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D'Deridex Retrofit. Change Ensign Sci slot into Enisgn Universal.
ussdanube
Member Posts: 105 Arc User
I think they should change the Ensign Science slot on the D'Dreidex Retrofit into an ensign universal slot to help Mitigate the loss of use of tier 5 allied ships.
The Assault Cruiser BOFF Config is 1 CMDR ENG, 1 LT CMDR ENG, 1 LT SCI, 1 LT TAC, 1 ENS TAC. This BOFF config is identical to the Vor'Cha Battle cruiser retrofit and near identical to the Negh'Var and Exploration Cruiser Retrofit (minus Saucer Sep) which instead of the ENS TAC has ENS ENG and the Mirror Vor'Cha and the Star cruiser which has ENS SCI.
Now that you can no longer use Tier 5 Allied ships, making this change to the D'Deridex Retrofit would go a long way towards Personal BOFF Config choice. and also alleviates a big gap in BOFF Config availible to FED and KDF forces and not currently to ROM forces.
Guide:
ENS- EnsignLT - LieutenantLT CMDR - Lieutenant Commander
CMDR - Commander.
SCI - Science
ENG - Engineering
TAC - Tactical.
The Assault Cruiser BOFF Config is 1 CMDR ENG, 1 LT CMDR ENG, 1 LT SCI, 1 LT TAC, 1 ENS TAC. This BOFF config is identical to the Vor'Cha Battle cruiser retrofit and near identical to the Negh'Var and Exploration Cruiser Retrofit (minus Saucer Sep) which instead of the ENS TAC has ENS ENG and the Mirror Vor'Cha and the Star cruiser which has ENS SCI.
Now that you can no longer use Tier 5 Allied ships, making this change to the D'Deridex Retrofit would go a long way towards Personal BOFF Config choice. and also alleviates a big gap in BOFF Config availible to FED and KDF forces and not currently to ROM forces.
Guide:
ENS- EnsignLT - LieutenantLT CMDR - Lieutenant Commander
CMDR - Commander.
SCI - Science
ENG - Engineering
TAC - Tactical.
Post edited by ussdanube on
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T5(RA) T'varo Light Warbird Retrofit
T5(RA) Dhelan Warbird Retrofit
T5(VA) Mogai Heavy Warbird Retrofit
T5(VA) D'Deridex Warbird Battle Cruiser Retrofit
T5(VA) Haakona Advanced Warbird (Ha'apax upgrade - not on the blog list but in the store)
T5(F1) Fleet T'Varo Light Warbird Retrofit
T5(F2) Fleet Dhelan Warbird Retrofit
T5(F3) Fleet Mogai Heavy Warbird Retrofit
T5(F4) Fleet D'Deridex Warbird Battle Cruiser Retrofit
T5(F5) Fleet Ha'apax Advanced Warbird
T5(F5) Fleet Ha'apax Advanced Warbird Refit
Cardassian Galor Class Cruiser
Ferengi D'Kora Marauder
Tholian Orb Weaver
Tholian Recluse Carrier
Breen Chel Grett Warship (if the event is run again or the ship made available in another fashion)
Jem'Hadar Attack Ship
Jem'Hadar Heavy Escort Carrier
Jem'Hadar Dreadnought
Geko has mentioned additional ships, including the Romulan Science Vessel (the one that looks like the Scout Ship - about half the size of the Galaxy)...and we all know the Scimitar is coming at some point.
There will be additional non-faction Lockbox ships, etc, etc, etc.
Had you been talking about the T5(RA) Ha'apax and a lack of "free" ships at RA and the inability to select the "free" ships of your ally...well, that would have been one thing.
You pointed to a C-Store ship...and well, if one wants a diff BOFF layout(console layout) - there are what...19 or so choices one can make currently and more on the way?
edit: Some would say they're making progress on it, eh?
Went from a Galaxy Retro to a Mirror Vor'cha for BOFFs/consoles.
Course, the Ha'apax is a non-Fleet Fleet Heavy Cruiser Retro.
Going to be interesting with those turn rates...
Or, preferably Release D'deridex variants similar to the Odyssey, Andorian Escort and the Vesta lines.
For example All the D'deridex variants would have the 1 same unique console but they would all have different BOFF/Console configurations, D'Deridex Tactical, D'deridex Science, D'Deridex Engineering.
D'Deridex Tactical would replace the ensign sci bridge slot with an ensign tactical with the same current console config of 4 Eng, 2 Sci, 3 Tac.
D'deridex Science would keep the same current BOFF config with a different Console Config 4 Eng, 3 Sci, 2 Tac.
D'deridex Enginnering would have different BOFF and Console config replacing the Ensign Sci BOFF with and Ensign Eng slot. 5 Eng, 2 Sci, 2 Tac.
Current D'Deridex Retrofit Configuration.
BOFF
1 CMDR Engineering
1 LT CMDR Engineering
1 LT Tactical1 LT Science1 ENS Science
Console
4 Engineering2 Science3 Tactical
I agree. either that or Engineering, Science and Tactical variants of all ships. although that might be overstepping a line and be bad business.
Maybe ltcmdr universal to make it a more interesting space whale perhaps if it was balanced....
What Cryptic should consider before releasing anything.
There's 28 Fed choices (including the Chimera Vet reward and picking up the Steamrunner from Steam). There's 39 additional choices if one would consider Lockbox or Fleet vessels. I did not include either the Anniversary Ambassador (no longer available) nor the Chel Grett (no longer available). But were you, that would be the 69 ships available to Fed characters at 50.
There's 14 KDF choices (including the Peghqu' Vet reward). There's 31 additional choices if one would consider Lockbox or Fleet vessels. I did not include either the Anniversary Kamarag (no longer available) nor the Chel Grett (no longer available). But were you, that would be the 47 ships available to KDF characters at 50.
Romulans appear to have 6 choices at launch if they do not want a Fleet/Lockbox ship. They have another 13 if they do. If the Chel is made available again, then they'd be looking at 20 choices in comparison to the 47 for the KDF and 69 for the Federation.
Of those 69 ships potentially available to the Feds, 55 of them were added in the last year or so. Of those 47 ships potentially available to the KDF, 37 of them were added in the last year or so.
14 Fed choices and 10 KDF choices...before the F2P conversion. 19 choices for the Romulans potentially at launch with more to follow after the launch (Science Vessel, Scimitar 3pack, etc, etc, etc).
Just saying...
Yep, we've discussed that in regard to those pesky 3 En BOFF ships - and - I could see that being carried over to any of the T5 Retrofits as well as the Fleet Refits/Retrofits. Many may use it as whatever it was beforehand (outside of the 3somes), but it would still add that little bit of variety to them.
That's a little more complicated, and Cryptic has already said how such a change for other ships would cost them money. They want people to fly different ships...they want people to "buy" different ships. It's one of the reasons why you see that Uni LCdr only in special ships or special packs.
If they were to do contests to allow for kickstarter type things where they were to get the money upfront for such a ship (covering not only the cost of the ship, but whatever else that team may have been working on, as well as a profit - so at least twice would it actually cost for them to make it)...then perhaps they might do something like that.
Imagine monthly or quarterly contests, polls if you will, where the winning ship gets a kickstarter type thing going for it - when the goal is made - then within 2-4 weeks, tada - the three pack of ships is made available. Those that contributed, get their ships - say you have levels where they've bought one ship, bought the 3pack, or even contributed more and get a little extra something out of it, etc, etc, etc.
But for them to go through and do 3packs of various ships in the hopes that they'll recoup their investment would definitely be risky business. They're looking at three models, making sure the kitbash for it works with any existing kitbash - making sure the various skins and patterns work - making sure any of the special visuals from current gear and future gear appear correctly...yeah, there's a lot of work involved in doing something like that.
There is hope yet
There's 14 KDF choices (including the Peghqu' Vet reward). There's 31 additional choices if one would consider Lockbox or Fleet vessels. I did not include either the Anniversary Kamarag (no longer available) nor the Chel Grett (no longer available). But were you, that would be the 47 ships available to KDF characters at 50.
Romulans appear to have 6 choices at launch if they do not want a Fleet/Lockbox ship. They have another 13 if they do. If the Chel is made available again, then they'd be looking at 20 choices in comparison to the 47 for the KDF and 69 for the Federation.
Of those 69 ships potentially available to the Feds, 55 of them were added in the last year or so. Of those 47 ships potentially available to the KDF, 37 of them were added in the last year or so.
14 Fed choices and 10 KDF choices...before the F2P conversion. 19 choices for the Romulans potentially at launch with more to follow after the launch (Science Vessel, Scimitar 3pack, etc, etc, etc).
Just saying...
I was not counting fleet vessels. i was counting ALL Tier 5 ships that do not need to be obtained therough a fleet. Including all rear admiral ships. and Mirror ships, which you can pick off the exchange for a couple of hundred thousand energy credits, tops, and all Vice Admiral Ships. I did not include the lock box ships that would be near unobtainable to a casual player like the the box ships or the high end Lobi ships.
I've played this game since launch at 2010 so i know that, at launch, they're were no other ships apart from the ships you were given as you rank up, and i agree with all the devs, this game has come a hell of a long way since launch.
Yes most of the ships were added in the last year. it started with the Odyssey at Free to Play launch and continued from there.
I was only making a suggestion to replace the Ensign Science slot on tier 5 D'deridex warbird to an Ensign universal to help counter-balance the loss of certain BOFF configurations you would have otherwise, until recently be able to get from tier 5 ally ships already availible.
I never count ships that, to an average casual player, would be near unobtainable like the Cardassian Galor, or the Ferengi D'kora.
And i also stated that there are a lot of fleets struggling to get to the higher tiers and Cryptic have acknowledged this fact.
As such, a lot of players sadly will not be able to acces the Fleet D'deridex for a while.
I know that this technically shouldn't apply but it should also weigh into the descision making process made by CRYPTIC.
I agree on you're final point. As i stated to the comment made by dalnar83, It would be easier, But bad business. and as much as we as players enjoy playing STO, it is still a business.
Thank the lord i hear this. i hope it is a reality. I would never use the ENS Sci BOFF. I use an ambassador on my FED. which would have an identical BOFF layout. which is also Identical to the Assault cruiser and the Vor'Cha Retro.
Um, the current one is the change.
The D'Deridex went from a Galaxy to a Mirror Vor'cha.
The Mirror Ships come from lockboxes, so I included them with lockbox ships. Yes, the majority of them can be had for less than a million EC...compared to the 40-100+ million EC for the other lockbox vessels.
I'm not sure when you last looked at the prices for some of those Mirror Ships.
1.9m Mirror Qin
1.2m Mirror Vor'cha
0.3m Mirror Vo'Quv
0.5m Mirror Assault
0.4m Mirror Star
35k Mirror Patrol
35k Mirror Advanced
50k Mirror Recon
50k Mirror Deep
Yep, I grabbed all of mine back when they uber cheap. I remember complaining about how much the Mirror Vor'cha cost back then in comparison to the rest, lol. Then again, it went up as high as ~3m at one point. It's come down since. But yeah, those Mirror Patrol and Mirror Advanced aren't going to sell as well since so many folks level with an Escort and look for a different ship at T5. Hrmm, the Assault's lost 250k in price since last night when I put another one up for sale...bah.
I couldn't bring myself to play at launch. It just wasn't Star Trek to me...and to be honest, the ground was a total turnoff to me at that point. When they invited me again in 2011, I remember installing...going through the character creation...jumping once...and uninstalling. STO still doesn't feel like it had the "love" from the devs like CoH did before parting ways with Cryptic. I was on CoH like a fly on poo from before the start. I'd been following STO's development long before Perpetual collapsed...but it was easy to see that Cryptic was stuck with a deadline to try to release the game where it wouldn't be complete. Like being given a project by your boss that a co-worker had supposedly been working on for weeks that's due in 30 minutes...yeah, meh. But then again, STO's never been the complete cluster...er...mess that CO is.
I think some of my...hrmmm...whatever one might call it - attitude? - comes from the Romulans having access to the T1-T4 ships as is. They're just a money grab on Cryptic's part, which in general I wouldn't mind - they need money to keep the game going - but it's the discrepancies not only in power of the consoles but also the costs for the different factions for those consoles. The side that can buy the console on the Exchange pays far less than the side that has to buy the ship to get it.
There's also the aspect of how that fed into them not feeling quite like a complete faction as much as a subfaction for the two existing factions. With it this way, one can envision both the Federation and KDF as unwitting pawns of the Romulan Republic...rather than the Romulans being the charity cases or slaves of the Feds/KDF.
I sold a D'Kora a week or so ago. Used the EC to buy a JHEC and a bunch of keys to get Lobi for a toon that needed a Tachyo. It was the first ship like that I'd gotten out of a box, but I don't buy keys unless I need the Lobi for a Tachyo for a toon.
But yeah, the D'Kora is going for ~90m EC. The Galor is going for ~112m EC.
FSMs have dropped down to 8-9m. Keys are still hovering around ~1.5m.
500 Zen for a FSM. 5625 Zen or so for a D'Kora. 736,875 Dil or so for a D'Kora.
125 Zen for a Key. 7500 Zen or so for a D'Kora. 982,500 Dil or so for a D'Kora.
While there are definitely scams out there, there are respectable fleets that sell one-time or account-wide life access for much less. It's not that difficult to get a solo T1 shipyard to get the provisions you'd need.
I guess I think there's just more enjoyment out of something in working a little for it rather than it being easy to come by...less chance of taking it for granted, etc, etc, etc.
I still hate the inconsistency that kind of exists though, mind you. KDF BoPs/Raiders - Geko sees them as Assassins. He's described the Romulans as a form of Hybrid-Assassins. Yet, there's a distinct lack of Uni BOFF slots on them.
Business/Development aside - there's just...inconsistencies.
It's going to be somewhat interesting where they take the D'Deridex in the long run. I don't think they're done. There's way too many folks complaining, eh?
But looking at the comparable ships:
T4 Galaxy
T4 Galaxy Refit
T5 Galaxy Retrofit
T5 Galaxy Dreadnought
T5 Fleet Galaxy Retrofit
T5 Negh'Var
T5 Fleet Negh'Var
Geko's talked about a T5 Fleet Assault Negh'Var (Regent-like). There's been talk of a T5 Fleet Galaxy Dreadnought.
Here we are with the D'Deridex.
T4 D'Deridex
T4 D'Deridex Refit
T5 D'Deridex Retrofit
T5 Fleet D'Deridex Retrofit
Will there be a T5 Fleet Assault/Dreadnought D'Deridex down the road?
They've already said neither the D'Deridex nor Ha'apax is going to get the Ody/Bort treatment - they're not flagships. So we'll likely see that with the Scimitar, eh? Unless they pull a brand new ship out for that. They can't do the Andorian/Vesta thing for it because it does have those previous versions and the various Refits/Retrofits.
There's also the console from the Refit and Retrofit to consider, including whatever the 2pc set bonus is for running them, eh?
While I'm glad it's no longer the Galaxy, I'm not entirely sold on it being the Mirror Vor'cha. Not with that turn rate. One of the things that makes the Mirror Vor'cha work is the 10 Turn. 5.5/5 Turn? Hrmm, not sure how much turn the console adds - what the duration of that is...etc, etc, etc.
In the end though, it may just be a case of us having to adapt and finding what we can do with the ships rather than asking them to change the ship to something we're comfortable with...after all, we're not all comfortable flying the same ship to begin with - so there wouldn't be any agreement there anyway. Somebody would have to adapt or simply look elsewhere, eh?
This is something, that even if folks want other changes - I think we'll find most will be able to agree upon...well, outside of Cryptic.
I'd like to hope that they do make this change.
There is a big gaping hole in BOFF Configs what this minor change would cover.
Still, better having a sci than a eng.
There's been rumors that the EPtX changes are part of an overall change to Eng BOFFs and there might be more Eng En abilities coming down the road. Yes, I'm a sucker for those rumors...meh.
Refit and fleet versions should get same layout but make the Lt Eng universal since the Regent/fleet regent gets lt universal.
Although Exploration Cruiser Retrofit captains might be slightly more comfortable with the Haakona Advanced Warbird.
Who knows at this point. only time will tell. the fact is, i'm drifting from the point which is to Replace the Ensign Sci slot on the D'deridex Warbird battlecruiser Retrofit with an Ensign Universal BOFF slot.
Yes as was i. This was the reason i started this thread. i was planning to put a Beam Array Overload in the Ensign slot as i always do on my cruisers. as i always go for the cruisers with Assault Cruiser BOFF Config.
This ensign Sci slot really doesn't help that. I'm sure there are a lot of captains out there who would prefer that ensign slot to be an engineering slot, or like me to be a tactical slot. Then there are some who will indeed prefer it to be the Science slot.
My point is that people should be able to choose what they put in that slot. We are probably going to be putting down 2500 ZEN for it and the least you should be able to do is equip it's BOFF Config to something you're comfortable with from the FED or KDF, Weather it be from the Assault Cruiser, Star Cruiser, Galaxy Retrofit, Negh'Var, Vor'Cha or Mirror Vor'Cha it should be our choice what our Ensign BOFF is for the money we're paying.
Edit: my bad, thought the OP was talking about the free bird. Retrofit, I would support a universal station of some sort
Well, I agree that the D'deridex as it is doesn't look very appealing. Changing just the Ensign slot isn't enough for me. I would want something like this:
Commander Eng
Lt.Com. Universal
Lt. Sci
Lt. Tac
Ensign Universal