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Why loosing is OK in PvP. :)
vegie0
Member Posts: 480 Arc User
I am making this thread to help some of the players that go bonkers when they go Boom. Primarily by sharing the experiences I myself endured while getting pwned in Ker'rat and various queues
Lets begin,
I first started this game as a Fed Sci, with none other then my first VA rank ship... A Galaxy-X
. I did not even run Tac Team, as it seemed rather useless in the PvE (Missions) I had taked part in up to that point. I then ventured into Ker'rat for the first time, I went Boom at the first Alpha Strike.
Lessons Learned? Tac team is need to distribute shields
I then slowly started getting better, moved up to an Advanced Escort. I ran it as a Beam Scort with Faw. Did OK, as I had a much better Turn rate then my Galaxy-X did, better more Scientific Boff seating, and I ran Defence related skills like TT. I know make ppl go pew by spiraly upwards and mashing the space bar. Escorts with DHC could still Pew Pew me thou.
Lessons Learned? Movement is nice, but ability to pick a fight is very valuable.
I finaly made a Klink, now I was Pewing with the best of them. But I went splat soooo much more then other Klinks. This was because while yes the Cloak is nice, the 22k Hull I had was far less then I was used too.
Lessons Learned? Use the Cloak to run away from things I can not kill.
Now I have a Romulan, and 1000s of explosions later I am almost a decent PvPer. The problem is, I still die. I pew pew a lot now, and can schred most PvE players in meer seconds. But since I have gotten better (not just my equipment), I find it harder and harder to get better still. There is a skill cap that will be encountered at various times. This causes you to not get any better unless you seek out the best players in game and pew pew with them. It is the ONLY way to get better.
Lessons Learned? Fight players often and do not give up. As a great many of the PvP players will encourage you and often times help you to achieve your goals.
"Cliff Notes" Pew Pew is better then QQ
Lets begin,
I first started this game as a Fed Sci, with none other then my first VA rank ship... A Galaxy-X
. I did not even run Tac Team, as it seemed rather useless in the PvE (Missions) I had taked part in up to that point. I then ventured into Ker'rat for the first time, I went Boom at the first Alpha Strike.Lessons Learned? Tac team is need to distribute shields
I then slowly started getting better, moved up to an Advanced Escort. I ran it as a Beam Scort with Faw. Did OK, as I had a much better Turn rate then my Galaxy-X did, better more Scientific Boff seating, and I ran Defence related skills like TT. I know make ppl go pew by spiraly upwards and mashing the space bar. Escorts with DHC could still Pew Pew me thou
.Lessons Learned? Movement is nice, but ability to pick a fight is very valuable.
I finaly made a Klink, now I was Pewing with the best of them. But I went splat soooo much more then other Klinks
. This was because while yes the Cloak is nice, the 22k Hull I had was far less then I was used too.Lessons Learned? Use the Cloak to run away from things I can not kill.
Now I have a Romulan, and 1000s of explosions later I am almost a decent PvPer. The problem is, I still die. I pew pew a lot now, and can schred most PvE players in meer seconds. But since I have gotten better (not just my equipment), I find it harder and harder to get better still. There is a skill cap that will be encountered at various times. This causes you to not get any better unless you seek out the best players in game and pew pew with them. It is the ONLY way to get better.
Lessons Learned? Fight players often and do not give up. As a great many of the PvP players will encourage you and often times help you to achieve your goals.
"Cliff Notes" Pew Pew is better then QQ
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by vegie0 on
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Except in cases were this supposed "QQ" serves to fix exploited mechanics and devices, thus increase the quality of "PewPew" for all those not in the wrong. The superior.
Well thats a whole nother topic in its own right. But a lot of PvP is just players testing themselves. Unfortunately the PvE crowd sees death as a permanent thing, and never wishes to test themselves again. Then even develop a hatred for PvP players. Which causes even more problems as Ego, and in some cases the Froidian Id, prevents people from making friends.
As a Klink, it is also nice to receive dilithium for dying often
Jo Cox 22.6.1974 - 16.6.2016
Glad to see you are sticking with it, and also that you picked the best faction
Hello respawn and tac powers off cooldown
Have fun kill bad guys
-thrusters on full-
Meanwhile I am trying to keep Cruisers in PvP, I survive alpha strikes, pound the escorts only to see them constantly and effectively running away till their CDs are reset.
Still though PvP > PvE
PvE is easymode, the shock from taking a PvE ship into PvP is too traumatic for those types of players.
The Devs needs to take the builds from here and apply them to PvE NPC's.
Make the PvE crowd actually have to do more then tappy tap tap on the spacebar.
I actually became rather infamous for using the D'Deridex. And my Fed Sci still uses a Temporal Science vessel, or an Oddy. So it is not Escorts online yet. As I get blowed up all the time by well built Cruisers.
It's actually rewarding, in some ways. Team healing is one of the best feelings I get from playing a cruiser in 5v5. People depend on me, and I can help them.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
Curses upon you and all the Healing Hax Cruisers :eek:. You ruin my Alphas :P
I started out in beta as a Fed Science captain and continued to do that when the game went live. I played PvE for 2-3 months then decided to PvP. Well, my experience of PvP was: Boom, Boom, Boom, Boom, etc. continually died, hardly scratched anyones hull. I continued to try to figure out powers... PvE was so easy, and PvP I got wasted, time and time again.
Eventually I read on the forums that the Engineer had the best tanking abilities for the captain skills... so, I rerolled a Fed Engineer in a sci ship, and took as many shield and hull repair skills as I could.
Although, I continually died, it took people longer and longer to kill me until I found the right combinations and timing. I felt good, only took me 6-8 months of dying and I finally figured out how to survive 3-5 people at a time... only problem was, I couldn't kill anyone as I had all defense skills...
So, I began to slowly change out defense skills for offense so I could kill at least a couple people during a match.
Eventually, I switched to a cruiser (hated it), then switched to an escort... pretty much never went back to a sci ship or cruiser... I continued to PvP as an Escort for 3-6 months until I ran across an opponent that was super good (Reaper (Diablo) / SVK Elite), and convinced me to try a klingon instead. So, I created a klingon engineer in a BoP. Finally, I could fly an escort that I could put as much defense as I wanted on it, and yet could switch it out in battle (by cloaking).
Eventually, about a year and a half ago, I created a Tac captain, and finally found my calling... with all the time spent on figuring out defense skills, I was able to create escorts that could take a pounding, and yet, be able to kill others as well... Finally... 2+ years later...
Keep in mind, I learned all of this on my own. Nowdays, there is the OPvP channel, fleets, PvP BootCamp (where I learned a ton), to help you.
All I can say is never give up. Try try again. Eventually, you will be doing well and helping the next new PvP player...
Qapla
Obsidian
...yeahyeah... better have some nuc-ies with u and take em elsewhere from where i am ^^ ;D...
CUUCUUMBEER! "-With slight partigen with it."
Proud member or DPS-800 "-We kill dem mines with our scitter turrets."
1. Do your best, but don't stress out
2. Try to coordinate with your team, but don't think you're Picard taking command of the fleet
3. Be prepared to blow up, and don't waste vast amounts of time running away and hiding
4. Losing is OK, you still get your dilithium, and maybe you learned something
Basically, just get in there, fight it out, and don't sweat it too much. Improvement will come with time.
Good for you, you found something within the limitations imposed by the escort loving devs that make you happy.
Sadly for me, Star Trek is about Cruisers.
I did not grow up watching the USS Enterprise following escorts around being their private healbots.
Cruisers went out into deep space solo while escorts stayed home and watched the freighters.
PvP would be a whole lot better if Klingons stopped staying cloaked and then picking on someone who is engaging Borg cubes on Kerrat with an Alpha strike.
I would love to see an option to have all cloaks disabled to even up the field, perhaps a new map exclusively PvP.
Alas, most Klingons in PvP stay cloaked, and stay together, in my mind that makes them cowards!. Stand and fight grrrr (oo)
If your gonna PvP and test yourself, do not cloak, sure you will go boom often but you will learn a little more. Stop relying on cloaks, and dont think that your improving just because you destroyed a fed ship with sneak attacks.
Mmmmm Feds mostly are / were / noobs? This is from a KDF player comment. Well this same player probably does exactly what I posted above, likes to cloak, only attacks with a friend on an opponent who is allready under fire. Probably exclusively only goes into Kerrat as Klingon. I hereby challenge you to face me on Kerrat ' saxfire ' without your cloak - you can fall back if you want to, wont do you any good
Victory is life!
LOL, I hope this is ment as sarcasm lol. Seeing as my Cloak costs me 20k hull and 8k Shields >.<, but a lot of feds think that the cloak is an end all. My ships often times do not need a cloak so much as I could use MES. I could also get a Cruiser and tank/pew my way out of just about anything. I just enjoy the fun of cloak sneaking upon a target.
i always seem to start out as trying to be an irritant more than for the killing ppl, that way the good players will get ticked and keep after me the bad just go boom alot.
oh forgot the more you go boom the better the learning curve i think
To be quite honest with you, I believe that it is infinitely more satisfying to theorycraft ways to beat someone despite the cloak.
That said, PvP for me is very much about experimentation. I've tossed together so many builds in my head that I could never get the resources to try each one. Take a look at my signature - every one of those toons has a different design philosophy and has a different focus in mind. I still pop and lose on a regular basis.....but that's part of the fun. As someone studying to be an engineer, this is the essence of problem-solving - prototyping, testing, modifying the prototype, then testing some more. Whether KDF, fed, or Rom, revenge is truly a dish best served cold.
Although in Kerrat...I have an aversion towards shooting someone already engaging the Borg. Just doesn't feel very nice to me....a bit like kicking someone while they're down. That said, I'm not gonna rage if a KDFer takes the opportunity to take a few potshots while I'm engaged. Maybe it's because my connection tends to lag out at random, and it often resyncs just in time for me to become a vapor cloud.
I occassionally PVP, and have have benefitted from some sage advice from a fantastic sci pvp'er and a eng/tac pvp'er.
I prefer to run my Wells heal boat.
Now, while I agree it is OK to lose, and it is part of learning. Most times, to a PvP Initiate, it's not even close... rapid and repeated certain death awaits when the whiff of weakness leaks out to the opposing team.
That in and of itself, is demoralizing and can turn off prospective players.
What makes it worse are the griefers... be them on the initiates team, or the opposing team in zone chat. Its one thing to deal with defeat, and quite another to be humiliated... and watch the rest just sit back and enjoy the show. How often do you stand up when someone olse is getting griefed on?
There are some PvP'ers who honestly have gone out of their way to help others... then there are those that have gone out of their way to make it an inhospitable environment that I wouldn't recommend to my worst enemy.
There is also such a thing as constructive criticism, and help vs. well, being down right insulting. Had a conversation with one person, while I do fine in PvP (not stellar, but decent), who essentially told me to throw away everything, roll a new toon, which faction, which traits, which ship, which weapons, which doffs, which boff abilities (and pasives) otherwise I was wasteing my time in PvP... The person was trying to be helpful (I do recognize that), but in the end I was a tad insulted. More than a tad... very much insulted. Remember, while I die in PvP... I am a consistently good performer as well, usually amassing the top heal spot on my teams (avg 800k-1M of course depending on time, and whetehr or not its a premade that desimates us).
I do hope they make something of PvP... but lately, for the issues described above (be they directed at me, or other players)..I've cut back the time spent in PvP... its just not fun anymore.
Star Trek Online, Now with out the Trek....
How do i defend against 5 people wailing on me at the same time?
My excelsior can hold off 2 people, 3 at a push... but the entire team picking their targets? No way in hell. Yet ive seen oddy's and especially the recluse hold off entire teams for a good 3 or 4 minutes as their comrades come back from being one shot killed. I pug in PVP... a LOT.
For weeks now I have seen player after player in my teams, new to PVP say in team chat they they are quitting pvp as it it nothing more than a bad joke. For PVP to expand and at least give the new players a fighting chance... premade teams should NEVER... EVER be allowed to fight against a pug team.
As long as the premade's and semi premades with a couple of pugs continue to rule the roost in arena, then the new players to PVP will simply die over, and over and over again, and im sorry... saying its "ok to die in pvp" to someone new to PVP is just rubbing more salt in the wound.
Some premades are beatable. In any event, I wouldn't recommend the Arenas as a place to start learning about PvP. Try Kerrat, you will learn more there and if Fed, there will be more players to help you there. Capture & Hold is also nice place to start as premades don't usually go there. If you are in Arena and noticed the premades are bent on using every broken trick in the book, let them know in chat why you will warp out and they won't get the credit toward dilithium as a result. There is nothing more frustrating to these semi-cheaters to know they spammed all the consumables for nothing and can't complete the Arena. Enough people doing that, the said premade won't get their thrill and may end up trying to find another premade of equal footing instead of picking on pugs.
....it's all about the learning curve! prob is not pvp itself, or premades or whatever... prob is the way the game not prepares u for pvp.
indeed pve does it not in any way till some decent pvp tutorials/ mechanic-explanations-while-levelling/ temp-amb-style-cookie-cutter-missions takes that task of educating new pvp'ers away from the community (soon tm).
but u may also should notice that something like that is very unlikely to happen at all, and that "the community" indeed already does a great job! go pvp-bootcamp. anything there u'll need. or just ask ingame, most people will give advice.
p.s.: just guess of a pugteam of very experienced pvp'ers against any premade. u really think that premade always will bear the "we-win" flag?.... i don't think so ^^
"The weak...will perish." only people really interested in killing other players will adapt, learn etc... I pug mostly and i do not have any problem facing premade, actually premades is what makes me to play even more PvP, learning from coordinated group of people is most important one. Find weakness in CD's, analysing combat logs, analysing numbers and powers counters is beautiful!
Knowledge is power (power is power
This is all about passion to kill !
This would result in them queuing singly and only accepting when their entire team has a pop, which would in turn greatly annoy people who get a match, only to find that the match fails on account of lack of players because insufficient people accepted the pop.
On top of that, there's multiple levels of "premadeness", from "random people who are bored and decide to form a team of people who they think are semi-competent so they don't have to put up with smacktards", to "casual friends who always play together", to "serious teams that actually know what they're doing as a team and drill specifically for whoopass". At what point do such groups become "premades"? Do you want to stick a casual friendly group up against a team of professional asswhuppers every time? Because that's what happens with your "premade" queue. This is, of course, no better than the present situation, as it will quickly result in the "solution" as I previously mentioned, which will then proceed to annoy everyone else.