Redoing the engine for the game really isn't practical. I agree that it would be great to have a more stable and robust backbone to the game with improved gameplay. But while that would be awesome it would also be insanely expensive and time consuming. This isn't a simple task. It would consume virtually all of their programmers time for several years (they don't have a massive team) to do and even when it was ready there would probably be several problems that crop up and it could take a long time to squash all the bugs.
Its kinda hard for a company to justify to their financiers that they are going to put new content on hold (remember that this is a F2P game, new content is how they pay the bills) while they poor resources into creating a new engine. They also hope that all of their players won't get completely bored with the fact that they have little to no new content during this time and have to rely on the promise that sometime in several years it will be great. If it works, then in the end the hardcore players may love all the bug fixes but they were already highly devoted to the game. In addition they might not love the changes (after all they were already hardcore fans they might not want change). Some new players will probably be attracted to it, but unless there are a lot of bells and whistles to attract new players it probably won't really get that many people. And they will probably lose a lot of players who simply got bored with no new content for so long.
From a business perspective it really just makes far more sense to just keep doing what they have been doing. I saw some of their financials a little over a year ago and they were actually doing quite well, I haven't seen any indication that this has changed.
Which makes it a pejorative term. And constitutes an exaggeration, as you implied that it will be the only experience a player will have in the game. Both of these notions are false.
For a lot of people it apparently IS the sole way to experience fun... and apparently for you too...
Are you not people? Are you now and forever an a**hole, who given the tools, WILL use them to your utmost ability to disrupt other players... anyway ans anytime you can?
If, not, then... more hyperbole.
I am Human...
There are no innocent bystanders flying armed ships through a warzone attacking my artificial allies and compatriots. They are enemy combatants and they came looking for battle. I get the satisfaction of providing them that battle. And hopefully, I get a good fight in return. A fight much more interesting and exhilarating than any current AI can provide.
Now you're just grasping straws... really?
Time you should probably be spending on your children anyway. Or doing some charity work. Or watching My Little Pony re-runs (friendship is magic, you know).
Your time is no more precious than mine. So don't waste it by being an ill equipped and unwilling slug, who won't attempt to defend themselves while puttering around a warzone.
It is not that is right... it is the same... so you go play PvP in your arena and I explore some Clusters... where's the Problem?
And see... There's the beast!
I HAVE to equip myself and form my playstyle around YOUR Needs so you can get a party hat when you fight me...
Too late.
You are correct... but no in the way you think...
Gain from you? Apparently nothing.
Of course not... I'm no PvP-Junkie...
No it does not need to be confined in that way. You simply need to be a little more considerate and a lot less greedy, in thinking that any and every PvE element in the game must be accessible on the terms you dictate. There are other people's feelings to consider here, you know?
Your feelings?
We have PvP... just queue yourself in and you can blast as much people as you can... we even have friggin dailies so you can get rewarded for it!
You see... I get your problem...
In the PvP Queue there are only people actually willing AND Equipped to play against you and that is what you don't want!
You want unprepared, unequipped VICTIMS that maybe try to fight you but simply cannot stand a chance...
THAT is the ONLY Reason an Open PvP would be good for some...
YOU hate to loose to people who are as well versed and equipped as you and actually know what is happening!
YOU simply want to go around and gank people, gathering Win after Win against inferior and ill-equipped enemies!
YOU want to ENFORCE YOUR PLAYSTYLE on Everything because you are unable to deal with actual competition!
We have PvE and we have PvP... everyone is able to do whatever he or she wants without being disturbed...
But you know what?
I am able to compromise... make the frontlines (Fed-Kling, Fed-Rom, Kling-Rom) its own sectorblocks and make ONLY THESE Sectorblocks OpenPvP and move all the Frontlinesystems in there.
You can enter these and wait for competition and have the same stuff as now but you would have a "new" battlefield: "Deep Space" for those that got caught up while in transit from one Arena to another...
No one is forced to PvP if unwilling and everyone willing can simply enter the Frontlines and go hunting!
Imho the whole discussion about unrestricted, open PvP is rather tedious, as it won't happen.
For one they don't even have a working instanced PvP-system and haven't worked on it for years now, so by the time they would be ready to implement an outdoor PvP-system, it'll probably be 2099
Secondly, having an established game with only a single PvE realm and turning it into an Eve-style PvP-realm is too risky as that they're ever going to implement it. It could easily result in driving away the majority of their playerbase.
Which makes it a pejorative term. And constitutes an exaggeration, as you implied that it will be the only experience a player will have in the game. Both of these notions are false.
Are you not people? Are you now and forever an a**hole, who given the tools, WILL use them to your utmost ability to disrupt other players... anyway and anytime you can?
If, not, then... more hyperbole.
There are no innocent bystanders flying armed ships through a warzone attacking my artificial allies and compatriots. They are enemy combatants and they came looking for battle. I get the satisfaction of providing them that battle. And hopefully, I get a good fight in return. A fight much more interesting and exhilarating than any current AI can provide.
Time you should probably be spending on your children anyway. Or doing some charity work. Or watching My Little Pony re-runs (friendship is magic, you know).
Your time is no more precious than mine. So don't waste it by being an ill equipped and unwilling slug, who won't attempt to defend themselves while puttering around a warzone.
Too late.
Gain from you? Apparently nothing.
No it does not need to be confined in that way. You simply need to be a little more considerate and a lot less greedy, in thinking that any and every PvE element in the game must be accessible on the terms you dictate. There are other people's feelings to consider here, you know?
Having played some MMOs where there is a PVP server, I can tell you. Yes, People will attack any random player they encounter for no other reason then to mess with them, And some will even brag about it. Is it everyone, no. Heck it might not even be a majority. But the fact remains that if all I am trying to do is complete the next mission in my story arc, having someone randomly attack me because they can is annoy. If you are not good at PvP it is also frustrating as anything, because now you have to effectively start over because the person is most likely more experienced then you.
There is nothing wrong with players wanting a challenge, and yes players will always be better then an AI, no matter how "smart" that AI is. That is what PvP is all about.
But creating an instance where players who do not want to PvP, for whatever reason, have to PvP is bad business. Players who are terrible at PvP or don't want to PvP, will leave. My guess is in droves.
Just pull a ********* and introduce a Wilderness. Deep space, if you will, that can satisfy both sides and in fact could be more Star Trek than you might think.
Allow open PVP (with a mandatory stake required for entry to Deep space that you would lose to your opponent if he destroys you (your destruction putting you back in sector space), thus making it worthwhile for everyone involved) but pack the place with exploration missions (ala Exploration Clusters) that are harder and more unique (possibly the Foundry could be used for this purpose) that reward all kinds of things, ranging from things like all of the currencies (all kinds of marks, dilithium, etc) to all levels of weapons and consoles.
Doing this makes an open PVP area worth traversing for both kinds of players, while also keeping with a Star Trek theme of exploring the unknown, which can both be very rewarding and very dangerous.
For a lot of people it apparently IS the sole way to experience fun... and apparently for you too...
And apparently you're just gonna gloss over the fact that I repudiated your earlier statement concerning hyperbole. Maybe you want to reread the part you quoted and see how your response is irreconcilable with regard to my statement.
I am Human...
No acknowledgement of hyperbole there. So human, but not people? Perhaps you simply believe yourself to be better than everyone else?
Now you're just grasping straws... really?
You asked a question. I challenged your premise and provided an answer. I don't know where you see any grasping. Is it that you simply did not like the answer?
It is not that is right... it is the same... so you go play PvP in your arena and I explore some Clusters... where's the Problem?
Okay. Slow down and get all your words in order, before hitting the reply button.
Now if, I understand you correctly, the problem here (aside from your apparent inability to acknowledge error) is you dictating where and how I can play with others who wish to play in a similar manner.
And see... There's the beast!
I HAVE to equip myself and form my playstyle around YOUR Needs so you can get a party hat when you fight me...
No you don't. You can not go to where the fighting is. Or you can just not care that you will likely be killed in going.
What kind of junkie needs a fix so badly that they are willing to risk their 10 seconds of respawn time by going into a warzone unprepared?
You are correct... but no in the way you think...
Coy. Hard to argue with coy.
Of course not... I'm no PvP-Junkie...
Of course you're not. You're a PvE junkie. If, there's PvE anywhere, you have to have it. And you have to have it the way that you want it, regardless of the needs or wants of anyone else.
Your feelings?
We have PvP... just queue yourself in and you can blast as much people as you can... we even have friggin dailies so you can get rewarded for it!
You see... I get your problem...
In the PvP Queue there are only people actually willing AND Equipped to play against you and that is what you don't want!
You want unprepared, unequipped VICTIMS that maybe try to fight you but simply cannot stand a chance...
THAT is the ONLY Reason an Open PvP would be good for some...
YOU hate to loose to people who are as well versed and equipped as you and actually know what is happening!
YOU simply want to go around and gank people, gathering Win after Win against inferior and ill-equipped enemies!
YOU want to ENFORCE YOUR PLAYSTYLE on Everything because you are unable to deal with actual competition!
Hyperbole, conjecture, and assumption. You do not know what I want, as I have not stated it here in any detail. You appear to be operating off a set of preconceptions, which seem to me to be largely ill informed.
We have PvE and we have PvP... everyone is able to do whatever he or she wants without being disturbed...
But you know what?
I am able to compromise... make the frontlines (Fed-Kling, Fed-Rom, Kling-Rom) its own sectorblocks and make ONLY THESE Sectorblocks OpenPvP and move all the Frontlinesystems in there.
You can enter these and wait for competition and have the same stuff as now but you would have a "new" battlefield: "Deep Space" for those that got caught up while in transit from one Arena to another...
No one is forced to PvP if unwilling and everyone willing can simply enter the Frontlines and go hunting!
That might be acceptable, with some mechanism of territory control. The devil is always in the details. And considering your lack of candor, details would be required... in writing... with witnesses... and a notary.
PvP should remain in the PvP queues or in specific systems like Ker'rat. No one should be able to see someone in sector space and force a fight on someone.
Once upon a time, "Enemy Signal Contacts" would actually pursue nearby players and suck them into a battle.
People didn't like being dumped into a Red Alert when they were just trying to get from point A to point B. Making progress through the game storyline requires a lot of travel from point A to point B; it was annoying at best. And that was just with NPC's.
Imagine what trying to travel through Sector Space would be like as a low-level character if you're getting dumped into a Red Alert by every troll you try to pass.
There's a reason why we don't have PvP in Sector Space and I'm glad of it. That said, I wouldn't mind having a few areas that were dangerous to travel through, as long as there was another path if you didn't want to take the risk.
Thank you for educating me on that, I didn't know that it was an issue in the beginning.
One day Cryptic will be free from their Perfect World overlord. Until that day comes, they will continue to pamper the whales of this game, and ignore everyone that isn't a whale.
Notice how all the negative comments about PvP are exaggerated hyperbole.
Ever played World of ********? On Emerald Dream server (or any other PVP server for that matter)?
It's not as if this game is super social to begin with (compared to other MMOs) but if people got picked off going from point A to point B like they do in any other game where the PVP is brutal, you'd have a lot of people simply quitting, clamming up, or whining/antagonizing. Forcing people to do something they don't want to do just results in them finding a better pasture to graze in. I like the idea thrown around about some Deep Space kinda thing, that way the option is there for those who want to participate but I do not believe that it should be for everyone all the time. I understand what you're saying too because as a role player it steams my carrots to a certain extent to see so many people that should be hostile just parked around me with no problem. HOWEVER, I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice my own fun or gaming experience or anyone else's for that matter for the sake of it.
I'm all for exploration and diplomacy.
I would love Star Trek Online to feel more Star Trekkie and less generic. I'm also probably the only person here who would love the option of being a member of somebody else's ship rather than the Captain of my own. I wish there was more roleplaying out in the world and I've yet to really see any.
:: reminisces about the old Star Trek AOL Chatrooms ::
This is completely off-topic, but why does this board censor "War-craft"?
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Ever played World of ********? On Emerald Dream server (or any other PVP server for that matter)?
As a matter of fact, I have. I had characters on several WoW RP-PvP servers. I also played the Everquest "Zek" servers. And Eve, Anarchy Online, Dark Age of Camelot... if the game didn't at least promise some PvP, I didn't play it.
It's not as if this game is super social to begin with (compared to other MMOs) but if people got picked off going from point A to point B like they do in any other game where the PVP is brutal, you'd have a lot of people simply quitting, clamming up, or whining/antagonizing.
Understood.
Forcing people to do something they don't want to do just results in them finding a better pasture to graze in.
No one is forced to do anything in an MMO. Playing this or any other game is optional. However, that is a bit harsh. So let's say that traveling through a warzone is optional. I don't want anyone to be forced to PvP, unless they want to access the ancillary PvE content that is within a PvP zone. If, they want to get that, they should have to accept the possibility of PvP being thrust upon them.
I like the idea thrown around about some Deep Space kinda thing, that way the option is there for those who want to participate but I do not believe that it should be for everyone all the time. I understand what you're saying too because as a role player it steams my carrots to a certain extent to see so many people that should be hostile just parked around me with no problem. HOWEVER, I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice my own fun or gaming experience or anyone else's for that matter for the sake of it.
I appreciate that. My point initially in today's posts was that PvP and PvE can coexist within a game. All it takes is a little clear thinking and discussion, without the hyperbole, to devise a system that satisfies reasonable expectations.
I'm all for exploration and diplomacy.
PvP warzones would be an excellent opportunity to exercise the "Diplomatic Immunity" ability.
I would love Star Trek Online to feel more Star Trekkie and less generic. I'm also probably the only person here who would love the option of being a member of somebody else's ship rather than the Captain of my own. I wish there was more roleplaying out in the world and I've yet to really see any.
I sympathize with your desire. It struck me as odd that Cryptic did not establish different servers or instances, which would have catered to different playstyles, such as RP and PvP.
Then again, I find their approach to a number of things rather odd.
:: reminisces about the old Star Trek AOL Chatrooms ::
I hope you find what you are looking for, in this or some other game.
So let's say that traveling through a warzone is optional. I don't want anyone to be forced to PvP, unless they want to access the ancillary PvE content that is within a PvP zone. If, they want to get that, they should have to accept the possibility of PvP being thrust upon them.
Exactly my feeling. I don't have a problem with the idea of mixed PvP/PvE zones as long as you can avoid them if you want. If somebody goes into an area like that (like, say, Ker'rat) then they might want to be ready to be targeted by another player. I don't necessarily believe that PvE rewards on a PvP map have to be accessible to people who aren't willing to risk PvP.
Sector Space is basically a travel/social zone, which is why Open PvP isn't a good idea there. My belief is that any given map in the game is either all PvP-enabled or not, so there's no concept of "hot territory" that can exist in the middle of a non-PvP map. Which unfortunately means there's no way to "go around" to get to normal PvE mission doors that exist on that map.
PvP warzones would be an excellent opportunity to exercise the "Diplomatic Immunity" ability.
Not exactly sure what you're getting at there. If you're thinking to extend the functionality of DI to allow non-combatants to cross a PvP map... what do we do for the KDF who have "Raiding Party"? KDF non-combatants are a bit of an oxymoron in STO IMO, but we do have to allow for the possibility if we allow Feds to opt out. Giving the ability to opt-out of combat to someone who's a "raiding party" just doesn't feel right somehow. Otherwise, I would like the idea.
Maybe, to go with the flavor of the factions, we turn that around... Give KDF the ability to initiate PvP in a warzone (if they have Raiding Party) and Fed the ability to opt-out (If they have Diplomatic Immunity).
"Raiding Party" could allow KDF to initiate PvP combat in certain Open PvP sectors if:
*the target is at least their level and,
*if the target is above a certain minimum level and,
*the target possesses the Diplomatic Immunity ability.
That would prevent high-level characters from ganking low-level characters. If the KDF moves out of range before the Fed enters the arena, the challenge is revoked and the Fed can keep going.
"Diplomatic Immunity" could then be used by Feds to make themselves temporarily immune to the effects of "Raiding Party" with sufficient duration to cross through. Feds with DI would get a button on a dialog "Invoke Diplomatic Immunity". If they press that, they're immune to "Raiding Party" for a few minutes, cannot be challenged for the duration, and they get to continue on their way. Alternatively, they could decide to press "Defend Yourself" to engage immediately or wait for the timer to run out and get dumped into the arena 30 seconds later. If the KDF moves out of range before the Fed enters the arena, the challenge is revoked and the Fed can keep going.
I would like to stress that this idea should only apply as such --
*To designated open PvP sectors that players can choose to bypass somehow.
*That characters below a given minimum level are immune to challenge (let low-level characters get to their mission doors unhindered).
*That this is 1-on-1 Red vs Blue -- no teams and no 5-on-1 dogpiles.
*That Red can choose to opt-out by simply choosing not to initiate a fight.
*That Blue cannot be challenged in the first place if they are lower level than the Red player.
*That only players with "Raiding Party" or "Diplomatic Immunity" can participate (or some other similar opt-in mechanic is in place).
*That "Diplomatic Immunity" prevents the player from being stopped over and over while active.
Something like this would allow consensual PvP in areas where it makes sense to allow it and in accord with the IP and the Dev's Red vs Blue paradigm for factions.
Fleet-on-fleet PvP needs to be handled differently and would need to use a different mechanism.
Either way, we're talking a lot of new tech.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
I googled the term "transition era MMO" and the number one result returned was . . . this thread. So, I don't know who's saying that. If someone else does, you'll have to educate me.
The closest thing I could find is this:
Third generation MMOs were a time of stagnation for the Massively Multiplayer Online Game as companies tried to replicate WoW's success and playing things safe by borrowing liberally from World of ******** and trying to appeal to its customer base. Fans of each new game insisted it should be looked upon as "The WoW Killer." And yet that never happened, because few games truly innovated during this period. Graphics were improved, games were optimized to run on higher-end machines, but the underlying structure of everything was widely similar. Lord of The Rings Online, Tabula Rasa, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes, Age of Conan, ****, Pirates of the Burning Sea, Warhammer Online, Fallen Earth, Champions Online, Star Trek Online, and others filled out the third generation of MMO.
Because this game is so much like WoW?
The same article lists SWTOR as a 4th generation MMO, but that was another widely touted "WoW" killer with classes and such. It's big innovations are apparently story and voice acting. STO already added a storyline similar to it (albeit not fully voiced) with LOR and content is moving more in that direction all the time.
So, I guess that would make it a transition-era one? But it doesn't really need a new engine?
Someone's going to have to define their terms for this thread to make sense.
I googled the term "transition era MMO" and the number one result returned was . . . this thread. So, I don't know who's saying that. If someone else does, you'll have to educate me.
The closest thing I could find is this:
Because this game is so much like WoW?
The same article lists SWTOR as a 4th generation MMO, but that was another widely touted "WoW" killer with classes and such. It's big innovations are apparently story and voice acting. STO already added a storyline similar to it (albeit not fully voiced) with LOR and content is moving more in that direction all the time.
So, I guess that would make it a transition-era one? But it doesn't really need a new engine?
Someone's going to have to define their terms for this thread to make sense.
Heh...
Seems you kinda-sorta missed that somewhere along the way...
It became a PvP vs PvE thread.
<chuckle>
:cool:
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I've found that around here though..., isn't isn't always so.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
building a new game engine is an extremely costly project for any studio to undertake. Sure Cryptic will need to building a new one, one day. Especially if there current one is reaching it limits. or they could just go and license something like i-novae engine.
As to PVP in sector space, personally I would like more random things to happen why flying through sector, the enterprise could never fly from one planet to another without something happening to them:P, so why should we. But then their people out there that goes to the extreme of purposely attacking people they know don't stand a chance of winning, which ruins the experience for them. May be introduce a mechanic where if you attack someone who can't defend themselves, a fleet of heavily ship arrives to backup the weaker player and to blow you out of the sky:) or may be not. A more fun sector space would be welcome .
I googled the term "transition era MMO" and the number one result returned was . . . this thread. So, I don't know who's saying that. If someone else does, you'll have to educate me.
The same article lists SWTOR as a 4th generation MMO, but that was another widely touted "WoW" killer with classes and such. It's big innovations are apparently story and voice acting. STO already added a storyline similar to it (albeit not fully voiced) with LOR and content is moving more in that direction all the time.
So, I guess that would make it a transition-era one? But it doesn't really need a new engine?
Someone's going to have to define their terms for this thread to make sense.
Basically what a "transition era MMO" is an MMO that doesn't ape WoW. Keep in mind, that when STO first released, Shooter Mode didn't actually exist. So yes. It was much more like WoW when it was first on the market. It has been steadily moving away from that, so yes, it is a "transition era MMO".
Ya know, this whole 'sandbox is the way to go' is a bit contradictory when people also say 'leave the past of mmo's behind and forge ahead'
SANDBOXES are the past... seriously, EVE is one of the only main stream Sandbox mmo's left - TOR, STO, CO, WoW, DCUO - these are some of the most well known MMO's out there. You can find people in the grocery line talking about them... none of them are sandboxes. The new Elder Scrolls mmo in production isn't going to be a sandbox
Beyond the exception of EVE (which, I'm sorry to admit, I STILL can't get into) sandboxes haven't been a viable mmo formula for almost a decade... this game is BASICALLY Starfleet Command 3 with bits of Elite Force I and II tacked on... and it works. It's not perfect - if I don't get some TWOK phasers and a proper Norway class soon I'm going to go crazy :P not to mention the clipping issues on most (if not all) of the Romulan armor... how they didn't test something that was going to be THAT heavily used I'll never know...
It's not perfect, not perfect, but maybe with a little work (and a little less PRAISE TEH SANDBOX GODS TRIBBLE and PVE'ers/PVP'ers suck and are 'insert description'ing the game junk) it can BE something that's 'forged ahead'
Ya know, this whole 'sandbox is the way to go' is a bit contradictory when people also say 'leave the past of mmo's behind and forge ahead'
SANDBOXES are the past... seriously, EVE is one of the only main stream Sandbox mmo's left - TOR, STO, CO, WoW, DCUO - these are some of the most well known MMO's out there. You can find people in the grocery line talking about them... none of them are sandboxes. The new Elder Scrolls mmo in production isn't going to be a sandbox
Beyond the exception of EVE (which, I'm sorry to admit, I STILL can't get into) sandboxes haven't been a viable mmo formula for almost a decade... this game is BASICALLY Starfleet Command 3 with bits of Elite Force I and II tacked on... and it works. It's not perfect - if I don't get some TWOK phasers and a proper Norway class soon I'm going to go crazy :P not to mention the clipping issues on most (if not all) of the Romulan armor... how they didn't test something that was going to be THAT heavily used I'll never know...
It's not perfect, not perfect, but maybe with a little work (and a little less PRAISE TEH SANDBOX GODS TRIBBLE and PVE'ers/PVP'ers suck and are 'insert description'ing the game junk) it can BE something that's 'forged ahead'
The sandbox MMO didn't really work back then, for lots of reasons, biggest one probably being juggernaut of WOW and every MMO player being pissed if the new game wasn't identical to how WOW work. This got so bad that games were launch that were virtual copies of WOW.
I don't think Star Trek or any existing franchise is particularly suitable for a full sandbox game. Races have to act in certain ways to act, there are already existing territories layout and fractions and planets that needs to be in a star trek game.
It likely that whenever Cryptic does upgrade the engine it will likely be an engine capable of build sandbox games, most engines are being push in that direction, and perhaps things like Fleet bases could benefit for more creativity and tools.
An it would be cool to be able to have seamless space to planetside flying.
But there is a new big push by publishers to build sandbox MMOs. Minecraft is the new WOW in this arena, Star citizen and there are others in the work.
The question is will this wave of MMO sandbox games be successful, frankly the first game that combines open play of EVE, but make it fun and not so much you are managing spreadsheets and simple will have a hit on their hands.
I don't think Star Trek or any existing franchise is particularly suitable for a full sandbox game. Races have to act in certain ways to act, there are already existing territories layout and fractions and planets that needs to be in a star trek game.
I've often thought of why an MMO like SWTOR and STO can fail (struggle maybe is a better word?) when a game like EVE does ok. Does part of the reason have something to do with the IP? are games based off of IPs pretty much destined to fail?
If a developer wants to make a sandbox game with spaceships and ground combat and call it "spaceships online" are they more likely to succeed? I dont know too much about the process of how a game gets made. I just know basic terms, i know what some of them do, dont know what some others do and i dont know how some of them relate to one another...terms like dev, publisher or whatever. I know more or less what the devs do, vaguely know what publishers do and i only know a little about who has authority over who.
If EVE online had been based off of Star Trek or Star Wars could they still have succeeded? All the mechanics could have been the same...instead of a Bantam or Antron frigate you're flying a BoP or a Miranda and instead of a Raven or Megathron you are flying a Galaxy or Bortasqu ship. All names are changed to trek versions even for all the little TRIBBLE. If this were so would an EVE online based off of Star Trek be successful? or would the involvement of the IP (and everything that comes with it) have hurt any success that such a game would have had?
EDIT: also when i say successful i mean fun for the player. Not successful as in "profits are up 500% due to C-store sales but number of active users are down 75%"
I've often thought of why an MMO like SWTOR and STO can fail (struggle maybe is a better word?) when a game like EVE does ok. Does part of the reason have something to do with the IP? are games based off of IPs pretty much destined to fail?
If a developer wants to make a sandbox game with spaceships and ground combat and call it "spaceships online" are they more likely to succeed? I dont know too much about the process of how a game gets made. I just know basic terms, i know what some of them do, dont know what some others do and i dont know how some of them relate to one another...terms like dev, publisher or whatever. I know more or less what the devs do, vaguely know what publishers do and i only know a little about who has authority over who.
If EVE online had been based off of Star Trek or Star Wars could they still have succeeded? All the mechanics could have been the same...instead of a Bantam or Antron frigate you're flying a BoP or a Miranda and instead of a Raven or Megathron you are flying a Galaxy or Bortasqu ship. All names are changed to trek versions even for all the little TRIBBLE. If this were so would an EVE online based off of Star Trek be successful? or would the involvement of the IP (and everything that comes with it) have hurt any success that such a game would have had?
Yes, it is the money involved. Star Wars Galaxies was one of the best sandbox MMO's and was shut down, not because it failed, but because the execs demanded it make more money like WoW. They changed it drastically and lost a lot of players trying to mimic WoW, then abandoned it for TOR. If it did not have the IP Star Wars and the ego of LucasArts it would still be around today.
Yes, it is the money involved. Star Wars Galaxies was one of the best sandbox MMO's and was shut down, not because it failed, but because the execs demanded it make more money like WoW. They changed it drastically and lost a lot of players trying to mimic WoW, then abandoned it for TOR. If it did not have the IP Star Wars and the ego of LucasArts it would still be around today.
From what you posted, it sounds like it would have been fine with the Star Wars IP - it seems to me that it was the ego, as you said, that brought about its downfall.
That would be the equivalent here of PWE mucking about with STO much more than they appear to, in an attempt to hammer STO into 'WoW in Space.'
This game would be better if the home worlds were fleshed out and you could exist in the universe with out having to join a faction what if i just wanted to be a pitate in the startrek universe.
all planets need to beable to beam down to maybe not to be forced in to a mission but just to hang out
this game needs to give me the choice to to resign my commission in what ever faction im in and join the klingon or the borg or the bajorans
ship interiors are just instance that get loaded when you visit then why cant they be bigger
why cant i give fleetmate rooms on my ship?
why cant i get a house on DS9 or risa?
why cant i level up my duty officer and have them gain special traits and bounuses for the missions they do?
why cant i take parts form ships that i have bought and beable to create a 100% unique starthip?
Yes, it is the money involved. Star Wars Galaxies was one of the best sandbox MMO's and was shut down, not because it failed, but because the execs demanded it make more money like WoW. They changed it drastically and lost a lot of players trying to mimic WoW, then abandoned it for TOR. If it did not have the IP Star Wars and the ego of LucasArts it would still be around today.
If I recall correctly SWG was shut down not because of money, but because TOR was in development and although the games are set in different time periods they didn't want 2 SW games competing against each other (conflict of interest).
If I recall correctly SWG was shut down not because of money, but because TOR was in development and although the games are set in different time periods they didn't want 2 SW games competing against each other (conflict of interest).
I remember what buccaneer is talking about.
They changed SWG in such a way that talents, classes and all that were made more 'WoW' like. From what i hear SWG used to be really complex, and the changes simplified things. But the change ended up pissing a lot of people off, and a lot of them quit. Here is a short exchange between someone interviewing John Smedley, who from what i can tell was one responsible for the decision to change SWG.
Interviewer: Can you finally come clean about the decisions that were made regarding SWG? Mainly the CU and NGE?
John Smedley: Star Wars Galaxies (SWG) went through 2 major revamps during it's life span. The Combat Upgrade (CU) which completely changed the way combat worked in the game and was met with negative reactions before and after it was released and ultimately led to a massive decline in subs. Most people who loved the game at that point quit.
Then they pushed the New Game Experience (NGE) that again changed the combat and by that time the servers became a ghost town.
SWG was a Massively Multiplayer Online game (MMO) unlike any other and many people were heart broken to see the game they loved be completely changed into something that they hated.
John Smedley: sure. Stupid decisions. Complete and utter fail and I am very sorry.
I agree with the OP, I feel that sandbox will be a good way to allow us to entertain ourselves.
I have always wondered why this game was so "soft" about sector space combat. I honestly thought it would be the battle ground for PVP. If I'm in my JHDC and flying through Beata Ursae, I'd most likely have to fight my way through it against some Federations players/ships in the Sector (or help my fell Jem'hadar attck ship allies fight some federation ships). But if I fly my JHDC through Romulan space (like Alpha Centauri block), I should be fighting my way through a hord of Romulan ships. Since it's their turf, I shouldn't be able to causally cruise right through it. Wouldn't this immersion make the game more challenging? Instead of being so easy to get to point A & B.
I know many won't agree, but it's just an idea. Why keep PVP in a stupid arena when in actuality all of space is a battle ground for PVP? How often did Klingon's cruise through Federation controlled space without someone questioning their presence?
I find this thread interesting, because I feel that the game is stuck in a rut. I think that's because it has no direct STO competition. If their was another Star Trek game out their, this would force Cryptic to "step their game up". I also agree with the comment that they've build so much upon this engine/system that a major change could cause it all to come crashing down and TRIBBLE off a lot of people.
in all honestly a lot of this thread sounds like "lets make STO into EVE" and have nothing but PVP" I can promise you, make a move like that and STO would die a very sudden, horrible death, because 4/5ths of the player base would leave.
one thing that COULD be done to help the game is more content. backstories on some of the BOFFs would be interesting. adding some episodes that give you a choice in the outcome, (and effecting your future) could be done,
for example, you do an episode like operation Gamma, where you get to decide if you kill the ferengi or not. that decision could /should affect your reputation throughout the quadrant. if the choice hurts the klingon empire, why wouldn't klingon NPCs fight harder against you?
And already the EVE comparisons are made. Do you lose the ship? Do you lose the skillpoints? How about consoles, weapons, boffs? No you don't. All you lose is 10 seconds and bragging rights. I wish people would stop comparing 2 completely different games.
Rant aside, you would think PvP would be more prevalent in a game set during a huge KDF/Federation war. It certainly screams territory control and fleet battles to me - kinda like Planetside 2 with spaceships.
Of course, one problem being that due to the overwhelming Federation playerbase the KDF even with their Romulan allies would get stomped in minutes.
Alas, sandbox would be too much of a stretch I think.
I also hear you on the lack of competition. Even with Star Citizen and EVE there is no competition for any of them, they all occupy their own little niche corners.
exactly what are the queues for PVP now? the queues have a long wait.. not because the pipes are full, but because no one is queuing. I'm sure one reason PVP has received no love is because the subscriber bas has not supported it. if the PVP queues had the traffic STF queues do, there would be ad eicated dev team to expanding/improving it.
You won't loose anything like EVE. It'll just be a fight, they can even program it so that you'll have to PVP 3-5 ships before they make you immune from any other PVP fight in that sector. That way win or loose to those 3-5 PVP ships both players will get something from it. They can even drop loot and reward the winner with extra dill, skill points or fleet marks. So that'll make the fight more appealing.
If you're a skilled PVPer then the program will find 3-5 PVPers that's within your bracket and you'll have to fight them off before you get to your destination. Something as simple as that isn't really "Eve" it's reality. Even gang members don't go waltzing through another gang's territory without some conflict arising.
and for the roleplayers who are Vadm and are flying the T2 cruiser or the voyager fanboy would be at the mercy of up to 5 escort jockeys per sector? no thanks.
I saw in sector chat yesterday "only chumps are not in fleets" IMHO, there is absolutely no reason to be IN a fleet unless you want to PVP or have to have the best toys.
same with PVP if I want to PVP I'll join the queue. now if they wanted to add a sector that was PVP oriented, like age of conan did, then that would be fine. don't want to PVP , don't go there. or at least give the player the choice to toggle PVP on and off
Comments
Its kinda hard for a company to justify to their financiers that they are going to put new content on hold (remember that this is a F2P game, new content is how they pay the bills) while they poor resources into creating a new engine. They also hope that all of their players won't get completely bored with the fact that they have little to no new content during this time and have to rely on the promise that sometime in several years it will be great. If it works, then in the end the hardcore players may love all the bug fixes but they were already highly devoted to the game. In addition they might not love the changes (after all they were already hardcore fans they might not want change). Some new players will probably be attracted to it, but unless there are a lot of bells and whistles to attract new players it probably won't really get that many people. And they will probably lose a lot of players who simply got bored with no new content for so long.
From a business perspective it really just makes far more sense to just keep doing what they have been doing. I saw some of their financials a little over a year ago and they were actually doing quite well, I haven't seen any indication that this has changed.
For a lot of people it apparently IS the sole way to experience fun... and apparently for you too...
I am Human...
Now you're just grasping straws... really?
It is not that is right... it is the same... so you go play PvP in your arena and I explore some Clusters... where's the Problem?
And see... There's the beast!
I HAVE to equip myself and form my playstyle around YOUR Needs so you can get a party hat when you fight me...
You are correct... but no in the way you think...
Of course not... I'm no PvP-Junkie...
Your feelings?
We have PvP... just queue yourself in and you can blast as much people as you can... we even have friggin dailies so you can get rewarded for it!
You see... I get your problem...
In the PvP Queue there are only people actually willing AND Equipped to play against you and that is what you don't want!
You want unprepared, unequipped VICTIMS that maybe try to fight you but simply cannot stand a chance...
THAT is the ONLY Reason an Open PvP would be good for some...
YOU hate to loose to people who are as well versed and equipped as you and actually know what is happening!
YOU simply want to go around and gank people, gathering Win after Win against inferior and ill-equipped enemies!
YOU want to ENFORCE YOUR PLAYSTYLE on Everything because you are unable to deal with actual competition!
We have PvE and we have PvP... everyone is able to do whatever he or she wants without being disturbed...
But you know what?
I am able to compromise... make the frontlines (Fed-Kling, Fed-Rom, Kling-Rom) its own sectorblocks and make ONLY THESE Sectorblocks OpenPvP and move all the Frontlinesystems in there.
You can enter these and wait for competition and have the same stuff as now but you would have a "new" battlefield: "Deep Space" for those that got caught up while in transit from one Arena to another...
No one is forced to PvP if unwilling and everyone willing can simply enter the Frontlines and go hunting!
For one they don't even have a working instanced PvP-system and haven't worked on it for years now, so by the time they would be ready to implement an outdoor PvP-system, it'll probably be 2099
Secondly, having an established game with only a single PvE realm and turning it into an Eve-style PvP-realm is too risky as that they're ever going to implement it. It could easily result in driving away the majority of their playerbase.
Having played some MMOs where there is a PVP server, I can tell you. Yes, People will attack any random player they encounter for no other reason then to mess with them, And some will even brag about it. Is it everyone, no. Heck it might not even be a majority. But the fact remains that if all I am trying to do is complete the next mission in my story arc, having someone randomly attack me because they can is annoy. If you are not good at PvP it is also frustrating as anything, because now you have to effectively start over because the person is most likely more experienced then you.
There is nothing wrong with players wanting a challenge, and yes players will always be better then an AI, no matter how "smart" that AI is. That is what PvP is all about.
But creating an instance where players who do not want to PvP, for whatever reason, have to PvP is bad business. Players who are terrible at PvP or don't want to PvP, will leave. My guess is in droves.
Allow open PVP (with a mandatory stake required for entry to Deep space that you would lose to your opponent if he destroys you (your destruction putting you back in sector space), thus making it worthwhile for everyone involved) but pack the place with exploration missions (ala Exploration Clusters) that are harder and more unique (possibly the Foundry could be used for this purpose) that reward all kinds of things, ranging from things like all of the currencies (all kinds of marks, dilithium, etc) to all levels of weapons and consoles.
Doing this makes an open PVP area worth traversing for both kinds of players, while also keeping with a Star Trek theme of exploring the unknown, which can both be very rewarding and very dangerous.
And apparently you're just gonna gloss over the fact that I repudiated your earlier statement concerning hyperbole. Maybe you want to reread the part you quoted and see how your response is irreconcilable with regard to my statement.
No acknowledgement of hyperbole there. So human, but not people? Perhaps you simply believe yourself to be better than everyone else?
You asked a question. I challenged your premise and provided an answer. I don't know where you see any grasping. Is it that you simply did not like the answer?
Okay. Slow down and get all your words in order, before hitting the reply button.
Now if, I understand you correctly, the problem here (aside from your apparent inability to acknowledge error) is you dictating where and how I can play with others who wish to play in a similar manner.
No you don't. You can not go to where the fighting is. Or you can just not care that you will likely be killed in going.
What kind of junkie needs a fix so badly that they are willing to risk their 10 seconds of respawn time by going into a warzone unprepared?
Coy. Hard to argue with coy.
Of course you're not. You're a PvE junkie. If, there's PvE anywhere, you have to have it. And you have to have it the way that you want it, regardless of the needs or wants of anyone else.
Hyperbole, conjecture, and assumption. You do not know what I want, as I have not stated it here in any detail. You appear to be operating off a set of preconceptions, which seem to me to be largely ill informed.
That might be acceptable, with some mechanism of territory control. The devil is always in the details. And considering your lack of candor, details would be required... in writing... with witnesses... and a notary.
Thank you for educating me on that, I didn't know that it was an issue in the beginning.
Ever played World of ********? On Emerald Dream server (or any other PVP server for that matter)?
It's not as if this game is super social to begin with (compared to other MMOs) but if people got picked off going from point A to point B like they do in any other game where the PVP is brutal, you'd have a lot of people simply quitting, clamming up, or whining/antagonizing. Forcing people to do something they don't want to do just results in them finding a better pasture to graze in. I like the idea thrown around about some Deep Space kinda thing, that way the option is there for those who want to participate but I do not believe that it should be for everyone all the time. I understand what you're saying too because as a role player it steams my carrots to a certain extent to see so many people that should be hostile just parked around me with no problem. HOWEVER, I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice my own fun or gaming experience or anyone else's for that matter for the sake of it.
I'm all for exploration and diplomacy.
I would love Star Trek Online to feel more Star Trekkie and less generic. I'm also probably the only person here who would love the option of being a member of somebody else's ship rather than the Captain of my own. I wish there was more roleplaying out in the world and I've yet to really see any.
:: reminisces about the old Star Trek AOL Chatrooms ::
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
Probably to keep people from referencing it?
As a matter of fact, I have. I had characters on several WoW RP-PvP servers. I also played the Everquest "Zek" servers. And Eve, Anarchy Online, Dark Age of Camelot... if the game didn't at least promise some PvP, I didn't play it.
Understood.
No one is forced to do anything in an MMO. Playing this or any other game is optional. However, that is a bit harsh. So let's say that traveling through a warzone is optional. I don't want anyone to be forced to PvP, unless they want to access the ancillary PvE content that is within a PvP zone. If, they want to get that, they should have to accept the possibility of PvP being thrust upon them.
I appreciate that. My point initially in today's posts was that PvP and PvE can coexist within a game. All it takes is a little clear thinking and discussion, without the hyperbole, to devise a system that satisfies reasonable expectations.
PvP warzones would be an excellent opportunity to exercise the "Diplomatic Immunity" ability.
I sympathize with your desire. It struck me as odd that Cryptic did not establish different servers or instances, which would have catered to different playstyles, such as RP and PvP.
Then again, I find their approach to a number of things rather odd.
I hope you find what you are looking for, in this or some other game.
Exactly my feeling. I don't have a problem with the idea of mixed PvP/PvE zones as long as you can avoid them if you want. If somebody goes into an area like that (like, say, Ker'rat) then they might want to be ready to be targeted by another player. I don't necessarily believe that PvE rewards on a PvP map have to be accessible to people who aren't willing to risk PvP.
Sector Space is basically a travel/social zone, which is why Open PvP isn't a good idea there. My belief is that any given map in the game is either all PvP-enabled or not, so there's no concept of "hot territory" that can exist in the middle of a non-PvP map. Which unfortunately means there's no way to "go around" to get to normal PvE mission doors that exist on that map.
Not exactly sure what you're getting at there. If you're thinking to extend the functionality of DI to allow non-combatants to cross a PvP map... what do we do for the KDF who have "Raiding Party"? KDF non-combatants are a bit of an oxymoron in STO IMO, but we do have to allow for the possibility if we allow Feds to opt out. Giving the ability to opt-out of combat to someone who's a "raiding party" just doesn't feel right somehow. Otherwise, I would like the idea.
Maybe, to go with the flavor of the factions, we turn that around... Give KDF the ability to initiate PvP in a warzone (if they have Raiding Party) and Fed the ability to opt-out (If they have Diplomatic Immunity).
"Raiding Party" could allow KDF to initiate PvP combat in certain Open PvP sectors if:
*the target is at least their level and,
*if the target is above a certain minimum level and,
*the target possesses the Diplomatic Immunity ability.
That would prevent high-level characters from ganking low-level characters. If the KDF moves out of range before the Fed enters the arena, the challenge is revoked and the Fed can keep going.
"Diplomatic Immunity" could then be used by Feds to make themselves temporarily immune to the effects of "Raiding Party" with sufficient duration to cross through. Feds with DI would get a button on a dialog "Invoke Diplomatic Immunity". If they press that, they're immune to "Raiding Party" for a few minutes, cannot be challenged for the duration, and they get to continue on their way. Alternatively, they could decide to press "Defend Yourself" to engage immediately or wait for the timer to run out and get dumped into the arena 30 seconds later. If the KDF moves out of range before the Fed enters the arena, the challenge is revoked and the Fed can keep going.
I would like to stress that this idea should only apply as such --
*To designated open PvP sectors that players can choose to bypass somehow.
*That characters below a given minimum level are immune to challenge (let low-level characters get to their mission doors unhindered).
*That this is 1-on-1 Red vs Blue -- no teams and no 5-on-1 dogpiles.
*That Red can choose to opt-out by simply choosing not to initiate a fight.
*That Blue cannot be challenged in the first place if they are lower level than the Red player.
*That only players with "Raiding Party" or "Diplomatic Immunity" can participate (or some other similar opt-in mechanic is in place).
*That "Diplomatic Immunity" prevents the player from being stopped over and over while active.
Something like this would allow consensual PvP in areas where it makes sense to allow it and in accord with the IP and the Dev's Red vs Blue paradigm for factions.
Fleet-on-fleet PvP needs to be handled differently and would need to use a different mechanism.
Either way, we're talking a lot of new tech.
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The closest thing I could find is this:
Because this game is so much like WoW?
The same article lists SWTOR as a 4th generation MMO, but that was another widely touted "WoW" killer with classes and such. It's big innovations are apparently story and voice acting. STO already added a storyline similar to it (albeit not fully voiced) with LOR and content is moving more in that direction all the time.
So, I guess that would make it a transition-era one? But it doesn't really need a new engine?
Someone's going to have to define their terms for this thread to make sense.
Heh...
Seems you kinda-sorta missed that somewhere along the way...
It became a PvP vs PvE thread.
<chuckle>
:cool:
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I didn't so much miss it as choose to ignore it. :P
I've found that around here though..., isn't isn't always so.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
building a new game engine is an extremely costly project for any studio to undertake. Sure Cryptic will need to building a new one, one day. Especially if there current one is reaching it limits. or they could just go and license something like i-novae engine.
As to PVP in sector space, personally I would like more random things to happen why flying through sector, the enterprise could never fly from one planet to another without something happening to them:P, so why should we. But then their people out there that goes to the extreme of purposely attacking people they know don't stand a chance of winning, which ruins the experience for them. May be introduce a mechanic where if you attack someone who can't defend themselves, a fleet of heavily ship arrives to backup the weaker player and to blow you out of the sky:) or may be not. A more fun sector space would be welcome .
Basically what a "transition era MMO" is an MMO that doesn't ape WoW. Keep in mind, that when STO first released, Shooter Mode didn't actually exist. So yes. It was much more like WoW when it was first on the market. It has been steadily moving away from that, so yes, it is a "transition era MMO".
SANDBOXES are the past... seriously, EVE is one of the only main stream Sandbox mmo's left - TOR, STO, CO, WoW, DCUO - these are some of the most well known MMO's out there. You can find people in the grocery line talking about them... none of them are sandboxes. The new Elder Scrolls mmo in production isn't going to be a sandbox
Beyond the exception of EVE (which, I'm sorry to admit, I STILL can't get into) sandboxes haven't been a viable mmo formula for almost a decade... this game is BASICALLY Starfleet Command 3 with bits of Elite Force I and II tacked on... and it works. It's not perfect - if I don't get some TWOK phasers and a proper Norway class soon I'm going to go crazy :P not to mention the clipping issues on most (if not all) of the Romulan armor... how they didn't test something that was going to be THAT heavily used I'll never know...
It's not perfect, not perfect, but maybe with a little work (and a little less PRAISE TEH SANDBOX GODS TRIBBLE and PVE'ers/PVP'ers suck and are 'insert description'ing the game junk) it can BE something that's 'forged ahead'
The sandbox MMO didn't really work back then, for lots of reasons, biggest one probably being juggernaut of WOW and every MMO player being pissed if the new game wasn't identical to how WOW work. This got so bad that games were launch that were virtual copies of WOW.
I don't think Star Trek or any existing franchise is particularly suitable for a full sandbox game. Races have to act in certain ways to act, there are already existing territories layout and fractions and planets that needs to be in a star trek game.
It likely that whenever Cryptic does upgrade the engine it will likely be an engine capable of build sandbox games, most engines are being push in that direction, and perhaps things like Fleet bases could benefit for more creativity and tools.
An it would be cool to be able to have seamless space to planetside flying.
But there is a new big push by publishers to build sandbox MMOs. Minecraft is the new WOW in this arena, Star citizen and there are others in the work.
The question is will this wave of MMO sandbox games be successful, frankly the first game that combines open play of EVE, but make it fun and not so much you are managing spreadsheets and simple will have a hit on their hands.
I've often thought of why an MMO like SWTOR and STO can fail (struggle maybe is a better word?) when a game like EVE does ok. Does part of the reason have something to do with the IP? are games based off of IPs pretty much destined to fail?
If a developer wants to make a sandbox game with spaceships and ground combat and call it "spaceships online" are they more likely to succeed? I dont know too much about the process of how a game gets made. I just know basic terms, i know what some of them do, dont know what some others do and i dont know how some of them relate to one another...terms like dev, publisher or whatever. I know more or less what the devs do, vaguely know what publishers do and i only know a little about who has authority over who.
If EVE online had been based off of Star Trek or Star Wars could they still have succeeded? All the mechanics could have been the same...instead of a Bantam or Antron frigate you're flying a BoP or a Miranda and instead of a Raven or Megathron you are flying a Galaxy or Bortasqu ship. All names are changed to trek versions even for all the little TRIBBLE. If this were so would an EVE online based off of Star Trek be successful? or would the involvement of the IP (and everything that comes with it) have hurt any success that such a game would have had?
EDIT: also when i say successful i mean fun for the player. Not successful as in "profits are up 500% due to C-store sales but number of active users are down 75%"
Yes, it is the money involved. Star Wars Galaxies was one of the best sandbox MMO's and was shut down, not because it failed, but because the execs demanded it make more money like WoW. They changed it drastically and lost a lot of players trying to mimic WoW, then abandoned it for TOR. If it did not have the IP Star Wars and the ego of LucasArts it would still be around today.
From what you posted, it sounds like it would have been fine with the Star Wars IP - it seems to me that it was the ego, as you said, that brought about its downfall.
That would be the equivalent here of PWE mucking about with STO much more than they appear to, in an attempt to hammer STO into 'WoW in Space.'
all planets need to beable to beam down to maybe not to be forced in to a mission but just to hang out
this game needs to give me the choice to to resign my commission in what ever faction im in and join the klingon or the borg or the bajorans
ship interiors are just instance that get loaded when you visit then why cant they be bigger
why cant i give fleetmate rooms on my ship?
why cant i get a house on DS9 or risa?
why cant i level up my duty officer and have them gain special traits and bounuses for the missions they do?
why cant i take parts form ships that i have bought and beable to create a 100% unique starthip?
If I recall correctly SWG was shut down not because of money, but because TOR was in development and although the games are set in different time periods they didn't want 2 SW games competing against each other (conflict of interest).
I remember what buccaneer is talking about.
They changed SWG in such a way that talents, classes and all that were made more 'WoW' like. From what i hear SWG used to be really complex, and the changes simplified things. But the change ended up pissing a lot of people off, and a lot of them quit. Here is a short exchange between someone interviewing John Smedley, who from what i can tell was one responsible for the decision to change SWG.
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/xlir0/iama_john_smedley_22_year_game_industry_veteran/
in all honestly a lot of this thread sounds like "lets make STO into EVE" and have nothing but PVP" I can promise you, make a move like that and STO would die a very sudden, horrible death, because 4/5ths of the player base would leave.
one thing that COULD be done to help the game is more content. backstories on some of the BOFFs would be interesting. adding some episodes that give you a choice in the outcome, (and effecting your future) could be done,
for example, you do an episode like operation Gamma, where you get to decide if you kill the ferengi or not. that decision could /should affect your reputation throughout the quadrant. if the choice hurts the klingon empire, why wouldn't klingon NPCs fight harder against you?
exactly what are the queues for PVP now? the queues have a long wait.. not because the pipes are full, but because no one is queuing. I'm sure one reason PVP has received no love is because the subscriber bas has not supported it. if the PVP queues had the traffic STF queues do, there would be ad eicated dev team to expanding/improving it.
and for the roleplayers who are Vadm and are flying the T2 cruiser or the voyager fanboy would be at the mercy of up to 5 escort jockeys per sector? no thanks.
I saw in sector chat yesterday "only chumps are not in fleets" IMHO, there is absolutely no reason to be IN a fleet unless you want to PVP or have to have the best toys.
same with PVP if I want to PVP I'll join the queue. now if they wanted to add a sector that was PVP oriented, like age of conan did, then that would be fine. don't want to PVP , don't go there. or at least give the player the choice to toggle PVP on and off