnought and Battleship-level ships and Captain-level NPCs pulling routine patrol or guard duty...

...

Ohh yes this is a pet peeve of mine too (more to the ground than space)

isthisscience · October 2013

erei1 wrote: »

-Having my female char called "he".
-Having my alien char being treated as a Human.
->pro tip, not every char that will play the mission will be the average human male.

And where there is a gender choice, don't tie it into sexuality. Just because you're picking one gender's pronouns, doesn't mean your character is interested in the other gender. Best to avoid all of this full stop. But the best ones are where you have full options for everything, including Vulcan and Tellerite choices etc. But that is a lot of work. IMHO, worth it if you're prepared to put the time in and the story can take it.

erei1 wrote: »

-I don't like having some personal choices done for me. For example, I remember a mission where the only answer I had for a dialogue was "My God !". In an agnostic Universe, using a Betazoid, it felt really wrong.

It is a turn of phrase. I'm atheist and I say it. The English language is full of references to thinks you do not intend to make.

But generally with your point, yes. But with caveats. As a starfleet officer you went to the academy and there you likely had friends. You have some kind of backstory and referencing someone from your past (given warning that this is in the episode) is not a bad thing in itself, if done properly. It can involve your character quite well if done correctly, add a bond between you and the NPC that would be hard to establish from scratch. But you can't make it too close and you can't assume too much about what the player likes in another person.

alan171717 · October 2013

donperk wrote: »

Here's my list of good things in descending order of importance:

A story that is actually a story. That means it has a reason for being, some basic conflict between characters that drives the plot and continuity. I don't mind a story that starts in one place and takes a major left turn (or two) as long as the turns flow logically and give me a good ride.

Dialogue that is "real" -- that reads like something that a character would actually say out loud. If a Foundry mission reads like a good play, then I'm a happy camper.

Detailed, interesting map designs. Not every map has to be cluttered, but I like seeing maps that look lived-in.

Maps that have LIFE! Beyond being lived-in, it's nice to see ships and people moving around, doing things appropriate to the situation.

NAMED NPCs AND SHIPS! I love seeing that level of care. Plus it makes the mission more interesting and immersive.

Combat that flows from and is part of the story. I like that moment of "He did me wrong -- I'm going to stun him until his own mother doesn't recognize him!"

Dialogue choices (and follow-on responses) that let me feel I'm driving the story to some degree. I like being able to have the choice between a respectful response or a disrespectful one. I like when my character can express frustration or dedication. And if there's a chance to be a bit snarky, I'm going to take it.

I love all these things

Mind if I use this as a checklist for my mission I am making?

adverbero · October 2013

i don't mind having old acadamy freinds, but don't as long as i don't have to have been best freinds forever with them

Another peave might be Lovers, course i like options , one mission had me choose an option where its my rival at the acadamy which was cool

donperk · October 2013

adverbero wrote: »

Another peave might be Lovers, course i like options , one mission had me choose an option where its my rival at the acadamy which was cool

I'm guilty of the forced romance angle and knew some people wouldn't like it -- though I don't believe I pushed it too hard and was mainly using it for comic relief. I agree,though, that it should be avoided if possible and have been irritated by not being able to rebuff an advance.

turbomagnus · October 2013

There was one mission I remember that played the 'lovers' angle well with a ship from an alternate universe; one of the officers on board had been involved with your counterpart and you could play up similarities between you and your counterpart or be an entirely different kind of person, each resulting in different reactions from the AU ship's officer.

markhawkman · October 2013

Yeah, I don't like stories that delve into the history of my character.... mainly because I play oddball characters and a lot of them would make no sense at all.

Now what Isthisscience did in "Rose tinted mirror" was really cool. Mainly because it was an alternate universe. Even so it was problematic due to the strange nature of some of my chars.... Also that story assumed your char was male.

since people are wondering...

Melati Kusumu; fed eng, female Orion/Kriosian
Beltran; kdf tac, male Orion
Meghan Eridian; fed sci, female Mirror Universe Vorta
Chuft; fed tac, male Kzinti
Drexela; fed eng, female Lib Borg Joined Trill
7 of 13; fed tac, male Lib Borg T-888
Monica Rappaccini; fed eng, female Human, with a few non-Borg cybernetics(this is the char I played rose Tinted Mirror with)
Carnlan Rixx; fed sci, male Bolian
Sekkoth; fed tac, male Romulan/Vulcan
Diaula; RRF sci, female Romulan
Emani; RRK eng, female Lib Borg Romulan
Soheth; RRF tac, female alien

Good luck doing a story that doesn't conflict with the backstory of at least one of them. :P

adverbero · October 2013

you oddballs, always throwing a spanner in the works!

Still it inspires me to have some more unusual character considorations which is nice

waaagh951 · November 2013

donperk wrote: »

I'm guilty of the forced romance angle and knew some people wouldn't like it -- though I don't believe I pushed it too hard and was mainly using it for comic relief. I agree,though, that it should be avoided if possible and have been irritated by not being able to rebuff an advance.

same here on the Redeem and plauge series. i might redo that entire group of missions when i got enought knowledge to do it correct( forget that. they can't be redon.- the story of the entire plauge and redeem series have top be redone.
also planning a new group where poeple won't be forced. all missions are planning on going into the same mission i am already making. now what do i want in a great mission
a story that really pulls you in. anything else?
a good fight when needed.
no grinding missions.
i think i covered all now

paxfederatica · November 2013

erei1 wrote: »

-I don't like having some personal choices done for me. For example, I remember a mission where the only answer I had for a dialogue was "My God !". In an agnostic Universe, using a Betazoid, it felt really wrong.

isthisscience wrote: »

It is a turn of phrase. I'm atheist and I say it. The English language is full of references to thinks you do not intend to make.

It still doesn't make sense for certain races to say it. The Bajorans, in particular, come to mind, as they worship the Prophets rather than a single deity. They wouldn't say "My God", as they surely have their own equivalent turn of phrase to reflect that fact. (Even so, I know of at least two instances where this mistake was made in TV episodes.)

I use "Great Bird[!]" as a catch-all substitute for this sort of thing in my missions - referring, of course, to Gene Roddenberry, aka "The Great Bird of the Galaxy".

odyssey47 · November 2013

I think it's difficult to have it both ways. There's not very many good stories that can be had without taking some liberties with your character's life story. I plan to label my foundry missions as holonovels, so your character is playing a character.

My pet peeve is dialogue that is all exposition. Some missions I've played every dialogue box was exposition. It needs to read like a real conversation with personality. I get bored quickly when it is like that and I won't bother to read the rest of the mission but I'll continue checking out the map design, etc.

amahood · November 2013

onlyslightlybent wrote: »

On feedback after creating a foundry mission, people find it annoying when there are lots of load screens with very little to do in the map.

What are some things you enjoy seeing and don't enjoy while playing a foundry mission?

I'd say what I find annoying more than anything, is when the mission takes 2 hours.

I also don't like alot of maps,(though with some stories, you can't help it, and I understand that.)

And one other thing I find annoying, is lots and lots of 'leg work'. Meaning, lots of investigating without battle or story, such as, having to use ten different computers, walking around many areas , then using more computers, without doing anything but that sort of thing without any fighting Or advancement of story.

YET having said that, everyone's creation is their own, and all that matters is that the creator enjoys what they created. If others do as well, so be it, if not, so what . LOL

All that matters is that the creator has fun! and if others do as well, awesome! if not, there's alot of others to choose from.

odyssey47 wrote: »

My pet peeve is dialogue that is all exposition. Some missions I've played every dialogue box was exposition. It needs to read like a real conversation with personality. I get bored quickly when it is like that

we-he-he-hell you should try my missions, on either the kdf or fed, (once they're all up, whenever that will be since the new seasons screwed things up). my missions have ALOT of wild emotional dialogue (making many people not like it, my dialogue is un-startrek like LOL). Yet if your lookin for drama in dialogue, just try 'amahood' in author search area of foundry.

I'd have to say 'long lost friend 3' has alot of emotion, and 'bloodthirsty enemies' and my new 'time twister'.

borrowedtune · November 2013

markhawkman wrote: »

Yeah, I don't like stories that delve into the history of my character.... mainly because I play oddball characters and a lot of them would make no sense at all.

Now what Isthisscience did in "Rose tinted mirror" was really cool. Mainly because it was an alternate universe. Even so it was problematic due to the strange nature of some of my chars.... Also that story assumed your char was male.

since people are wondering...

Melati Kusumu; fed eng, female Orion/Kriosian
Beltran; kdf tac, male Orion
Meghan Eridian; fed sci, female Mirror Universe Vorta
Chuft; fed tac, male Kzinti
Drexela; fed eng, female Lib Borg Joined Trill
7 of 13; fed tac, male Lib Borg T-888
Monica Rappaccini; fed eng, female Human, with a few non-Borg cybernetics(this is the char I played rose Tinted Mirror with)
Carnlan Rixx; fed sci, male Bolian
Sekkoth; fed tac, male Romulan/Vulcan
Diaula; RRF sci, female Romulan
Emani; RRK eng, female Lib Borg Romulan
Soheth; RRF tac, female alien

Good luck doing a story that doesn't conflict with the backstory of at least one of them. :P

Seriously. My main is an alien from a distant world in a parallel universe on the other side of a black hole. The universal translator doesn't work for his language so he must communicate only by interpretive dance. Worse yet, my first officer only speaks in a series of clicks and whistles and my chief engineer is an actual humpback whale. I one star every mission that forces my character or boffs to speak because it totally ruins my immersion.

For the record - not "seriously."

:P

What do you love and not love seeing when playing a foundry mission?

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