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Why are Female NPCs So Oversized in STO?

orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
edited December 2013 in The Art of Star Trek Online
Almost every female NPC I've seen is on average very tall. Just as tall as the male NPCs I'd even say. Granted, not all species of female are shorter than that, and some might be taller, but most are unreasonably tall. It breaks immersion.

Even canonically short female characters are pushing 6 feet, such as Tasha Yar. If memory serves me correctly, she was the shortest of the cast. Yet she's taller than my 'tall' human character.

What gives, STO?
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Comments

  • angrytargangrytarg Member Posts: 11,001 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    "It breaks immersion."
    lFC4bt2.gif
    ^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
    "No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
    "A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
    "That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
  • stf65stf65 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    orangeitis wrote: »
    Even canonically short female characters are pushing 6 feet, such as Tasha Yar. If memory serves me correctly, she was the shortest of the cast. Yet she's taller than my 'tall' human character.
    Denise Crosby is 5'8" tall. Put her in some 1-2" heeled costume boots and she is taller then the average man in the USA. She only looks smaller because she is usually standing next to 6'4" Michael Dorn, who is also 1-2" taller then 6'4"due to the costume boots.
  • doffingcomradedoffingcomrade Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    You're missing a bigger question: Why is *EVERYTHING* in STO oversized?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    stf65 wrote: »
    Denise Crosby is 5'8" tall. Put her in some 1-2" heeled costume boots and she is taller then the average man in the USA. She only looks smaller because she is usually standing next to 6'4" Michael Dorn, who is also 1-2" taller then 6'4"due to the costume boots.
    Oh, good point. :o
    angrytarg wrote: »
    "It breaks immersion."
    For me it does.
  • marikaoniki1marikaoniki1 Member Posts: 85 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Funny thing is, the one character I've completed Sphere of Influence on is so ridiculously tall (by choice) that Worf looks undersized. It's hilarious, he's a good 1-2 heads shorter than her.

    A bit more on topic, though, I've never noticed any of the female NPCs being overly tall, though I suppose I've never seen the Tasha and Worf NPCs side by side, so can't comment on that. Besides, just because they're tall doesn't mean they're "over-sized".
  • marc8219marc8219 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    I never noticed npc's being too tall, main thing I notice is many player females seem to be around 6 1/2 ft or so, most of them are taller then my 5 ft 10 in main. Looks really weird.
    Tala -KDF Tac- House of Beautiful Orions
  • orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    marc8219 wrote: »
    I never noticed npc's being too tall, main thing I notice is many player females seem to be around 6 1/2 ft or so, most of them are taller then my 5 ft 10 in main. Looks really weird.
    The customization window 'height' isn't accurate most of the time, as when you adjust settings like torso and leg length, the height measurements do not change accordingly. Judging by Worf's height in comparison to 'average' settings in torso, head, leg, and foot height, it's way off anyway. It's best to ignore it.

    As for player characters, well IMHO that's up to the players to decide.I personally try to have a variety of tall and short characters.
  • fazemladaiyafazemladaiya Member Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    So the complaint of this thread is that the females are tall, skinny and sexy . . . wait where's the complaint here . . . ?
  • orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Females are supposed to be tall, skinny and sexy . . . wait where's the complaint here . . . ?
    Why do you assume they're "supposed to" be anything? I'm talking biologically... women are on average shorter than men, regardless if tall women are 'sexy' or not.
  • fazemladaiyafazemladaiya Member Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    orangeitis wrote: »
    Why do you assume they're "supposed to" be anything? I'm talking biologically... women are on average shorter than men, regardless if tall women are 'sexy' or not.

    I actually saw my wording and changed my post. We were just typing at the same time, apparently. When I re-read my post it sounded a bit sexist so I changed it to emphasize the humor i was seeing and not making a sexist remark. ~shrug~
  • sch3ff3lsch3ff3l Member Posts: 118 Bug Hunter
    edited October 2013
    :confused:
    i think i have the answer...
    Boots + bad character creation engine... aaand... everything in STO its oversized...
    just go take a good look (A VERY VERY VEEERY GOOD LOOK) at DS9 the DS9 in the series the defiant was able to just fit at the docking ring of the station... and a galaxy class cruiser needed to dock on the pylons... and this was on the series...
    On STO a defiant not just fit on the docking ring but have an enormous loose space an the pylons? well just try to put the neck of a galaxy cruiser there...
    and yes thers to the problem with the character creator were the height of the character dont correspond with the real height cause you can just chage the torso and leg lenght and boom you hava a space giant...
    :cool:

    every thing on STO is oversized besides the ships...who are undersized... anda the interior looks bigger than the ship itself...

    ;)not that really have something wrong with tall women;)
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  • fazemladaiyafazemladaiya Member Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    sch3ff3l wrote: »
    :confused:
    i think i have the answer...
    Boots + bad character creation engine... aaand... everything in STO its oversized...
    just go take a good look (A VERY VERY VEEERY GOOD LOOK) at DS9 the DS9 in the series the defiant was able to just fit at the docking ring of the station... and a galaxy class cruiser needed to dock on the pylons... and this was on the series...
    On STO a defiant not just fit on the docking ring but have an enormous loose space an the pylons? well just try to put the neck of a galaxy cruiser there...
    and yes thers to the problem with the character creator were the height of the character dont correspond with the real height cause you can just chage the torso and leg lenght and boom you hava a space giant...

    every thing on STO is oversized besides the ships...who are undersized... anda the interior looks bigger than the ship itself...

    ;)not that really have something wrong with tall women;)

    . . . . Tardis . . . . The Doctor is in . . . ;)

    This is so true though. With the STO bridges I feel like every starship is, indeed, a Tardis!!!
  • beerxhyperbeerxhyper Member Posts: 676 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    orangeitis wrote: »
    Why do you assume they're "supposed to" be anything? I'm talking biologically... women are on average shorter than men, regardless if tall women are 'sexy' or not.

    wait women are sposed to be shorter then men? uumm my wife my mother my grandmother on both sides of the family want to have a word with ur little man cause my wife is 6ft1in and i'm 5ft11inch ssoo yeah my family is tall lol


  • jodarkriderjodarkrider Member Posts: 2,097 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    So the complaint of this thread is that the females are tall, skinny and sexy . . . wait where's the complaint here . . . ?
    Perhaps not everyone wants to see that distorted "ideal" of a female... I personally prefer more butch/athletic/no-baloon-smuggling ones (read flat & tomboyish), and sadly, we don't get those in STO...

    Really wish the females had more variety in general (ie most costumes look crappy on them, compared to males, as if the females were smuggling balloons underneath their uniforms), and for all I care, let there be a small ones, but don't make it a rule... <.< >.> More variety, less restrictions/limitations. Really. :)
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  • orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    beerxhyper wrote: »
    wait women are sposed to be shorter then men? uumm my wife my mother my grandmother on both sides of the family want to have a word with ur little man cause my wife is 6ft1in and i'm 5ft11inch ssoo yeah my family is tall lol
    Your family does not dictate the average female height compared to the average male height. Sure it's possible for there to be tall women, just unlikely. And to have too many tall women in the galaxy... yeah.
  • alan171717alan171717 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Well, this takes place 400 years in the future, there is no reason they wouldn't be more similar in height

    From what I have observed as I researched human sexual dimorphism for my biology class, is that females and males, as time passes, are becoming more equal in height. The effect is a great deal more prevalent in developed countries as well, and I assume the Federation counts as developed.

    To sum up, I am saying that over the 400 years, our genders became less different
    "I am a travelor of both time and space to be where I have been"
  • fazemladaiyafazemladaiya Member Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Height-wise I could care less,

    But 400 years in the future I WOULD hope people did exercise finally :)
  • orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    alan171717 wrote: »
    Well, this takes place 400 years in the future, there is no reason they wouldn't be more similar in height

    From what I have observed as I researched human sexual dimorphism for my biology class, is that females and males, as time passes, are becoming more equal in height. The effect is a great deal more prevalent in developed countries as well, and I assume the Federation counts as developed.

    To sum up, I am saying that over the 400 years, our genders became less different

    Actually, studies show that IRL, qwe are getting more sexually dimorphic as time passes by. Biologically, at least. And since genetic engineering is frowned upon by the Federation, odds are that growing sexual dimorphism trend will continue.
    Height-wise I could care less,

    But 400 years in the future I WOULD hope people did exercise finally :)
    How much could you care less? :P

    Also, relative height does not reflect fitness levels.
  • alan171717alan171717 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    orangeitis wrote: »
    Actually, studies show that IRL, qwe are getting more sexually dimorphic as time passes by. Biologically, at least. And since genetic engineering is frowned upon by the Federation, odds are that growing sexual dimorphism trend will continue.

    How much could you care less? :P

    Also, relative height does not reflect fitness levels.

    Oh geez
    It worries me that I got a good grade on that now....
    "I am a travelor of both time and space to be where I have been"
  • feiqafeiqa Member Posts: 2,410 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Going to leave real world comparisons out on this one and look at the game.

    Most NPCs are just a handful of models recycled. As noted the height scaler is broken. Assuming the setting is acurate for middle torso and leg lengths, you can get much taller or smaller persons by altering those sliders besides just the height scale alone. Without putting a ruler on my screen as I note heights then look at the variation in torso and leg length I cannot tell you how much variation.
    Sorry, rambling. Anyway, the game was built with a handful of NPC's recycled, they were all set the same and then set loose on us. If they were misbuilt when launched then they will seem a little off on size.

    But they all look tall to me as I run at near bottom height. ;)

    Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
    Network engineers are not ship designers.
    Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
  • tpalelenatpalelena Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    Women and to a lesser extent, men have been becoming taller with better nutrition (and some people in tinfoil hats say growth hormone laced food) .

    People mature faster and grow bigger on a good developed world meal, it seems.

    I think a 1.8m for males and 1.7 for females is a good average for the youth in my country, while the elderly can get much, much shorter.
    Let us wear Swimsuits on Foundry maps or bridges please! I would pay zen for that.
  • fazemladaiyafazemladaiya Member Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    orangeitis wrote: »

    How much could you care less? :P

    Also, relative height does not reflect fitness levels.

    I was referring to other proportions. ;) Height is indeed not a reflection of fitness. I've seen so many beer guts on Starfleet personnel in this game on both genders that it makes me cringe when looking at them donning a uniform ROFL.
    feiqa wrote: »
    Going to leave real world comparisons out on this one and look at the game.

    Game? What is it you refer to as a game? Real world? ~opens Google~
  • centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    I made my captain 5'4. She's hilariously tiny.

    The main thing that bothers me is how all female NPC's look like they were handcrafted by Rob Liefeld.
  • orangeitisorangeitis Member Posts: 5,222 Arc User
    edited October 2013
    alan171717 wrote: »
    Oh geez
    It worries me that I got a good grade on that now....
    Here's a good paper on it. But it's a tl;dr for me, so w/e. :P

    http://www.intercult.su.se/publications/Gustafsson_&_Lindenfors_2009.pdf
  • majortiraomegamajortiraomega Member Posts: 2,214 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    This is the 24th century, there is nothing to stop a female from reaching a taller height than a male. Six foot four inch tall females exist in the real world now, there is no reason to believe a woman cannot attain that height 396 years into the future. Consider this, 120 years ago it was very rare for someone to reach six feet. Now, with better nutrition, humans are taller than they were in the eighteenth century. It's not implausible to believe that future medical advancements will improve our health further. I don't see any problems with the current female height, their overall frame (shoulder complexion, etc.) is still accurate in relation to male frames.
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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I made my captain 5'4. She's hilariously tiny.

    The main thing that bothers me is how all female NPC's look like they were handcrafted by Rob Liefeld.
    Wasp waists, tiny ankles, and huge assets?
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • feiqafeiqa Member Posts: 2,410 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I made my captain 5'4. She's hilariously tiny.

    The main thing that bothers me is how all female NPC's look like they were handcrafted by Rob Liefeld.

    Not quite. I still have trouble finding good hair. :cool:

    Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
    Network engineers are not ship designers.
    Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
  • rooster707rooster707 Member Posts: 901 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    I hadn't really noticed... Mostly because my main character is pretty much taller than everyone. :P
    76561198032353876.png
  • twg042370twg042370 Member Posts: 2,312 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    It's not just the women. I based my Fed's height on the western average and he looks like a Munchkin running around ESD.
    <3
  • centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited November 2013
    Wasp waists, tiny ankles, and huge assets?

    Everyfreakingwhere.
    feiqa wrote: »
    Not quite. I still have trouble finding good hair. :cool:

    True. But I would like to have the height issues fixed first.
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