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Missing Mail **UPDATE: Items now back on Holodeck with the 7/11 patch**

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  • cptniteusercptniteuser Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    All of you should not have stored items in mail for extra free bank space. Sry it happened to you all, but I saw this one coming sooner or later. This thread makes me glad I keep my expensive stuff in paid for extra bank spots and followed the rules.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • aarons9aarons9 Member Posts: 961
    edited July 2013
    All of you should not have stored items in mail for extra free bank space. Sry it happened to you all, but I saw this one coming sooner or later. This thread makes me glad I keep my expensive stuff in paid for extra bank spots and followed the rules.

    again i will say.. i didnt just lose items, i lost ALL OF MY EMAIL..

    im glad you're glad the email system is not important to you..

    i was important to me, it is the only way to communicate with people that are offline.

    also, i dont see any rules saying that one day all of your email will be deleted?
    ontop of that, most of the items i lost in my email was from the exchange.. i just havent gotten around to reposting them yet.
    [12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
    [12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
  • cptniteusercptniteuser Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Correct game mail to me is old news, as this games email system is really basic without better features like delete all for massive exchange mail. Thats why we use real email and teamspeak for more important fleet/friend discussions. Again it is unfortunate you all had this problem and hopefully it may be resolved.

    Next time dont put all your eggs in one basket so to say, is all im saying.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Bran mentioned we might get our items back after this week's maintenance.. so, I guess we'll see come Thursday.

    I might win the lottery after this weeks drawing on Wednesday and buy everyone on the planet an ice cream cone and a Ferrari...We'll see after the drawing later this week.

    ...You holding your breath for a favorable outcome ?
    ;)
    KBF Lord MalaK
    Awoken Dead
    giphy.gif

    Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
  • dkeith2011dkeith2011 Member Posts: 595 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I'm still expecting a canned and totally insincere apology saying that they are sorry but the lost items can't be restored.

    This whole mess has already significantly impacted my spending on STO, a failure to restore lost items will certainly impact it further.
  • valenn1valenn1 Member Posts: 842 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    dkeith2011 wrote: »
    I'm still expecting a canned and totally insincere apology saying that they are sorry but the lost items can't be restored.

    This whole mess has already significantly impacted my spending on STO, a failure to restore lost items will certainly impact it further.

    Well... then i see villagers... with pitchforks!

    (And i want my stuff back! I cannot afford a suliban freighter without the revenue gained from my stored[lost?] DOFFs)
    Beta, LTA, CE, Multiple preorder Versions, all Addon Packs except AoY, nearly all KDF/Rom and ~50% of all Fedships, over 25 LockboxShips, Endurer of Atari's "Year of Hell", but...
    unfortunately:

    NOT LOYAL ENOUGH!!!
  • nacrananacrana Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I'm missing my Jem'Hadar Escort Carrier from the expired exchange mail...
    When i can get it back...? -.-
    ________________
    Greetings
    Nacrana
    Admiral @ raumflotte.de
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • therealfluffytherealfluffy Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Next time dont put all your eggs in one basket so to say, is all im saying.

    I will give you the benefit of a doubt and assume you're not trolling. The disturbing thing here is that Cryptic can arbitrarily delete anything they like and it's that part of the ToS I object to. This time it was items in mail. I've shown you two earlier cases where they deleted items in our inventories. What is next?

    "-We apologize to our users but for database performance reasons we've had to cut all bank inventory in half. All items stored in your bottom half of your bank is lost and for obvious reasons we can't return them to you since that would invalidate the performance enhancements. Any extra bank space, purchased with Zen, has been removed for the same reason. There will be no refund."

    Would this be ok too? Where do we draw the line? I know this is only a game and the items have no true value but they do represent an investment in time in this game. If Cryptic chose to arbitrarily delete items now and then, what incentive to they give us to play the game?
  • obligoblig Member Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    any news Devs?

    pls

    this is taking a bit too long now :rolleyes:
  • blackjackwidowblackjackwidow Member Posts: 572 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I will give you the benefit of a doubt and assume you're not trolling. The disturbing thing here is that Cryptic can arbitrarily delete anything they like and it's that part of the ToS I object to. This time it was items in mail. I've shown you two earlier cases where they deleted items in our inventories. What is next?

    "-We apologize to our users but for database performance reasons we've had to cut all bank inventory in half. All items stored in your bottom half of your bank is lost and for obvious reasons we can't return them to you since that would invalidate the performance enhancements. Any extra bank space, purchased with Zen, has been removed for the same reason. There will be no refund."

    Would this be ok too? Where do we draw the line? I know this is only a game and the items have no true value but they do represent an investment in time in this game. If Cryptic chose to arbitrarily delete items now and then, what incentive to they give us to play the game?

    Unfortunately, this.

    Awaiting Thursday's patch and hoping we're going to see some stuff back. Not holding my breath though.

    Aliella Hawklight, Divine Oracle Devoted Cleric
    "Whenever a time arises where clarity is desired, it is always wise to reflect on the sage within."
    ― Sereda Aleta Dailey

    DaiMon Moogie, U.S.S. Acquisition
    Rule of Acquisition #57: Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them.

    STO LTS since launch; NW player since 2014; ARC user - only when I have to put in codes for free stuff :)
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    ...If Cryptic chose to arbitrarily delete items now and then, what incentive to they give us to play the game?
    You can accuse them of arbitrarily making a upgrate to the mail system. That they did do (and did so stealthily by not adding any reference to it in the Release Notes), but Cryptic did not "arbitrarily delete items". It is a bug. A mistake. They are working to fix it and get the items back to you.

    :rolleyes:

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • blackjackwidowblackjackwidow Member Posts: 572 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    You can accuse them of arbitrarily making a upgrate to the mail system. That they did do (and did so stealthily by not adding any reference to it in the Release Notes), but Cryptic did not "arbitrarily delete items". It is a bug. A mistake. They are working to fix it and get the items back to you.

    :rolleyes:

    I agree, to a point. The biggest thing they did wrong was to not announce either change to the mail system, first, and then when they did this migration they apparently didn't check to see that stuff had moved correctly.

    I am not one to scream 'the devs are incompetent, off with their heads' usually. And this isn't because nothing has affected me before, because a lot of stuff has affected me in the past. I try to roll with the punches, I understand mistakes, I've made plenty of them myself.

    The whole forum switch-over was a perfect example. Same sort of stealth change that didn't really work out the way they intended.

    But still - if you are going to move a system, any system - you should do a back up of the existing one first. Then you check to make sure stuff from the old moved to the new. This obviously wasn't done, or not enough checking was done prior to rolling it out.

    Since the response was "we don't have the messages, but we still have the items since they're in a different database" one can infer there is no way to restore these systems after they're moved.

    I tend to think that if the same procedures were followed in an inventory system move it is quite possible that items could be lost as well. Intentional deletion? I don't really think so. Still, there is an argument to be made that 'arbitrary' - as in 'random' - deletion was a result and can happen at any time, regardless if it is an item in a bank, in the mail, or even your characters.

    Do I think someone went out there and 'arbitrarily' - as in 'personal whim' - deleted select mailboxes? No. Do I believe they're working on a solution. Probably. Do I have hope that my items will come back to me? Well, I have hope. There is always hope. :)

    Aliella Hawklight, Divine Oracle Devoted Cleric
    "Whenever a time arises where clarity is desired, it is always wise to reflect on the sage within."
    ― Sereda Aleta Dailey

    DaiMon Moogie, U.S.S. Acquisition
    Rule of Acquisition #57: Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them.

    STO LTS since launch; NW player since 2014; ARC user - only when I have to put in codes for free stuff :)
  • bigdamnheroes69bigdamnheroes69 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    lordmalak1 wrote: »
    I might win the lottery after this weeks drawing on Wednesday and buy everyone on the planet an ice cream cone and a Ferrari...We'll see after the drawing later this week.

    ...You holding your breath for a favorable outcome ?
    ;)

    Nope...just passing on the message. Hell... I'm still waiting for an official announcement about the limit changing to 100 items....
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    ...Intentional deletion? I don't really think so. Still, there is an argument to be made that 'arbitrary' - as in 'random' - deletion was a result and can happen at any time...
    Ah. You had intended to use arbitrary as simply a synonym for the word random without considering the implied will. The only part of arbitrary that means random is that the will involved selects without reason. It doesn't actually mean random, as in chaos, chance, or haphazard.

    Sorry, I don't mean to argue semantics. You've agreed you didn't think they willfully deleted mailboxes, and that was my point.

    As for you further discussion about them not having a backup, not making sure the system moves worked, etc. You're right. I'm totally with you on that. I work in IT system analysis, and before we ever rollout a system to Production, we test it exhaustively in-lab, once we're sure it works, we make back-ups and consider/plan fail-back contingencies... Only then do we push something Live.

    Computers/systems are only as good as their human creators. Bugs/mistakes happen. If/when something fails, there must be ways to immediately un-throw the switch.

    :cool:

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • oldkilldareoldkilldare Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    that's beut writin yer lordship but i just wants me stuff back...
  • lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Ah. You had intended to use arbitrary as simply a synonym for the word random without considering the implied will. The only part of arbitrary that means random is that the will involved selects without reason. It doesn't actually mean random, as in chaos, chance, or haphazard.

    Sorry, I don't mean to argue semantics. You've agreed you didn't think they willfully deleted mailboxes, and that was my point.

    As for you further discussion about them not having a backup, not making sure the system moves worked, etc. You're right. I'm totally with you on that. I work in IT system analysis, and before we ever rollout a system to Production, we test it exhaustively in-lab, once we're sure it works, we make back-ups and consider/plan fail-back contingencies... Only then do we push something Live.

    Computers/systems are only as good as their human creators. Bugs/mistakes happen. If/when something fails, there must be ways to immediately un-throw the switch.

    :cool:

    I'm at a loss how you can chastise me in one thread for not giving Cryptic some slack about the poor way they handled the mail fiasco yet you agree they did a poor job testing the updates in this thread.

    FYI, I too work in the IT industry, tho my primary job is hardware design with programming and testing as a secondary vocation.
    KBF Lord MalaK
    Awoken Dead
    giphy.gif

    Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
  • blackjackwidowblackjackwidow Member Posts: 572 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Ah. You had intended to use arbitrary as simply a synonym for the word random without considering the implied will.
    Well, wasn't me in the original message :). But yeah, semantics aside, as I said, I agree with you to a point - meaning the point that it wasn't on purpose. But unfortunately, it still seems that deletion of anything out there seems to be a very real possibility.

    Computers/systems are only as good as their human creators. Bugs/mistakes happen. If/when something fails, there must be ways to immediately un-throw the switch.

    Exactly - I also have a bit of technical background, and I've tried really hard not to start throwing out 'what you should have done' type of things. But I've already said quite a few times in this thread - bottom line, there was obviously no revert/undo/restore options. Unacceptable, regardless of your technical expertise.

    This whole mail fiasco is an unfortunate, massive FAIL.

    Aliella Hawklight, Divine Oracle Devoted Cleric
    "Whenever a time arises where clarity is desired, it is always wise to reflect on the sage within."
    ― Sereda Aleta Dailey

    DaiMon Moogie, U.S.S. Acquisition
    Rule of Acquisition #57: Good customers are as rare as latinum. Treasure them.

    STO LTS since launch; NW player since 2014; ARC user - only when I have to put in codes for free stuff :)
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    lordmalak1 wrote: »
    I'm at a loss how you can chastise me in one thread for not giving Cryptic some slack about the poor way they handled the mail fiasco yet you agree they did a poor job testing the updates in this thread...
    I wasn't talking to you about not giving them slack.

    In the other thread, about the Summer Event being Live, you complained that you couldn't play because of the Mail bug, I asked why, and you replied in hyperbolic falsehoods that Cryptic isn't talking about the bug, so I supplied you with the info you either missed or were intentionally ignoring.

    You also expressed a concern that your stuff was at risk of being lost if you logged. I countered that I could understand, but thought you were missing out on fun over something that was going to be fixed. I was, at that point, just stating an opinion.

    I apologize if you took any of that as (to define chastise) severely rebuking or punishing you. I do admit to the use of some mocking (like when using ALL CAPS to mimic your style), but that was only meant to add some levity.

    Anyway, sincerely... Sorry to have offended. :o

    To be clear:

    Do I think Cryptic buggered up the mail update when they lost our stuff and didn't have a quick back-up/restore procedure in place? Yes.

    Do I think it's right for people in the forums to complain that Cryptic isn't talking about the failure when clearly they are doing so? No.

    In the case of the former, I figure it's going to be fixed. We'll get our stuff back. I'm not worried about it. If we don't get our stuff back, then is the time to get the torches and pitchforks. :rolleyes:

    In the latter, I prefer to inform rather than let untruths spread. I suppose it could be argued that they aren't talking enough, or giving more updates... and I'd probably agree with that, depending what was said.
    lordmalak1 wrote: »
    NO, I don't trust them... ALL of us (including you) are STILL waiting for an admission they they have actually put a limit of 100 items into the mail system, or are you so enamored by their freebie ship bribe to remember.
    I've taken to reply to this from the other thread, because the topic belongs here.

    Please don't include me in your "ALL of us". Personally I'm not concerned with the New Undocumented 100 Item Mail Limit. Is it an inconvenience, yeah, but I'll overcome. Is it bad form that they didn't tell us about it in advance or even when it occurred. Absolutely. But I don't really care about it. I think in some thread I posted that it was crappy, ie voiced my opinion, but I'm not so worked up about either the limit or the lack of communication that I'm going to rant about it as so many have.

    To be clear again: I *DO* care about the bug/lost stuff, and if it's not returned, then I'll get a rope...

    I only got in these discussions because A) I was asking why you weren't playing, and B) I saw people spreading the wrong info about Cryptic, so I was making sure the correct info was out there.
    lordmalak1 wrote: »
    ...You've been here about as long as I have, and yet you still think they don't stretch the truth a bit , or outright lie ? ...
    I've been with STO since Feb 2010. Yes, I've seen them stretch the truth and/or change their minds about things. There might have been a lie or two.

    Judge me how you will, but I've never see them do it in so heinous a way that I distrust them as a company I'm willing to do business with. Most of these Big Issues I suspect you're referring to were mostly Spin or Changed Minds or Schedule Changes. Etc.

    Ultimately I know they are a company who does what they think will keep themselves in business. I'm not overtly fond of all their decisions, but I still support them on "99%" of the things they do, and continue to enjoy their product.

    It's a game. I'm here to have fun.
    ...bottom line, there was obviously no revert/undo/restore options. Unacceptable, regardless of your technical expertise.

    This whole mail fiasco is an unfortunate, massive FAIL.
    Heh. Agreed.

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    <snip>
    Please don't include me in your "ALL of us". Personally I'm not concerned with the New Undocumented 100 Item Mail Limit. Is it an inconvenience, yeah, but I'll overcome. Is it bad form that they didn't tell us about it in advance or even when it occurred. Absolutely. But I don't really care about it. <snip>

    Sorry if you feel my use of hyperbole and personal experience to speculate about my mail is unacceptable, but at this point it's all I have to go on. A message from the devs post mortem isn't what I've known and expected from them until recently. I'm sure the summer event is fun, but as this is now the second event I've missed since LoR launch because of game bugs (the first being a patch that corrupted the launcher among many things, that only a restored backup could fix- WITHOUT help from support who apparently we're too swamped with new bugs to be bothered with even acknowledging receipt of my support request). I'm beginning to realize that it could be time I put this game behind me and play something with less issues, but for some reason I still hang on to a hope that the problem may be fixed in a reasonable time, and the devs could be a little more forthcoming with information in the future.
    KBF Lord MalaK
    Awoken Dead
    giphy.gif

    Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
  • vinsinarvinsinar Member Posts: 55 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    lordmalak1 wrote: »
    and play something with less issues,

    Good luck with that, there isn't a game out there that doesn't have issues every time they patch/update the game.


    Not trying to rain on your parade but your better served by knowing that every game will have its issues so you adapt and move forward until it's fixed.
  • nacrananacrana Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    When comes my Jem'Hadar Heavy Escort Package back?!
    ________________
    Greetings
    Nacrana
    Admiral @ raumflotte.de
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    vinsinar wrote: »
    Good luck with that, there isn't a game out there that doesn't have issues every time they patch/update the game.


    Not trying to rain on your parade but your better served by knowing that every game will have its issues so you adapt and move forward until it's fixed.

    True, but I've always seen improvements in other games when they patch.
    ;)
    KBF Lord MalaK
    Awoken Dead
    giphy.gif

    Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
  • tarrennistarrennis Member Posts: 166 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I get new mail now, but I am missing a number of mails with attached items. I filed tickets but get no reply. I can't delete exchange sale expired emails either.

    I would still like to know if there is an officially published limit to item attachments.
  • lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    tarrennis wrote: »
    I get new mail now, but I am missing a number of mails with attached items. I filed tickets but get no reply. I can't delete exchange sale expired emails either.

    I would still like to know if there is an officially published limit to item attachments.

    Post 101 is as close as it's ever gotten to an admission that the mail system was changed. Bran tweeted information about the new limit, but the thread on this site with the quoted text from the tweet was closed.

    No official post about any new attachment limit was ever made on this site as far as I know.
    KBF Lord MalaK
    Awoken Dead
    giphy.gif

    Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    lordmalak1 wrote: »
    I want to be sure you read my post that Bran responded to, he responded to MAKE IT CLEAR the mods assertion that mail items in excess of the new limit could be be arbitrarily deleted, did not happen.

    It was damage control for the mods assumption that deletion could happen again, not to be apologetic for a mistake in programming. You understand the difference, right ?
    I read the posts. As I understand Brandon, he was trying to clear up any misconceptions, refute the unfounded assumptions, and admit to an unintended bug, but you are correct, he did not apologize.

    What is your point?

    :confused:

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Woot! The fix for the missing mail is on Tribble.
    [*]The mail items that went missing should now be returned to you! Please log in and check to make sure all of your items are back!

    Won't be long now before we have our stuffz back.

    Yay!

    :D

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
  • schizojrschizojr Member Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    I've been with STO since Feb 2010. Yes, I've seen them stretch the truth and/or change their minds about things. There might have been a lie or two.

    Judge me how you will, but I've never see them do it in so heinous a way that I distrust them as a company I'm willing to do business with. Most of these Big Issues I suspect you're referring to were mostly Spin or Changed Minds or Schedule Changes. Etc.

    Talking about streching the truth / change their minds / lying, you should read up on the "The History Of The Klingon Empire With Cryptic Studios" written up by Peregrine Falcon right here :
    http://sto.gamepedia.com/User:Peregrine_Falcon#The_History_Of_The_Klingon_Empire_With_Cryptic_Studios

    Be warned, its a massive read, but very complete and documented report of all that was said, done, and more specifically NOT done about the KDF faction.

    I know, its off the current topic. Won't do it again.
  • armitasarmitas Member Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    waiting for my old mails and items :mad:
  • goltzhargoltzhar Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    Why can't we get a more recent update on this issue.... even if it's the same answer. Just need some update.

    Edit:
    Just found on tribble:
    We will be bringing the Tribble server down for maintenance to apply a new update.
    ST.31.20130609a.36

    General:
    The mail items that went missing should now be returned to you! Please log in and check to make sure all of your items are back!
  • lordhavelocklordhavelock Member Posts: 2,248 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    schizojr wrote: »
    ...I know, its off the current topic. Won't do it again.
    Apparently you missed that I've been here since Feb 2010. I lived through/experienced most of that History, and I'm well aware of PF's post, too. I've read, and referenced it myself, many times.

    :cool:
    goltzhar wrote: »
    Just found on tribble:
    heh. I broke that info to this thread about three posts back from yours.

    :P

    You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
This discussion has been closed.