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PvE Regent: Why (some) cruisers are strong enough
mscowboy
Member Posts: 231 Arc User
Ooh, this'll be a long read, I hope some of you can stick with it! I've been flying in STO for a fairly long time now, though I haven't posted much. This will be my first build posted in its own thread, so be gentle. My favorite ships are cruisers, though I do have 9 captains and know how to fly almost anything. I am also a PvE player. After all this time I've finally come up with a build I could be proud to share. Currently I fly a cruiser which is far and away stronger than any I've flown before or even seen flown by others. They say that if you can find a good PvP build you will destroy PvE. I suppose that's true, but it remains that PvE is very different and you WILL perform much better if you build specifically for it (Read: APO becomes APB) and so without further ado:
The Entrada PvE Cruiser Build
Engineer Captain
Standard 100/50/25/25 power
Gear:
Borg set2 + Maco shield
Weapons:
Wide Angle Quantum + 7 Arrays (Disruptor)
Consoles:
Borg, 3 Neutronium
2 Field Gen
You can guess the tacs
Boff Powers:
Tac Team 1, Torp Spread 2, Attack Pattern Beta 2
Fire at Will 1
EmPower>Weapons 1, Reserve Shield Polarity 1, EmPower>Shields 3, Directed Energy Modulation 3
EmPower>Engines 1, Aux2batt 1
Hazard Emitters 1, Transfer Shield Strength 2
Doffs:
3x Aux2batt Technicians
1x DEM Systems Engineer
1x Shield Distribution
And my skill points as requested, for what they are worth: http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=EntradaBuildPvE_2584
I'm sure some parts of the build will raise some eyebrows, but let me start with a pedigree of feats I'm capable of in this ship, many of which are quite rare amongst cruiser captains and some I've simply never seen accomplished or attempted in a cruiser by another player.
In Infected I can:
-Hold aggro of all (nanite) spheres and stay alive
-Hold aggro of gate (inside its range) and/or Tac Cube and stay alive
In Khitomer I can:
-Solo a side, including destroying both cubes while letting no probes pass, in a timely fashion (Slows down a fair bit when having to break down the far transformer alone)
-Destroy a probe wave of ANY size in seconds with a single cast/volley of FAW+Torp Spread (Most escorts I see are slower on the waves.)
-Maintain target focus on a gate while singlehandedly taking out the probe waves entirely with FAW/Spread AOE, keeping uninterrupted DPS on the gate and fulfilling probe duty simultaneously
-Hold aggro on Donatra and survive indefinitely at 5km+ without resorting to flying out of range for a breather
In Cure I can:
-Destroy a BoP wave in seconds with a single cast/volley of FAW+Torp Spread
-Kill a Negh'Var and Raptor spawn with no help without dying
What I can't do: Stop nanite spheres when Infected goes wrong, delay raptor waves. A lack of crowd control is my only regret. I tried the Regent's vent console but every single time I needed it for the slow it immediately ignited prematurely. Naturally it sticks around until I trigger it every time I don't need the slow. You could swap a neutronium for vent theta, of course, but I'm not fond of the mere 50% slow.
How does it work? Lots and lots of weapon energy power. With 7 beam arrays, this ship has a great deal of damage potential but also some heavy power drain. I tend to sit around 93 weapon power mid-firing cycle with EmPW active.
As an Engineer I have two natural abilities to counteract this. Nadion Inversion negates nearly all of the weapon drain, while EPS power transfer effectively does the same, taking all those diminishing returns of 7 beams and turning it all into pure damage. EPS is slightly less effective than NI, but still counteracts drain enough to boost damage noticeably. These powers should not be combined; Nadion needs no help from EPS to do its thing, and EPS is better spent afterward for a combined 60 seconds of boosted DPS.
But that's not all! I mentioned a number of key feats involving destroying waves in a very expeditious manner. You can't rely on long cooldown captain powers for every wave. Luckily, the new Systems Engineer doff provides the same effect as Nadion Inversion for 8 seconds after using Directed Energy Manipulation. Just long enough for a very powerful Fire at Will. Just long enough to handily pop a probe/BoP wave in an instant so that you can go spend your valuable time somewhere else. Between NI, EPS, and aux2batt refreshed DEM, most of your casts of Fire at Will are boosted.
Otherwise the ship uses a fairly normal Aux2batt build. The huge cooldown reduction ensures you'll be using those super powered FAWs very frequently (you'll get two of them in for each uptime of NI and EPS), allows one copy of each Emp2etc to chain as though there were two of each, keeps long CD powers like RSP and DEM down to global, and all that jazz.
To address some concerns I'm sure will arise:
"No Aux2SIF on a cruiser? You must be a complete noob."
This was one of the hardest things to give up. I'm well aware of its role on a cruiser and have used it for a long time. One of its key advantages is low cooldown and high uptime for its armor boost, and yet even with the aux2batt timing conflict which more or less destroys this advantage I still ran Aux2SIF3 for the longest time on this ship. Removing it was a tentative, expiremental move to say the least, with every intention of quickly putting it back on, but I was delighted to find that my ability to tank every PvE threat in the game was not comprimised. It takes some skill to stay alive, but it's still very possible. You lose a decent transferable heal, but this is NOT a heal boat. Your job is to keep everyone alive by taking all the fire and not dying, not worrying about healing everyone else. Threat control is mandatory!
"Your only hull heals are HE1, Miracle Worker, and the borg set2 proc. Doesn't this make it hard to stay alive?"
Generally I have no problems. With all my shield heals and buffs it's easy to keep them up, and bleedthrough is manageable (you'd better be using resilient shields). Aux2batt keeps HE1 and TSS2 going every 30 seconds instead of 45. You must be proactive while tanking in this ship; there is no reacting to damage once it's done. You have to know when you're about to be taking large amounts of damage and have RSF up, Brace and tac team ready at a moments notice, etc.
"An offensively focused cruiser with an Engineer captain? This thread isn't even worth reading!"
The goal here is to make a PvE cruiser that is simultaneously A) As strong as it can possibly be and
Capable of surviving anything in the game. As you can probably tell by now, my defenses are tenuous at best. Without Engineer abilties, I'd pop in an instant. A tac captain would have to dedicate far more ship space to defensive powers and probably still wouldn't be able to survive as much. Given the choice between a Tactical cruiser loaded with defensive powers, and an Engineer cruiser loaded with offensive ones, I believe the latter is generally more effective on both fronts.
"Why this specific setup for the Engineer boffs? You could be using RSP3 and DEM1, or switch EmP>Engines for Eng team for some much needed hull heals."
The choice of DEM3 or RSP3 is subjective. Either would work fine. Since I can already survive everything PvE has to offer, I prefer the offensive option. The same applies for Eng team. I don't really need it, and it would conflict with the aux2batt refreshed tac team anyway. Because this ship is so much more capable in STFs than most other cruisers and doesn't need to just sit on probe duty, EmP>Engines is an excellent mobility booster that helps me get around the maps that much faster.
"Why the Regent? Everyone knows the Excelsior is the only offensive cruiser worth flying."
I love my Regent, and it is a very capable ship. You could say that this entire thread was written to hold the Regent up in one of the few builds it can pull off in a way that the Excelsior never could. The frightful AOE/PvE power that this cruiser holds is a result of the combined broadside power of (drain resisted) fire at will, wide angle torp spread, and APB. The Excelsior simply cannot run this setup (not without giving up tac team that is) and frankly there's nothing the Excelsior CAN run that can match the AOE broadside damage of this build. The Oddy could run a similar setup but would have to give up RSP, as well as the Galor (which would lose TSS2), but in both cases you'd need a Regent anyway for the wide angle quantum.
And finally, I'd love to hear your thoughts! Please try to be constructive. If all you have to offer is the implication that only PvP matters and any PvE focused build is a waste of effort, don't bother posting.
The Entrada PvE Cruiser Build
Engineer Captain
Standard 100/50/25/25 power
Gear:
Borg set2 + Maco shield
Weapons:
Wide Angle Quantum + 7 Arrays (Disruptor)
Consoles:
Borg, 3 Neutronium
2 Field Gen
You can guess the tacs
Boff Powers:
Tac Team 1, Torp Spread 2, Attack Pattern Beta 2
Fire at Will 1
EmPower>Weapons 1, Reserve Shield Polarity 1, EmPower>Shields 3, Directed Energy Modulation 3
EmPower>Engines 1, Aux2batt 1
Hazard Emitters 1, Transfer Shield Strength 2
Doffs:
3x Aux2batt Technicians
1x DEM Systems Engineer
1x Shield Distribution
And my skill points as requested, for what they are worth: http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=EntradaBuildPvE_2584
I'm sure some parts of the build will raise some eyebrows, but let me start with a pedigree of feats I'm capable of in this ship, many of which are quite rare amongst cruiser captains and some I've simply never seen accomplished or attempted in a cruiser by another player.
In Infected I can:
-Hold aggro of all (nanite) spheres and stay alive
-Hold aggro of gate (inside its range) and/or Tac Cube and stay alive
In Khitomer I can:
-Solo a side, including destroying both cubes while letting no probes pass, in a timely fashion (Slows down a fair bit when having to break down the far transformer alone)
-Destroy a probe wave of ANY size in seconds with a single cast/volley of FAW+Torp Spread (Most escorts I see are slower on the waves.)
-Maintain target focus on a gate while singlehandedly taking out the probe waves entirely with FAW/Spread AOE, keeping uninterrupted DPS on the gate and fulfilling probe duty simultaneously
-Hold aggro on Donatra and survive indefinitely at 5km+ without resorting to flying out of range for a breather
In Cure I can:
-Destroy a BoP wave in seconds with a single cast/volley of FAW+Torp Spread
-Kill a Negh'Var and Raptor spawn with no help without dying
What I can't do: Stop nanite spheres when Infected goes wrong, delay raptor waves. A lack of crowd control is my only regret. I tried the Regent's vent console but every single time I needed it for the slow it immediately ignited prematurely. Naturally it sticks around until I trigger it every time I don't need the slow. You could swap a neutronium for vent theta, of course, but I'm not fond of the mere 50% slow.
How does it work? Lots and lots of weapon energy power. With 7 beam arrays, this ship has a great deal of damage potential but also some heavy power drain. I tend to sit around 93 weapon power mid-firing cycle with EmPW active.
As an Engineer I have two natural abilities to counteract this. Nadion Inversion negates nearly all of the weapon drain, while EPS power transfer effectively does the same, taking all those diminishing returns of 7 beams and turning it all into pure damage. EPS is slightly less effective than NI, but still counteracts drain enough to boost damage noticeably. These powers should not be combined; Nadion needs no help from EPS to do its thing, and EPS is better spent afterward for a combined 60 seconds of boosted DPS.
But that's not all! I mentioned a number of key feats involving destroying waves in a very expeditious manner. You can't rely on long cooldown captain powers for every wave. Luckily, the new Systems Engineer doff provides the same effect as Nadion Inversion for 8 seconds after using Directed Energy Manipulation. Just long enough for a very powerful Fire at Will. Just long enough to handily pop a probe/BoP wave in an instant so that you can go spend your valuable time somewhere else. Between NI, EPS, and aux2batt refreshed DEM, most of your casts of Fire at Will are boosted.
Otherwise the ship uses a fairly normal Aux2batt build. The huge cooldown reduction ensures you'll be using those super powered FAWs very frequently (you'll get two of them in for each uptime of NI and EPS), allows one copy of each Emp2etc to chain as though there were two of each, keeps long CD powers like RSP and DEM down to global, and all that jazz.
To address some concerns I'm sure will arise:
"No Aux2SIF on a cruiser? You must be a complete noob."
This was one of the hardest things to give up. I'm well aware of its role on a cruiser and have used it for a long time. One of its key advantages is low cooldown and high uptime for its armor boost, and yet even with the aux2batt timing conflict which more or less destroys this advantage I still ran Aux2SIF3 for the longest time on this ship. Removing it was a tentative, expiremental move to say the least, with every intention of quickly putting it back on, but I was delighted to find that my ability to tank every PvE threat in the game was not comprimised. It takes some skill to stay alive, but it's still very possible. You lose a decent transferable heal, but this is NOT a heal boat. Your job is to keep everyone alive by taking all the fire and not dying, not worrying about healing everyone else. Threat control is mandatory!
"Your only hull heals are HE1, Miracle Worker, and the borg set2 proc. Doesn't this make it hard to stay alive?"
Generally I have no problems. With all my shield heals and buffs it's easy to keep them up, and bleedthrough is manageable (you'd better be using resilient shields). Aux2batt keeps HE1 and TSS2 going every 30 seconds instead of 45. You must be proactive while tanking in this ship; there is no reacting to damage once it's done. You have to know when you're about to be taking large amounts of damage and have RSF up, Brace and tac team ready at a moments notice, etc.
"An offensively focused cruiser with an Engineer captain? This thread isn't even worth reading!"
The goal here is to make a PvE cruiser that is simultaneously A) As strong as it can possibly be and
Capable of surviving anything in the game. As you can probably tell by now, my defenses are tenuous at best. Without Engineer abilties, I'd pop in an instant. A tac captain would have to dedicate far more ship space to defensive powers and probably still wouldn't be able to survive as much. Given the choice between a Tactical cruiser loaded with defensive powers, and an Engineer cruiser loaded with offensive ones, I believe the latter is generally more effective on both fronts."Why this specific setup for the Engineer boffs? You could be using RSP3 and DEM1, or switch EmP>Engines for Eng team for some much needed hull heals."
The choice of DEM3 or RSP3 is subjective. Either would work fine. Since I can already survive everything PvE has to offer, I prefer the offensive option. The same applies for Eng team. I don't really need it, and it would conflict with the aux2batt refreshed tac team anyway. Because this ship is so much more capable in STFs than most other cruisers and doesn't need to just sit on probe duty, EmP>Engines is an excellent mobility booster that helps me get around the maps that much faster.
"Why the Regent? Everyone knows the Excelsior is the only offensive cruiser worth flying."
I love my Regent, and it is a very capable ship. You could say that this entire thread was written to hold the Regent up in one of the few builds it can pull off in a way that the Excelsior never could. The frightful AOE/PvE power that this cruiser holds is a result of the combined broadside power of (drain resisted) fire at will, wide angle torp spread, and APB. The Excelsior simply cannot run this setup (not without giving up tac team that is) and frankly there's nothing the Excelsior CAN run that can match the AOE broadside damage of this build. The Oddy could run a similar setup but would have to give up RSP, as well as the Galor (which would lose TSS2), but in both cases you'd need a Regent anyway for the wide angle quantum.
And finally, I'd love to hear your thoughts! Please try to be constructive. If all you have to offer is the implication that only PvP matters and any PvE focused build is a waste of effort, don't bother posting.
Post edited by mscowboy on
0
Comments
but i really like what you can acclompish with a cruiser,you take damage and deal good damage.
See: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=484781 for my current build.
So maybe it doesn't have the torp power you do but that's just a minor note considering how I can solo almost anything the game can throw my way, i can also handle more damage once dealt than you can due to my damage limitation skills.
I have oddys( i use the sci mainly) and the regent, mirror assault(star) cruiser, and tac vesta and run the builds the same way. Now i am running fleet turrets in the vesta and that seems to work ok. I dont run cannons on anything, I spent more time lining up the shots that actually doing damage, so dual bb's and beam arrays are great.
On emergency powers I run ep2 weapons and ep2 shields only, 1 copy of each. Tac Team 1 and 2, torp spread, beam overload 1 and 2 and a few others I dont remember at the moment. Cruisers do great and do great damage for what they are. When I start learning how to build for pvp hopefully I will do more damage and still be able to load out the ship how I want to.
also i would only use 2 technician DOFFS (purple) and 2x aux2bat and compensate with a EPtAUX + aux batteries.
only 1 hull heal (HE) is in my opinion not enough for any cruiser...and if you are using your aux2bat in that very moment the HE is not even a strong HOT.
all in all, build works, but could work better in my opinion.
PS: the shield distribution doff is kind of worthless after the change they made...get a projectile doff for more rapid torp fire instead.
No need to be gentle that build is pretty solid and the regent is definitely one of the better cruiser options fedside. I plan on getting the fleet version if my fleet can ever get to tier 5 lol.
I actually think that the three Purple Tech Doffs helps the double Aux2Batt build work more smoothly. While its a matter of a second or two, i feel like it makes the whole sequence just flow a little better.
I agree, throwing ET into the mix is a good idea.
To clarify for you, OP, you have to include an EPtAux in the mix if you still want the second Aux2Batt to 'fuel' the power bonus to Weapons, Shields and Engines, because your Aux is still bottomed-out from the first Aux2Batt when the second one comes off the global cooldown.
I usually hit EPtAux right after i hit the 1st Aux2Batt, because I think the bonus power lasts for 30 seconds.
I am currently using the double aux2batt build on my Fleet Excelsior and it cooks. Tac Captain, 3x Single cannons and 1 quantorp fore, 4xturrets aft (all AP weapons). Using DEM as well on this build, but using RSP3: almost 15 sec of RSP is very nice. Usually using 2xOMEGA, plus MACO shield.
I was a little anxious about sinking 3 Eng Boff abilities (and 3 DOff slots!) into making the double aux2batt work, but I really like it for a cruiser.
It does require that you pay attention and think ahead, so you have aux energy for your heals/resists.
About the Doffs, I strongly endorse an Energy Weapon Officer that decreases cooldown on your beam weapon skills, it really makes a difference.
that why i came here to ask you this, even if this is not my type of play and that i will certainly not doing ( even remotly ) the same things as you do ( i don't spec my ships for pve but for pvp where other imperativ came into play ).
they are some players in my fleet that just do pve content only,and they might be very interested in this build.
so can you post your skillpoint layout too, so that the build is complete.
it will allow me to see what the idea behind this, and maybe tweak it a little.
and if your build can spread in pve content it could be a good things for this game.
it will, however, not change my personal opinion that for pvp, some cruisers need some kind of buff ( don't ask me how and how much, for now i don't known;) )
looking foward to see the skillpoint layout that you made for it.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
A one or two Aux2batt build is a good choice to consider, but I like how the single build works on the Regent. I do actually run a double aux2batt setup on my Chimera, as it is a wonderful ship for it. The regent would have to give up RSP for it though, and emergency to weapons is an important ability in resisting weapon drain, which is the focus of the build.
You're right about Eng Team though. Objectively I have to admit the ship would be better with it, so let's just call emergency to engines one of my guilty pleasures, along with those drive coil points
I'm going to be snatching that ship up just as soon as my fleet will allow it
Since I'm building specifically for PvE, APB is a must. It may not have a huge impact in PvP where well maintained shields make a hull debuff hard to capitalize on, but in PvE it is simply unmatched for the massive boost in damage it provides to you AND the team. Beam overload is also fairly bad in (Elite) PvE, but it's a good option to swap out for when going into PvP. I would still prefer APO for that though.
On the issue of Doffs, the lonely Shield Distribution officer slot is certainly open for experimentation. I wouldn't really recommend a CD doff for basic abilities; the Aux2batt technicians are enough, and adding more cooldown for just FAW will only result in desynchronizing its cooldown from torp spread and APB, messing up the burst cycle. I've also experimented with an Evasive Maneuvers CD doff just to make it easier to get around and run between cubes and probes faster when soloing in khit. I don't think the random extra single torpedo would make one projectile doff particularly worthwhile, though I suppose it could save you from a HY plasma if you're counting on spread to knock it down and you let a torp go just a moment too soon. A warp core engineer might be of some use, there shouldn't be any trouble keeping shields and weapons maxed anyway but at the very least it could give a handy Aux boost during a battery cycle.
Thank you very much for the kind words!
I'm not sure how it will look to the PvP elite, but here is my skill layout: http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=EntradaBuildPvE_2584
I've also added it to the initial post.
I hope your fleetmates get at least some benefit out of my ideas, and I hope you get to see some very fast, very smooth STF runs in the near future.
Not a PvP expert, but I'm under the impression that the reason why APB is weaker in PvP than in PvE is not just the increase in skill with shield distribution/tanking/etc. but also because the debuff is cleared by Tactical Team, which is carried by nearly every ship due to its extensive utility (auto-distribution, damage boost, clears APB/D and Boarding Party) for a single Ensign Tactical ability (of which there's otherwise only relatively weak Torpedo and Beam powers), and with the ability to run it at global cooldown for 66% uptime.
An excellent point that I completely forgot. Only get 5 seconds of APB in PvP if they are paying attention. Really is a useless ability there, isn't it?
I agree with you completely, the Excelsior was good, but the Regent is better.
Using AUX2BAT x 2 practically doubles up on the number of powers you can use, this is particularly important as far as tac powers are concerned. The Regent gets a base 4 while an Excelsior only gets 3, when doubled up it makes a HUGE difference.
Since I can get double the uptime on APO and use RCS consoles the slight turning advantage of the Excelsior hardly matters.