test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
AUX as mana
ursusmorologus
Member Posts: 5,328 Arc User
Something that came up in another thread, and I know its been brought up before, is to make all of the Aux-to-whatever abilities actually consume AUX power. Along the same lines, why not make all Sci abilities consume AUX too, so that it is essentially treated as a mana pool the same as weapons power.
Obviously it would suck to have Sci powers drain your Aux, but what if it was accompanied with a reduction in Sci cooldowns? So, yeah, you can (almost) chain gravwell but you better have a lot of skillpoints in EPS or the second one wont get off the ground or will do suck damage.
This would also provide a self-penalty for things like Aux-to-ID, which is clearly OP. Hit that monkey too much and you wont have any juice left for Aux-to-SIF!
Looking around at things like AtB and a couple of others, it seems that this was kind of the plan at some point. Possible to finish?
Obviously it would suck to have Sci powers drain your Aux, but what if it was accompanied with a reduction in Sci cooldowns? So, yeah, you can (almost) chain gravwell but you better have a lot of skillpoints in EPS or the second one wont get off the ground or will do suck damage.
This would also provide a self-penalty for things like Aux-to-ID, which is clearly OP. Hit that monkey too much and you wont have any juice left for Aux-to-SIF!
Looking around at things like AtB and a couple of others, it seems that this was kind of the plan at some point. Possible to finish?
[img]http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x57/UrsusMorologus/MechWarrior Online/Catapult_K2 sig.jpg[/img]
Post edited by Unknown User on
0
Comments
It was never the plan, really. Aux2ID only became extremely good after the release of the Aux2ID DOffs.
Aux2Batt itself, not all Aux2 powers, was designed this way since you're getting a megaboost in the other 3 subsystems. With Aux2SIF you get a small heal and Aux2ID you get some movement speed and kinetic resist.
Aux2Batt has had it's Tech DOffs forever and a day, no nerf in sight. But since you can keep Aux2ID up for a goodly amount of time you call for a nerf to Aux power?
Who said you wouldnt be able to stack them? I said you might not have enough power to chain gravwell back-to-back without waiting for a recharge, but that doesnt mean you cant stack different types. Actually I didnt even discuss power consumption at all, and only suggested some kind of cooldown reduction (which is anti-nerf) as a counter. Right now the cooldowns are too long to use science abilities alone, and you are required to supplement with some kind of weapon for control and/or damage while you wait for cooldowns. This is the difference between being forced to wait, and being able to juice power so that you dont have to wait.
On the subject of mechanics though, one possiblity is to do the old-school style where each rank has a fixed mana cost, something like ensign is 30 AUX, lietenant is 40 AUX, and so forth. So something like TB1+VM2+GW3 is [30+50+60] 140 AUX; you have 130; so you cast the first two then delay the final spell for a second while you wait for power to recharge enough to get it off successfully. Then you wait another couple of seconds for 50 AUX to charge up and throw SS2 on the pile. Downside is that if you are caught with pants down you willl need to wait the same couple of seconds to get off TSS3. Numbers could be tweaked I guess. Couple of other ways to go.
The biggest problem I see with it is that the BOFF seating is too rigid.
Overall though, I do not like that AUX power is used to weight the power of spells, but it is not consumed by those spells. Same for Aux-to-whatever, if I'm directing Aux power to something, take the freakin power
[SARCASM]Why leave it at engineer and sci abilities? Lets make tac skills drain a good amount of Aux? [/SARCASM]
So basically nerf everyone except tac captain? TRIBBLE you!
Time for nap and bottle?
Tacs would be hit with it if they used Aux-based abilities. You know, Aux-to-SIF, PH, HE, TSS, TB, .... And they typically have the smallest AUX power pool right?
the effectiveness of sci abilities must be revisited and buffed
a completely new value that increases the accumulation of aux power...[aux reg] on warpcores for instance.
power transfer consoles and the corresponding skill could be made a factor for aux recuperation, etc...
For one, as a poster before me already astutely noted, only aux2bat really drains aux power, by design, as aux is being emptied to fill up the others -- which makes conceptually sense.
There are abilities that create power ex nihilo, as it were, like all the EPtX abilities (or, rather, they supposedly draw power from an internal, non-visible ship battery pool). And this is also conceptually sound.
Now, aux2-whatever abilties, like many Science abilities, while they do not draw aux power directly, are certainly dependent upon aux levels (for either duration or effectiveness). Making these skills also draw actual aux power, means their effectiveness/duration would already be diminished mid-operation (and this would assuredly be the case come activation of your next aux-ability). Ergo, it would constitute a major nerf.
Also, the suggestion to offer a reduced cooldown in return is kinda meaningless, as with drained aux you ere need a longer time to wait for aux levels to have recovered than having your second copy available sooner, but with no significant aux to spare.
Incase you didn't get the subtle hint. If you made them like weapons then which would you make them like? DHC's and their silly efficiency or beams and their huge drain? The question really is, do you want to nerf science abilities or make them inline with tactical weapons and systems?
Also if we're paying for these in aux power (which could range from -8 power to whatever large figure science captains are fearing you're dreaming up) can we have them beefed up so I can tear your ship apart with my gravity well 3 being chained. I am afterall paying for it with power and having less power to put into other science abilities, defencive abilities, heals and weapons.
Nice thought but would need a VERY big overhaul of science abilities or everything science related.
Oh nearly forgot, what about science captains, will they use up aux on their captain abilities that perform better with more aux power? If so, any plans to make tactical captains pay for thier abilities with weapon power? If not then it would stick out and be very unintuitive.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
Pro tip: don't lie when it's this easy for people to prove it:
As for not stacking, I'm more than a little startled that you couldn't make the connection here, but I guess I'll spell it out. Your plan is that using Grav Well should heavily drain your Aux power, so much so that you have to wait for some time after it ends before you can effectively use a second copy. If you can't use a second power after the first one ends, you can't possibly use two at once, because each will be draining such a large quantity of power that even just after it ends all sci abilities will be extremely weak. If we figure 50 Aux per ability, which is about in the right range for what you're saying there, then a second ability would have a maximum of 75 Aux to work with, and a third a maximum of 25, after which your Aux would be totally offline. Of course, actually running 125 Aux is both difficult and impractical, so it's more likely that the second ability would be hit at 40 or so, and knock your Aux clean offline.
Meanwhile any decent escort keeps 3 abilities in its type up constantly (TT, APx, Cxx), and a cruiser keeps at least 2 (EPtS, EPtX) and frequently 3 (EPtS, EPtX, A2B). You simply have to be able to use multiple abilities simultaneously to be effective in this game, and you can't do that if any ability you use after the first does practically nothing.
As I've posted numerous times before, sci abilities really just need to be able to do what they say on the tin. Power drains need to have a significant effect on enemy damage output and shield resistance, Gravity Well needs to actually draw and hold enemies unless they're using a counter, Viral Matrix needs to shut down things that the target actually uses and do so for a significant length of time (that one will be hard since "significant" is very different in PvP and PvE), PSW needs to do serious damage and have a stun that's longer than a 10th of a second, shield drains need to drain shields better than weapons, and the heals might need a lower system cooldown. The only ones that are weak in concept are the two sensor abilities and to some extent FBP and Tractor Beam, and I think we can all live with those if the others are good.
How do we get there? Well, I'd favor making the skills have a much bigger effect on the abilities, and maybe Aux power as well, plus a handful of base number boosts where things are really too weak even at base. That would boost those investing in sci abilities without giving too much of a buff to people just sticking one ability on an escort or cruiser.
Now, that still wouldn't necessarily make a sci ship a good choice for people just trying to faceroll stuff faster, but it would make scis very valuable in pugs where you don't know how good and coordinated the team will be (I saved tons of ISE optionals with GW before LoR, and it probably ought to be better than it was then).
exactly, that is why it is just a thought to discuss...not really worth extrapolating any further or going into details.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
no, it should stay open until atleast one person cries!
Its just "mostly dead"...
Nobody's even tried to solve it and failed spectacularly yet
It's an ok concept but then you would have to make science abilities more like weapons and by doing that you would be asking yet more questions without any real answers that many people are not really bothered about answering.
No-one has failed anything, there is no pass mark if this is not workable.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
^^ And this is why your idea stranded.
Seriously. Any change, on the scale that you propose, needs to be overwhelmingly needed in the first place. "Difficult to sort out doesnt mean its unworkable" does not nearly tip that threshold.
Also, as bpharma asked, will her GW3 be able to tear your ship apart, like a critical hit of BO3 may do?! (Oh yeah, that's right: there are no 'Criticals' on abilities: they're not weapons).
It just looks like you haven't really thought of the possible ramifications of your proposed change (some of which could be quite severe). That is why I see (not so much the thread, but) the idea failing: it engenders far more questions/complications than it solves -- and for a 'problem' that didn't even need solving to begin with.
So you use gravity well, that means say 20 aux is now on 'reserve' for ten seconds or so. Same with say hazard emitters reserving 10 for the duration of the power and so on. Then you apply the same to attack patterns and engine power if you really want to get crazy!
Also, another reference mark: the MACO 3-piece Graviton Beam drains -31 AUX power on use. One side-effect of this is not a lot of Sci captains use it, and its difficult to use with AtB. This is the kind of interaction I am looking for.