D'deridex - Cannons or Beamboat?

latiasracer · August 2013

So i've been flying this a while, but i'm nearing the point where i can afford a full set of Romulan Plasma weapons, but i don't want to waste dilithium if it turns out they are not good for the ship. Is this ship better run with Cannons, Beams or a Mixture of the two?

What i'm using at the moment : (All Energy Weapons are Plasma)

For - DHC, DHC, DBB, QT

Aft - Turret, Turret, Beam Array, Beam Array

Shields, Engines & Deflector - Reman Blue XII

Singularity - Weapons boosting advanced fleet core.

Eng Consoles : RCS X2, Neutronium alloy
Sci : 2 X Field Generators, Singularity Launching thing (That the D'D Retro comes with)
Tac : 3 X Plasma damage boosters.

Suggestions would be appreciated, before i unload 200k plus Dilithium onto it

eisenw0lf · August 2013

I would actually equip single cannons and turrets, just for the looks since these fire from the ships 'beak' like in the shows. D'Deridex is a failboat anyway, there are simply far better ships in the Romulan ship roster. Like the Federation Galaxy class it's only for people who want an iconic ship and don't care for its effectiveness.

If you however don't care for looks then equip 8 beam arrays and spam fire at will + directed energy modulation III (with a marion DOff if you can afford one) + aux2bat. This normally generates pretty decent DPS. Just don't mix beams and cannons.

nikephorus · August 2013

latiasracer wrote: »

So i've been flying this a while, but i'm nearing the point where i can afford a full set of Romulan Plasma weapons, but i don't want to waste dilithium if it turns out they are not good for the ship. Is this ship better run with Cannons, Beams or a Mixture of the two?

What i'm using at the moment : (All Energy Weapons are Plasma)

For - DHC, DHC, DBB, QT

Aft - Turret, Turret, Beam Array, Beam Array

Shields, Engines & Deflector - Reman Blue XII

Singularity - Weapons boosting advanced fleet core.

Eng Consoles : RCS X2, Neutronium alloy
Sci : 2 X Field Generators, Singularity Launching thing (That the D'D Retro comes with)
Tac : 3 X Plasma damage boosters.

Suggestions would be appreciated, before i unload 200k plus Dilithium onto it

If this is for PvE I would suggest you go with beams arrays. This ship is not well suited for the use of cannons. For PvP you can use dual heavy cannons for an ambush type build, but even that is just an alpha and get out of dodge build because it has no staying power after the initial strike. Here's what I'm running on mine.

Weapons (Fore): 2xRomulan Plasma Beam Arrays, Romulan Experimental Beam Array, Romulan Hyper-Plasma Torpedo Launcher
(Aft) 4xRomulan Plasma Beam Arrays
Deflector/Engines/Shields: Omega Set (Can use whatever you wish..I like tetryon glider and gravitic anchor)
Eng:2xFleet RCS [ResAll], Molecular Phase, Projected Singularity
Sci: 2xRomulan Emitter Array, Zero Point
Tac: 3xPlasma Infuser

dknight0001 · August 2013

White or Green Mk X or XI weapons are so cheap it's not funny.

Buy a set of those and perfect the ship for yourself, one you've got the performance you want invest in the good stuff. Chances are the MK XI greens are so cheap you'll make a little EC selling them.

I hated it at T4 with DHC's. I found 4 Beams 1 DBB, and a Torp fore and aft kinda worked, but I did not enjoy my time in it.

Partly because it goes turn rate 18, 16, 14, 5. Fast, a bit slower, a bit slower, permanently stuck in a tractor beam.

I contemplated single cannons but ultimately considered it too slow for anything but beams.

Using cheap gear to try out a configuration is the way forward when your unsure.

alfamega · August 2013

latiasracer wrote: »

For - DHC, DHC, DBB, QT
Aft - Turret, Turret, Beam Array, Beam Array

i did that way:
fore - DHC, single cannon, DBB, omega torp
aft - turret, beam, kinetic beam, plasma torp

kinda balanced setup with favoring of front arc to compensate the slow speed and turn rate.
i'm doing acceptable frontal damage for uncloaking alpha as well as maintaining dps on the sides and back. 6 weapons firing in front, 4-5 broadside/aligning, 4 on back.

seitei1 · August 2013

Beams. Turn rate's too low for cannon even with the +2 from the set(Which it sounds like you're not considering in any case).

Don't mix beams+cannons. EVER.

You want the Omega Weapon Amplifier proc(Grants resistance to weapons power drain like the Engineer captain skill Nadion Inversion), so something needs to shift for the Assimilated Console-probably a Field Generator. This also means a back beam will be dropped for the Kinetic Cutting Beam.

Now, ask yourself whether you want to go for merely the 2-piece of the Romulan Set bonus(extra Plasma damage) or the 3 piece(Which empowers the Experimental Romulan Plasma Array, which is something you kinda want because it drains no power ever). If the 2 piece, then it's probably gonna look like

Fore: 3 Romulan Beam Arrays, EXP.Romulan.
Aft: 3 Romulan Beam Arrays, Kinetic Cutting Beam.

3 Piece is something like

Fore: 2 Romulans, EXP.Romulan, Romulan Hyper-Plasma Torpedo Launcher
Aft: 3 Romulans, Kinetic.

I'm in a similar situation, considering whether to go 2-piece or 3-piece, though I don't have the resources as yet(Tier 4 Romulan).

alopen · August 2013

Well I PvP with the D'D just fine. Sadly, I've even managed to be the top scorer for the KDF side on a rare occassion or two.

That said, use it as a beam boat and do NOT use auxtB with it. Besides the obvious problem of burning a LCDR BOFF slot for the secon auxtB, you also ruin the LCDR SCI BOFF slot by burning up all your aux power. Its a unique BOFF setup and it takes some getting used to.

http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=ddbeamboat_0

The nukara stuff is not updated yet so that should be nukara mk xii gear full set if your wondering. The beams are all refracting tetyron which also is not updated on the site.

SCI consoles slots are valdore, and the 2 D'D universals. If I was going to PvE I could and should swap out the beams for cannons and would do just fine. Most of the dmge comes from not having to run away in a fight and also I run up to tgts as close as I can. ( <1km prefered). Also, I have 3 Attack pattern doffs and so pretty much cycle APB 2 non stop.

sjokruhlica · August 2013

Beams. Maybe a torp on each end. The D'deribrick's turn rate is just too slow for cannons.

alfamega · August 2013

colonelmarik wrote: »

I always approach Romulan ships as if they were submarines.

this!. cloak is the main turning boost. 2 consoles and helmsman won't hurt either.

wolfpacknz · August 2013

Simple rule of thumb, a ship that turns that slow where you firing arc is out 90% of the time DC and DHC's are effectively pointless and a waste of money.

stardestroyer001 · August 2013

latiasracer wrote: »

So i've been flying this a while, but i'm nearing the point where i can afford a full set of Romulan Plasma weapons, but i don't want to waste dilithium if it turns out they are not good for the ship. Is this ship better run with Cannons, Beams or a Mixture of the two?

Torpedoes. Go torpedoes and mines. People hate my D'Deridex simply because of torp and mine spam.

stardestroyer001 · August 2013

colonelmarik wrote: »

Another way to use cannons if you want is to employ the "Gorn Anchor." This was a tactic from Starfleet Battles where you would grab the enemy in a tractor beam and pump torpedoes into him. The main point there was to prevent him launching decoy shuttles (Wild Weasels), but the fact that it would immobilize him in front of you means you get to pummel him for several seconds with those cannons.

Then you cloak and reposition to do it again.

Unfortunately, player ships can either negate the tractor beam with APO or PH, push out of tractor with Evasive or EPtE, or reflect your damage with FBP.

This game isn't Starfleet Command, sorry

trhrangerxml · August 2013

I actually have a planned build for Cannons and Turrets for the Fleet D'Deridex with this weapon layout:

Fore: Experimental Rom Plasma Beam Array, 2x Rom Plasma Cannon [Acc][CrtH], Hyper Plasma Torp
Aft: 3x Rom Plasma Turrets [Acc][CrtH], Borg Cutting Beam

Weapons fire is actually going to look canon

stardestroyer001 · August 2013

colonelmarik wrote: »

There were counters in Starfleet Battles, too. The point is, there are tactics you can employ. If you time your anchor properly, a player would find himself unable to respond. Plus, there's more in the game than PvP.

That is true.

schloopdoo · August 2013

If you're willing to install two good RCS consoles and keep at least 30 power to Engines, then there's nothing stopping you from using cannons viably. You'll still have the momentum that comes with a heavy ship, but your cannon aim will be fine.

If you need those two Engineering Console slots for something else, like hull plating or maybe emergency force fields, then use beams.

mustafatennick · August 2013

schloopdoo wrote: »

If you're willing to install two good RCS consoles and keep at least 30 power to Engines, then there's nothing stopping you from using cannons viably. You'll still have the momentum that comes with a heavy ship, but your cannon aim will be fine.

If you need those two Engineering Console slots for something else, like hull plating or maybe emergency force fields, then use beams.

You are seriously deluded I'm afraid

Yes RCS got a boost but on a ship that moves worse than a voquv unless your shooting Borg there's no way your going to hit a blind mouse with cannons in this crock of TRIBBLE

schloopdoo · August 2013

The OP's D'deridex has the same turn rate as my Klingon toon's Bortas'qu, and I do just fine with cannons on that ship. In fact, the console that came with it is a glorified cannon. Go ahead, devalue my experience some more. Or read your own signature and starting acting like you mean what it says. Either one.

stardestroyer001 · August 2013

schloopdoo wrote: »

If you're willing to install two good RCS consoles and keep at least 30 power to Engines, then there's nothing stopping you from using cannons viably. You'll still have the momentum that comes with a heavy ship, but your cannon aim will be fine.

If you need those two Engineering Console slots for something else, like hull plating or maybe emergency force fields, then use beams.

The problem with all Romulan ships is the low hull dmg resist ratings. Even though the hull numbers are high, the hull degrades much faster than the hull of the other two factions.

Emergency force fields does not help keep hull dmg resists high. Armor, Alloys and Hull Platings are the ones who keep the numbers high, and that would be the first thing I would slot on the ship.

If you have the DOFF that reduces Evasive's recharge time, that might be an alternative to wasting those valuable Engineering console slots on consoles that will only give a marginal increase in turn rate.

ussberlin · August 2013

dont mix cannons and beams i learned if you dont do it you have higher weapon Power

i whould use 2 dual heavy Bean Banks 1 or 2 Torps one back one front at at all other weapons slots normal Singel Beams

stardestroyer001 · August 2013

ussberlin wrote: »

dont mix cannons and beams i learned if you dont do it you have higher weapon Power

i whould use 2 dual heavy Bean Banks 1 or 2 Torps one back one front at at all other weapons slots normal Singel Beams

General misconception. Dual Beam Bank + Beam Overload + Marion doff and then add buffed cannons makes for one hard-hitting escort.

But for cruisers I agree. Don't slot cannons, since in most cases the turn rates of these cruisers suck.

mustafatennick · August 2013

schloopdoo wrote: »

The OP's D'deridex has the same turn rate as my Klingon toon's Bortas'qu, and I do just fine with cannons on that ship. In fact, the console that came with it is a glorified cannon. Go ahead, devalue my experience some more. Or read your own signature and starting acting like you mean what it says. Either one.

The fact tha you think you do "just fine" with cannons on a bortasqu show why you comment should be removed by the moderators you loon

Next you'll be telling me your engineering slots house rcs consoles and the jump/leleport console and your tac consoles house the bortasqu 3 piece console set and you run the disruptor quad cannons

yay cannon bortasqu for the win!

alopen · August 2013

stardestroyer001 wrote: »

The problem with all Romulan ships is the low hull dmg resist ratings. Even though the hull numbers are high, the hull degrades much faster than the hull of the other two factions.

Emergency force fields does not help keep hull dmg resists high. Armor, Alloys and Hull Platings are the ones who keep the numbers high, and that would be the first thing I would slot on the ship.

If you have the DOFF that reduces Evasive's recharge time, that might be an alternative to wasting those valuable Engineering console slots on consoles that will only give a marginal increase in turn rate.

Couldn't agree more. A single neutronium goes a long way on Romulan ships. It would take at least 2 RCS concoles to even be a viable turning ship and it would still fail to stay on tgt against anything but a fed cruiser, Voqov, Bortasqu or tholian recluse. Try it in PvP and prove me wrong. If you want to PvP you need beams on this thing. *Side note: the D'D may be one of the more interesting beamboats out there with the singularity powers and cloak. Dual cannons will work in ESTFs. It may also work in episodes where the AI will wait for you to cloak and turn around. But forget it in PvP.

On a side note the crew numbers are so messed up. I've been blown and when I respawn my able crew man will be like 100 out of 1500. It would be nice if Cryptic figured out what they want to do with this stat other than penalize large vessels.

stardestroyer001 · August 2013

mustafatennick wrote: »

The fact tha you think you do "just fine" with cannons on a bortasqu show why you comment should be removed by the moderators you loon

Next you'll be telling me your engineering slots house rcs consoles and the jump/leleport console and your tac consoles house the bortasqu 3 piece console set and you run the disruptor quad cannons

yay cannon bortasqu for the win!

What's wrong with cannon Bortas'qu? DEM, Tactical captain, TT, Beam overload with one Dual Beam Bank, Weapons battery with doff, Marion doff... the Bortasqu is one of the most powerful offensive cruisers to exist in this game.

chrisbrown12009 · August 2013

what about cannons? not the DHC or the DC but the single cannons with a fire arc of 180 degrees? ive been trying those out and in STF they are ok, they also havent been to bad in PVP with the members of my fleet. i am also using two rcs for turning though. my DPS number seem like they are higher than with beams. Keep in mind however, i am by my own addmission a N00b so any advice will be wanted.

mustafatennick · August 2013

stardestroyer001 wrote: »

What's wrong with cannon Bortas'qu? DEM, Tactical captain, TT, Beam overload with one Dual Beam Bank, Weapons battery with doff, Marion doff... the Bortasqu is one of the most powerful offensive cruisers to exist in this game.

No doubt but the torkaht<--(still my favourite ship even with the romulan warbird invasion) turns looks great and is just as tough

Bu back on topic

I have had success with single cannons as long as you use dem to add to damage I hate beams so there normally my go to if I'm running a cruise liner

farmallm · August 2013

At level 30 when I used it. I mostly had beam arrays on it. And the duel beam bank. I didn't have problems with it. However due to being Tac I was taking a little beating. However with the T5 one, I get the "free" slot. I will put in my Sci officer to get me a shield heal in. With that ship I was mainly going to use what I did before. Mostly beams and at least a torpedo launcher forward and aft.

Once I get better with it, I was going to try a DHC. Since you can cloak, turn fast, then drop cloak. And they will be back in firing range.

Granted I play PVE only. I never had a problem using beams plus cannons. All my KDF ships has them. They really help me deal some serious damage to my target. Specially when I get the beam array, dual beam banks, and DHCs going at once. Once shields get weak/drop then fire torpedoes.

hereticknight085 · August 2013

As stated by others, the biggest weakness of the double D is it's turn rate. That thing turns like a fed whale. Thankfully though, she can hit hella harder. Something that was brought up by someone in another thread was this tactic:

DBBs on the nose with a torp, BAs and a torp/mine launcher in the rear. Decloak at a slight angle to your target, hit BO and then BFAW (with marion of course), and a THY or TS, and a TT, then do a long sweeping alpha strike past your target hammering it with DBBs and your nose torp, and after you pass it (yes, you keep going past it) keeping up the pressure and pounding with your BAs and torp in the rear (hopefully your TS/BO/BFAW are off cd and you can do it again), then re-cloak and set up for another pass.

It worked wonders with the level 30 version, however, I don't have the Zen to try the level 50 version and see if it's still viable. But on paper it looks good, esp with the LtCmdr tac that the double D packs. Add in the Cmdr engi, and you got choke survivability to go with it. But again, on paper, it's perfectly viable.

Try it, you might like it.

farmallm · August 2013

hereticknight085 wrote: »

It worked wonders with the level 30 version, however, I don't have the Zen to try the level 50 version and see if it's still viable. But on paper it looks good, esp with the LtCmdr tac that the double D packs. Add in the Cmdr engi, and you got choke survivability to go with it. But again, on paper, it's perfectly viable.

Try it, you might like it.

I agree with this. Which is what my next ship purchase will be. Hopefully will be in the next month or Oct. Since I buy a few Zen at a time. Then I will be sharing what I try out.

You never know, until you try it. If it turns into a fail. I still have my freebie ship to use I got at Level 40. Until I get the Mogai.

D'deridex - Cannons or Beamboat?

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