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Original and Streamlined STFs
supergaminggeek
Member Posts: 616 Arc User
I've decided to take a look at YouTube videos that depict STFs before they were dulled down. And might I say, they were very good. I don't know why Cryptic decided to compact them, but I really like the old STFs.
So, I was thinking, "Hmm, I'd really like to play the old STFs, but time machines haven't been invented yet. Relative to our time period, of course." That's when I thought, Cryptic might still have the old code in the archives of their computers. In theory, Cryptic could have the old STFs readily available alongside the new, smaller STFs.
I propose this because there are still people from Season One who remember playing these STFs. Not me, I'm Season Five. Fact of the matter is, I want to see the two STFs available to every player, whether PUG'd or privately queued.
The parts of the STFs already in play will be exactly how they are now. The original, cut STF parts from before the compacting will be left untouched, save the new Borg ship modifiers. In essence, the two STF modes will be combined, but the Original STF will contain more of the lore in the game.
Streamlined versions are the STFs we have at the moment. Simple objectives in a short amount of time to complete. Queue in, blow up Borg, get your marks and Dilithium Ore, and get out.
So, I was thinking, "Hmm, I'd really like to play the old STFs, but time machines haven't been invented yet. Relative to our time period, of course." That's when I thought, Cryptic might still have the old code in the archives of their computers. In theory, Cryptic could have the old STFs readily available alongside the new, smaller STFs.
I propose this because there are still people from Season One who remember playing these STFs. Not me, I'm Season Five. Fact of the matter is, I want to see the two STFs available to every player, whether PUG'd or privately queued.
The parts of the STFs already in play will be exactly how they are now. The original, cut STF parts from before the compacting will be left untouched, save the new Borg ship modifiers. In essence, the two STF modes will be combined, but the Original STF will contain more of the lore in the game.
Streamlined versions are the STFs we have at the moment. Simple objectives in a short amount of time to complete. Queue in, blow up Borg, get your marks and Dilithium Ore, and get out.
Post edited by supergaminggeek on
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- it take hours to complete. (2-5 h)
- much more tacs needed to discuss during the gameplay
- the rewards was the Borg set, it were pretty impressive, but it was almost undooable with pug. or at least needed 2-3 experienced player to finish it
and ofcourse they were buggy as hell. for example:
Old Khitomer:
after you finish the two gateway, you warp to the planet, some combat in space, and beam down, into the ground. After you finish the ground beam up, again some space combat, and if you can not warp as soon as possible, you stuck there. if you warp, than another lengtly space combat against Donatras Scimitar. That fight can take hours, if 1-2 ppl stayed behind becuse of the warp bug.
Terradome:
If the you cant finish the Spawning Chamber room quickly, you cant finish the instace, cuese all the team die almost instantly, when 20-30 Undine hit you as soon as you respawn in the same room. and again, and again, and again...
So, i like the newer verion, cause if i like the space combat better, i do that. If i like the ground, i choose that.
But you are right, it was nice to have those Full Infected, Full Cure, Full Khitomer back, just to remember the good old times...
those stfs were fun to do if you knew how to play and that is the reason why they were redesigned... most of the players back than preferred to cry about the "difficulty" rather than learning to play the game so they would either never finish them or do them once with a group that would carry them and never do them again.
damn i really miss rushing them, i used to be able to get a decent pug through them in 30-45 min on infected, cure took about 50min and khitomer accord about 80 minutes
On the road where the dead years run
Cold as moonlight
Terrible as the sun
If you introduced missions with multiple concurrent objectives for each Mission Step you'd have a chance at much more dynamic, engaging and challenging experiences. As well as opening up for different roles to contribute other than raw DPS.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
Old STFs took more than two hours to complete under the following circumstances:
- The group deliberately took a slow, methodical approach and / or took breaks.
- Bad group.
They could be done in an hour or so if you tried to do them as fast as possible and people knew what they were doing. Bear in mind regular STF times of under 10 minutes are a product of rushing, which was considerably less common under the old STFs. And given the power creep since then (new ships, rep gear, fleet gear etc.), if you restored the old ones, I guarantee you under 1 hour would be the norm for a good team.
This is the actual reason they were reduced. Not that either of these (or the time) is a problem, imo, but that they were perceived as problems by players who weren't interested in organising their groups properly or having a bit of patience. And that Cryptic appears to have listened to those players.
Why should top level raid content be PuGgable? Seriously? What is the point in teamwork if you can just grab any four other players at random and zerg it? Cos that's what we have now.
Bugs can be fixed without fundamentally changing the mission design and ethos.
This man speaks good sense.
Accessibility. Always have been the sole cause. Exclusive content is dangerous, especially in this day and age because it no longer breeds a desire for people to "want to aspire to that" like in the old days. It just furthers the gap between have and have not, and mainstream MMORPG gamers aren't content to put up with that.
I.e Have the original ones give the same rewards. Just more of them.
For example: Have each part you complete give a certain amount of Dil, OM And BNP. so that once you finish the run, you end up with (and this is just a random number for example) 300 OM, 4k Dil and 10 BNP. It would be justified because of the difficulty and time factor.
And/Or if you wanted something to differentiate the "original runners" and the "Streamlined runners", have each part drop a random piece of purple MKXII Borg loot at the end. Loot that has the exact same stats as the rep-dropped, but with some visual differentiation to it. That way those who have done all the "Original" STF's would have something to show for it, without giving them an edge.
And if Cryptic does that, they might realize after 2 weeks that nobody is running them because nostalgia glasses have been taken off and people realize they aren't so fun.
This kinda convo has been done to death over at WoW regarding the old 40-man raids and bringing them back.
I wouldn't mind running the original STF's a time or two just to experience them though.
1: Up the rewards. If you run the original STF, you get the marks/dilithium rewards equal to the ground + space + bonus.
2: Add career specific optional objectives that if completed would add even more rewards (marks/dilithium). This could encourage players to set up a full team that encompasses the different fields.
It involved taking the "best" bits from each mission and mixing it together in one mission.
Essentially you'd have
* Probes warp in every 30-60 seconds and try to escape through the Gate.
* NPC (Kang) must be protected by additional attacking spheres warping in (Reinforcements every 30-60 seconds), opposite end from probes.
* Gate is shielded by 2x transformers, 8x generators.
* Gate does not have offensive capability.
* Initially 2 elite tac cubes are guarding gate on Elite difficulty, 1 on normal, mission timer starts when first player engages the cube. Mission would have 30 second countdown before start.
* Optional would be lost if any probes exit the gate, or Kang drops below 75% on elite, or 50% health on normal.
* Mission would be lost if too many probes exit gate, or Kang dies.
Mission success would then become a two step process, involving both defending an objective (Kang) as well as attacking an objective (Gate).
new 3 piece space set, 3 new space stf guarantied reward, lik ethe borg set was the old borg stfs.
new endgame content, and must have go through of them, but secont time, you gain dil and/or existing mark.
it would be also awsame some 3 stf for the jem hadar space set, 3 stf for the jem hadar ground set, stc... not just some episode...
I have to disagree.
There's no reason to have to know what you're doing before you enter a zone. The mission briefing should cover that. Now, running it a few times and working out a strategy is fine and all. But WHY do I have to know what I'm doing ahead of time? All I want to do is play the game and enjoy it. It's hard to enjoy when I'm lost as son as I enter. Not to mention other people who either demand perfection or suicide at the end. I shouldn't have to put so much energy into a video game, endgame content or otherwise. PERIOD.
Also it isn't my idea of a good time having to constantly respawn and take injuries. And the cure -- ****! If you died too far along the borg would rez forcing you to either wait it out or quit. Try doing this for 3 hours straight. It WASN'T fun.
Lastly, I never appreciated the forced teaming dynamic with STFs. If I solo'd the game UP TO the STFs, I should at least have the option of soloin the STF's. Granted, they would have to be reworked and rescaled. Bt WHY AM I FORCED TO TEAM?? This isn't ****ing WoW, and these aren't traditional raids.
I dunno -- I only finished the old STFs once each (I didn't bother to count the failed attempts). And I tried Terradome several times and quit forever. Too many bugs, and for a while it really couldn't be finished. I think people who have a passion for STFs have VERY low standards. It's a grind of near-constant failure. Even today, PUGs only finish about half of the STFs they attempt. That's not saying much.
For the record, I ONLY do them now because they are a necessary evil (marks, rep, dil...). If it were up to me I'd have them removed and replaced with something that wasn't so pointless and grindy. They've NEVER been fun.
There's a few other good suggestions, such as bringing the originals back to run alongside the bitesize versions with bigger rewards.
Separate, new missions with multiple concurrent or dynamic objectives would be cool as well.