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Something I've wondered Since Nemesis
damzelltrill
Member Posts: 443 Arc User
Now we know what Reman females look like, and it turns out they aren't as horrific as I'd thought I have to wonder, are Remans and Romulans still genetically compatible or has Remus's conditions mutated them enough from vulcanoid norms to make such a cross breeding impossible?
A Trill, a Gorn, a Jem'Hadar, Bejoran and a Voth walk into a bar, and the Bartender asks "What is this a Joke?"
"Nope, just my away team" the trill replies before ordering a round for the bar.
"Nope, just my away team" the trill replies before ordering a round for the bar.
Post edited by damzelltrill on
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The problem of cultural/behavioral isolation is probably not so easily ignored. There's not likely to be much common ground for attraction, but... Well, if Rom can fall *** backwards through an equally immense cultural barrier I guess we can assume that sometime, somewhere, some Reman will too.
1) Vulcans and romulans are the same species.
2) 1600 years
3) ??? My speculation is that remans might be the native inhabitants to Remus due to their sensitivity to light from the planets lack or rotation.
4) Memory Alpha
As far as Remans, they're based on bats. As such I doubt they have any genetic relationship to Romulans or even proto-Vulcans. They were probably the primitive species that lived on Remus when the Vulans arrived on Romulus. The Remans were most likely enslaved and have been treated as inferiors ever since.
Expanding on that just a bit...
The background information and apocrypha on the Reman page of Memory Alpha has these two tidbits that seemingly clash:
1) John Logan (who created the idea of the Remans): "It seemed obvious to me that the Romulans would subjugate some other race to dig dilithium for them. Much too messy for our pristine and elegant Romulans."
2.) "According to the novel trilogy Vulcan's Soul, the Remans were descended from the telepathic Vulcans who refused to give up their abilities during the exodus to Romulus, and were enslaved by the majority non-telepaths who became the Romulans."
I can see why there is confusion.
cause sometimes its party time!
I've always thought this made two characters really oddly portrayed.
1. Saavik is half Vulcan, half Romulan. Doesn't that just mean she's Vulcan because she chose that way of life?
2. Sybok. When that bald dude on Nimbus III saw his ears, he was amazed and said, "You're a Vulcan!" Why didn't that guy just assume he was Romulan? And later, when Spock tells them about Sybok, Bones is all, "A passionate Vulcan!" Why didn't someone look at him and say, "You mean, like every Romulan we've ever met?"
1:Kind of like saying someone is half-English
2a: That would complicate the scene
2b: It's been established since the beginning that Vulcans have simmering passions underneath the logical visage. And, everyone probably knew that was just Bones busting Spock's chops yet again.
This is the movie where they traveled to the center of the galaxy so Kirk could say "What does God need with a starship?", and ended with them singing "Row Row Row Your Boat", so, take this movie as you will.
No canon females of the species. I was extrapolating from what the males looked like. I didn't take into account sexual dimorphism.
Though having actually made a reman and seen the facial options, some of them are more hideous then others.
"Nope, just my away team" the trill replies before ordering a round for the bar.
As a whole, over the course of the 2000 evolutionary difference it is safe to assume that Romulans no longer have the Vulcan strength or secondary eyelid due to the less hellish environment which is why it never came up in canon until the 2009 movie. Similarly it's why the Remans have much larger heads as well as greater telepathic abilities as well was possibly physically stronger which is why they were perfect shock troopers during the dominion war. While it might be possible that they can still interbreed it is highly unlikely due to cultural prejudices of Romulans against the physical appearance of the Remans. As shown in canon, since most of the species are in fact based on the common ancestor of the preservers, cross breeding is a fairly common thing so breeding between remans and romulans should in fact be easier than between vulcans and humans or humans and romulans.
i also discount the theory that remans are vulcans who refused to give up their telepathic powers as evolution takes millions of years, not thousands.
its also not possible for romulans in a short time unless assisted by outside help as they may have interbred with another race to lose the internal emotional suppression system, the ability to eat more then veg and give them a hard v ridge on their foreheads. in order for the vulcans to reach the point they could build ships and march under the raptors wings, they must has been around for more then 50,000 years if not more due to their violent nature before Surak and in order for them to be what they are they didnt evolve the same as us, they just changed their perception after the nuclear disaster on vulcan. so if anything they should be a bit like the romulans from TOS, no v ridge, and more emotionally stable thinking things a bit more logically.
Remans are tied to the romulan people since the vulcans found the planet to call home, it may have been the intent of these vulcans to live peacefully with the remans and perhaps asked a bit too much of the remans when they could of setup an agreement that remans worked and they are supported by the new government.. but the vulcans may have seen it as illogical after a short time and the remans grew fed up with this logic business. i dunno where it would of gone wrong, but remans ended up a slave race in the dilithium mines on remus and fueling the romulan warmachine. i would say that cosmic may have a point.
as for STO remans though, the remans in game look nothing like nemesis remans at all. so female or not, it doesnt change anything beyond the fact that remans in game are not represented properly.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
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The proto-Vulcans in TNG had the same forehead configuration as TNG Romulans. Not many Romulans were seen in ToS, so my theory, is that the forehead isactually a historically Vulcan trait, which was 'bred out' following the Separation, possibly simply due to the difference in political affiliation following genetic lines as has been seen historically many times... Over time, most Romulans typically retain the proto-Vulcan forehead, with a minority (possibly of 'sympathizer descent' rather than the traditional bloodline distinction'), having what is considered a 'more Vulcan' appearance, and Vulcans obviously appearing as they do...
With regards the Remans, I don't believe they are in any way evolved/mutated from
Romulans, but simply the indigenous people to Remus who were subjugated by the incoming Romulans (the Son'a integrated two additional race into their culture as a labor class) who enslaved them to mine dilithium. I find that more plausible, than the idea of Romulan geneticists taking the trouble to bio-engineer an off-shoot species simply to use them as slave-labor for such manual work and as canon-fodder.
Think of the difference between Vulcan and Romulan as religious rather then biological and it all makes sense.
I agree and I've got one to add to this list:
When Picard had a wounded Romulan soldier in the episode: "The Enemy"
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/The_Enemy_(episode)
Beverly was unable to treat the Romulan's injuries, but has no problem one would presume with Vulcans.
I like it, much better explanation than the rubbish they cacked out as part of the Novelverse. It makes far more sense for the differences between Vulcans and Romulans to have already existed prior to the Sundering, with their differing genetic and cultural background forming the basis for the philosophical divide.
The interesting question if we go with that interpretation is; are we talking the difference between a West African and a Northern European, ie superficial differences in physical appearance with only a minor amount of genetic drift, or something more along the lines of the difference between a Human and a Neanderthal, ie two distinct evolutionary branches with a recent common ancestor which can still interbreed to some extent, but have substantial physical and genetic deviation from one another?
Most of the references to the relationship between the two would suggest the former, but as someone mentioned Crusher's comments in "The Enemy" would make the latter more likely.
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