Re-balancing ships

mtgraves83 · June 2013

So I came across this post today -
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=566321
I figured I'd say my piece but by page 51, most people stop reading except for the people arguing.

Anyways, I had to agree with the person who posted the thread. Being and Engineering Captian, and a Star Trek fan it pains me to have to use escorts all the time just to beat missions considering the Galaxy is my favorite ship. Honestly if you are reading this ask your self... Could 5 Cruisers or 5 Science ships beat the Fleet Starbase Alert mission in the time limit? With out any Escorts... NO! Thus causing Eng and Sci players to use them. The best I've seen is 2 escorts, 2 cruisers and a science ship. and the only reason why we managed was because everyone knew how to use their ships and work as a team. But playing with players who really know how to work together is rare unless you only login with people you know. And as for the Borg missions, with no escorts, you might be able to beat it, if you have 5 hours to play it.

Now before someone starts complaining that, thats not the only reason people switch to escorts. Yes I know that some players just like those ships, and that some players strategically play as Eng or Sci characters and use the escorts so they have the Eng or Sci captian abilities... Yes, I know this...

Anyways, I'm fine with the escorts being as powerfull as they are... But I'd like to see Cryptic make some changes to the Cruisers and Science Vessels. For the older Fed ships and their refit versions. I think the KDF ships are fine, but I haven't used a lot of them so I don't know for sure.

Upgrades I think could help people want to use these ships more often:

Cruisers -
Larger Hull HP count & Faster hull repair times then current (larger crew means more people to fix things right?)
Extra power boost (Bigger ship, larger crew, better engine performance)
The bigger crusiers like the Galaxy and up should get 1 extra tac console slot then they have now to increase weapon power weither it be for DPS or weapon abilities. Its a cruiser, it should be some what powerful.
Better Eng BO abilities. (Admit it, theres like 4 or 5 good BO abilities for the engineers.)

Science -
More console slots.
I think science ships should have a 4th console section with 2 or 3 slots to use the special console players get from buying ships or unlocking drop boxes. This way they can use the Tac, Eng, and Sci slots for Tac, Eng, and Sci type of consoles. Now you're thinking, well that would make them OP... Its a science ship so they should be ability crazy since they don't have attack power and they deal with SCIENCE and break through technologies. They should have a S@*t ton of crazy abilities this way the can support the team cuz thats what medical/ science officers do on the ground, so should the ships.

In the beginnig of STO it was like this

Tac Escorts - Fast, Powerful attack, yet weak HP (Attacker)
Eng Cruiser - Slow, Mid attack power, High HP hard to kill (Tank)
Sci Vessel - Mid speed, low attack power, Mid HP (Support abilities/ Healer)

Now the escorts can be all of these things for them selves, yet other than being able to kill enemies rather quickly, they can't really do anything to support their fellow team mates due to the lack of Eng and Sci BO ability slots. I just think it would be nice to go back to each ship type being seriously different in these aspects.

Thanks for reading. Remember, this is my option so if you don't agree thats great... But thats your option. No need to start arguments.

mtgraves83 · June 2013

Oh, and as a side note. Who agrees with me that they should make the saucer seperation, cloak, Multi-vector, and armor plating consoles, devices instead of consoles that take up console slots... Or even give them their own special slot... Man theres just not enough slots to have cool abilities and increase your ship stats...

georgedp · June 2013

dont know about old times cause I m new, but for me escorts are still weak in defense (if your shields drop and have used your buffs you're dead if you dont run faster than the torpedos following you :P)
they dont have enough engineering consoles to increase both shields and armor like cruisers and their aim is to kill the target quicker than their shield drops or hull get holes ...or start running like hell....

cruisers can stay and fight without the need of running away and are "beating" the target with steady rate of fire...they dont even have to turn all the time...

havent use science vessels so dont know them enough to tell but I believe with the right "staff" they're descent opponents with all that exotic powers and buffs

I think things aren't as black as you see them

edit:

mtgraves83 wrote: »

Oh, and as a side note. Who agrees with me that they should make the saucer seperation, cloak, Multi-vector, and armor plating consoles, devices instead of consoles that take up console slots... Or even give them their own special slot... Man theres just not enough slots to have cool abilities and increase your ship stats...

I agree on that one

itstimeyoudie · June 2013

They just need to make escorts more fragile and completely remove speed tanking. Speed tanking makes no sense to me. I think weapons should have 100% change of hitting and then rebalance damage/crit chance as needed.

mtgraves83 · June 2013

I didn't in any way mean to make it sound that the escorts are all powerful. But I noticed that everyone uses them now. If And for the most part all the new ships being added are all Tac heavy.

I use Cruisers, and even druing a mission where there is no time limit, sure I can last longer than an escort, but not forever, and my weapons don't do enough damage to be really useful if my Tac team mates are all dead, eventually I either die too or the mission takes forever. In the end it all comes down to working as a team, but I still think the bigger Cruisers should have Hull HP over at least 42000 and an extra Tac console slot.

As for the Science ships, I don't use them enough to really have an opinion, I just went off of what I've heard for other players.

georgedp · June 2013

itstimeyoudie wrote: »

They just need to make escorts more fragile and completely remove speed tanking.

yes but then nobody would take escorts, there 's no fun in dying all the time...

mtgraves83 wrote: »

I didn't in any way mean to make it sound that the escorts are all powerful. But I noticed that everyone uses them now. If And for the most part all the new ships being added are all Tac heavy.

I use Cruisers, and even druing a mission where there is no time limit, sure I can last longer than an escort, but not forever, and my weapons don't do enough damage to be really useful if my Tac team mates are all dead, eventually I either die too or the mission takes forever. In the end it all comes down to working as a team, but I still think the bigger Cruisers should have Hull HP over at least 42000 and an extra Tac console slot.

As for the Science ships, I don't use them enough to really have an opinion, I just went off of what I've heard for other players.

i think thats because escorts are targeted more cause they make more damage, but you re right you shouldn't get killed, you supposed to be the tank that stays foot till escorts come back again from respawn.

You should be able to take the damage till that happens.
As for team play, If there is a healer in science ship escorts last more, being the targets and also delivering damage, and you can be alive and constantly firing from start to finish cause nobody targets you....
Some times when fighting with good teammates some guys do that and it really helps. (Along with the science powers that keep targets together or blind or powerless)
The problem for me is that first place should have more criteria than damage made. That would encourage more players to play like actually belong to a team and not just try to make more damage...

age03 · June 2013

You talk about criuser and sci ships but escort could use 1 more eng consol slot.

learn to use the edit button.

hereticknight085 · June 2013

age03 wrote: »

You talk about criuser and sci ships but escort could use 1 more eng consol slot.

learn to use the edit button.

Fleet Patrol Escort: 4 eng consoles
Fleet Qin Heavy Raptor: 4 eng consoles
Fleet Mogai Heavy Escort: 4 eng consoles

Fleet Assault Cruiser Refit: 4 eng consoles
Fleet Advanced Cruiser Refit: 4 eng consoles
Fleet Tor'kaht Battlecruiser Retrofit: 4 eng consoles

3 examples of escorts. And 3 cruisers. And they have equal eng consoles. So... no, escorts do not need more engi consoles.

haubrock · June 2013

This is a nice thread:
My opinion: You are completely right. The ships are unbalanced.
Look at the JemBug, in myopinion the most effective escort against other escorts and cruisers or sci ships.
If u are flying other escorts, you have a hard time taking out sci eng or whatever ship has good shield healing skills. If you e.g. fly the fleet defiant like me, u can think of ur ship as a paper and glass made torp that might die instantly if u are not really cautious.
Therefor I would suggest another improvement: no sound when buffing while cloaked...

To all the ppl that are now saying that that is the risk of flying adefiant: alright, but u can only stay alive with a fleetdefiant in a pvp match if u have a good healer in ur team or u run away everytime a bug or whatever focuses on u...

dknight0001 · June 2013

I was around at the beginning of STO, I can tell you Sci ships where the uber ships of the game, back when Feedback Pulse killed an Escort stupid enough to open fire on it. When Viral matrix was a death sentence and Sub Nuke's where unstoppable.

Sci got nerfed into the ground.

This game has never been good for the role of Healer in a Sci ship. Cruisers almost always made better healers and tanks at the same time.

But enough about the past.

I've done many an all Cruiser run in an Elite STF and never had a problem with it. The key is knowing how to build and use your ship. Honestly your suggestions throw balance completely out the window.

Not enough good Engineer powers, is probably true. But the goods ones are great EPtS, EPtW, DEM, A2Sif, RSP. A2Batt on the right build.

This game does need change but your ideas are just ridiculous.

Re-balancing ships

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