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Excuses, excuses.
stevehale
Member Posts: 437
Excuse Generator!
I took a break from PvP for a bit because I was getting pretty frustrated with connection issues (I live in the boonies, it's to be expected). Rather than playing the "you only killed me because I was lagging" card I figured it would just be easier for everyone. Besides, doffing provides more than enough time wasting opportunities and they actually do what I tell them (like a boss)
.
Still, I missed some parts of PvP so last week I tried to give it another shot. Now I have to admit, I'm rusty as hell and it's been harder to get back into the swing of things than I expected. While I'm trying to get myself back up to speed, I want to rule out some of the basic stuff that might be beyond my control (or propensity for making mistakes).
Rubber banding in PvP has become more common than ever (it was bad when I took a break but nothing to this extent). I entered a Cap and Hold that was already in progress. Everyone was fighting near the abandoned star base (around 25km away) and I looked like was was goose stepping trying to leave the spawn area, lol. So I ran some tracerts and nettests and this is what I got.
Aside from some random SNRs or occasionally long load times when going from one zone to the next, I don't typically have much difficulty with these issues outside of PvP. Is there anything in these numbers what would help me understand what's happening with my lag, rubber banding, or misfired weapons and abilities in PvP?
I took a break from PvP for a bit because I was getting pretty frustrated with connection issues (I live in the boonies, it's to be expected). Rather than playing the "you only killed me because I was lagging" card I figured it would just be easier for everyone. Besides, doffing provides more than enough time wasting opportunities and they actually do what I tell them (like a boss)
.Still, I missed some parts of PvP so last week I tried to give it another shot. Now I have to admit, I'm rusty as hell and it's been harder to get back into the swing of things than I expected. While I'm trying to get myself back up to speed, I want to rule out some of the basic stuff that might be beyond my control (or propensity for making mistakes).
Rubber banding in PvP has become more common than ever (it was bad when I took a break but nothing to this extent). I entered a Cap and Hold that was already in progress. Everyone was fighting near the abandoned star base (around 25km away) and I looked like was was goose stepping trying to leave the spawn area, lol. So I ran some tracerts and nettests and this is what I got.
Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]
Copyright (c) 2009 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
C:\Users\Serenity>tracert patchserver.crypticstudios.com
Tracing route to patchserver.crypticstudios.com [x]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 2 ms 2 ms 1 ms dslrouter.westell.com [10.0.0.1]
2 53 ms 50 ms 51 ms va-184-6-32-1.dhcp.embarqhsd.net [184.6.32.1]
3 51 ms 51 ms 49 ms va-69-34-35-93.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.35.93]
4 88 ms 63 ms 63 ms 208-110-248-241.centurylink.net [208.110.248.241
]
5 69 ms 71 ms 71 ms bb-asbnvacy-jx9-01-ae0.0.core.centurytel.net [20
8.110.248.117]
6 70 ms 69 ms 69 ms dcx2-edge-01.inet.qwest.net [65.113.64.197]
7 * 62 ms 63 ms dcp-brdr-03.inet.qwest.net [205.171.251.6]
8 72 ms 69 ms 69 ms bpr1-so-6-0-0.VirginiaEquinix.savvis.net [208.17
3.52.65]
9 65 ms 69 ms 85 ms cr1-tengig0-7-2-0.washington.savvis.net [204.70.
197.242]
10 69 ms 71 ms 69 ms cr2-te-0-3-1-0.nyr.savvis.net [204.70.192.2]
11 78 ms 76 ms 75 ms er1-te-2-1.newyorknyd.savvis.net [204.70.196.70]
12 83 ms 83 ms 83 ms msr1-te-0-3-0-0.bos.savvis.net [206.28.97.205]
13 79 ms 83 ms 83 ms 206.28.97.137
14 83 ms 83 ms 83 ms internap.Boston.savvis.net [208.172.51.230]
15 83 ms 83 ms 91 ms border11.te7-1-bbnet1.bsn.pnap.net [63.251.128.4
1]
16 88 ms 89 ms 89 ms perfectworldent-4.border11.bsn.pnap.net [216.52.
61.78]
17 83 ms 83 ms 81 ms
Trace complete.
contacting nettest server..
Local IP: TRIBBLE.x.xx.TRIBBLE
Ping: 71.5 msec
Port: 80: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 80: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 443: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 443: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7255: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7255: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7003: 58 KB/sec 2 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7003: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7202: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7202: 58 KB/sec 2 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7499: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 7499: 58 KB/sec 3 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Port: 80: 58 KB/sec 2 KB/sec 62 KB/sec 500
Idle NIC bandwidth Send: 0 KB/sec Recv: 0 KB/sec
Aside from some random SNRs or occasionally long load times when going from one zone to the next, I don't typically have much difficulty with these issues outside of PvP. Is there anything in these numbers what would help me understand what's happening with my lag, rubber banding, or misfired weapons and abilities in PvP?
__________________________________________
Foundry: Yet Another Borg MissionIt's terrible but easy, and these Borg are way cooler than the mess STO and Voyager left us.
May not actually be "way" cooler or even "slightly" cooler.
Post edited by stevehale on
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It's terrible but easy, and these Borg are way cooler than the mess STO and Voyager left us.
How hot does it get usually?
I've often had all manner of issues with routers as they start to show a little age and many times its been from heat.
Ultimatum's jury rig for hot routers
Requires:
* 2 to 4 x 5lb weightlifting plates (can be found stupid cheap, many people already probably have them from some super lame bench set by a mass brand like weider - you do not need "olympic style" plates).
* A working freezer/fridge
* Beer
1) Place all plates in freezer until cold.
2) Place 1 cold plate under router, router needs to be horizontal for as much contact as possible.
3) Once current plate gets hot, swap out with 1 cold one from the freezer.
4) Keep a beer in the fridge so you can get beers and cold plates at the same time.
5) Drink the beer while gaming. Do not pour it on the router.
There's a good chance this might not even remotely be connected to your actual problem.
The tests were actually run with nothing, else open (no game, browser, etc). Does running either of these things hurt the connection while I'm playing? The rubber banding isn't constant, sometimes it's a few seconds, other times it's a few minutes depending on when I have to respawn or whether I can get away.
It's hard to get away when you are constantly flying sideways, jumping, dropping or back stepping. I kind of want to see if I can record it but it sounds like a lot of work for a weak technical mind and I think most people know what rubber banding looks like.
It's terrible but easy, and these Borg are way cooler than the mess STO and Voyager left us.
Depending on the zone that can be a large amount of information. For PVP zones you can be SURE that that is a large amount of information. Did you know that if you are in a zone when someone zones in, you will 'see' them before they actually drop the loading screen? Just saying that THAT loading screen is your client not being ready to paint the zone info on your monitor. But you're IN the zone. Anyway keep that in mind.
Okay. In sector space you zone, maybe it takes a few seconds, no biggie. You get in, and you're IN. You likely do not lag. Why? because there's like ZERO extra objects. So there's a few other players and encounters. NOT processor intensive.
PVP not so much. Your client gets that there's a station, some sensors, some asteroids, blah blah blah and it DROPS you into the zone. NICE! HAI GUYZS I ISZ HERE! Well ok. Your "ship" starts to function in the zone. Part of that functionality is 'scanning' for objects. You know these objects as 'SPAM'. Don't think "oh I can't see it so it isn't 'there' yet. It is. The ENTIRE zone is in your client. So you see what happened? You come into a match in progress you are trying to process a LARGE amount of queries. Good luck!
So your bandwith and your processor/gpu are handling a certain level of information fine. You burst over that and there's a jam.
And. Also. This is a bit different than if you said "I was in the middle of a fight, everything was fine, nothing changed, just suddenly I was rubberbanding". That could POSSIBLY be an external issue.
If you were in the middle of a fight and SUDDENLY 3 carriers launched wings, everyone triggered photonic fleet and nimbus distress and TS3 and THEN you rubberbanded, we're back to the original diagnosis.
Cheers!
Nothing you listed indicates you're issue was a network one. You could try other things like installing wireshark (it's free) and running it. But, I think you'd have a tough time figuring out what the output meant. You could size pings to see if it's an mtu issues, but nothing points to that at this point.
Fyi, w/pings and tracerts one thing to look for in addition to the delay is the "jitter" the difference between the response time. This could have explained your rubberbanding some, but there didn't seem to be an indication of that.
DSL value is dependent on how close you are to a "Central Office" or CO of the ISP as well as the quality of the lines it's running over.
For windows I'm not really sure of a good resource monitoring tool.
Can't get into it much here, but if you see me online I can get into potential nefarious things people maybe using. That shouldn't be ubiquitous across all your matches, so I doubt that's your issue.
Cryptic has stealth installed a peer to peer sharing app, dump it. Also, check for any other app that maybe running in the background that could be chewing up your dsl resources. One thing to keep in mind w/DSL is the upload (ei going from your pc/rtr) is much smaller than the bandwidth you can download with. It wouldn't take much for a rogue app to TRIBBLE that up.
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
That original diagnosis is usually what happens with me whenever I lag/rubberband. If I'm moving around a 'cluttered' zone (like Ker'rat or ISE-with-the-damned-gate-graphics), I'll sometimes experience rubberbanding just from the computer rendering the Borg ships, because there's a lot of stuff to render. If I get into a spam-filled skirmish with other players (people photonic-fleeting away, calling in reinforcements, launching fighters, using theta radiation/warp plasma/ gravity well, etc) I'll start lagging and rubberbanding (something I really can't afford to have happening on a de-cloak alpha run that requires precise piloting and timing).
Not joking, because I live in Tennessee and we invented the boonies, but I seriously did not know anyone still used DSL...
Tracing route to patchserver.crypticstudios.com [x.x.x.x]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 550 ms 693 ms 35 ms x.x.x.x
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 14 ms 143 ms 380 ms something [x.x.x.x]
4 499 ms 141 ms 109 ms something [x.x.x.x]
5 118 ms 15 ms 17 ms something [x.x.x.x]
6 21 ms 29 ms 23 ms something [x.x.x.x]
7 21 ms 20 ms 34 ms something [x.x.x.x]
8 301 ms 350 ms 392 ms something [x.x.x.x]
9 24 ms 23 ms 23 ms something [x.x.x.x]
10 303 ms 45 ms 30 ms something [x.x.x.x]
11 133 ms 34 ms 33 ms something [x.x.x.x]
12 53 ms 35 ms 63 ms something [x.x.x.x]
13 36 ms 35 ms 36 ms x.x.x.x
14 59 ms 33 ms 33 ms x.x.x.x
Trace complete.
Usually everything's under 20-40, but somewhere between 1-4AM...I'll usually do the Die25 on my KDF because there's not much else I'm going to be doing until it straightens itself out somewhere between 6-8AM...
To be honest, over here in the Netherlands there's loads of people using ADSL connections. The high-grade ADSL subscriptions offer the same speed (around 50Mbit/s advertised) as a medium cable connection, though the top speeds on cable are higher (up to 150 mbit/s).
That's harsh. Really. I feel for you... I think I would complain at my ISP at regular intervals if they slammed me with those numbers. No matter what you're paying, that kind of service is just silly.
It's their maintenance window...meh. The time where anything they do would have the least effect on folks - cause most folks are asleep at the time. At 2:30 AM, nothing was over 30 and it was sweet. An hour later - I was getting motion sickness from the rubberbanding, meh.
Noticed as I was finishing up Die25 in a shuttle, that the rubberbanding had stopped - so I checked again...
Tracing route to patchserver.crypticstudios.com [x.x.x.x]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms x.x.x.x
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 12 ms 12 ms 15 ms something [x.x.x.x]
4 16 ms 14 ms 17 ms something [x.x.x.x]
5 23 ms 22 ms 18 ms something [x.x.x.x]
6 26 ms 23 ms 28 ms something [x.x.x.x]
7 20 ms 26 ms 23 ms something [x.x.x.x]
8 23 ms 22 ms 23 ms something [x.x.x.x]
9 22 ms 24 ms 23 ms something [x.x.x.x]
10 27 ms 29 ms 26 ms something [x.x.x.x]
11 32 ms 37 ms 35 ms something [x.x.x.x]
12 32 ms 34 ms 34 ms something [x.x.x.x]
13 45 ms 35 ms 34 ms x.x.x.x
14 31 ms 31 ms 31 ms x.x.x.x
Trace complete.
Which is pretty close to what it normally is...
However, it might be misleading if you are getting a lot of packet errors - single pings get through, but actual info needs to get re-sent a lot.
The only hope you have of fixing it on your end is that it might be caused by a faulty router. (Bad router -> packet errors -> packet re-tries.)
Routers do go bad...I've replace several after electrical storms.
If your ISP is somebody like Comcast, you have another issue: they do 'shaping' which can lead to random delays of up to 100 ms.
[Kluless][Kold][Steel Heels][Snagtooth]
[Louis Cipher][Outta Gum][Thysa Kymbo][Spanner][Frakk]
[D'Mented][D'Licious]
Joined October 2009. READ BEFORE POSTING
Shaping? Would that explain something like this?
Tracing route to patchserver.crypticstudios.com [x.x.x.x]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms x.x.x.x
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 12 ms 13 ms 14 ms [x.x.x.x]
4 12 ms 16 ms 17 ms [x.x.x.x]
5 22 ms 19 ms 15 ms [x.x.x.x]
6 76 ms 40 ms 27 ms [x.x.x.x]
7 22 ms 28 ms 25 ms [x.x.x.x]
8 50 ms 39 ms 78 ms [x.x.x.x]
9 75 ms 76 ms 68 ms [x.x.x.x]
10 107 ms 86 ms 78 ms [x.x.x.x]
11 101 ms 88 ms 121 ms [x.x.x.x]
12 86 ms 89 ms 85 ms [x.x.x.x]
13 41 ms 52 ms 35 ms x.x.x.x
14 32 ms 33 ms 33 ms x.x.x.x
Trace complete.
Just that jumping around certain of thing going on?
Cause in the past 10 minutes...
Rubberbanding in Ker'rat, normalized, queue popped, about two minutes in D/C'd, reconnect, Ker'rat fine, queue pops, freeze frames, rubberbanding, and...yeah, I'm going to smoke.
And yeah, I just noticed what time it was based on the history with my ISP - my own fault for trying to queue.
edit: Lol, it was funny later though - working on Die25 on Geist, I went to decloak on somebody I knew could obliterate him in seconds....and I'm sitting there wondering why nothing is firing - then I notice I'm still a Full Impulse...the next second, the guy's already 26km away. I frickin' hate my ISP in the middle of the night, but sometimes it is funny.
Tracing route to patchserver.crypticstudios.com [x.x.x.x]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 2 ms 1 ms x.x.x.x
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 17 ms 14 ms 20 ms [x.x.x.x]
4 99 ms 12 ms 941 ms [x.x.x.x]
5 1864 ms 649 ms 471 ms [x.x.x.x]
6 52 ms 22 ms 23 ms [x.x.x.x]
7 865 ms 755 ms 665 ms [x.x.x.x]
8 1191 ms 63 ms 34 ms [x.x.x.x]
9 490 ms 353 ms 71 ms [x.x.x.x]
10 1058 ms 1603 ms 902 ms [x.x.x.x]
11 88 ms 83 ms 87 ms [x.x.x.x]
12 719 ms 1117 ms 88 ms [x.x.x.x]
13 90 ms 86 ms 85 ms x.x.x.x
14 1067 ms 657 ms 165 ms x.x.x.x
Trace complete.
...this is the one where the girlfriend woke up and asked me what I was cursing about (was in Ker'rat as everything turned into a mix of rubberbanding and a slideshow). She wasn't happy - and - I just looked stupid for getting so upset over a game.
...this is one of the major reasons that I don't x up for anything. It's one of the major reasons why it takes me so long to get most things done - I'm not going to queue even for team PvE when TRIBBLE like that happens with my connection.
...this is one of the reasons that folks are more likely to see me typing in OPvP or posting on the forums than actually playing in the game.
And yeah, it's the typical 1 AM on a Friday garbage...I effin' hate this effin' ISP. It's the worst internet connection I've had since going "online" with a Vic20 and a 300 baud modem. Over 10 years ago, I worked for another company doing broadband tech support - every single customer we had that had to deal with this ISP complained. Lucky me...lucky me.
/end_rant