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STO - Should be Klingon Empire Online?
staq16
Member Posts: 1,181 Arc User
This came spinning of my thoughts from another thread ("conversations in sector space")...
A lot of KDF-first players feel hard done by in terms of Dev attention. I am a primarily KDF player - of my 4 alts only 1 is a Fed, and he didn't make it past level 6 for eighteen months (until all my KDF alts were fully STF geared). I still have yet to roll a Romulan on the grounds that I've never overly cared for them (great adversaries, yes).
The Feds, of course, have the flashiest gear; the Vesta and Kumari have no answers from the KDF. They also have a much wider range of ships and single-player narrative missions. But all of these, really, are just fluffy padding around a core game that is very Klingon.
What do you do? You level up by confronting and defeating your enemies. Occasionally, you might rescue a civilian or explore a bit of space. But even when you explore, usually it's to root out intruders or raiders. You may gather data, but its main practical use is crafting weapons.
It doesn't matter about your ship's capability for deep research, or evacuating civilians, or transporting aid; what matters is the power of your weapons and key tactical systems. Even so-called "science" vessels are valued for their electronic warfare and exotic weaponry capabilities.
And then the missions - at endgame, it's a ceaseless struggle against relentless enemies; the Borg and the Tholians, plus armed peacekeeping around Romulan space. Only by systained combat will you gain the reputation necessary to justify issue of the best equipment. Well, there's Epohh tagging, but that's almost the exception which proves the rule...
Then consider "uniformity". Starfleet officers now dress like marauders and other sorts of ill repute rather than officers. This sort of rough-and-ready garb has long been acceptable in the Empire - even more so among its subject races - but now it's the norm in the Federation.
So, to my fellow Klingons and our Orion, Gorn, Nausicaan, Lethean and true Romulan comrades-in-arms, I say - do not fret. Victory is already ours; the Federation has embraced the Klingon way.
Qapla'!
A lot of KDF-first players feel hard done by in terms of Dev attention. I am a primarily KDF player - of my 4 alts only 1 is a Fed, and he didn't make it past level 6 for eighteen months (until all my KDF alts were fully STF geared). I still have yet to roll a Romulan on the grounds that I've never overly cared for them (great adversaries, yes).
The Feds, of course, have the flashiest gear; the Vesta and Kumari have no answers from the KDF. They also have a much wider range of ships and single-player narrative missions. But all of these, really, are just fluffy padding around a core game that is very Klingon.
What do you do? You level up by confronting and defeating your enemies. Occasionally, you might rescue a civilian or explore a bit of space. But even when you explore, usually it's to root out intruders or raiders. You may gather data, but its main practical use is crafting weapons.
It doesn't matter about your ship's capability for deep research, or evacuating civilians, or transporting aid; what matters is the power of your weapons and key tactical systems. Even so-called "science" vessels are valued for their electronic warfare and exotic weaponry capabilities.
And then the missions - at endgame, it's a ceaseless struggle against relentless enemies; the Borg and the Tholians, plus armed peacekeeping around Romulan space. Only by systained combat will you gain the reputation necessary to justify issue of the best equipment. Well, there's Epohh tagging, but that's almost the exception which proves the rule...
Then consider "uniformity". Starfleet officers now dress like marauders and other sorts of ill repute rather than officers. This sort of rough-and-ready garb has long been acceptable in the Empire - even more so among its subject races - but now it's the norm in the Federation.
So, to my fellow Klingons and our Orion, Gorn, Nausicaan, Lethean and true Romulan comrades-in-arms, I say - do not fret. Victory is already ours; the Federation has embraced the Klingon way.
Qapla'!
Post edited by staq16 on
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KDF isn't as unique as you are trying to make it out to be. :rolleyes:
I think you missed the OP's point. He's saying that Starfleet has pretty much become as ruthless and warlike as the Klingons. To "seek out new worlds and new civilizations" has fallen by the wayside.
original join date 2010
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I don't think the OP is disagreeing at all. In fact, he/she is in agreement with your statement, to a certain degree.
Given the quality of new missions we've seen in LoR, it does shed some light on a lot of the older missions for both Federation and Klingons: they could really use some loving attention. From Dev comments post-LoR release, it's clear that they too have noticed the demand for at least a redone Federation tutorial. If they do make a new Federation tutorial, and it turns out to be successful, I think that would pave the way for the possibility of updated and/or new missions.
At least when I play Klingon it feels like I'm doing what I'm suposed to do in the Trek universe. The KDF in STO is much closer to the actual Star Trek lore.
Of course you have to ask yourself would you really enjoy a less combat intensive game and if the answer is yes, how exactly would you implement that in such a way that keeps players engrossed?
Its a mute point for me anyway since I am KDF and also Romulan KDF. Nothing better in life than crippling Federation freighters and selling prisoners off to Orions.
"You have not experienced Shakespeare until you have read him in the original Klingon, taH pagh, taH be"
I do have a fully fledged Fed - admittedly themed around the 22nd century - full reps, Mk XII STF / Elite fleet gear. And he basically does what my KDF alts do (with less marauding - he's basically a money launderer for KDF contraband).
Which, as others picked up, is the point - STO plays like a KDF game with its focus on constant combat, which is why I don't feel hard done by in terms of game content
I mean, look at Nukara - it's an uninhabited rock in contested space - the Feds *should* be politely trying to negotiate with the Tholians, but instead it's lock and load. However this makes perfect sense for the KDF.
I have no problems with combat on my Fed. I like flying around in my Feddie ship and shooting things. The problem I have is how we arrive at that combat. The context of the combat, if you will. We don't try talking to people in many of the missions. We don't carry out investigations. It's just warp into system > Shoot 'em.
I don't need much in the way of diplomacy or investigations either. If I can at least attempt diplomacy and the other guy is like "lolno" then I have no problems blowing him out of the sky. If an investigation is carried out and it proves that yes, the bad guys are doing bad things, then by all means I'll happily start shooting away. But at least give me some context for combat instead of Ye Olde Warp into System and SHOOT 'EM.
Oh and Divide et Impera needs to be removed in it's entirety. It makes no sense in any context. Scrap dat TRIBBLE.
Mine Trap Supporter
i do see what the op means tho.
just have fun with it.
MMO's in general aren't famed for having the most sophisticated mechanics in the world - and you'll need something far more interesting than spamming the F button during diplomatic meet n' greets to convince players to favour peaceful resolutions.
Like the breen line of missions . they had my Klingon tactical officer basically doing brain surgery to save a alien. id have left him on the table.
orthe drozona line, doing autopsy's on stairs . go through all the trouble to close that rift to the past. why not just blow up the station it was on . especially knowing what we know in the games time line its just a hang out for federation low life. no loss if when we slingshot to the past in out ship. we just blew the place up.
instead of running around serving a ****** drinks ,and healing feddies all over the station in the past.
game lost alot of trekkies at the start of the game because of exactly what youve just described. we will never know now how suxccesfull the game would have been if they had stuck the principles of lets say TNG era
We cant build then defend colonys.........like player citys/colonys like SWG had
There is no real distress calls defend the border missions that have any mmo meaning
There is no real mmo explore and expand our borders type of missions
basically no end came content of a star trek nature
cryptic has a long way to go
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
The basic problem, I guess, is that combat is easier, from a development point of view. It has clearly definable success conditions - if you have two people in a contest, the one who is currently exploding has lost. With diplomacy, you win best by making everyone a winner, which is harder to simulate in game terms.
Now, of course, there's always the Foundry, which lets us make our own diplomatic missions... except, even there, the bias is towards missions that drop loot, and loot only drops from defeated enemies, so there is an inbuilt tendency towards violence.
Hmm. Now, then, I wonder if this points a way towards a solution? Say, some better reward scheme for Foundry missions that complete without anyone exploding? That's something the devs could potentially code for - and it would open the way for some more Fed-friendly content.
(For those who like that sort of thing. Personally, my main toon is an Andorian and is perfectly fine with blowing stuff up. Don't judge me on your touchy-feely pinkskin values, thankyouverymuch.:D )
As it is right now we could also replace the Trek with War............
Your ability to distinguish video game mechanics from the principles and realism of Trek lore will affect your enjoyment of the game. I would suggest to any developers in the future working on another Star Trek game (MMO or not) to consider creating an experience that evenly balances combat and non-combat gameplay.
and it isn't because it drops a toon of loot or anything I am just hoping devs maybe track the types of mission people play the most. to base decisions on the type of content to further develop. so the premise of the mission I really like , since you can go the feddy route I'M NOT ONE BUT THEY NEED THE OPTION or my route blast the buggers .
its NOT the federation which is "warlike and pillaging everywhere"
The Story is a personal Story, written for YOUR toon, you do special missions, work with shady task forces, the mainsteady of the federation, is for sure our there, exloring, peactalking, whatever.
But the Story revolves arround a "Hero", arround the guy you call when the going gets rough.
Even in the "endgame" ist not "OMG!!! THE FEDS ARE AT DEM WAR!!"
its about a *small* group of Special Task force members, which is send to fight decisive Battles.
Point is, you can not say "But every Fed toon is doing the same Stuff, and its all aggressive!"
Because, we are not.
The story has to be seen in an personal context, while every player, for gameplay reasons, destroys the doomsday machine, story wise it happens *once* and that one time it happens, you do it, nobody else.
If the Federation would be, as you describe, depicted "klingon like" the game would revolve arround:
Your toon, his Ship and his ****ton of allied federation vessels kicking the living TRIBBLE out of everybody.
But thats not the case, as mentioned, its only *you* who happens to start his career as someone with the skills needed to survive a Borg onslaught, and from there on, your Career is set for you, you are, no matter if science, engi or tac, "that" guy, who is called upon, if **** hits the fan...
the remaining MILLIONS of federation Members? You bet, they research, explore and have some nice peace talks.
Fed First Officer assignments for Duty Officers are Diplomacy. For KDF they are Marauding. I know that's merely a sub-text and not "actual" context, but it a big difference of color.
The Fed might be somewhat desperate. They are giving ship command to Lieutenants. They are beset by Klingons, Tal Shiar, Orion and Nausicaan pirates, Breen, Tholians, and the freaking Borg.
I play a KDF officer and my concept is a pirate. I'm not adverse to combat and marauding. The KDF missions starting with DS9 involve the character becoming a representative for the Empire. I actually felt that was a bit out of character for my toon but justified it because she is an Orion and can be flexible in negotiations. I might go back and try the more belligerent dialogue options on a different KDF toon just to see what happens.
I tell you guys.... this game..... this game.....
....has ..... P O T E N T...... POTENTIAL
cause sometimes its party time!
They just needs a major expansion for doff uses and maybe add in Bridge officers, Unused Starships and even maybe colonies and star systems.
Okay picture you go exploring in a cluster and you scan an anamoly and it sends you to a first contact mission on a planet with Alien Species X. This Species wishes to get to know the federation better and so it gives you a simple job to do, say removing an invasive species of dangerous animals from an area and asa reward you get an assignment chain called first contact with species X.
Its starts with a simple assignment host Diplomatic gala and you assign doffs to organize tue gala. Next assignment might be find a permanent solution to enviromental problems on planet x, and then an assignment to build an federation embassy, and so on till you get to the end assignment which is negiotate the entry of species X into the Federation, which requires the use of not just doffs, but a bridge officer and a ship, and awards a star system, which would be a type of currency, which you spend on a Diplomancy Rep.
Just an idea and just the tip of the iceberg.
Its the Doff system with it diplomacy missions, trade, recruitment, colonization, medical, espionge, science, exploration, development missions that really feels like star trek. Intergrate it with other game mechanics and systems and expand it and you have a more star trek federation feel.
The KDF and Romulans can have thier own verison of this of this. The KDF can have a Conquest Rep with more battle or in the case of Orions trickery focus.
Romulans maybe the focus is more on rebuilding, so they find and reintergrate former Romulan, Reman or other Romulan allied species, search out relics of thier history and culture and build up New Romulus some more and so on, maybe also retake colonies enslaved by the Tal Shiar.
What do you guys think of my idea?
Another idea is just as your ship has five doffs and your away team has 5 doff slots maybe other assets can have doff slots too. Like maybe in a mission you earn a Title and Land on Qornos and you can assign doffs to administer it to give it a bonus, or for the federation, maybe for the Federation you do a mission where they name a branch of the Daystrom institute after you and you can put five doffs into Daystrom Slots which provide some kind of benifit, and the Romulans have a spy network with the Tal Shiar with five slots that grant bonuses.
Just food for thought.
That's what we all are. There is no faction, war or story just farming the next eSTF.
I have characters in all factions just like I play all careers so I tried all content.
Don't feel any kind of immersion or loyalty outside for the next item I am grinding.
If the Feds mean to have a war, then by god Cryptic, let's have a WAR!!!
cause sometimes its party time!
If like someone suggest the game is made of doff, then let's make it browser based, no need for the toon...
As we discute in another thread, the problem is that nothing matter. Vestereng sum up the problem and lykum suggestion is wat this game (evey MMO may be) lack. If we are at War let's make it!
2 thoughts : _ personnal story in a MMO is somewhat a bad content as every body do the same, so it cannot be part of your background, which mean : it is either outside the game or it is a we all have do it thing. That mean in a MMORPG you can tell the player he is a hero : he is not! He is just captain among thousands of others unless he stands out from the other player.
_ Though Federation does negociate and explore, it wage war like every body else. Look at balance of Terror (the crew discuss option but basically gun it out with the romulan warbird, though the battle was interesting). There are some reference to fleet battle and the Federation does fight normally (ie explode the the opposition). The difference with the game is that political consideration (and humanitarian too) are taken into account before going into action (this is true for the Klingon to some extend, and this is definetly the case for Romulan though they have not the same goal and morals). Therefore I am not again the idea of line battle with the klingon, borg, true way... but we need to have more discussion about the option and their consequence.
Skanvak Drakken
http://lamaisondesdrakkens.clan-box.com/index.php
In STO, if you want to play a faction that even remotely resembles to what the TV shows & movies depicted... you need to play the KDF.
Not the Federation.
Definitely not the now-subservient Romulans.
But the Klingon Empire. I know there are generic missions out there that are based from a Fed POV (i.e. Dominion arc). But in general, the Klingons seek out and are happy with conflict in STO. They have rivalries between the houses in STO, though this should be explored more. There's some quests related to Klingon beliefs. And the Empire is at war with the Federation, which is actually a classic Star Trek theme, and the original rivalry between major powers in the franchise.
In short, the Klingon Empire in STO is a closer resemblence to canon Star Trek than the currently depicted Federation faction and shattered Romulans ever will. The Klingons are closer to what people generically imagine what that group should be.
The Federation is nowhere near anything like what the Federation you watched on TV and on the silver screens.
I have 3 kdf, 1 fed, and 1 kdf rom.
As a kdf I can pretend that the Feds play by the way that they do in the ip because now, they never do.
If the kdf faction didn't exist I wouldn't be playing this. And I have been a serious Star Trek fan for 35 years.
As this is a ftp game and funding is a bit low to even attempt to create new content i suggest the devs do a KICKSTARTER thing to fund what the community wants,
I mean as if we want new clothing, ships and whatnot we all donate a dollar to a kickstarter campian to bring in this content as long is it brought out by the devs clearly defining what they need to do with the money and what we want as a community to be brought into the game .