1100 day Vet reward dont look good:(

jtmarsh · September 2012

From the Ask section the chance of 1100 dont look good. To be frank the answer given lacked.

"Then we plan to go back and review the rewards at each tier to ensure we have everything implemented as was discussed. Only after that will we consider going past 1000 days. We are discussing this with Champs, but for now, there are no details yet."

What are you all going to review? Ok we know the Android lacked. You have a thread that is always on the first page that speaks to that. We are talking 10 rewards.. How long is it to review and or fix them? Well nvm "see andriod thread"

I have posted this before if you cant take the time to give something every 100 days thats sad. We are talking a belt buckle to a person that has paid you for 1100 days. Im sorry I am at a loss on why that is so hard.

Its insulting to us payers... I'm not a lifetime but a 6 month from day one sub. So I and others are still paying you. Maybe we are just a small fraction that do. The middle people that are not life but also not free.

Well im going to play this game I love. But September 22 may be my last 6 month. Ill take it to 1000+ but in 6 months we dont get a 1100 reward then ill be a happy free to play player:) Im strange like that;)

leviathan99 · September 2012

Frankly, I think adding more rewards to the lower tiers makes more sense as it seems that the vet rewards (along with stipend) are the primary selling point behind subs and lifetimes.

Adding rewards beyond 1000 days would really only benefit lifers. Adding rewards pre-1000 days still benefits lifers but will move more subs.

starkaos · September 2012

I mentioned it in another thread, but Star Trek Online could go for something similar to the veteran reward system of Anarchy Online. Every 100 days could give a veteran token that can be purchased for various rewards. Simple rewards could cost 1 token and more elaborate rewards could cost more. So you could save up for a year to purchase an ultra deluxe starship or a bunch of hats. Of course, we don't change the current rewards. Also, they could be character unlocks so you can unlock one reward for one character and another reward for another character.

cormoran · September 2012

The thing is PWE doesn't want people playing STO for 1000+ days so they won't reward that behaviour. I doubt they even want people to sub since they could get more out of people who don't, but they pretty much have to considering the nature of how Cryptic games worked before PWE bought them out.

They want people to play for short periods of time, spending as much as possible in that time, then moving onto the next PWE game. By 1000+ days the customer should be onto their third or fourth PWE game and purchasing from its zen store.

leviathan99 · September 2012

cormoran wrote: »

The thing is PWE doesn't want people playing STO for 1000+ days so they won't reward that behaviour. I doubt they even want people to sub since they could get more out of people who don't, but they pretty much have to considering the nature of how Cryptic games worked before PWE bought them out.

They want people to play for short periods of time, spending as much as possible in that time, then moving onto the next PWE game. By 1000+ days the customer should be onto their third or fourth PWE game and purchasing from its zen store.

I think it's a mistake to say they WANT that. Now, maybe they don't CARE if that's what happens or not.

But I think they'd be funneling a lot more resources than they have to for someone who doesn't care.

I think they have a different business model for STO than they have for their Eastern games. Now, a big part of that is adapting a lot of what works about those games here, using Cryptic as an R&D resource.

It would be foolish not to mak a churn game in the Eastern markets because of the population size. It would be equally foolish to bank on churn games in the West, because of the MUCH SMALLER population size.

I think the core idea behind what we see with Cryptic is an attempt to see how to adapt as much as possible from PWE's in-house games while mitigating the churn effect. And that the varying pricepoints and shifts in lockboxes are all an effort to locate the sweet spot where they can keep as much as possible from the Eastern model, sans churn, since churn is the smart way to do business over there and the population demographics don't do it for that model here.

A churn game might be designed to die in five years but it wouldn't last nearly as long in the U.S., for example. Partly due to differing values and economies, perhaps, but largely due to the fact that the entire population here (non-gamers included) is probably smaller than the gaming market in Asia.

So the trick becomes how to create longterm lockbox customers.

That said, rewarding people past 1000 days makes little sense since it mainly targets lifers, who are already an economic drain via the stipend. Whereas adding extra rewards to 100, 200, and 300 days will generate new revenue.

teleon22 · September 2012

stoleviathan99 wrote: »

I think it's a mistake to say they WANT that. Now, maybe they don't CARE if that's what happens or not.

But I think they'd be funneling a lot more resources than they have to for someone who doesn't care.

I think they have a different business model for STO than they have for their Eastern games. Now, a big part of that is adapting a lot of what works about those games here, using Cryptic as an R&D resource.

It would be foolish not to mak a churn game in the Eastern markets because of the population size. It would be equally foolish to bank on churn games in the West, because of the MUCH SMALLER population size.

I think the core idea behind what we see with Cryptic is an attempt to see how to adapt as much as possible from PWE's in-house games while mitigating the churn effect. And that the varying pricepoints and shifts in lockboxes are all an effort to locate the sweet spot where they can keep as much as possible from the Eastern model, sans churn, since churn is the smart way to do business over there and the population demographics don't do it for that model here.

A churn game might be designed to die in five years but it wouldn't last nearly as long in the U.S., for example. Partly due to differing values and economies, perhaps, but largely due to the fact that the entire population here (non-gamers included) is probably smaller than the gaming market in Asia.

So the trick becomes how to create longterm lockbox customers.

That said, rewarding people past 1000 days makes little sense since it mainly targets lifers, who are already an economic drain via the stipend. Whereas adding extra rewards to 100, 200, and 300 days will generate new revenue.

A very strong opinion. I tend to agree with your view on this.

zerobang · September 2012

to be honest, i'm more concerned about that 1000 day reward at the moment

if it's the last one it should better be awesome

kobayashlmaru · September 2012

Supporting the vet system beyond 1000 days is difficult. And presents an interesting dilemma to which there is no easy solution:

You have to justify that spending time making new rewards justifies the revenue it will generate. Versus spending that time/money on producing something else like lockbox content.
There are serious gaps in the existing rewards. They aren't building vet rewards to appeal to LTS's (who benefit most from more high level vet rewards) but to people who might be on the cusp of the next 100 day reward but need a bit of an incentive. As more gold's switch to silver's over time, they lag behind the LTS's who are in front, causing this issue to grow.
And lastly, the longer it takes to flesh out rewards lower tier rewards, it is less likely they will ever return, because the ones who are already in front will get the content without effort and therefore spoil the reason for offering it.

kingdoxy · September 2012

Buffing the earlier rewards makes a ton of sense. A new lifer wouldn't see some of the rewards for years. But if you Buff the early ones it might make some folks want the LTS for the vet rewards they would get sooner.

jermbot · September 2012

Buffing early rewards would certainly make me feel hunky dory about them moving any future rewards to an 'every 250 days' schedule.

theindefatigable · September 2012

Vet rewards beyond 1000 days might help draw back lifers who have moved on mostly to other games, or at least keep them checking in once in a while. More people playing the game is good in many ways, especially if said vets come back and want some C-store content and need to pay that little bit extra beyond their saved-up stipends to get it.

Just fishing here...I'm a relatively recent lifer but have played since beta, and only let my sub lapse when I was broke and had a dying computer. As soon as I replaced it, I was back in the game.

) I do think a reason to keep this game going and develop it instead of focus on drawing players into the next MMO is that there have got to be a bunch of players who WON'T move to the next MMO. The entire Special Service Squadron is an example. My whole (small) fleet is unlikely to play any PWE games except STO, as we are all Trek fans, and I know that if STO isn't handled well I am certainly not going to invest time, money, and love into any other PWE product. As all of us already don't trust PWE, they will have to do a really good job with STO and keep it going in order to keep us paying them--and believe me, most of my fleet are lifers but my buddies and I spend plenty on STO.

psymantis · September 2012

After 1000 days it could be small rewards that require nothing added. For example a character slot every 100 days and/or 100k? of refined dilithuim. Something that says thank you for continuing to support the game but nothing that anyone else could never get, like an exclusive item.

leviathan99 · September 2012

theindefatigable wrote: »

Vet rewards beyond 1000 days might help draw back lifers who have moved on mostly to other games, or at least keep them checking in once in a while. More people playing the game is good in many ways, especially if said vets come back and want some C-store content and need to pay that little bit extra beyond their saved-up stipends to get it.

Just fishing here...I'm a relatively recent lifer but have played since beta, and only let my sub lapse when I was broke and had a dying computer. As soon as I replaced it, I was back in the game. ) I do think a reason to keep this game going and develop it instead of focus on drawing players into the next MMO is that there have got to be a bunch of players who WON'T move to the next MMO. The entire Special Service Squadron is an example. My whole (small) fleet is unlikely to play any PWE games except STO, as we are all Trek fans, and I know that if STO isn't handled well I am certainly not going to invest time, money, and love into any other PWE product. As all of us already don't trust PWE, they will have to do a really good job with STO and keep it going in order to keep us paying them--and believe me, most of my fleet are lifers but my buddies and I spend plenty on STO.

Buffing 100 and 200 day rewards would do the same thing.

Or (and I think this would be better for subs), add 150, 250, 350, 450, 550, 650, 750, 850, and 950 day rewards.

Doing it on a 50 day timeframe would leave people saying, "Okay. I'll sub for just ONE MORE MONTH."

There's very little benefit I can see with adding post-1000 day rewards that wouldn't be more effective with more pre-1000 day rewards.

The lifers and longtermers still get them.

But post-1000 days is too far away to entice new lifetime sales or subbing.

cryptiecop · September 2012

For a 1000 day reward, I would like the ability to choose 1 C-Store item of my choice on my account...that would be a really awesome award imo...

theultimatex · September 2012

Heck, here is one.

Add a Transwarp option to the Captain's Chair when you claim the Classified Access item from the Legacy section of the Cryptic Store!

Heck, this should ALREADY be something us lifetime, career players already have as an option to us. Why is adding this so very difficult for them. After all, the only way to get into it is with a TRANSWARP.

theultimatex · September 2012

psymantis wrote: »

After 1000 days it could be small rewards that require nothing added. For example a character slot every 100 days and/or 100k? of refined dilithuim. Something that says thank you for continuing to support the game but nothing that anyone else could never get, like an exclusive item.

I strangely agree with this. There are more important things for them to work on, and seriously who is going to take a 2 to 3 year chance on this game to get at all of the paying member "rewards".

dublinraider · September 2012

As a long time subscriber i will be watching this topic closely.
If there are no further rewards for veterans i will definitely unsub and go ftp.

darthstormstrike · September 2012

It's funny they gave a BOFF as a reward but no slot to put him in. That was basically a reward that forced you to pay for it or delete someone. 1000 days and they still won't give you a single BOFF slot.

happyhappyj0yj0y · September 2012

jtmarsh wrote: »

From the Ask section the chance of 1100 dont look good. To be frank the answer given lacked.

"Then we plan to go back and review the rewards at each tier to ensure we have everything implemented as was discussed. Only after that will we consider going past 1000 days. We are discussing this with Champs, but for now, there are no details yet."

From what Dstahl has said previously about there being no plans to continue the program, and what they've said over at CO that discussion seems to have been over before Danny Boy's comment there (you'll note the CO thread confirming the program stopping at 1,000 pre-dates the Ask Cryptic).

starkaos · September 2012

Sounds like the devs have no idea if there will be veteran rewards past 1000 days.

Dstahl: First, we intend to ensure that the 1000 day vet reward is awesome for both FED and KDF players. Then we plan to go back and review the rewards at each tier to ensure we have everything implemented as was discussed. Only after that will we consider going past 1000 days. We are discussing this with Champs, but for now, there are no details yet.

So the official dev response is their MIGHT be veteran rewards after 1000 days. We probably won't know if there is any veteran rewards past 1000 days until next year.

centersolace · September 2012

starkaos wrote: »

So the official dev response is their MIGHT be veteran rewards after 1000 days. We probably won't know if there is any veteran rewards past 1000 days until next year.

That doesn't mean we wont get veteran rewards though. Just be ones that you get sooner than 1000 days.

While there's lots of cool stuff that we could get veterans, having quality of life improvements like ship/character/boff/doff slots, bank/inventory space, a fleet mark stipend, hell, you could get a "Valued Customer" ability that allows you to summon the S.S. Azura (and the klingon equivalent, whatever it was called) without the comm code item.

Little things like that wouldn't be that difficult to put in, and they would make a lot of people happy.

happyhappyj0yj0y · September 2012

starkaos wrote: »

Sounds like the devs have no idea if there will be veteran rewards past 1000 days.

So the official dev response is their MIGHT be veteran rewards after 1000 days. We probably won't know if there is any veteran rewards past 1000 days until next year.

These days Dan is the guy who continually has to say, "Well that's really not my department you should ask [random employee] about it, as that's his thing!"

Dan is also the guy who said that they're discussing it with the CO devs. CO's community manager, the guy who actually does talk to the involved parties before responding (ideally) since it's his job to convey information from them gave the rather clear response that the 1000 day mark is "as high as it will go".

Also, Champions Online reached it's 1,100 day point on September 5th... ten days ago. There was no Veteran Reward.

They aren't courting subscriptions anymore, it's all about micro-transactions. I'm all for optimism up to a point, but after a while you have to give it up and embrace realism. Without a massive outcry (and even THAT'S iffy) the chances of a 1,100 day vet reward is hovering at almost exactly 0%.

futurepastnow · September 2012

At the very minimum, a free respec every 100 days after 1000 would be nice and would not cost them anything.

happyhappyj0yj0y · September 2012

futurepastnow wrote: »

At the very minimum, a free respec every 100 days after 1000 would be nice and would not cost them anything.

Actually that would more or less cost them about five bucks a shot as that's what they sell them for in the C-Store.

starkaos · September 2012

happyhappyj0yj0y wrote: »

Also, Champions Online reached it's 1,100 day point on September 5th... ten days ago. There was no Veteran Reward.

Champions Online is known for taking their sweet time in getting veteran rewards to players. Their 900 and 1000 day veteran rewards took a month to 2 months to obtain after players reached those milestones.

happyhappyj0yj0y · September 2012

starkaos wrote: »

Champions Online is known for taking their sweet time in getting veteran rewards to players. Their 900 and 1000 day veteran rewards took a month to 2 months to obtain after players reached those milesthe tones.

Aye, but the community rep (trailturtle) has flat out said there isn't a 1,100 day reward coming.

Also, the FAQ makes it bluntly clear:

CO Vet FAQ wrote:

Q: How high does it go?

Veteran Rewards are capped at 1,000 days.

So, yeah, barring a massive upheaval that will change minds it's officially done at 1,000 days.

jtmarsh · September 2012

happyhappyj0yj0y wrote: »

Aye, but the community rep (trailturtle) has flat out said there isn't a 1,100 day reward coming.

Also, the FAQ makes it bluntly clear:

So, yeah, barring a massive upheaval that will change minds it's officially done at 1,000 days.

Well if that is the case for this game my sub will be capped in Febuary;) Am I leaving?? Heck no!! But with one real toon and a TRIBBLE load of cstore purchase before the change to zen I will have no reason to stay pay... But heck I will lose my monthly zen! But I can buy way more with over $70 every 6 month that I will save on the sub;)

Its not being a hard "end" Its the fact.... "and I hope someone with power from this games developer and or owner sees this" Its the fact that if you all cant so much take the time for a badge or belt buckle or even a new pair of pants every 100 days for people that have lifed or are still paying you every month for 1100 plus days.. Well then you cant do that then thats a slap in the face to me and a slap of my sub closed to you.
Its a real discrace... Is all I can say. I know it might be small compared to what some of you have felt slighted about. But at its core this would be a real slap.

pupibird · September 2012

At least some veteran accolades could be added above 1000 days.

Besides that I think I have spent more cash on the game since F2P than my LTS cost - not by hunting a lockbox ship, just for the fun new items can offer. I bought my LTS two months before F2P, after paying monthly for more than a year. On the day F2P launched I already owned 75% of all C-Store items one was able to buy back those days.

I hope Cryptic does not forget that many golds and lifers are still good customers, and in some ways they are the heartbeat of the game. They produce the fanpages and podcasts, they advertise C-Store items in-game only by wearing them, and they have been active on the forums (they still are) for years.

crusty8mac · September 2012

Realistically speaking, I doubt there are many - if any - 1000 day monthly subscribers left. I can't imagine Cryptic putting any more effort into rewarding lifers.

starkaos · September 2012

crusty8mac wrote: »

Realistically speaking, I doubt there are many - if any - 1000 day monthly subscribers left. I can't imagine Cryptic putting any more effort into rewarding lifers.

If there are any monthly subscribers that are close to 1000 days, then why are they not a lifer?

If the rewards are cool enough, then it would give incentive to some to subscribe. Seriously, the current incentives for being a gold member sucks. If I was not a beta lifer and just came to this game, then I would give very careful thought whether to get a lifetime subscription or not.

Have to agree with dstahl about giving more rewards to the other veteran rewards since we get more rewards and others will be given an incentive to subscribe.

crusty8mac · September 2012

That works for me.

1100 day Vet reward dont look good:(

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