If you read the descriptions of the vet ships you'll see they refer to them being '1000-day veteran' ships - all along these were intended (right up until the last minute) very specifically as rewards for 1000-day veterans.
At the last minute somebody decided to monetize them (as they have pretty much every last aspect of this game).
Those LTS players that had months to go to get their ships got a nice surprise and I'm happy for them.
But Cryptic didn't do this for them. It certainly didn't do it for the 1000-day vets. It did it to make a fast buck. And I find that distasteful - if you think that's just good business sense then fine. I don't - and I won't be supporting them with my money any more as a result.
Except ALL Vet Rewafrds were monetized from the start in that you had to pay a montkly subscription (or buy an LTS) to acrue 'days' towards getting them. It was like that from day 1 of the F2P relaunch; so again, if you're upset about the monetization of these rewards; I'm amazed you were spending any money on STO after the F2P launch.
Also, remember, while anyone who bought an LTS from day 1 up to the point of this most recent LTS sale does indeed get all 1000 day vet rewards immediately - those who continue to subscribe month to month (some paying a low a $10 a munth, plus the $5.00 ZP stipend - bringing their cost to $5 a month if they buy from the C-Store) are still acruing days and unlocking rewards as they 'hit' them.
Again, I don't get the outrage of some of my other early apodting LTS bretheren.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
They are still veteran rewards because they are still earned by gold players with long experience.
The LTS perk does not change that fact as the game still has non-LTS gold members.
They can not by definition be veteran rewards when someone starting today can instantly gain them. They don't fit the definition and to be frank I find it insulting that comparatively young accounts can now prance around with the full gauntlet of 1000 day veteran rewards. Just because they can afford to shell out for a LTS.
They can not by definition be veteran rewards when someone starting today can instantly gain them. They don't fit the definition and to be frank I find it insulting that comparatively young accounts can now prance around with the full gauntlet of 1000 day veteran rewards. Just because they can afford to shell out for a LTS.
Well, they should have taken the word "veteran" out when they went F2P since you then had veterans who didn't get rewards... and getting the rewards was always tied to anniversary rather than any measure of experience. It's an argument over whether absolute definitions for words matter.
EDIT: No offense intended. Best to take any issues to PMs.
I can't help but feel putting the vet reward up for sale is nothing but a way for then to make some quick cash to pay for the upcoming seasons. Remember nothing is sacred in the business world. The only way you are going to get PWE/Cryptic to start listening to its players is to mess with their cash flow. You start having players yank their scrips and boycott the c-store for a bit we might start getting some love.
Well, they should have taken the word "veteran" out when they went F2P since you then had veterans who didn't get rewards... and getting the rewards was always tied to anniversary rather than any measure of experience. It's an argument over whether absolute definitions for words matter.
Half these discussions wind up feeling like Asperger's support group double booked a convention center with a marketing trade show.
A statement like this really describes what kind of person you are. This is just F'd up and should not be made into a joke.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] EXPLORE.
Dec '07 Account I EARNED 1000 days...I didn't BUY it! New LTS=Death to Vet.System: 10/10/12 Never Forget Something should be done for those who cared enough to have a 1000+ day sub.
Well, they should have taken the word "veteran" out when they went F2P since you then had veterans who didn't get rewards... and getting the rewards was always tied to anniversary rather than any measure of experience. It's an argument over whether absolute definitions for words matter.
Half these discussions wind up feeling like Asperger's support group double booked a convention center with a marketing trade show.
Speaking of "Anniversary," it implies a year's worth of dedication or celebration of one's beginnings.
I like the way ARENANET in their game Guild Wars have you earn a gift box every year per character on the day that particular character was created. Every Year that one particular toon would earn a special gift box that contained a tradable unique mini pet ranging from common to ultra rare. Its a way to reward their veteran players - which everyone gains as their characters age.
Cryptic's Veteran reward program in its very essence is named wrong. The term now is misleading since it is associated with currency. Meaning like the OP stated, that you invest a set amount of dollars to gain a unique status, which is labeled Veteran.
The confusion lies in the term veteran - but keep in mind pre-PWE the term was appropriately applied because you earn Vet points as your account aged. Hence the 100days to 1,000days.
Post PWE, Vet days lost relevence since they are now operating under an entirely different set of rules. Keep in mind that the Vet rewards themselves were changed here and there.
Remember the ship token debacle, also the Dilithium earnings under the vet rewards program that some received and others were S.O.L.
The Lifer program should remain just that - The Lifer program. - Just remove the Vet terminology. It should have never had a Vet Day attached to it.
Vet days should be earned by all players, whether you're silver, gold, or lifer.
LIFERS, aside from subscription being paid off, already were neglected by Cryptic in regards to gaining perks - Greatly lacking. This became very apparent at the dawn of F2P - where many former Gold members that had switched to silver account maintained some of their former perks.
Anyone buying an LTS now should have to wait 1000 days to get the 1000 day reward just like the LTS who bought their LTS pre-launch as I and others did.
Post PWE, Vet days lost relevence since they are now operating under an entirely different set of rules. Keep in mind that the Vet rewards themselves were changed here and there.
I don't see it as ever really applying to "veteran" status.
Veteran implies DOING something. Vet rewards were always just about paying and waiting. They never measured activity.
"Customer Loyalty" would be more accurate. And that's always what it was. Never a measure of DOING anything.
Anyone buying an LTS now should have to wait 1000 days to get the 1000 day reward just like the LTS who bought their LTS pre-launch as I and others did.
waiting is silly if you have paid for something. why dont you get another LTS; i just got my 3rd because it really is a good deal now. what a feeling, logging in, doing the tutorial mission and then shortly thereafter seeing all those rewards pop that you just paid a lot of money for instead of having to wait like those choosing to pay by installments as it were; wonderful. It still sends shivers down my back thinking about it...
im being a little silly here but it really is a great time to get LTS or 2. having two accounts can be very useful...
waiting is silly if you have paid for something. why dont you get another LTS; i just got my 3rd because it really is a good deal now. what a feeling, logging in, doing the tutorial mission and then shortly thereafter seeing all those rewards pop that you just paid a lot of money for instead of having to wait like those choosing to pay by installments as it were; wonderful. It still sends shivers down my back thinking about it...
im being a little silly here but it really is a great time to get LTS or 2. having two accounts can be very useful...
That is a clever idea. May i also add you are one handsome bloke!!!
Anyone buying an LTS now should have to wait 1000 days to get the 1000 day reward just like the LTS who bought their LTS pre-launch as I and others did.
soooooooooo this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 100 agree
In both scenarios, the player hasn't done anything to earn these rewards in terms of gameplay. They haven't been playing. They've shelled out cash, either in a lump sum or slowly over time. Yet they get the Veteran Rewards.
What does it all mean?
It means that Veteran Rewards, in this and all MMOs, have always been rewards for money invested, not time spent in-game. You get them whether you play for five minutes a month or five hours a day.
When you look at it like that, this most recent move by Cryptic makes perfect sense. The person has laid out the money for the lifetime sub. Why make them wait for what they've paid for? They're going to get it regardless of how much or how often they play.
It also means that the Veteran Rewards suffer from being incorrectly named. Naming them Veteran Rewards implies that the reward is for investing time, which, as we have just demonstrated, is false. It's about invested money, not time. In this writer's opinion they should be named something else, something that implies the player has elected to support Cryptic with their dollars.
Or how about this scenario;
You subscribe to the game and the next day your house is hit by a meteor and burns down with all your possessions. It takes 1000 days to get the insurance money and rebuild. When you finally get to log on to the game again...wham! You have your reward for doing nothing.
Or how about this;
You get married and your new wife won't let you play the game. 1000 days later you catch her with the pool boy and get divorced. You log into the game and wham! You get the reward for doing nothing.
Here we go;
You're abducted by terrorists and tortured mercilessly for 1000 days until Special Forces can break in and rescue you. When you get back home, log on to the game and wham! There is your reward for doing nothing.
Or how about this;
You just play the game and stop worrying about what other people get.
Sheesh - answer a question with another question......
That's the point - it's not. Your money isn't better than his. His isn't better than yours. You both paid the same amount of money for the same product.
only he or she dont have to wait to me thats saying there money is better then mine
Good to see we now play: Animal Farm Online; to an extent.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] EXPLORE.
Dec '07 Account I EARNED 1000 days...I didn't BUY it! New LTS=Death to Vet.System: 10/10/12 Never Forget Something should be done for those who cared enough to have a 1000+ day sub.
Sheesh - answer a question with another question......
That's the point - it's not. Your money isn't better than his. His isn't better than yours. You both paid the same amount of money for the same product.
Added to this: the things old vets had to wait for DIDN'T exist, which is the real reason we waited for them.
I suggested having lifers automatically get all vet perks years ago and the Cryptic response, as I recall, was, "We haven't made them all yet. But if we had them all made, we'd consider it."
I like the way ARENANET in their game Guild Wars have you earn a gift box every year per character on the day that particular character was created. Every Year that one particular toon would earn a special gift box that contained a tradable unique mini pet ranging from common to ultra rare. Its a way to reward their veteran players - which everyone gains as their characters age.
I'd like to point out that every single Guild Wars 1/2 player has a LTS.
Added to this: the things old vets had to wait for DIDN'T exist, which is the real reason we waited for them.
I suggested having lifers automatically get all vet perks years ago and the Cryptic response, as I recall, was, "We haven't made them all yet. But if we had them all made, we'd consider it."
would love a link to this for i dont see it take long to make a title a ship a Boff and a pet fireworks emo oh and outfits ive seen Dev admit to they can make 40 Cstore ships in 6 months and 12 outfits same time frame
Bunch of petty people arguing semantics and wording at this point.
And someone thinking they are above others.
I think you've been watching The Avengers too much.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] EXPLORE.
Dec '07 Account I EARNED 1000 days...I didn't BUY it! New LTS=Death to Vet.System: 10/10/12 Never Forget Something should be done for those who cared enough to have a 1000+ day sub.
Perhaps - but sadly, the fact is that this all boils down to money and Cryptic (or more likely PWE) simply decided that 'when' you purchased the LFT is no longer as relevant as the fact that you brought one at all.
You get the same product for the same money regardless of when said product was purchased.
again only they dont have to wait maybe if i pay apple 10000000$ maybe they mite let me get the new iphone 6
Not the same thing. There is no Iphone 6 for one. And there were no Veteran rewards when STO was released.
i see it as same thing if you got lots of money you get ahead of every one i think if i had to wait for my Veteran rewards SO should they they are no one special
would love a link to this for i dont see it take long to make a title a ship a Boff and a pet fireworks emo oh and outfits ive seen Dev admit to they can make 40 Cstore ships in 6 months and 12 outfits same time frame
Ships take about six weeks, counting art and design. I think BOffs take a couple of weeks, passing through multiple hands.
The dev who made 40 C-Store ships in 6 months:
- Started with existing templates.
- Quit after he did it.
- The system design on these was crazy too but they did work from existing BOff/Console templates and just flatly added to them.
Ships take about six weeks, counting art and design. I think BOffs take a couple of weeks, passing through multiple hands.
The dev who made 40 C-Store ships in 6 months:
- Started with existing templates.
- Quit after he did it.
- The system design on these was crazy too but they did work from existing BOff/Console templates and just flatly added to them.
wow didnt know you worked for cryptic to know what they use and do not use to know there time frame on get stuff dun man are you a Dev?
wow didnt know you worked for cryptic to know what they use and do not use to know there time frame on get stuff dun man are you a Dev?
No. I just read the dev tracker a lot.
Or they're lying whenever they say it's typically six weeks. It makes sense to me, though, and ships take a lot of hard work beyond just art.
They have a bureaucracy to go through and in a field where average salary is $80k and Cryptic's training period is over 2 months, they have a need to extract work from people on one hand (they pay too much not to demand productivity) and a need to not burn people out on the other, because it costs them upwards of $15 grand plus lost time and lost sales to replace anyone who gets burnt out.
Comments
Except ALL Vet Rewafrds were monetized from the start in that you had to pay a montkly subscription (or buy an LTS) to acrue 'days' towards getting them. It was like that from day 1 of the F2P relaunch; so again, if you're upset about the monetization of these rewards; I'm amazed you were spending any money on STO after the F2P launch.
Also, remember, while anyone who bought an LTS from day 1 up to the point of this most recent LTS sale does indeed get all 1000 day vet rewards immediately - those who continue to subscribe month to month (some paying a low a $10 a munth, plus the $5.00 ZP stipend - bringing their cost to $5 a month if they buy from the C-Store) are still acruing days and unlocking rewards as they 'hit' them.
Again, I don't get the outrage of some of my other early apodting LTS bretheren.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
The veteran rewards program no longer fits this. Please address this thank you.
The LTS perk does not change that fact as the game still has non-LTS gold members.
They can not by definition be veteran rewards when someone starting today can instantly gain them. They don't fit the definition and to be frank I find it insulting that comparatively young accounts can now prance around with the full gauntlet of 1000 day veteran rewards. Just because they can afford to shell out for a LTS.
Well, they should have taken the word "veteran" out when they went F2P since you then had veterans who didn't get rewards... and getting the rewards was always tied to anniversary rather than any measure of experience. It's an argument over whether absolute definitions for words matter.
EDIT: No offense intended. Best to take any issues to PMs.
A statement like this really describes what kind of person you are. This is just F'd up and should not be made into a joke.
Dec '07 Account
I EARNED 1000 days...I didn't BUY it! New LTS=Death to Vet.System: 10/10/12 Never Forget
Something should be done for those who cared enough to have a 1000+ day sub.
I'm not sure I get it. Then again, I have Asperger's.
EDIT: Remainder of the post removed. Best to be addressed via PM.
Speaking of "Anniversary," it implies a year's worth of dedication or celebration of one's beginnings.
I like the way ARENANET in their game Guild Wars have you earn a gift box every year per character on the day that particular character was created. Every Year that one particular toon would earn a special gift box that contained a tradable unique mini pet ranging from common to ultra rare. Its a way to reward their veteran players - which everyone gains as their characters age.
Cryptic's Veteran reward program in its very essence is named wrong. The term now is misleading since it is associated with currency. Meaning like the OP stated, that you invest a set amount of dollars to gain a unique status, which is labeled Veteran.
The confusion lies in the term veteran - but keep in mind pre-PWE the term was appropriately applied because you earn Vet points as your account aged. Hence the 100days to 1,000days.
Post PWE, Vet days lost relevence since they are now operating under an entirely different set of rules. Keep in mind that the Vet rewards themselves were changed here and there.
Remember the ship token debacle, also the Dilithium earnings under the vet rewards program that some received and others were S.O.L.
The Lifer program should remain just that - The Lifer program. - Just remove the Vet terminology. It should have never had a Vet Day attached to it.
Vet days should be earned by all players, whether you're silver, gold, or lifer.
LIFERS, aside from subscription being paid off, already were neglected by Cryptic in regards to gaining perks - Greatly lacking. This became very apparent at the dawn of F2P - where many former Gold members that had switched to silver account maintained some of their former perks.
I don't see it as ever really applying to "veteran" status.
Veteran implies DOING something. Vet rewards were always just about paying and waiting. They never measured activity.
"Customer Loyalty" would be more accurate. And that's always what it was. Never a measure of DOING anything.
waiting is silly if you have paid for something. why dont you get another LTS; i just got my 3rd because it really is a good deal now. what a feeling, logging in, doing the tutorial mission and then shortly thereafter seeing all those rewards pop that you just paid a lot of money for instead of having to wait like those choosing to pay by installments as it were; wonderful. It still sends shivers down my back thinking about it...
im being a little silly here but it really is a great time to get LTS or 2. having two accounts can be very useful...
That is a clever idea. May i also add you are one handsome bloke!!!
soooooooooo this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 100 agree
system Lord Baal is dead
and why is a new lifer money better then mine?
system Lord Baal is dead
Or how about this scenario;
You subscribe to the game and the next day your house is hit by a meteor and burns down with all your possessions. It takes 1000 days to get the insurance money and rebuild. When you finally get to log on to the game again...wham! You have your reward for doing nothing.
Or how about this;
You get married and your new wife won't let you play the game. 1000 days later you catch her with the pool boy and get divorced. You log into the game and wham! You get the reward for doing nothing.
Here we go;
You're abducted by terrorists and tortured mercilessly for 1000 days until Special Forces can break in and rescue you. When you get back home, log on to the game and wham! There is your reward for doing nothing.
Or how about this;
You just play the game and stop worrying about what other people get.
only he or she dont have to wait to me thats saying there money is better then mine
system Lord Baal is dead
Dec '07 Account
I EARNED 1000 days...I didn't BUY it! New LTS=Death to Vet.System: 10/10/12 Never Forget
Something should be done for those who cared enough to have a 1000+ day sub.
Added to this: the things old vets had to wait for DIDN'T exist, which is the real reason we waited for them.
I suggested having lifers automatically get all vet perks years ago and the Cryptic response, as I recall, was, "We haven't made them all yet. But if we had them all made, we'd consider it."
would love a link to this for i dont see it take long to make a title a ship a Boff and a pet fireworks emo oh and outfits ive seen Dev admit to they can make 40 Cstore ships in 6 months and 12 outfits same time frame
system Lord Baal is dead
Bunch of petty people arguing semantics and wording at this point.
And someone thinking they are above others.
I think you've been watching The Avengers too much.
Dec '07 Account
I EARNED 1000 days...I didn't BUY it! New LTS=Death to Vet.System: 10/10/12 Never Forget
Something should be done for those who cared enough to have a 1000+ day sub.
you have your opinion i have mine and what may be irrelevant to you may not be to others
system Lord Baal is dead
again only they dont have to wait maybe if i pay apple 10000000$ maybe they mite let me get the new iphone 6
system Lord Baal is dead
i see it as same thing if you got lots of money you get ahead of every one i think if i had to wait for my Veteran rewards SO should they they are no one special
system Lord Baal is dead
Ships take about six weeks, counting art and design. I think BOffs take a couple of weeks, passing through multiple hands.
The dev who made 40 C-Store ships in 6 months:
- Started with existing templates.
- Quit after he did it.
- The system design on these was crazy too but they did work from existing BOff/Console templates and just flatly added to them.
wow didnt know you worked for cryptic to know what they use and do not use to know there time frame on get stuff dun man are you a Dev?
system Lord Baal is dead
No. I just read the dev tracker a lot.
Or they're lying whenever they say it's typically six weeks. It makes sense to me, though, and ships take a lot of hard work beyond just art.
They have a bureaucracy to go through and in a field where average salary is $80k and Cryptic's training period is over 2 months, they have a need to extract work from people on one hand (they pay too much not to demand productivity) and a need to not burn people out on the other, because it costs them upwards of $15 grand plus lost time and lost sales to replace anyone who gets burnt out.