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Help with an Armitage build
bespin18
Member Posts: 78 Arc User
I just bought an armitage, and im wondering if its build should be any different than my old fleet escort? i see alot of people putting dual beam banks on it which feels like a waste of my turn rate to me.
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=armitagebuild_0
here is my current build. Im a tact officer and my gear is as follows:
fore: 3xDHC Photon torpedo launcher
borg deflector
borg engine
MACO shield mk xii
aft: 3xturrets
engineering consoles: torpedo point defence system, 2xneutronium
Science consoles: borg console, field generator
tactical consoles: photon detonation assembly, 3x antiproton mag regulator
hangar: advanced peregrine fighters
i wanted to take advantage of the special console the armitage came with, because id feel like its a waste of money not to use it after i payed for it lol and a lot of threads say that the torpedo point defense console is affected by the photon tact console. i was using quantums but like i said, i wanted my weapon types to be universal.
some good feedback and positive criticism would be greatly appreciated
thx in advance
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=armitagebuild_0
here is my current build. Im a tact officer and my gear is as follows:
fore: 3xDHC Photon torpedo launcher
borg deflector
borg engine
MACO shield mk xii
aft: 3xturrets
engineering consoles: torpedo point defence system, 2xneutronium
Science consoles: borg console, field generator
tactical consoles: photon detonation assembly, 3x antiproton mag regulator
hangar: advanced peregrine fighters
i wanted to take advantage of the special console the armitage came with, because id feel like its a waste of money not to use it after i payed for it lol and a lot of threads say that the torpedo point defense console is affected by the photon tact console. i was using quantums but like i said, i wanted my weapon types to be universal.
some good feedback and positive criticism would be greatly appreciated
thx in advance Post edited by bespin18 on
0
Comments
One thing you might want to try, though, is a Aux2Bat build. The Armitage having two higher-than-ensign-level Engineering slots means you can take Aux2Bat1 and either Aux2SIF2 + EPTS1 or EPTS3 + ET1 (I prefer the former setup given the shared cooldown of ET1 with TT1).
Aux2Bat is a little tricky to get to grips with if you've not used it before... by itself it's pretty much a throwaway ability, but combined with 2-3 Purple Technician DOFFs it comes into its own as a major power recharge buff. The only downside to it is that it shares a cooldown with EPTX, so you can't double-stack EPTW+EPTS if you're using it (no problem for an Escort, since they can hit 125 Weapons power without any extra buffs). Despite what the name suggests, Aux2Bat does NOT share a cooldown with Aux2SIF... but since it works by diverting Aux power to other systems, you'll usually want to wait until the initial Aux Power debuff wears off (10 seconds) before using any Aux-based heals.
Taking Aux2Bat would allow you to drop one of the CSV1s for CRF1, and have all your powers recharge a lot sooner - whenever you click Aux2Bat they'll be nearly but not quite halved. Technically you might be able to get away with dropping a TT1 for THY1, but I prefer having perma Tac Team than "up really often" Tac Team.
On my Armitage I use 2x Purple Technician DOFFs, 2x Projectile Weapon DOFFs, and a Shield Redistribution DOFF, combined with the MACO Shields/Deflector and Borg Engines/Console. The two technicians plus the 5% Recharge buff from the MACO set makes me able to be just short of "perma" EPTS (3 Techs would make it Perma, but I didn't want to give up another DOFF slot). Fore Weapons are 1x Quad Cannon, 2x DHC, 1x Quantum Launcher with 3 Turrets at the rear... and I swap out one DHC for another Quantum Launcher during certain STFs.
Taking a second glance at this, I noticed what you mentioned about trying to maximise Photon Torpedo Potential along with that Universal Console.
There's a hard cap on the amount of Torpedos you can launch over time. Basically, one every two seconds. Assuming you're using at least two Projectile Weapon DOFFs, three launchers will start to give diminishing returns as they near that hard cap.
I've performed a lot of testing trying to figure out the optimum weapon setup. But basically: if we assume you've room to slot 2-3 Purple Projectile Weapon DOFFs, then you're better off with 2x DHCs and 2x Launchers (Photons being slightly better DPS at 2 DOFFs, Quantums slightly better at 3 DOFFs). Energy type should always be either Disruptors (for hull damage) or Antiprotons (for shield damage).
Your 3xDHC/1Torp Setup is pretty standard. There's a slight increase in Hull DPS going from 3xDHCs/1Torp to 2xDHCs/2Torps (with 2-3 DOFFs), but a noticable drop in general DPS going from 2xDHCs/2Torps to 1xDHC/3Torps. "Pure" torpedo boats are generally not as effective as hybrid DHC/Torp setups, outside of very specific builds exploiting the B'rel Retrofit's Battle Cloak.
Are you sure about this?
About a month ago I was playing around with Aux to Batts +Purple Techs, and I remember it putting Aux to SIF on cooldown.
I could simply be remembering it wrong, but it was one of the main reasons I decided against aux to batts.
Yeah, logically I'd have expected there to be a shared cooldown since they both use the Aux system. I was surprised to learn firsthand that there isn't one.
It even says on STOWiki that there's a shared cooldown, so perhaps there used to be one? However when I bought my Armitage I tested it out (Aux2SIF2 and Aux2Bat1, with EPTS1) in order to see if my survivability was greatly reduced... Currently using Aux2Bat1 starts a 40 second recharge on itself (after 3 seconds, the recharge buff kicks in and reduces this to 29 seconds) and puts EPTS1 on a 15 second system cooldown, but doesn't touch Aux2SIF2.
Currently in-game (testing right now) I can fire Aux2SIF2 right after Aux2Bat, but its effectiveness reduces considerably: at 52/25 AUX its 3972.5 Heal + 25.9% Resist buff becomes 2137 Heal + 13.9% resist due to the Aux power drain. Likewise, using Aux2SIF2 doesn't place a cooldown on Aux2Bat1. The only shared cooldown appears to be between EPTS1 and Aux2Bat1.
Interesting, I'll need to check in game again then.
I'm not sure if it would convince me to run the build but it's definitely something to consider.
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
I use this Aux2bat build too but on my Eng Armitage, and it is very effective with DEM2, but on a Tactical officer with Tactical Initiative I just wouldn't bother. Tac Init works better because it reduces the global cooldown not just the power cool down, and it free's up active space Doffs.
It does, however, provide an excellent power boost on any profession, especially if you hit a Aux battery before Aux2Bat, your levels shoot through the roof which is more apparent in an Eng if you hit EPS power transfer again before Aux2bat.
Tetryon weapons have been given a significant boost to the point where they may be better against shields than anti-protons. Anti-protons are mainly good for tacticals who get large numbers of criticals.
I'd stick with Antiprotons or Disruptors.
Tetryons have indeed been buffed, but for PVE it's usually not worth sacrificing the extra Hull Damage or Crits for a little extra shield bleedthrough. One thing to note is that Disruptors inflict a 10% damage debuff which will increase the damage from all your weapons and your torpedos (as well as the damage from any pets or teammates) whereas the Antiproton bonus Crit Severity only affects the weapon that's firing.
(Without Aux2Bat)
Tac Ensign - TS1
Tac Lt - TT1, CRF1
Tac Com - TT1, CSV1, APO1, APB3
Eng LtCom - EPTS1, EPTS2, Aux2SIF2
Sci LT - HE1, TSS2
(With Aux2Bat)
Tac Ensign - TS1
Tac Lt - TT1, CRF1
Tac Com - TT1, CSV1, APO1, APB3
Eng LtCom - EPTS1, Aux2Bat1, Aux2SIF2
Sci LT - HE1, TSS2
Literally all Aux2Bat is doing is reducing your power recharge times. You lose a little bit of personal survivability by dropping EPTS2, but the greater uptime of EPTS1, TSS and HE1 more than make up for this... and the Tac power uptime and allied healing potential are a lot better than the first build. Yes, you'll have access to "Tactical Initiative" as a Tac Captain, but the cooldown is pretty long and it doesn't affect non-tac powers.
The key in both builds is APB3 - it'll buff all your damage, from Torps and Energy Weapons and Fighters. APB3>CSV1>TS1 is a potent AoE combo, and APB>CRF1 is a decent buff to ST DPS. Especially when combined with Tac Captain Buffs.
Just rememeber to take at least 2x Projectile Weapon DOFFs on both builds, as well as 2x Technicians on the Aux2Bat one. And note that these are purely PvE builds - APB is easily countered in PvP.
Well, the main benefit of APs (which I'm quite sure you're aware of) is that Disruptors rely on the 2.5% proc rate, which can happen at the start of a fight while an enemy has full shields, or near the end of a fight where the enemy is about to die anyway - for some examples of disadvantages vs. AP.
AP goes by the crit proc rate your captain/ship and weapons are capable of and most of my parsings in ACT generally show most TACs running an average of 9-12% critical hit rate. At worst you might crit towards the end of a fight and do more damage than was needed.
I always flip flop between the two, because to be honest the math required to calculate which is better DPS overall is beyond me.
FWIW, running identical builds on a Tac/Fleet Escort w/ AP and Tac/Guramba w/ Disruptors (even went so far as to stay out of seige mode completely) my Tac/FE always came out ahead in DPS.
Ultimately I generally go with AP for ships that don't have something like a Javelin as higher crits are good vs. both hull and shields.
Disruptors give a 2.5% chance for a 15 second 10% debuff (which is meant to not stack from multiple sources), but if you're using a lot of energy weapons with a high rate of fire (particularly with CRF to lower the cycle time) then the expected uptime will rise significantly because of the long duration.
For Antiprotons you just need to know your Crit chance and Crit severity (these can be found in your ship attack stats page on any space map) - these let you find the average additional damage from Crits (= "A"). Then add the additional Antiproton Weapon Crit Severity modifier to your base Crit Severity, and calculate that TOTAL value against your listed Crit Chance score (= "B"). The difference between "A" and "B" will give you the average increase in damage you can expect from each antiproton weapon.
The uptime on Disruptors is a bit more difficult, but we can estimate it given standard probability mechanics: you take the chance of the event NOT occuring and multiply that up for each proc chance roll. With 3 Turrets and 3 DHCs, we'd have an average of 37.5 weapon cycles over 15 seconds (without CRF) or 47.54 (with CRF) so over the 15 second duration of the debuff, there'd be a lot of chances for the 2.5% proc to roll again to "refresh" the disruptor debuff for another 15 seconds (38 rolls with a "one in 40" chance to activate would mean you'd multiply 39/40 by itself 38 times to give an aggregate 61.79% chance that the debuff would refresh itself - with CRF that'd rise to an aggregate 70.34% chance).
Averaging those chances out by the 10% debuff means you can expect to inflict ~6.2% higher damage by using Disruptors or 7% with CRF on a 3 DHC/3 Turret build.
To compare that to Antiprotons, let's use your higher figure of 12% crit chance. Obviously, the most benefit from using Antiprotons will be seen if I'm at the lowest possible Base Severity to start off with. Base crit severity is 50%, which at 12% crit chance is an average increase in damage from Crits over time of 0.5*12/100=6%. Adding in an Antiproton +20% severity to this brings that up to 70% severity for 0.7*12/100=8.4% - so in this "best case" example, I would expect each Antiproton weapon I slot to do an average of 2.4% more damage over time.
That's 2.4% (best case Antiproton) against 6.2% (worst case Disruptor).
Further observations in favour of Antiprotons: Disruptor's damage won't apply against damage absorbed by shields. Antiproton damage will apply against Shields and Hull alike. In PvP you're usually not firing on bare hulls. With more than one person running disruptors you'll encounter severe diminishing returns, as the debuff doesn't stack (or at least isn't MEANT to stack) from multiple sources.
Further observations in favour of Disruptors: Disruptors will still apply against any Hull bleedthrough damage. In PVE shields are usually quite easy to wear down and large stuctures in STFs are completely unshielded. Disruptor's additional damage applies against ALL damage done to the target - rather than Antiprotons which only applies to that particular weapon.
Considering that an Armitage will likely be using at least one Torpedo Launcher and a wing of 6 Fighters, all of which would have their damage output buffed by the Disruptor Proc, I'd probably recommend Disruptors. Buffing the damage of any Teammates that also happen to fire on your target would be a bonus.
Front 2x Dual Cannon/1DHC/ 1 Quantum Torp
Rear: 3x Turret
(Exact same console setup)
Tac Team1, High Yield2, Torp Spread3, Scatter Volley3
High Yield1, Rapid Fire1
Torp Spread1
Emergency Power Shields 1, Engineering Team2, Reverse Shield Polarity2
Polarize Hull1, Hazard Emitters2 (Switch to Science Team II when not fighting Borg)
Doffs can make a big difference too.
Energy Weapons Officer - Reduce cannon ability cooldown (SV and RF)
Projectile Weapons Officer (Reduce Torpedo Cooldown)
Conn Officer (Reduce Tactical Team cooldown+buff)
Maintenance Engineer (Reduce Engineering Team Cooldown+buff)
Nurse - Increase crew regen rate when below 75% while in combat (like Biofunction monitor)
A very informative breakdown, thanks for putting that together.
So if you were going to choose disruptors for Fleet Events/STFs, would you be choosing CrtHx3 or CrtDx3?
Fleet Events will probably depend on the character, on one extreme, probably MkXII [CrtH]x3 for Tacs in Escorts; and on the other extreme, possibly MkXII [Dmg]x3 for Engineers in Cruisers.
Edited: After checking in game, with MkXII Purple Weapons [Dmg] modifiers look to grant a little over a 2.194% increase in DPS. +2% chance from CrtH should grant about an increase in average DPS over time of 2.25% (at base), and +20% severity from CrtD should grant 1.75%. So looks like that means "always go for CrtH"...? I haven't done many critical hit calculations before for STO though, so the math probably isn't foolproof.
STFs? Definitely MkXII [Borg], particularly on Torpedos and Turrets.
Is [DMG] a percentage?
I was looking on STO Wiki (which isn't always completely up to date admittedly) and it regularly lists [DMG] on space weapons as "+5 DPV".
So is it actually a percentage and not a straight +5 DPV?
If it's some form of a percentage than it might not be nearly as bad as I've been thinking.
It's not a flat percentage buff, when I checked in game to compare it to CrtH, it looked to be much more pronounced at lower levels and lower rarity tiers. So on a Purple MkXII weapon, a [Dmg] modifier would pretty much be at its least effective.
The quote above where I state that a [Dmg] buff looks it gives you an extra 2.194 "percent" DPS on a MkXII Purple weapon is just me trying to compare the extra DPS granted by [Dmg] to that granted by [CrtH] and [CritD] on endgame weaponry...
If it is only a flat +5 DPV the effect on endgame weaponry would be dictated by the weapon you're looking at.
A flat +5 DPV is going to be a larger % DPS increase on a Turret than it will on a DHC.
Is there a chart somewhere showing the comparative differences on skill levels?
There aren't any skill levels that affect CSV or TS directly, but the differences in added damage between the versions are:
For CSV/CRF:
---- DHC | Cannons | Turrets ----
CSV3: 25% | 25% | 73%
CSV2: 20% | 20% | 45%
CSV1: 15% | 15% | 17%
CRF3: 50% | 50% | 50%
CRF2: 40% | 40% | 40%
CRF1: 30% | 30% | 30%
[from a reply I received when asking a question here]
For TS/THY:
TS3: +136% (Max 5 Targets)
TS2: +107% (Max 4 Targets)
TS1: +78% (Max 3 Targets)
HY3: +195% (Max 1 Target)
HY2: +159% (Max 1 Target)
HY1: +123% (Max 1 Target)
[Tested personally with a White MkXII Quantum Torpedo Launcher here]
For APB, it's a little more involved as it's affected by your "Starship Attack Patterns" skill, but when maxxed out at 9/9 it's: 30% for APB1, 40% for APB2 and 50% for APB3.
Attack Pattern Beta is a debuff, which applies against all incoming damage received by your enemy (regardless of whether the damage is from you or your pets or your teammates) so it's usually the best choice to take for DPS in PVE, particularly if you're a carrier or if you're in a team. The only exception is if you're running an all-turret build, which few do because of the low base DPS of turrets.