Fighter Durability...

lianthelia · July 2013

I thought people might have been exaggerating a bit and thought fighters couldn't have been that bad in shape. Well I whipped out a Armitage and used some peregrines and I was quite shocked at the results.

It isn't a exaggeration, any aoe pretty much eliminates them...I never had fighters live beyond 1 star. I plan to test shuttles but damn...this pretty much makes fighters useless. Which kind kills my aspiration to buy a Scimitar because I wanted to load it with elite scorpions...

Plus it kills builds for other ships of mine which use fighters...pretty much kills my future corsair.

angrytarg · July 2013

Now even this game makes fighters in it's own lore obsolete, just like it should be

Fighters were never durable or dangerous to begin with aside from the debuffs some are capable off. A FAW or photnic shockwave pretty much trash them every time. If shuttles do any better it's just logical and even more canon appealing

wraithshadow13 · July 2013

I have about 2-3 get up to 4 stars, but they never really last all that long, especially in the elite STF's where NONE OF THEM ARE AVOIDING THE CORE BREACH!!!

Even then, the fighters don't really seem to last long once they've hit 4 stars, so i rarely see one making it to 5 let alone all of them.

Mind you i'm using the ultra rare tholian fighters...

captainrevo1 · July 2013

I've been getting my fighters up to 3, 4 a lot and sometimes 5 stars. every event and match is different. some go well, some go very badly. the avoid warp core explosion is also not working right yet so that should be improved in a later patch.

the rank changes are also an improvement on what we had before the patch. they always get stronger so even if you cant get to rank 1, you have not lost any damage on before, so if no one had a problem before with fighter damage, i cant work out why it would suddenly be a problem. you dont have to get to rank 4 or 5. its just a bonus on before.

lianthelia · July 2013

I tried a little of azure nebula rescue and the fighters get mowed down before than can even fire a shot...

Gonna try shuttles later and try my vo'quv on my KDF with her bops...but if this is the case with fighters I think I would like 10k zen back because I own four ships without frigate launch capability.

Was never a disclaimer that said fighters could potentially be made useless! :P

captainrevo1 · July 2013

lianthelia wrote: »

Was never a disclaimer that said fighters could potentially be made useless! :P

again fighters have not been nerfed. they are the same as before. the rank system only makes them stronger.

the only difference is you now see them die by a graphic instead of assuming they are still there or spamming the fighter button every time it resets.

doffingcomrade · July 2013

Why do you care if they die? If they die, it works just like before: You spam out new ones, they fire off their torps, and they die and you do it again.

lianthelia · July 2013

captainrevo1 wrote: »

again fighters have not been nerfed. they are the same as before. the rank system only makes them stronger.

the only difference is you now see them die by a graphic instead of assuming they are still there or spamming the fighter button every time it resets.

I don't remember them being this bad but maybe its been a while, plus at least when you launched a new wing you would get three fresh new fighters/shuttles with fresh cooldowns.

captainrevo1 · July 2013

lianthelia wrote: »

I don't remember them being this bad but maybe its been a while, plus at least when you launched a new wing you would get three fresh new fighters/shuttles with fresh cooldowns.

there is negatives and positives to that.

if you have 2 fighters on 3 stars you dont want a fresh wing as you'd lose the bonus.

the end of the day. you press the button and you end up with 3 fighters deployed. 1 or 2 may be old but hopefully they are more powerful and already in the thick of the battle doing damage.

lianthelia · July 2013

I honestly don't remember them being that fragile though, still leaves it kinda at if you have anything available that is heavier than a fighter why use fighters?

icsairguns · July 2013

captainrevo1 wrote: »

again fighters have not been nerfed. they are the same as before. the rank system only makes them stronger.

the only difference is you now see them die by a graphic instead of assuming they are still there or spamming the fighter button every time it resets.

Really? I read in one of these threads that they were indeed nerfed until they hit lvl 3 which would make them as they were before. and beyond that they actually start gaining.

personally I don't care I don't like carriers in the game really when every ship has a shuttle bay they should all be able to launch atleast one wing of small ships. but that's another thing.

the bortas BOP combat pet is also now pretty bad. it used to hang in a fight pretty good. now it skirts around on the outskirts so far it hardly ever shot except when the enemy shields are down then in runs at them and gets caught in the explosion almost every time. making it useless as well.

but it is using powers now. it actually was trying to heal the mother ship in one game before a torp spread from enemy took it out. again useless now.

anazonda · July 2013

Well, that is how they worked in the Series too...

skanvak · July 2013

I agree that fighters should not have a great life expency. It is logical that a trop spread clean them out. The fighters are mostly for mass first attack or for ground strike ie atmospheric fight where starship are not good (something we don't have in this game).

Remember, the D7 could launch nuclear missle from the shuttle bay (according to the technical manual). I don't think they were intended to fire at other starship...

captainrevo1 · July 2013

icsairguns wrote: »

Really? I read in one of these threads that they were indeed nerfed until they hit lvl 3 which would make them as they were before. and beyond that they actually start gaining.

originally it was rank 2 I believe but that was undone by a later tribble patch before it all went live.

havokreign · July 2013

if you use the recall command to repair your pets, they'll lose their accumulated experience when you relaunch them.

if they didn't actually die, they should get to keep it

tenkari · July 2013

lianthelia wrote: »

I tried a little of azure nebula rescue and the fighters get mowed down before than can even fire a shot...

Gonna try shuttles later and try my vo'quv on my KDF with her bops...but if this is the case with fighters I think I would like 10k zen back because I own four ships without frigate launch capability.

Was never a disclaimer that said fighters could potentially be made useless! :P

pulled out my engineer who runs the jem dread in an azure nebula myself. had blue danubes and blue peregrines equipped on it. i lost 2 fighters the entire match, the others were 4 sstar by the end. my 4 danubes were all level 4 as well.

i use recall to go between battles so they heal up, and when i let them back out they all pop out at once and unload their weaponry in one big assed volley.

havokreign wrote: »

if you use the recall command to repair your pets, they'll lose their accumulated experience when you relaunch them.

if they didn't actually die, they should get to keep it

pets dont lose their rank or rank progress when under recall. only destroyed pets lose their ranks. as my pets never ranked down after recall orders.

havokreign · July 2013

tenkari wrote: »

pets dont lose their rank or rank progress when under recall. only destroyed pets lose their ranks. as my pets never ranked down after recall orders.

If you recall them, and use the launch command they will be replaced with new 'stock' pets.

if you use attack/escort/intercept they will launch without being replaced and retain their experience.

thanks for the clarification

EDIT: when i tested using attack to relaunch my B'rel's has resulted in them attacking while cloaked. Enemy AI cannot see them to react, taking pot shots till they die.

tenkari · July 2013

havokreign wrote: »

If you recall them, and use the launch command they will be replaced with new 'stock' pets.

if you use attack/escort/intercept they will launch without being replaced and retain their experience.

thanks for the clarification

i never clicked the launch button, so that might have been your problem. i always launched them using the attack command and they all just popped out in one big group behind me and started shooting at whatever i had targeted.

lianthelia · July 2013

tenkari wrote: »

pulled out my engineer who runs the jem dread in an azure nebula myself. had blue danubes and blue peregrines equipped on it. i lost 2 fighters the entire match, the others were 4 sstar by the end. my 4 danubes were all level 4 as well.

i use recall to go between battles so they heal up, and when i let them back out they all pop out at once and unload their weaponry in one big assed volley.

pets dont lose their rank or rank progress when under recall. only destroyed pets lose their ranks. as my pets never ranked down after recall orders.

I tried the Danubes...they worked well only lost 1...peregrines on the other had died left and right. I did recall then for repairs if they managed to survive one pack which was rare.

tenkari · July 2013

lianthelia wrote: »

I tried the Danubes...they worked well only lost 1...peregrines on the other had died left and right. I did recall then for repairs if they managed to survive one pack which was rare.

what carrier were you using? most the time the enemy was firing on me rather than the pets. so i guess i just drew a massive amount of aggro.

havokreign · July 2013

my bug report:

I was testing whether or not my recalled pets would keep their gained experience when i relauch them.

I was in a T'kanis Nebula Borg Empire defense, using 2 B'rel Bird of Prey pets on a stock VoQuv Carrier ~ all 4 deployed.

after recalling, when i used the launch comand on the new hangar UI the first time, they were replaced with new 'stock' pets and had no experience.

then i used 'attack' command to launch them after recall, and the pets retained their experience, however the B'rel's did not uncloak.

Now they are flying around taking pot shots through their cloaks at enemy AI without being seen or getting attacked back.

Which is awesome, but probably not working as intended.

tenkari · July 2013

so, b'rels relaunched with the attack command get scimitar cloak, lol.

have you tried just turning off the recall command then ordering them to attack after they respawn?

havokreign · July 2013

i put a post in the bug forum about it with a screencap if you wanna see it. easily exploitable.

i haven't tried using escort or intercept to launch them yet, nor have i placed the buttons on the toolbar, im only using the ones on the new pet UI.

sander233 · July 2013

The only reason my elite Scorps don't make it to five stars is because the fight's over too fast. Or because I die first in ESTFs or CCE.

Seriously, the new pet system is fantastic.

My only gripe is it doesn't show which carrier command is currently active on either the pet UI or the weapons display, and sometimes I forget whether I'm having them attack or intercept.

(BTW, if your pets are still getting wiped out by core breaches, try hitting Recall when the enemy is about to be cored. Seems obvious to me but a lot of people are still complaining about it so I thought I'd mention it...)

tenkari · July 2013

sander233 wrote: »

My only gripe is it doesn't show which carrier command is currently active on either the pet UI or the weapons display, and sometimes I forget whether I'm having them attack or intercept.

Odd, mine show up in the new hanger UI, the icon has a slightly thicker white border, so yes its a little hard to see, but it does show which command the hanger has active.

lianthelia · July 2013

tenkari wrote: »

what carrier were you using? most the time the enemy was firing on me rather than the pets. so i guess i just drew a massive amount of aggro.

Using a Armitage...and the tholians use a lot of faw so even if I had infinite agro they wouldn't always hit me.

shadowwraith77 · July 2013

With a measly 2k+ hull on fighters they won't live long in heavy battles most of the time, they are good for single enemy combats where they can focus on buzzing it to death, but in most multiple enemy combats they tend to get swatted like flies from ship explosions and splitting up to take on too many enemies at once. Usually it is good to carry a variety of ships if you can, as the heavier ships like frigates, drones, etc... have much higher hull numbers, but usually are more limited in the amount that can be launched per hangar. As for the Scimitar the drones seem to be a very good choice as I have had them reach 5 stars on quite a few missions, and with a hull rating of 30k+ they tend to hold up quite well.

corvalle · July 2013

captainrevo1 wrote: »

again fighters have not been nerfed. they are the same as before. the rank system only makes them stronger.

the only difference is you now see them die by a graphic instead of assuming they are still there or spamming the fighter button every time it resets.

Ya, you are pretty much wrong across the board here.

Fighters are worse than they were before, according to notes they are supposed to ATTEMPT to avoid core breeches...now they fly right into them!

Sometimes the fighters even dissapear. They go off and attack other targets on other side of map..alot more so now than they did in the past.

Face it, Cryptic once again ruined the AI system. They made it WORSE! I give up on carriers in this game really..it is apparent that Cryptic will never have the skill set to code a proper AI

foundrelic · July 2013

Frigates seem to do well enough. my KDF in her Mirror Vo'quv and B'rel BoPs has managed several wings (SPread over multiple engagements) of level 5 Frigates.

jsck82 · July 2013

foundrelic wrote: »

Frigates seem to do well enough. my KDF in her Mirror Vo'quv and B'rel BoPs has managed several wings (SPread over multiple engagements) of level 5 Frigates.

Too bad for us Fed side players that we don't have a single faction-specific carrier that can launch a frigate

Aside from that, the "free" pets (peregrines and anything else that is blue, and costs like 4K ec) seems to pretty much suicide as often as possible. My Danubes do ok, and only sometimes suicide, and the Stalkers pretty much always live longer.

There are respawn issues with the new levellup system, resulting in only ACTUALLY getting 1-2 new fighters, and replacing a 3rd, experienced fighter. I've had as many as 4 dead, called a new squad in, and ended up with a total of 4, having had 2 new fighters come in, and my experienced fighter being replaced.

chainfall · July 2013

The BNW seems much less durable than it was before. So I'm thinking it isn't just carrier fighters.

Fighter Durability...

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