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Do you wanna fix the Dreadnought? Here is how...
pegasussgc
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
I have heard for a long time now that the Galaxy Dreadnought is getting saucer separation, personally I don't want that. What I'm about to suggest is going to stir up some controversy, but it needs to be said.
The Galaxy Dreadnought should get a battle cloak. Why? Because of how it helps the D'deridex. The D'deridex has a turn rate of 5, but when it's cloaked it has a turn rate nearly 10 times that. I've been flying the DD with my KDF allied Romulan and it works out great because of the battle cloak, I see no reason why the Galaxy Dreadnought shouldn't get this too.
Before anyone suggests that I'm asking for a battle cloak for the Defiant or any other ships, I'm not. I am against it, because other ships have enough advantages as it is.
The Battle-Cloak for the Galaxy Dreadnought is to fix the turn rate issue, nothing more, nothing less.
The Galaxy Dreadnought should get a battle cloak. Why? Because of how it helps the D'deridex. The D'deridex has a turn rate of 5, but when it's cloaked it has a turn rate nearly 10 times that. I've been flying the DD with my KDF allied Romulan and it works out great because of the battle cloak, I see no reason why the Galaxy Dreadnought shouldn't get this too.
Before anyone suggests that I'm asking for a battle cloak for the Defiant or any other ships, I'm not. I am against it, because other ships have enough advantages as it is.
The Battle-Cloak for the Galaxy Dreadnought is to fix the turn rate issue, nothing more, nothing less.
Post edited by pegasussgc on
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What i want is a lt.commander or a commander tac slot, so i can launch a decent amount of torpedos/powerfull beam overloads.
For a "battleship" it seems to be heavily boffed towards healing.
I can imagine some KDF players are going to object to this!
Plus, if the Gal-X got a Battle Cloak, people would start demanding the Defiant-R get one, too -- I don't think the TER/FTER needs a Battle Cloak either, but we'd see a storm of that exhausted topic brew up all over again.
I do think both ships need to have their regular cloak built-in though, as opposed to tied to a console, but that's probably a different conversation.
Lets take a look at the Vor'cha Retrofit and the Fleet Tor'kaht
Vor'cha - Cmd Eng, LTC Eng, Lt Tac, Ensign Tac, Lt Sci
Tor'kaht - Cmd Eng, LTC Tac, Lt Tac, Ensign Eng, Lt Univesal, +1 Tac Console
Hmm, the Vor'cha has the exact same BOff and console layout as both the Assault Cruiser and Dreadnought Cruiser.
The Assault Cruiser Refit swapped the LTC and Lt slots, and made the second Lt a Universal and the Fleet version is the same with a +1 Tac Console.
I'm thinking that the Dreadnought should receive the same treatment as the Tor'kaht, with or without it's Saucer Seperation. Give it enough Tac Slots to support DHCs if you want to use them.
yep, pretty much this
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
It'll likely be upgraded with 10% hull and shields, no boff seating changes and either an engineering or maybe tactical console update. The Fleet LSRV-R got tactical rather than sci, so it's possible they'd do the same with the Galaxy X.
I don't see any reason why the Galaxy X would get special treatment, unless they add in a Retrofit. At that point it wouldn't be an upgrade. It'd be an entirely new ship (with associated additional costs.)
The latter would be the better way for Cryptic to go since they'll make more money off it and could introduce a tactical version. Regardless of which direction they decide to go, people are going to complain anyway. To be honest, giving it seperation capability alone is a significant boost in effectiveness if it increases turning rate by 8 like the Oddy console does. I really wouldn't expect much more than that without a new ship being added.
Ironically, I'm willing to bet the seperation will require the Galaxy Retrofit console.
this ship as well as the galaxy retrofit got the best "special treatement" than any other ship in this game since the beguining, yes, the " gimp treatement".
so we suggest that cryptic remove that special treatment by making them on part with other ship, with a bo layout that is worth the price.
giving this ship a lt commander tact is just common sense for a ship meant for war.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
That would make sense, and Cryptic can't have that.
I wanted the saucer sep if only to add spice to the ship's gameplay. I advocated for it strongly.
I advocated the tac slot (and BOFF layout) changes as well for a fleet variant - the initial wasn't such a huge problem since there really wasn't a ship in the game I couldn't 1-shot anyway - but it would vastly support varied gameplay than 1-shot-the-noob-then-support-fire-for-3min-before-retreating-to-recloak-and-repeat (don't get me wrong, I had fun doing this).
Saucer sep would've allowed me to be more aggressive more continuously without much sacrifice - a huge buff, imho.
The rest? It just made sense, and appauling that Cryptic hadn't already made those changes.
But I gave up listening to Stahl's promises when he spouted about "big improvements to PvP" 2 years ago, then left the company, then came back - reitterating that "big changes to PvP" promise - and over a year after that, still nothing.
Does the Gal-X and Gal-R require attention? Yes, of course it does.
Will it ever come?
I don't know - ask Stahl and find out if you get a solid answer for the first time in the man's career.
yes, but i anderstand that cryptic give priority for more important things for the game expansion and overall succes than just this ship.
and somehow it a relief to think that they don't rush the launch of the fleet galaxy dreadnought if it is to make a well thought out product ( if that is really the case )
i have time, i have a lifetime suscription, i have been playing the game since launch without any interuption.
i got the quality of the jedi... patience.
over the past 3 years i have seen cryptic realise things that i wouldn't bielieve they were capable of in the first place.
a promise of daniel was realized ( a full klingon progression from 1 to 50 ) and some others.
we just need to be vocal about it, so that they don't forget, the important thing to me is not that these changes that we suggest come tomorow, but that they come.
it could be in 6 month, in 1 years, i don't care, i am not going anywhere and i am not changing my ship either, even if i have some in the shipyard.
let just continue to drive attention on this little part of the game, that is sufficient in the long run.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
"i (u)nderstand that cryptic give(s) priority (to) more important things (in) the game".
"a promise of daniel was realized (a full klingon progression from 1 to 50)".
The nature of the problem I speak of?
100% of Cryptic's resources - not some of, not piecemeal, not even the majority - ALL of Cryptic's resources are allocated toward the expansion of PvE.
"But Hakaishin, how is this a problem? PvE > PvP, right?"
...
I'll leave that one alone, but as to how it's a problem - The current iteration of the Dreadnought functions perfectly fine in PvE. Anyone can put together a rainbow-boat, randomized BOFFs, DOFFs, and white equipment and still perform reasonably well in (nearly) all PvE scenarios with minimal skill required.
Any increase in strength to the Dreadnought then becomes nothing more than fluff, and is ignored in favor of other PvE content.
You can only see the true shortcomings of the Dreadnought in PvP - and Cryptic has done EVERYTHING in their power to tell us without an official press release that PvP is never to be expanded upon, and is actually the black sheep of the title - an afterthought that the developers actually wish they never implemented to begin with.
Until that (PvP) is addressed - because the Dreadnought can and does perform in PvE - the Dreadnought will never be touched because the necessity isn't there.
Necessity facilitates action. No necessity = no action.
Even if action is taken, it is merely a band-aid solution - and ultimately solves nothing. The only area the ship falters is PvP, so even with a buff and changes made - without PvP being addressed on a grand scale, this becomes entirely self-defeating and utterly pointless.
Consider it along the same lines of the Neo-Con, Progressive, Conservative, Liberal, Democrat, and Republican response to liberty in foreign policy... "We're actively bombing the civilian populations every day (well, not EVERY day... 241 attacks in 365 days, but close enough) of no less than 9 countries to which we have no official declaration of war - we've killed in excess of 3,000 unarmed women and children with drone strikes against targets that have no congressional oversight nor judicial review...
"But the reason why terrorism exists is because we're such free, prosperous, and wonderful people! ...Nevermind that we are actually less free today than the American revolutionaries were when they went to war with Britain..."
...Yeah.
Unless the -problem- is addressed (not the symptom), there can be no cure.
Ever.
i don't demand or hope for such a huge "cure" because i don't bieleve it could be possible given the budget and priority of cryptic and perfect world.
just a band aid for this ship like the one many of us have suggest would be sufficient...at least to me it seem but we are growing bigger everyday as far as i can see.
in anycase your view on the subject seem a little pessimistic.
i believe that cryptic really want to improve pvp but ( and i known that this could sound like a joke) it is just not their priority for the moment.
but seing how well STO is performing lately, they have now the budget to undergo enhancement to the game at a much faster rate.
yes pve is their primary goal for the moment and it is justify since this game can be done solo and it is their primary source of revenu, but there will be a time when they will have to balance the direction of the game to pvp ( meaning 70% pve/ 30% pvp for example )
nothing last forever.
Nothing is lost, nothing is created, everything is transformed
don't worry, pvp will come, there even a reputation plan for it.
just have to be patient, hehe, just like tilk said, good things come to those who wait:)
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
True.
Good things do come to those that wait.
However, lol. Businesses that make people wait, lose customers. They don't gain them.
yes, generally, however here it daesn't seem to apply since sto have seen his player going up since the introduction of free to play, and even more with LOR.
so even if that make me sad a little it seem that cryptic have made the right choice until now for the prosperity of the game.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Yes but with the fleet Tor'Kaht feds got the fleet Assault Cruiser as its counterpart...I highly doubt the Galaxy Dread will be different boff layout with the fleet version the way they *love* Galaxy class ships...plus it will be getting the saucer separation.
The assault cruiser stands as the T4 ship that holds this particular layout. The dreadnought is the cstore holder of it, possibly being partly responsible for the Regent taking on a new layout. The fleet heavy cruiser holds this layout currently for Fleet cruisers. While Cryptic certainly has a tendency to keep Fleet boff layouts the same, their mandate to make equivalent tier ships unique in their layout easily supersedes this, therefore, a fleet dreadnought should have a new layout, even if only by switching a station to universal.
which cant even barley kill or not kill at all galaxy class dreadnought's or those federation science vessels. I think we all need battle cloak evenh the lowly cardassian galor as well
The average lifespan of an online title is 5-6 years (with a few exceptions - however this is fairly main-stay).
In those 3 years, not even so much as 1 new PvP map has been introduced. NOTHING in PvP has even been hinted at, outside of Stahl saying, "I have big plans for PvP".
...How long am I expected to grant the man before I take my money to another title that gives a damn about their PvPers (which I've already done as of August of last year... but same difference).
I would not be incorrect, based on current evidence, in citing that PvP in STO will never be more than an under-developed after-thought and has a VERY high possibility of never being expanded upon beyond its current state.
Because of this glaringly obvious fact, the Dreadnought, based on the reasons I stated in my previous post, will only receive (at best) minor, pathetic tweeks to adjust it for PvE use as Cryptic finds new ways to spit at the faces of some of their customers to cater to the rest who've already gotten everything they asked for since day 1.
I mean really there is little or no reason to get he dread over the Assault Cruiser Refit/fleet or the Fleet Heavy Cruiser Retrofit
The gas cans and the wide angle torp are better than the cloak and there is a fleet ship for it. Plus it has better turn rate, better Boff layout and almost the same hull. The Dread has the lance but I can't comment on how good that is, seems a narrow arc for such a slow ship.
So do something similar for the dread...
Add a unique weapon module like a powerful Phaser Turret, cannon or Beam array. Something on par with the wide angle torp which is a great mod because you can fire torps from broadside. I guess it could even be a unique dual phaser cannon since fitting cannons is it's thing even though it's slow.
The ship only really needs a small boost, even if you just give it 10% boost to hull and a Fleet option with 10 consoles to be considered a good ship?
1. They are power sinks. Cloaking devices in TOS were so power-hungry that the ship was incapable of warp speed while cloaked.
2. Faster moving cloaked ships are more easily detected. Picard was racing to the Preserver archive against two cloaked Romulan ships, one which was trying to get there ahead of him, and its warp drive imploded due to the strain of maintaining high enough power levels to move at high warp speed while cloaked. Both ships moving at high warp speed were no challenge for the Enterprise to detect at huge distances, but in another episode, Romulans moving at conservative speeds were only revealed when Picard lead a fleet of derelict starships on the Romulan/Klingon border to establish a tachyon detection grid.
There are many other examples of this, but a cloak shouldn't allow a ship to move or maneuver faster.
As for the Federation not suppose to have cloaking deivce, the Federation decided sometime during the Klingon-Federation war, As Cryptic would put it ''Although the Federation initially agreed to follow the treaty after the destruction of the Romulan homeworld, in early 2409 Starfleet was authorized to develop and implement cloaking technology on selected ships.'' and i don't think the Romulan Republic have the will or the power to enforce the ''Treaty of Algeron'' since they need the Federation and Klingon Empire to help fight against the Tal'Shiar.
I do not agree for all federation ships should have cloaking device because the Galaxy-X and Defiant has it. but i would agree that some future original cryptic fed C-store design ships could use it or Oberth Retrofit with a phasing cloaking device with a limited duration just like Rikers old ship the USS Pegasus.