test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
PvP Balance Idea(s)
jovoloro
Member Posts: 24 Arc User
I have had a couple ideas with engineers.... For PvP.
Give an engineer a taunt ability to grab aggro or force the target to change target to the user of the ability. The target of the engineer is forced to swap target to the engineer for a small amount of time, say 5 secs, after 5 secs the target gets an immunity for 30 secs from all other taunts. The power would have a 45 sec or so cooldown.
This ability could be made into a BOFF skill or a seperate capt power, or a built in ability of all cruisers.
OR
Give an engineer the ability to tank for a group in pvp and pve... an ability to tranfer damage from a ally target to the engineer. Similar to Extend shields, but opperating in a different way. The engineer that uses this ability on an ally has 75% of there threat and 50% of there damage dealt to them transfered to the engineer that uses this ability. (This effect is already in-game with the mobius pet power, when the past copy is damaged that damage is transfered to you)
You could restrict the usage as such that the target of this power could not be affected by extend shields for balance. Build this power into EPS TRANSFER, or a seperate captn power.
OR
Give an Engineer a passive ability that scales with damage taken, the more damage an engineer takes the more damage the engineer deals. Equivelant to sensor analysis. Couple this with the threat generation in the skill tree, that would enable the engineer to do dps, and tank in pve/pvp. But it would not allow for the engineer to take the burst dps role from a tactical captn, instead only build on the preasure dps that it is designed to do. But based on incoming damage.
Let me know what you think of my ideas, I have been discussing these at length with my fleet mates in the 106TH fleet.
Twenty-Two.
Give an engineer a taunt ability to grab aggro or force the target to change target to the user of the ability. The target of the engineer is forced to swap target to the engineer for a small amount of time, say 5 secs, after 5 secs the target gets an immunity for 30 secs from all other taunts. The power would have a 45 sec or so cooldown.
This ability could be made into a BOFF skill or a seperate capt power, or a built in ability of all cruisers.
OR
Give an engineer the ability to tank for a group in pvp and pve... an ability to tranfer damage from a ally target to the engineer. Similar to Extend shields, but opperating in a different way. The engineer that uses this ability on an ally has 75% of there threat and 50% of there damage dealt to them transfered to the engineer that uses this ability. (This effect is already in-game with the mobius pet power, when the past copy is damaged that damage is transfered to you)
You could restrict the usage as such that the target of this power could not be affected by extend shields for balance. Build this power into EPS TRANSFER, or a seperate captn power.
OR
Give an Engineer a passive ability that scales with damage taken, the more damage an engineer takes the more damage the engineer deals. Equivelant to sensor analysis. Couple this with the threat generation in the skill tree, that would enable the engineer to do dps, and tank in pve/pvp. But it would not allow for the engineer to take the burst dps role from a tactical captn, instead only build on the preasure dps that it is designed to do. But based on incoming damage.
Let me know what you think of my ideas, I have been discussing these at length with my fleet mates in the 106TH fleet.
Twenty-Two.
Post edited by jovoloro on
0
Comments
Damage transfer would be suicide.
And er, the Tacs may not want the Eng to have GDF.
I'll say what I've said in most of the Eng discussions.
Look at the Eng Ground Abilities. Where are the space equivalents? Oddly enough, the answer tends to be that anybody has them, you can buy them from the Z-Store, or either Sci or Tac has them.
If Eng actually had those abilities back... I believe it would make a world of difference.
Barrier Generator, Carrier (Pets, Drones, etc), Subsystem Targeting, Turrets, some kind of heavy CD alpha nuke, support platforms, boosted mines, etc, etc, etc...
...yeah, all the stuff that's in the store or given to somebody else.
It's bogus.
edit: It's bogus - as in what they gave to everybody else - not your ideas. Just wanted to make sure that was clear. I may roll Sci all but exclusively now, but that's how I get the majority of what should be the Eng abilities.
[SIGPIC]http://file3.guildlaunch.net/205090/DVhexishensig.jpg[/SIGPIC]
Cruisers with mk x common in infected elite http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q82PqoFFxjc
Cruisers with good gear in infected elite http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMnFljZD9m8
Soloing Infected Elite http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaEFICFx4E8&feature=youtu.be
Extend shields to share shield damage with the caster imo.
The other comment made towards the damage transfer being suicide, no it wouldn`t be, just like extends shields, it would give engineers a reason to tank in pvp, all be it not an insane amount. A good example is the draw fire ability the tacs already have and don`t use. Give it to engineers work it into the damage/threat transfer ability and after so much damage it stops working. (early if nesscary).
I`m looking for ideas for the balance of class demands in pvp, right now engineers have limited viability group pvp, besides being cruiser healers, let them tank/taunt like they should.
I believe engineers should be tanking/aggro machines, in pve as they are and in pvp which they are not at the moment. I know I shouldn`t use wow as an example but in this case I can`t think of anything else, warriors have or had an ability to take damage in place of someone else, paladins had it too when they tanked, it would meld well with the class in sto as it is.
Like heavy beam arrays, new Tac boff abilities for beams, even a turn rate enertia buff.
All things that and egineer can use to increase tjier combat effectivenessn using thier existing captains powers and the new boff abilities and weapons.
It adds to the game without just specifically buffing just cruisers or engineers
R.I.P
Why?
Ground Abilities:
Reroute Power to Shields - sure, it buffs their shields.
Cover Shield - is a support ability.
Support Drone Fab - support ability.
Orbital Strike - assault/damage ability (should be Tac)
Engineering Proficiency - support ability.
BOFF Ground:
Chron Mines - damage/snare.
Quick Fix - buff/cleanse/repair...support.
Shield Recharge - heal.
Weapons Malfunction - debuff.
Reroute Power to Shields - same as noted above.
Shield Generator Fab - buff/heal.
Turret Fab - DPS pet.
Cover Shield - same as noted above.
Equipment Diagnostics - cleanse/buff.
Medical Generator Fab - buff/heal.
Quantum Mortar Fab - DPS pet.
Combat Supply - consumable generation.
Fuse Armor - debuff.
Support Drone Fab - same as noted above.
BOFF Space:
Emergency Power to X - self subsystem buff.
Engineering Team - heal/cleanse.
Aux to Bat - self power buff.
Aux to Damp - self buff.
Aux to Structural - buff/heal.
Boarding Party - special damage/disable.
Directed Energy Mod - shield pen buff.
Extend Shields - target heal/buff.
Reverse Shield Polarity - damage to shield conversion.
Aceton Beam - debuff/DoT.
Eject Warp Plasma - snare/DoT.
So exactly where are you seeing the Engineer as the tanking/aggro machines?
RSF, MW, NI, RSP, EPtS... and pretty much just in space? That's the case for them being the tanks?
So pretty much ignore everything that screams that an Engineer is the Support Career - that they're the ones that keep others alive, fix what the enemy's trying to break, help break the enemy, bring the toys, etc, etc, etc...?
Tac - DPS
Eng - Defensive Support/Offensive Support
Sci - Offensive Support/Defensive Support
The Eng Captain space abilities are borked compared to Tac and Sci. Tac Ground/Space matches the best - then Sci - with Eng being a joke.
There are plenty of ways to improve Engineers so that they're thought of as more than just healers in PvP - without making them something or trying to introduce the artificial Trinity into PvP.
Neither Tac nor Sci would be happy with that... so thread after thread, it tends to fall on deaf ears.
edit: For example, Subsystem Targeting on a Sci ship. Really? Who's going to be more familiar with how a starship works... the guy that works on them or... oh yeah...
There's a bit of this here and there... stuff that doesn't make sense.
That's a "little" bit of an understatement.
and these type of threads have gotten a "little" bit old. :P
R.I.P
What about a TAC in said cruiser...
My stomach is clear and my mind is full of bacon!
Then I really doth protest!
The ENG already have innate abilities. Any more would just be unreasonable.
And if these are Boff abilities, all classes can just train them too.
Back to the point... the idea was to find some balance in class make up in the 5v5 ques.... right now the only viable classes are tacs and science , tacs can dps better than an engineer, science can dps better than an engineer and bring in useful group oriented abilities, the engineer has the potential but falls short of being useful, yes I have heard they make good cruiser healers, so can a science with a subnuke. Engineer can be a tanking aggro machine, that would give them a role that would be desirable in pve/pvp.
I`m not suggesting applying all of my abilities, I tend to like the damage/aggro transfer ability more than the rest, But I had other ideas to so I shared them as well. The ideas I have seen, like heavy beam array for cruisers, would not help the engineer class imbalance, the class itself needs something that stands out, like alpha does for tacs, and subnuke does for sci.
Yeah I know there have been alot of ideas floating around about balance, alot of them have been focused in different areas, and alot here. I`m not asking to make the engineer a dps machine, or healing machine, those roles are taken, I wanna see them get a role that is unique to them. And tanking/aggro management seems to be the role we all share.
The engineers role as it is, self heals, self/group buffs (worthless however)(ex: eps transfer), preasure dps (to low to be a threat), nothing that is a strong or attractive power or role for pvp. The damage transfer would give them a role, couple that with more damage they take the more they deal effect.(this idea is not a go down fighting effect, its just like the warriors and paladins have in wow when they spec protection to maintain aggro) I`d say make that effect scale slowly, buffing up to 15% or 20% damage output, but falls off fast if you stop taking damage.
This would increase there preasure dps role at the same time becoming the tank for a group, a focused target to heal, and a threat in pvp.
"NPC" Intelligence vs. "PC" Intelligence
There's a guy wearing a ton of armor, the size of a house, that eats his Wheaties. Behind him, there's the guy that can toss so many heals - he can play with his little toe while watching reruns of Car 54, Where Are You?, and there's three guys that can do enough damage to level planets.
The "NPC" attacks the guy that it is least likely to be able to kill, while ignoring the guy keeping that guy alive and ignoring the three guys that are actually going to kill the "NPC"...
The "PC" kills the healer, kills the DPS, and then kills the tank.
Why is that so difficult to grasp? The Trinity - utilizing threat mechanics/aggro is a bogus system. Bringing that to PvP? Why? Why?? WHY???
The only thing separating the three career choices in space are the five innate abilities. The Eng space abilities fail to reflect the ground abilities in the same way that the Tac (almost perfect) and Sci do...
One can look at them and see what they were trying to do (failed to do, but were trying to do)...
Tac <--> Sci <--> Eng
Offense <--> Mix Offense/Defense <--> Defense
Defense does not mean being a Trinity Tank - doesn't mean artificial aggro/threat mechanics.
And it's not just all Defense. I wish I could find my other posts on this, but I'm too lazy to look, tbh.
Leave RSF and Engineering Fleet as is, but take a look at EPS_PT, NI, and MW.
Make EPS_PT a drain field instead of a ST EPS buff.
Make NI an AoE drain resist buff instead of a ST drain buff.
Make MW launch a support platform that launches drones.
As is, the Eng Space Abilities make little sense when looking at the Ground Abilities. Tac matches up very well, one can see what they were doing with Sci, but when it comes to Eng - it makes no sense. It's as if they tried to squeeze a Trinity Tank in at the last moment...
Ground -
Tac = DPS
Eng = Offensive Support/Defensive Support
Sci = Defensive Support/Offensive Support
Space -
Tac = DPS
Eng = Defensive Support/Offensive Support
Sci = Offensive Support/Defensive Support
The primary/secondary for Eng/Sci switch whether you're on the ground or in space.
None of it involves any sort of Trinity Tank.
Ship selection, BOFF/DOFF choice, team comps, etc - would offer additional variables so somebody did not feel locked into play "X" when they want to play "Y"... the min/max crowd would invariably argue that "A" is better at "X" while "B" is better at "Y" - but at that level, outside of fail builds - it should be relatively close and not match deciding.