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I just watched ST-In To Darkness. My questions and comments
felixhex
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
First, let em say that I enjoyed this movie more than ST 2009. Why? It was all the cool action. It was fun what can I say? I am up on all the ST history concerning the story of this movie. Here is the only thing I could not explain away as a result of alternate timeline results.
Khan is white. He is English. This only makes sense if you just pretend you never watched WOK. Or the TOS episode. What was the logic behind changing the ethnicity of such an iconic villain in ST canon. It beats all I ever seen, seriously. He did a great job by the way. But it messed up my immersion to much. I know the real Khan is Indian.
That was my only gripe. I liked everything else in the movie. I pretty much could explain away certain things because it makes sense, Vulcan being destroyed, old Spock existing in the same reality as young Spock, that things will happen faster now. For example, the warship. The talks about Section 31.
One other big thing I forgot to mention by now. The Klingon had ridges. He also had piercings in his ridges. Cool addition. I just chalked the piercings up to a style we just never got to see before, and the very existence of the ridges, either the virus that takes them away hasn't happened yet, or it just didnt affect every single Klingon.
Khan is white. He is English. This only makes sense if you just pretend you never watched WOK. Or the TOS episode. What was the logic behind changing the ethnicity of such an iconic villain in ST canon. It beats all I ever seen, seriously. He did a great job by the way. But it messed up my immersion to much. I know the real Khan is Indian.
That was my only gripe. I liked everything else in the movie. I pretty much could explain away certain things because it makes sense, Vulcan being destroyed, old Spock existing in the same reality as young Spock, that things will happen faster now. For example, the warship. The talks about Section 31.
One other big thing I forgot to mention by now. The Klingon had ridges. He also had piercings in his ridges. Cool addition. I just chalked the piercings up to a style we just never got to see before, and the very existence of the ridges, either the virus that takes them away hasn't happened yet, or it just didnt affect every single Klingon.
Post edited by felixhex on
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EDIT: In retrospect, with this new timeline, who knows?? Might not see the virus at all!
You do know enterprise was before this trek so the episode divergence had already happened
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Yeah, I'm going to have to sit down and make a chart. $%#&TRIBBLE temporal mechanics.
Not every Klingon was affected by the virus. Plus Klingons live a long time and many of the Klingons you see could have been born before the virus. It's also possible that the reason they wore masks was to hide which ones were pure and which ones were infected.
A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
YES, thanks you for that idea. Just for myself, now the entire movie makes sense. It never was the actual Khan. Very plausible. And I will go with this to explain his skin color difference and accent.
I saw the destroyed planet, Praxis I have picked up on here. What is the original story with this?
Klingons over-mining caused it to explode. It happened later in the original timeline, but my explanation is that because of the "Nero incident" they stepped up military production(and required mining) and caused it to explode sooner.
As for it not being the real khan.... that's a very interesting take on it. And Khan in the film never uses his full name, he only ever says he is Khan.
A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
And yet if you look at a picture of Ricardo Montalb?n from Space Seed like this one
http://media.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/gallerypictures/45593L.jpg
and compare it to a picture of Benedict Cumberbatch from Star Trek into Darkness like this one
http://theaerogram.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/benedict-cumberbatch-khan.jpg
You notice a somewhat weird resemblance between the two.
So yeah its Khan all he did was cut his hair and lose the tan.
The skin color thing is easy to expalin, he just had a tan or does no one notice that Khan
was pretty white looking in TWOK.
Space Seed
http://media.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/gallerypictures/45593L.jpg
Wrath of Khan
http://mediageeknetwork.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/tumblr_lxclsysdu01qixaveo1_1280.jpg
Your post reminded me of this, which also mentions his difference in appearance in the "Wrath of Khan": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnhIkX99OYw
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
From easter egg material they were releasing for Into Darkness, Section 31 had a "Praxxis Project" that John Harrison was engaged in. It seems S31 had something to do with the destruction of Praxis; probably to weaken the empire in the event of war.
As for accent... he's a highly capable Augment, and he'd been working with (and blending into) Starfleet for years at that point in the alternate reality. Changing an accent for him may have been the most trivial change for him to make after the haircut and wardrobe replacement.
remember that this is one of the most famous men in earth's history. If Adolf Hitler appeared in 3 hundred years people would most likely still know what he looked like, so they just changed his look slighly so that he would not be instantly recognised thus questions being raised.
The praxis thing i put down to it being a ticking time bomb and therefore no reason it would go at the same time. they have probably been mining that thing for centuries and the destruction of 47 ship in XI means they upped production and it went off early.
The novelization strongly suggests this is true. Admiral Marcus even hints that the Enterprise's visit to the Klingon homeworld could very easily have already started the war.
As for Khan's appearance there are several easy explanations. Like someone mentioned before, I think the easiest explanation is that his appearance was simply altered by Section 31. This was a top secret project. It would make sense that they gave him an entirely new appearance.
Praxis: I would imaging that the RSE, SF and the KDF massively stepped up militarisation in the wake of the Nerada incident, with Praxis been over mined 10 or so years early.
Khan: Who is the only person in the film who says Khan Noonien Singh? Old Spock. He hears the name Khan and jumps to a conclusion. There are several possibilities here: Harrison is an Augment using the title Khan (One of the Augments in ENT did this I think), Harrison is lying about been Khan (he was defrosted by mistake and decided to be Khan), or Harrison is Khan and has had his appearance changed by Section 31 for obvious reasons.
Also about Khan, anyone complaining about a white English man playing a North Indian is been a bit silly, there is more English connection to India than Mexican, and anyone who thought that a Mexican (with a Mexico / American accent) was a convincing North Indian just by wearing makeup needs to have their eyes and ears checked
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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Maybe Khan tried to hide himself with Plastic Surgery, that's a possibility, also, as has been mentioned in the thread, it's a reboot, from the time the first film began it's totally different from the original series, they can go in any direction they want to, it makes a refreshing change
Unfortunately its more complicated than that. If they hadnt done the whole Nero/Spock thing, then you could say that any difference between Khan(or any other character) in the original series and in Into Darkness was because this is a new version of the story, and it isnt supposed to be exactly the same.
But by doing the whole Nero/Spock thing, they have acknowledged that the "prime timeline" exists in the same universe as this new movie. And what that means is that everything that happened in Trek history in the prime timeline before Nero went back in time would be exactly the same. And that means that Khan would have been exactly the same.
Of course, as people have said, there are many different possible explanations. Plastic surgery and a fake accent seems to be the most popular, and I have no problem with those explanations. But because of what I just mentioned, you cant simply dismiss it as part of the reboot, because the film makers decided to make it part of their story that everything before the Nero incident was exactly the same.