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Tactical Build Advice
doctortiki
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
I've just started a Tactical character and wanted to come up with a rough build so I know where to allocate points as I level.
Can any experienced Tactical guys give me some advice on this build?
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=tactileneck_0
I will be mostly PVE oriented but I wanted to try and keep it somewhat balanced so I could PVP on occasion as well. (The queue times I have experienced make me think it will be more PVE than PVP though)
I made some notes here about what I was thinking when I put it together:
Tactical: I put a smaller emphasis on the Projectiles mainly because the whole cannons thing still is a novelty to me
Engineering: I wasn't sure how much these skills affect power levels so I tried to keep them balanced where it seemed appropriate.
Science: I mainly just invested there for the resistances to status effects.
Ground: I might have spent too much here but I seem to get more ground missions than I would like and would hate for that to be my crutch.
Any feedback is greatly appreciated as I am still only level 14.
Thanks!
Can any experienced Tactical guys give me some advice on this build?
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=tactileneck_0
I will be mostly PVE oriented but I wanted to try and keep it somewhat balanced so I could PVP on occasion as well. (The queue times I have experienced make me think it will be more PVE than PVP though)
I made some notes here about what I was thinking when I put it together:
Tactical: I put a smaller emphasis on the Projectiles mainly because the whole cannons thing still is a novelty to me
Engineering: I wasn't sure how much these skills affect power levels so I tried to keep them balanced where it seemed appropriate.
Science: I mainly just invested there for the resistances to status effects.
Ground: I might have spent too much here but I seem to get more ground missions than I would like and would hate for that to be my crutch.
Any feedback is greatly appreciated as I am still only level 14.
Thanks!
Post edited by doctortiki on
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Comments
#1 - your weapon skills are actually divided by projectile/energy - cannons are actually energy weapons, as are beams...projectiles are basically all the torpedoes - so your spec into energy weapons will affect all your primary weapons (unless you prefer a torpedo boat build)
#2 - in almost all cases, the vast majority of people will recommend that whatever skills you do choose, stick with no more than 6 points in the skill - the last 3 points in a skill offer a very miniscule amount of actual effect
#3 - for myself, it would take too long to post my personal skills, but they seem to work all right, and I'll give you a general layout - with my tac captain, I tended to put a lot of skills in the tac line - all the energy weapon options, accuracy, maneuvers, etc - the only thing I didn't invest in much is torpedoes, and this is why
when it comes to outfitting your ship, you will also find yourself generally picking a primary weapon type - energy or projectile (note - *most* people don't build torpedo boats, although they are out there - you'd have to ask one of them for how effective it tends to be) because there are tactical consoles that increase weapons damage - consoles for increasing your torps and your beams/cannons - but as there are a limited number of slots for consoles, lots of people tend to focus on their energy weapons as their primary weapon, and therefore focus all their console slots on buffing energy weapon dmg - since it's likely that your torps are already going to suffer somewhat from not getting console buffs, you might consider skipping on skill buffing them as well, and save those points for other areas
#4 - Engineering skills - you'll want a LOT of these, which may seem odd as a tac captain, but SOOO many of the engineering skills affect the overall survivability/power efficiency of EVERY SHIP YOU'RE IN - power may not seem all that important right now, but it makes a huge difference at endgame over sustained conflicts - I *highly* recommend sinking 6 points of skill into every skill that buffs power or power efficiency (warp core, energy weapon, shields, aux, etc), as well as hull strength, hull armor, shield strength, etc, etc
#5 - Science skills - my tac captain has very few of these, and most others I expect are similar - there are some base science skills that increase shield heals and such, and most captains take these, but all the other sci skills are primarily required for offensive sci skills which most of the sci community will tell you have been nerfed to lowest levels of hell - as such, many non-dedicated sci ship fliers take just the basic survivability sci skills (polarize hull and hazard emitters) and not worry about the rest - this is a great place to not have to put skill points if you want to hoard them for more effective, albeit more conventional , layouts
mind you, if you want to fly sci ships and use heavy sci-skills, you're more than welcome to do so - and if that's your intention, you should definitely invest far more heavily in those sci skills, as they will be vital to getting any real effect out of sci-boff skills and such - but it's a rather unconventional way to go, so just be warned
Ground - it's true, you could save a lot of points by not going much ground - but there is a LOT of ground content in the game, and it can be fun - especially for some of the more profitable fleet mark missions - I personally put points into every skill that becomes a tac captain trainable skill (i.e. any skill that reads "if you have 3 ranks or more in this skill, a tac captain can train x-skill - this allows you to train your own or other people's boffs in that skill, which can be handy) - I skip the armor skill, and the ground threat skill, and I think I put 6 points in almost everything else
that's my input before seeing any of your choices, hope it helps - I may come back later after having looked if anything specific strikes me
James T. Kirk
take those extra points, spend a little more (up to 6) in weapon performance, aux and armor, and fill out some of those ground skills if you like
James T. Kirk
Thanks for all the suggestions! I have tried to work your ideas into this new build.
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=tactileneck1_0
Tactical: Not much changed here, spread the bonus for Energy/Projectile specialization
Engineering: Redistributed points here using your rule of 6
Science: Redistributed points here using your rule of 6
Ground: Oddly enough this did not change much.
Does this look more like what I should have as a rough goal? It seems pretty similar to what I had before, so perhaps I am missing something skill wise or is this solid enough?
Can anyone else confirm putting more than 6 points in a skill is always a waste, or are there exceptions for specialized tasks like Tactical Systems? Those were pretty much the only times I went to max a skill.
Thanks again for all the assistance
Well I'm just looking for advice here. As previously stated my character is level 14, so while you're offer to obliterate me is flattering, I don't see the point in that. I don't need to beat my head against a wall to know it will hurt. It doesn't mean I'm afraid to do it, just smart enough not to lol
I also will be heavier on the PVE side since the PVP queues have me waiting over an hour for a single game with only a few players (Also in my original post)
If you could provide some constructive feedback though that would be helpful..
Your revised build doesn't look too bad.
The ground skills could use a little reworking to be optimised for a Tactical player's usual ground team role ("DPS", rather than "tank") - I'd opt for 9/9 in Weapon Proficiency and Combat Specialist. Special Forces and Advanced Tactics are worth at least 3 in each, and you really want at least 5 but preferably 6 in Squad Command (because that's the point at which it'll let you stack "Ambush" 3 times in a row whilst under the effects of "Tactical Initiative" - a major spike damage benefit) Ignore Willpower, Threat Control and Combat Armor (the latter seems odd, until you realise that Diminishing Returns means that endgame armors don't get much benefit from this skill) and throw any spare points into PS Generator. Grenades are situational - I know some players don't use them at all, but they're cheap to skill up and I find myself using them quite often, so I'd go for 6/9 or 9/9 here depending on how regularly you find yourself using them as a source of damage.
The "rule of 3/6/9" is usually a good rule of thumb to follow - basically, put 3 in skills that are situational/rarely used, 6 in skills that are always useful, and only take essential skills to 9. You can see the "return" given by each skillpoint worth of investment by looking at the values on the green/yellow/red slider in the build planner. There are some exceptions though, due to cooldown cut offs etc (like with Squad Command above)
Your Tactical space skills are spot-on. For your Engineering skills, I'd recommend taking Structural Integrity, Warp Core Performance and Efficiency to 9/9. The Engine/Aux/Weapon "Performance" skills are probably best left at 3/9, and only brought higher if you need an extra point or two (say to "cap" weapons power at 125), but Armor/Hull Plating and Shield Performance all get a good return up to 6/9 if you're looking for more survivability.
For your Science skills, you've slotted up the majorly useful ones already (Flow Capacitors is good to slot up if you use any power drains) but again I'd recommend taking Shield Systems to 9/9. And if you're sticking to PVE you won't really need Power Insulators or Inertial Dampeners, they're pretty much PVP-only. If you're venturing into PVP occasionally you could probably get by with a few points in each - though I'd probably choose 6 in Insulators and 3 in Dampeners rather than the other way around.
Thanks a lot for the feedback! It's good to get some insight for the end game since I was not aware of some of those skills such as Ambush
I've updated the build and tried to work in your suggestions. How is this revision?
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=tactileneck4_2047
You could fly in that and be better than 90% of the PUG players I've seen in STFs
Tac, Ground and Science skills all look grand.
I've only got a few minor points concerning the Engineering skills:
You can get rid of any points in Subsystem Repair, it really does nothing worthwhile.
I've never bothered putting any points into the "Batteries" skill, as I never find myself using them for PVE... but that's a personal choice, some people find it useful because it does extend the duration of their buff quite noticeably.
The Aux Performance and Weapon Performance levels caught my eye too - there's nothing particularly wrong with not taking 3 or 6 in a skill, but opting for 3/9 in the performance skills adds a nice round number to that skill's energy pool - 5 energy. So just be careful that the extra point in Weapons isn't wasted by making you overshoot the "hard cap" of 125 Weapons Power [there are a few cases where this is a good thing, but it's basically to do with a bug that only applies to beam weapons]. If you're planning to use other means of raising your Weapons power (like running a few copies of EPTW) then you can add or reduce these skillpoints a little until you're hitting the exact power level you want.
Finally, Armor Reinforcements/Hull Plating.
Assuming that you have a decent BOFF power setup for whatever ship you're flying, then you shouldn't have much trouble taking too much damage unless you're fighting things like Elite Tac Cubes with their hyperpowerful Kinetic Damage Torpedos. So I'd lean slightly more towards increasing my Armor than Hull Plating... but realistically there's only going to be a few % points difference at higher levels with Neutronium or Monotanium Armor Consoles (with that darned "Diminishing Returns" kicking in again!)
A good question to ask yourself would be: are you planning to tank? (e.g fly a cruiser in PVE) If not, fine. But if so, it might be worth investing into Threat Control. In order to hold aggro reliably, Tanks should really have at least 6 points in this... but it'll add a little damage resistance as well, so you can reduce both Hull Plating and Armor Reinforcements to 3/9 if you're taking it.
Starship Batteries are pretty useless for the points. I would also not put points in subsystem repair because subsystems repair in 5 seconds without spending the points, there is just not bonus to get from the points.
Hull Plating and Armor Reinforcements should be full, it gives you better resists and you live longer. Same with weapon and shield performance, they are needed engine and Aux are not really.
Shield emitters and Shield systems are the only Science skills you need. The rest are useless for PVE.
Tac looks good and that really is a player by player choice. I chose not to use projectiles. I need to respect to move those points though.
Kyle
Thanks for all your help! Sorry for the delay in getting back, but I have been playing quite a bit in my free time hah.
I did read through your input and have revised my build to incorporate your suggestions, and also that of kylesal24. Also to answer your question I plan to focus on pure DPS and will want to avoid threat whenever possible. (I'm hoping I find some friends who enjoy tanking instead)
Here is my final draft of the build so far!
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=tactileneckv5_2047
Changes:
Tactical: None
Engineering:
- Removed points from Starship Subsystem Repair and Starship Batteries
- Added 3 points to driver coil (I hear it's a waste but I just wanted to try it as I was leveling since I don't have any fancy engines hah)
- Minor increase in last tier of Engineering skills to follow 3/6 skill pattern
Science:- Removed the debuff resistance skills under Science (Now only using the two shield related skills)
Ground: NoneHopefully this will put me in good shape for the challenges to come
Looks really solid.
Taking Shield Emitters all the way up to 9 isn't completely vital, but it'll certainly not be a wasted investment. It'll bump up your shield heals a bit and raises the bonus energy granted by EPTS (I've capped it out on one of my own characters to just get one extra energy point out of EPTS1) and you've really got nowhere better to put the spare points!
Driver Coil will make you go a bit quicker in sector space, but your maximum speed will eventually cap out at Warp 10 until you pickup Engines that can break that barrier (Like the Borg Engines)
If you ever find yourself occasionally wanting to PVP you can always take a few points out of Shield Emitters and Driver Coil and stick them into Power Insulators. It's nice to have a little bit of a buffer to work with!
Bridge Officer Powers and equipment will make all the difference now. (I'm sure you've already discovered that a ship's energy weapons 'type' should always match its Tactical Consoles, and that BOFF powers like Hazard Emitters, EPTS and Tactical Team are the cornerstones of a good build! There are a lot of tricks you can pull with DOFFs, but for levelling up, TT1x2+EPTS1x2+HE1+Aux2SIF1 will let you survive pretty much anything... and for most stuff you won't even need double-copies of TT or EPTS)
Now, which ship are you using now? (asking because I don't know if you have changed since the start of this thread.) Because next are BOFF powers, weapons, sets, and consoles.
All of us have our own idea of what to use and so you should be able to find a build you like. As always, if you have any questions then fire away!
Kyle
I sure have been leveling since my original post, and am now a 31 Captain in my new Tactical Escort!
I wasn't going to bother you with my configuration but since you mentioned it, I'd love to get your input in case I am doing something horribly wrong
While I do plan to start playing with Torpedos as I grow, for now I have been focusing my skills on the energy weapons and building the core of the skill build so they are neglected at the moment. (I really can't resist all the spray of cannon fire either haha)
Here is my current ship configuration (All MK8):
Fore Weapons: 4x Phaser Dual Heavy Cannons ( I was previously using Tetryon but they were too expensive in MK8)
Rear Weapons: 2x Phaser Turrets
Engineering Consoles: 1x EPS Flow Regulator, 1x Diburnium Hull Plating
Tactical Consoles: 3x Phaser Relay
Science Consoles: 2x Biofunction Monitor (Wasn't sure what else to put here)
Deflector: I am not really sure what to pick here, so I Just use the one with +Sensors and +Shield System
I have slightly tweaked my power levels for each configuration due to the power level bonuses, but my 'Balanced' config has Weapon power to full, Engines at 50(59), and Shield/Aux at 25(39).
Here are my current BOFFs:
Archer (Tactical): Tactical Team 1, Cannon Rapid Fire 1, Cannon Scatter Volley 2, Attack Pattern Omega 3
Rockit (Tactical): Tactical Team 1, Cannon Rapid Fire 1 (My goal was to change this to something like Torpedo High Yield 2 once I invest the Projectile skills but I currently have none; I was testing both of the Cannon abilities out for now as well not sure which levels of which to pick)
Dude (Engineer): Emergency Power To Shields 1, Reverse Shield Polarity 1 (Should I replace this with Auxiliary to Structural Integrity?)
Sprockit (Science): Science Team 1, Hazard Emitters 2
Also on the ground I have my Engineer and Science officers as dedicated Healers for Shields/Hp, and I bring my Security officers along for extra damage. I am currently using the Fire Team Kit for all the DPS buffs. Everyone is equipped with sniper rifles and I basically just mash all my DPS buffs and have them focus fire on my targets based on priority. It seems to work out well so far but perhaps I can make it more efficient?
Here are the ground abilities they currently use:
Tactical: Battle Strategies 1, Supressing Fire 1, Overwatch 1, Ambush 1
Engineer: Shield Recharge 1, Phaser Turret Fabrication 1, Shield Generator 2, Medical Generator 2
Science: Medical Tricorder 1 and 2, Vascular Regenerator 2, Nanite Health Monitor 1
As always thanks so much for your time and expertise. It has been a huge continuing help as I try to absorb all the information!
Right now your build is great for 30-45. Once you get there everything changes. Because you now have access to better equipment and sets.
Weapons: they are fine, when you get to VA either all cannons or 3 cannons or 1 torpedo will work. I would just stick with all cannons because you can save the torpedo points.
Consoles: Tac is fine. Eng: needs some work. When you get higher get the ASSM. console and put it here or Sci. Then fill the rest of the Eng. spots with Neutorion armor consoles. These give resist to everything.
Sci. you will want to get Field Generators once you et to 40+. (You can't till then because they start at mk X.)
Skills: The Tac is good. But one personal thing, I would get a CRF 3 for your Comm. slot. This can be trained by yourself. And put APO in either the LT or LTC slot.
Eng. EP2S 1 is good, RSP should go. Aux2SIF is the best because of the heal. Now if you get a ship with a LTC slot then go EP2S 1, RSP 1, Aux2SIF.
Sci. HE 1, TSS 2.
Sets. Go with Borg once you hit 45. Can be obtained by doing STFs. Best would be either Borg with MACO shield or full Omega, but this is a player thing.
If you have any other question just ask.
Kyle
Your loadout is fine. The EPS console won't do much for you unless you're switching your power levels around a lot, but there's not much else that's worth putting in here aside from possibly an RCS console.
Once you hit 50, assuming that you're staying with an Escort, you'll probably want to use your Engineering slots for Armors and keep the science slots for your Universal Consoles (Assimilated Borg Console being the main one, but it's also very handy to have one of the Vent Theta Radiation ones which you can get from the Lockbox Reward packs via the Exchange)
That's pretty much fine as well. For levelling up you don't need the most optimum setup, it's time to try out stuff to see what loadouts you feel most comfortable with.
One thing I would point out is that Tactical Team and Science Team share a cooldown, and "Transfer Shield Strength" is a handy shield heal that doesn't prevent you from using Tac Team. TSS1/HE2 or HE1/TSS2 are typically the norm, or you can drop APO and pickup Polarize Hull 1 for a Tractor Beam shed (taking PH1 and HE2).
At endgame; for shield healing the ideal would be to have two copies of EPTS and stagger them for constant uptime... but that's not feasible unless you're flying an Armitage or Patrol Escort, since you'll want a slot for either RSP (big spike shield heal - handy in PVP) or Aux2SIF (regular hull heal and resistance buff - handy for PVE). You can try using a Damage Control Engineer DOFF, but realistically 1xEPTS1 and 1xTSS2 is probably your best bet here, with HE1 and Aux2SIF1 for Hull healing.
Concerning the Tactical BOFFs... 2xTT1 is perfect. For the rest you have a little bit to play with - 1 Commander ability, 2x LtCom Abilities and 2x LT abilities. The best damage buff in endgame PVE is APB3 (it basically adds 50% to any hull damage inflicted to a target regardless of whether that damage is coming from yourself or your teammates), so that's your Commander ability sorted out. And you'll probably want to keep a copy of APO1 for shedding Tractor Beams if you're using HE1/TSS2 in your science slots... so that leaves 2xLT BOFF powers and a LtCom BOFF power. If you're going 4xDHCs then the way to go would be to take another copy of APB (probably APB1), and 2x CRFs - so you can keep both APB and CRF up constantly. Or if you're taking a Torpedo you could opt for spike AoE damage, with TS3 and CSV1/APB1. Or mix a little of both AoE and ST damage: CRF2, TS2, CSV1. (It's not worth going for CSV3 or CSV2: it doesn't add much damage over CSV1 unless you're only using Turrets... the point of the ability is to convert your Cannon Fire into an AoE rather than to boost your raw damage numbers)
Honestly, it depends entirely how you want to set your ship up. You could even swap APB3 out for CRF3 - giving yourself slightly better damage versus shielded targets, but not magnifying any of your teammates damage. You'll also find that on some of the endgame Escorts (like the Defiant) you'll have a spare Tactical Ensign slot, which can hold a HYT1 or TS1. (Personally I'm more fond of the ships with a spare Engineering Ensign slot for a 2nd copy of EPTS, but to each their own!!)
There are lots of threads discussing BOFF ground power setups.
A lot of combinations can work.
Personally I'm quite fond of 1x Tactical Melee (Bat'leth + SweepingStrikes1 + Lunge1 + BattleStrategies3 + SmokeGrenade3) and 2x Engineers (Pulsewave + ShieldRecharge1 + WeaponsMalfunction2 + TurretFabrication2 + QuantumMortar2/SupportDrone1), with 1x Sci "Healer/Debuffer" (Pulsewave + MedicalTricorder1 + TachyonHarmonic2 + TricorderScan2 + NaniteHealthMonitor1)
Basic idea with the above example is that the Engineers lay down deployable turrets (which do almost as much damage as the BOFFs, especially with Armory Officer and Explosives Expert DOFFs) whilst the science officer drains shields and debuffs things. The Tac officer tends to attract bosses and bounce them up and down off the ground. And they can heal each other's shields or health whilst in combat. All of which leaves you free to lob grenades at the now-unshielded targets, or focus fire stuff. Pulsewaves are shorter range weapons with an AoE cone primary fire. There's a lot of chances for your BOFFs to cause Exposes, so it can help to bring something like a Split Beam Rifle along for exploits.
BOFF traits are probably the thing to watch the most for ground missions - a Purple BOFF with good relevant "advanced" traits can be many times more effective than a standard common BOFF with traits that contribute nothing towards that BOFF's use. (As an example: for a Melee Tac BOFF I'd look for traits that increase damage output, damage resistance and increase their resistance to knockbacks and stuns, e.g. a Tellarite with Sturdy, Pig Headed, Superior Resilient and Superior Aggressive would be ideal)
It was a tremendous help as I was leveling and in trying different configurations. I have been a successful level 50 officer now for a while and have been flourishing, largely in part to all your great advice.
I did make some additional adjustments based on your feedback at the time
Thanks again and fly safe!
here is why: if you run 2 versions of the same tier abilitys the TACINI, will cut both CDs in half...so if you run one copy of a higher tier like scatter volly 3 and 1 and APbeta2 and 1 you can, while TACINI is active, rotate only the higher tier abilities instead of switching between T3 and T1. which greatly increases dps.
On any of the other 2 classes you may run 2 copies of the same ability of the same tier.
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=SciFleetDefiant_0
Basically, it's an all energy build, I prefer not to run torpedos on my escorts. Right now she runs 1 DBB and 3 DHCs (due to the ensign tac Defiant issue), but I am thinking about ditching the ensign tac (just ignoring it all together) and running 4 DHCs on her. Now I am assuming that you will be 50 soon, right? I found some really nice gear in the exchange that works great on this ship. Most notably, the Regenerative Shield Array Mk XII [Reg]x2. I love this shield, but this was mainly since this toon hit 50 after Season 7 dropped, and its to hold her off until I can get the borg shield.
Finally, I find this build PERFECT in PvE for survivability. I keep shield batteries handy, but its more to buff my shield power for the regen rate, and not the heal. It's also fairly tanky in PvP, of course like anything your team is also a vital part of survivability.
BTW, you mentioned you weren't a fan of how long the PvP queues take. That is more of a lower level issue, its normally much faster at lvl 50. But if you get into PvP, I highly recommend finding a fleet and getting on voice communications (Vent, TeamSpeak, ect) for PvP. Makes the teamwork much easier.