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All KDF (Klingon designed) ships should have a battle-cloak
pegasussgc
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Every ship for the Romulan faction has a battle-cloak, and that's a good thing. However, I see no reason why the Klingon faction should not have every ship (of Klingon design) equipped with a battle-cloak. It is canon.
Post edited by pegasussgc on
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So I think it's okay that only Klingon Birds of Prey, the Vet ship and Romulan ships have a battlecloak.
This permits a more differentiated shiplist and keeps the factions somewhat unique.
Otherwise, how would you keep the Klingons and Romulans different enough?
Klingons essentially build good warships and slap a cloak on them while Romulans seem to build their ships around the cloak (the power-to-size ratio is important to keep the energy signature low while cloaked)
So let's let them keep that advantage.
New technology by itself does not make a Captain more effective in combat. New technology coupled with proper training and experience does.
Think about it... Bird... Bird of Prey.... Romulan
The D7 models (in "The Enterprise Incident") In for the Romulan warships are actually Klingon ships, used instead of the Romulan warbird or Bird-of-Prey model seen in the episode "Balance of Terror". Although in production order the model was first used (as a Klingon ship) in "Elaan of Troyius", in transmission order it is first seen in this episode. It was stated in the first draft of the script that the Romulans and Klingons had an exchange of technology, where Romulans received four Klingon heavy D7 battlecruisers and the Klingons were given Romulan cloaking technology.
The Bird of Prey was originally meant to be a Romulan ship but they changed the script to make it a Klingon ship.
However, that assumes that Klingons were somehow unable to improve upon that cloaking technology. . .which I find incredibly difficult to believe, as it seems Romulans were able to improve upon the warp technology they obtained. Only a person predisposed to think of Klingons as 'ignorant, dim-witted drunkards' would believe that they are incapable of improving the cloaking tech.
The Klingon Empire didn't get to where it is today by being unable to improve upon technology they acquired. So I'm somewhat less inclined to accept the logic of 'the Romulans invented the cloak, so it must be automatically better'.
They did, it's called the Bird-of-Prey from Star Trek 6 - The Undiscovered Country
Return of Ja'Dok Series (6 Part Series)
Enemy of the Exile Series (4 Part Series)
Task Force Ja'Dok Series (3 Part Series)
Now on the other hand.. "Standard" cloak should become a console power.. and make it an engineering console.. NOT a universal. And you know, while your at it. If you install 2 cloak consoles.. you can have battle cloak..
Klingon ships get the cloak as an intrinsic power...
Feds get cloak.. they'll be so happy.. They'll loose one to 2 engineering console slots for the ability. On some of the fed escorts that would mean no engineering consoles other then the cloak consoles.. They get cloak, but they also get a down side to the priv..
so anyway who how.. Cloaks.. Absolutly agree all Klingon ships should have cloak..Battle cloak..
regular cloak shifts to a console power availible to anyone who can find one or two of the consoles..
Advanced cloak how ever gets severly restricted.. but the single current ship that has it could use a touch more beef. Even with the advanced cloak that is still was fragile ship. How ever, the thought come to mind of having Klingon BOP's (any) be able to have the advanced cloak through the use of a console also. Giving up a console slot on a top tier Fleet BOP..to get advanced cloak.. I could live with that. Even if the same mechanic were used with current KDF ships being:
Add a cloak console to improve the type of cloak by one level (ie: none, basic, battle, advanced) escorts class/raiders can mount 2 consoles and advance by 2 types..
(yes, that does mean that a t-5 and plus Defiant/San Paulo can get to advanced cloak..)
Certainly make it availible to everyone... but, there's a price to pay in addition to the normal down sides of cloak with the loss of console slots to pay for the ability.. I'd even add in a power loss to all systems. Cloaks take power, and this would act as a "keeping a charge on the system" so its ready for instant use.
this concept speads the joy.... and the dissapointment... Feds wanna have a BOP analog..sure.. no problem..just give up a couple of engineering consoles for the priv!
Khemaraa sends.
Otherwise, I'm happy with the current setup.
No BoP captain worth a damn will ever find himself under a true alpha, and outside of that set of circumstances that almost never happens, going to cloak is as easy as pushing the button... If you can't hit cloak because you're afraid you're going to die, well that's not very Klingon (the fear does have a Romulan ring to it though)...
Seriously, in my Fleet Norgh I could be at 25% hull and I have no problem going to cloak, because my defense goes up to like 140% or something lulzy and everything after that is gravy... 24/25 times I'll live through that scenario...
I cloak while under attack while in my c-store B'rel and generally expect to survive, unless the enemy really knows how to play. And that thing is pretty much made out of paper.
I pop hazard emitters, brace for impact, evasive manouvres and cloak, and off I go. The little damage I do take despite the hefty defence and resistance boni is easily outhealed by HE, which will keep ticking under cloak to heal the damage already suffered.
You mean like the fact that (litereally) 3 minutes before he openend this thread, the OP opened one in the Fed shipyard forums proposing a battlecloak for the Dreadnought Cruiser...?;)
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=743221
I smell a connection there.
The history is when the Klings not KDF traded D7 designed hulls with the Roms for cloaking Technology.
USS WARRIOR NCC 1720 Commanding Officer
Star Trek Gamers
You going that logic the UFP starship cloak device should have phase cloak device. Since all fairness only power realist design work one. All practice reason the UFP allow use cloak mines not cloak ship. The fact issue came part warp drive show the cloak device being used was design for mines that did not have a warp drive and for some reason they could replication that kind cloak device.
One thing I would like to know is how does cryptic explain in their universe why there are no raptors being seen in service in any series other than enterprise. That being said they should be able to use battle cloaks I would just think they would just have a lower stealth value.
Also I could see the defiant using one I would just think like the raptor it would be a lower stealth value and longer cd due to they have not been able to experiment with them based on the treaty of algeron if I remember right.
They explained it back before the game was launched....and the hid the information as well a possbiel by removing it from their own website.
But there are still old backups available:
http://www.warcry.com/news/view/89845-Star-Trek-Online-Klingon-Raptor-Revealed
This also explains why the Somraw Raptor in STO is 100 meters longer than the one in "Enterprise": it's not the same ship.
It also explains why the Raptor in STO has nothing to do with the one in "Enterprise" in terms of function. There is was a scouting ship (the Birds-of-Prey of that time were their fighting ships) and personally I would have preferred them as a science-oriented ship in STO as well. It would have made an interesting dynamic: Feds have cruisers, escorts and light-cruiser based science ships; KDF have battlecruisers, BoPs as a line of lighter escorts and Raptors as destroyer-based science ships instead of light-cruiser based ones.*SIGH*
The one thing this does not explain is why the late 24th century Raptor has those cables in the hull. Those were a 22nd century hull-reinforcement feature. Today ships have SIFs for that.
Considering Klingons and Romulans give for their cloak, not many Klingon ships have battle cloak, and Romulan ships suffer a significant power loss for their Battle Cloak it isn't fair.
If the Fed(s) that do this can't work with the significant advantages they have been given over the years then don't pvp if they're gonna take the cheap and lame way out.
If a KDF or Romulan uses BC to attempt escape they run the risk of still dying defenseless as many ways exist to track a cloaked vessel and continue to attack it in its weakened state.
Logging out to escape dying is cheap as you are leaving the game alltogether, exploiting the system, and returning when you feel its safe. Kinda hard to use ingame measures to find a player who has left the game becuase they logged out.
Its easy to call them cheap though because to quit the game rather than die is a cheap move.
R.I.P
This. KDF raptors and BoPs are not the equal of Federation escorts in most situations. That's the truth of the matter. Even then, it's mostly the BoPs that do the running because that's pretty much what they're supposed to do outside of specific support-type builds that might have more tanking. Flying a BoP and not using the hell out of that battlecloak is a waste of a BoP.
The Romulans did field this design. D'vas Cruiser (Great Bird),Khinei'rrh-class Destroyer (Strongbird), there is also a frigate and a scout ship. The Frigate is known as the Greaterbrid and the scout is called the Bird of Prey. So there is actually eight classes of the BoP hull. The forward section of the BoP design can also be seen on the Reema-class Destroyer (Bright One), and the Galan Stelri-class Cruiser (Star Seeker).
This is just several examples how STO is not really going by established cannon from a previous game setup with legal clauses with Paramount Pictures.
It was mentioned in some writing that the Bird of Prey that Lord Kruge had was the first of these ship that was received from the Romulans. If you watch the film closely you will notice that the ship in this film and the Final Frontier fires off a plasma torpedo and not a photon torpedo as the one in the Undiscovered Country does. So this would place The Search for Spock and the Final Frontier near the end of the Klingon/Romulan treaty era.
I do wish STO would get their facts straight. They must be going by the Bennet Star Trek and not the Roddenberry Star Trek.
The only "established canon" in Star Trek is what's on screen in a movie or the various TV series. That's it. Hell, even Star Trek the animated series is more valid with regards to canon than the board game.
Furthermore, unless the "legal clauses" you refer to when referring to ST: TCS' deal with Paramount specifically state that whatever happens in the board game is canonical, then STO has exactly as much canonicity as ST:TCS. Which is to say "material approved" DOES NOT equate to "material is canonical". Again. ONLY what happened on the screen matters to CBS/Paramount.
Even furthermore, for STO to "get its facts straight" as you put it, would require negotiations with FASA, the makers of ST TCS. FASA licensed the rights to Star Trek boardgames from CBS/Paramount, just like Cryptic licensed the rights to a Star Trek MMO from CBS/Paramount. Unless specifically stated by CBS/Paramount, NEITHER is "more canonical" with regards to original material.
This is why STO is prevented from using original ship designs from games like Star Trek Armada, which Activision published. Because even though those games are based on IP owned by CBS/Paramount, original material from those games is owned by the games' IP owners, namely Activision and whoever else.
A lot of people forget that Cloaked players are still effected by AoE attacks. :P
a slightly better cloak for romulans harder to detect faster cooldown
feds console power but phase shift not a cloak. its been some time since rikers old ship got stuck in the rocks the feds should have been able to perfect the tech by now.
enhanced battle cloak like the rommies and the B'rel have is another story. the rommy enhanced cloak is nice my tvaro can fire torps like mad and never even get shot at. my B'rel is another thing. if you look at the time line it took about 40 years for the Klingons to advance the cloak they got from the rommies to the enhanced cloak that chang had. now what 200 years later Klingons are not supposed to have gotten it right yet?
It's silly to have anything other than battle cloak. Canon or not. The Defiant, Gal-x, and all KDF ships should have it IMO. To say, well this is a PvP only issue, anyone that has a battle cloak in PvE and doesn't use it regularly is missing out. Missing out on the game play fun of a cloaking ship and missing out on the massive damage bonus.
B: 'Tis a ZOMBIE thread! :P
C: Can everyone just get over the cloaking business already?
I'll just say the same thing I said in the Fed. section of the forum before this thread gets locked:
In order to portray an influence from the canon and the IP the Cryptic team made a decision to distinquish the cloaking tech availible to the factions. Therefore:
- The Federation, a faction that is not suposed to use cloaking technology at all, is able to use a regular cloak on a very small limited selection of ships, in a form of a console.
- The Klingon Empire, a faction that obtained cloaking technology via trading agreement with the Romulan Star Empire has the cloak built in their ships, but it's a regular cloak.
The exception for this being the raider class, which on the KDF side suffers heavily for having battlecloak and it's a unique and special class all around.
- The Romulan Republic, a faction whoose people invented the cloaking technology in the first place is able to use the most advanced form of cloaking - the battlecloak on all of their ships.
I tip my hat to Cryptic for making the decision to distinguish the cloaking tech between the factions. It is a good choice and the way it's implemented is not too shabby either.
Federation players should stop whining about integrated cloaks and Klingon players should stop whining about battlecloaks and learn to suck it up and live with it.