test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Options
Fleet Action level restriction please
grtiggy
Member Posts: 444 Arc User
ok so just been doing the starbase defence scenario thing and for some reason we got a lvl 8 guy in it with his miranda join the rest of us who were at least level 40 and of course the miranda pretty much contributed NOTHING to the thign and of course we lost...
i think we need some cut offs for the lower levels so they can still earn fleet marks but go in with there own level guys and not TRIBBLE over the higher levels at the same time cause it is a bit rediuclus
i think we need some cut offs for the lower levels so they can still earn fleet marks but go in with there own level guys and not TRIBBLE over the higher levels at the same time cause it is a bit rediuclus
Post edited by grtiggy on
0
Comments
These need to be either gated to VA only, if we are going to be facing level 52 enemies. Either that or at least have it be that VA's are teamed together and the Lieutenant characters are being teamed together, kind of like with the pvp side.
I ran this like crazy with my fleet on tribble, we had it down to a science. Even when we had to do a pick up group people would catch on fast. It just disappoints me that when I try it with a PUG on holodeck that the team is so messed up that we ultimately have the deck stacked against us.
Lt=ltcom
Com-capt
and then no one will be moaning
but in a real fleet for every admiral there are dozens of captains and hundreds of lts
I guess the relative difficulty should fall very steeply for lower lvls on these.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Big ships (cruisers and up) deal with the big ships
Small ships (escorts and light cruisers) deal with the small ships and fly point
and as to "Crowd control" a dozen VA's spamming special effects can crash the instance for some people
you can not put a va escort on the same level as a miranda. The VA escort can surive for a bit, where the miranda can't. I doubt the miranda with a lt 5 can generate enough dps to even get the npc to fire at it.
small fast attack vessels their combat role is the same as a light cruiser
Engage and destroy (not in priority order ) Interceptor fighters , bird of prey type vessels , frigates , corvettes , other escorts , other light cruisers.
Forget DPS DPM and DPH think DPE (damage per engagement)
and a VA or a lt com in an escort is fast response (highly reactive interception role)
so is that miranda
Now I have pugged a few of these missions now and watched some interesting behaviour
for example a VA rank in a Carrier (Caitian) stand off and order everyone else to "heal the starbase" until the mission was over (even after the enemy were after the facilities)
A matched pair of high end Escorts (not familiar with the exact model sorry) trying to pick off all the BIG ships while the cruisers dealt with the swarming corvettes (wrong way round guys)
And no less than three science ships popping gravity wells at the same time and crashing the instance (at least on my computer)
Huh? But because the DPS of my escort is higher, my "DPE" will be higher then others too?
??? Of course they did, its their job to kill the big babies ??? Higher DPS (or DPE how you want to call it) means faster destruction of the big enemies with the big weapons. Other ships with lower DPS are better in attacking smaller ships, because they will kill these too in a good time.
Oh and one more: It is better for an escort to attack an enemy which is not very fast, because we need to focus our DHCs on the enemy. A small ship will be harder to get in the front of the ship, so our DPS will drop dramatically. A beam-boat doesn't have these problems, because it will shoot with at least 2 or 3 beams at the same time.
"What are his rights in this century? Will there be a trial or shall I execute him?" - Worf
and no
your DPS is for the few seconds your target is being fired on
DPE is higher for beam armed ships in most cases
On a more positive note I think the idea of a level restriction on the fleet actions are a must. I'm actually very surprised at the fact that it wasn't implemented in the first place.
Last night I saw some level 18 sci in a nova basically just pewpewing and dying in just one or two hits every time.
if it would be that simple, i joined many battle's where i was outperforming everyone else (including almost all odyssey's)
Clearly the lower level instances would be easier to complete.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Have you or have you not played the fleet actions in question?
As is your right to do so. Disagreement is rarely a bad thing after all!
Yes, I follow. At least I do now, at first I thought it was about the new carpets!*
There is no need to totally exclude them from building bases, but fleet marks are not the only resource needed to build a base. You do realise that?
Besides, the low tier players who take part are basically dead weight that makes it harder for the team to succeed. If they don't succeed then they don't get fleet marks (for the most part) which would be a sad waste of time.
We could throw heals at them yes, but they go down so easily you'd end up having to follow them throwing down heals every few seconds. Now please tell me, which heals can recharge in a matter of 5 or 6 seconds every time they are used?
I'm afraid I don't know how our devs would do it. I would assume they have different variants of the mission that is geared towards players of particular levels which then only display in the PVE queue when one is at the required level. I.e. A Lt will only see Lt level mission, Cmdr will only see Cmdr level mission etc. I think it could be done as you don't see any of the STFs in the pve queue below a certain level. Level 40 I think.
I'm sorry, but I don't understand your question.
Maybe my coffee hasn't quite kicked in yet?
Sollvax. Hasn't he already been fed this week? (if you catch my meaning)
As I explained earlier in this post, one simply cannot afford to waste time going haring off after these guys trying to keep them alive. The boff powers simply don't cool down fast enough. These guys take one or two hits and they are instantly below 50% hull. They also do nowhere near enough damage to be able to make a contribution to the team effort in other words they are effectively dead weight and thereby making the scenario impossibly difficult to complete.
I'm all for throwing heals around, I even do it in my escort with it's *very* limited team heals but to be expected to throw one out every few seconds (which is what it would need to keep a low level cruiser alive) is simply bonkers. You cannot expect an entire team to throw their heals on a player who simply cannot pull the weight required. Heals that they could get far more effective use from by using them on themselves or on other ships that are far more capable than the low level players.
My friend there is fairness and then there is allowing a group to be hamstrung by a single low level player who cannot fend for themselves effectively.
Why on earth do you think the borg RA events are almost always failing in Sirius and Regulus blocks? Because they are being flooded with relatively new players who simply cannot put out or take the damage required to succeed. It's a very similar thing happening with the fleet events.
*Forgive me, I need to exercise the sarcasm muscles every now and then lol
If this is your experience of Escorts then all the Escorts you've seen have sucked hard. Cruisers are actually useful in these things but mostly as the support vessels they are; Escorts are all about damage and that's what they bring in spades. If you want to spend 20 minutes tickling an NPC to death with a BA broadside then go for it but I'd rather the Escort popped it in one pass so that we can quickly get onto the next freighter.
Regarding the fighter spam, a Cruiser spamming Fire at Will is in a good position to deal with this, Escorts will clear some with CSV but those DHCs need to be pointing at the important targets and not at a bunch of fighters; given the speed of the fighters and the limited arc of DHCs there's even less reason why you'd think an Escort should be chasing them down rather than your Cruiser which, with the wide arc of BAs, is perfectly suited for spam clearance duties as well as (shock and horror) supporting the other ships on your team and the important NPCs. I know that the Cruiser's BAs miss a lot against fighters but so do DHCs and I usually find that an 800 damage BA shot missing is less important than a 4000-6000 damage DHC bolt missing when it could instead be hitting a bigger NPC.
The simple fact is that Cruisers aren't bringing the burst damage to deal with the attacking NPCs quickly, Cruisers and Science ships are better off CCing the attacking NPCs to let the Freighter leave weapons range so that you can move to the next Freighter rather than trying to destroy them all for no reason. The attacking mob doesn't even need to be destroyed in Blockade, you just have to prevent them from destroying the Freighters and even in Fleet Alert and Starbase Defence you're better off supporting friendly players and healing the friendly NPCs (where possible) than trying to out damage the Escorts.
Yeah, a lot of that is down to pets and cpu load. Then add in the sound bugs in some of the maps that causes sounds to randomly play more and more and before long you have one toasty cpu!
It would be different if the enemy level required fly bys, but a lot of these missions just don't have difficult enemies... the challenge is quantity rather than quality. Thus an escort can basically park or go to 25% engines and rip into a big ship, then move on to the next, much more quickly than a cruiser, without having to worry too much about dying. Meanwhile, a cruiser can hop from small target to small target more quickly than an escort who has to turn and face.
The best way to translate the high DPS of an escort into DPE is to maximize the amount of time they're shooting vs the amount of time they're turning to face targets. Even a fairly nimble escort can have a hard time keeping a fighter in its sights, so they're left usually firing their aft turrets a good portion of the time.
Then we haven't even talked about carriers, who can just go intercept and have their pets take care of the fighters. Or science vessels who, when not healing, should be tying up the smaller stuff into a cluster that is easily destroyed by either cruisers OR escorts.
Yes, there should be something done differently than making the requirement "5 players from LVL 2 to 50." I queued up for one in a LtCmdr ship, not realizing it would put me with the big boys, and I did a decent enough job with the small stuff, but I would've been a real hindrance on Blockade or NWS (this was in Fleet Defense). I felt bad, but that's the way it's set up now.
The mission should be accessible to all, but there should be some way of making everyone useful. But there are a few options:
-Gating it so that ships of similar levels fight together
-Give (sometimes massive) boosts to health, damage, and cooldown proportional to how far from VA you are. If you're Lt, and all you've got is one FAW, you should be able to spam it almost non stop
-Set the 5 man team as the basis for VA level, then start slotting more ships to get a similar total firepower. e.g. start the engagement with 5 VAs OR 3 VAs + 3 Capt OR 2 VAs + 4 Cmdr + 6 Lt (just assign a point value to each level and make the total points add up)
Sometimes I will want to play with people on my level (VA 50) to be as successful at the missions as possible but other times I will want to play with my Fleet Members, no matter their rank. It?s very important to me that I am available to do this because its a Fleet Event, something that all of our fleet members should be able to partake in. I would hate to exclude someone because of rank.
Im not sure what the Devs can do but as long as it can be balanced so that I can play with my fleet no matter the ranks and have fun or team up with people at my same rank and be successful at both.
U.S.S Limitless
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations
^That functionality is already in game, it's called making a private match. PvE Queue -> Create Private.
On topic
The normal PvE queue shouldn't permit pre 50s from being teamed with 50s. It's beyond stupid getting teamed up in a team of 4 50s and a lvl 11 which contributes nothing and only degrades the experience of 4 other people, completely unacceptable.
Before this season hit, the reality of joint missions was simple: level the lowbies quickly so they could participate in STFs and such with us.
The ability to play together with lower level toons is great in theory but has not been effective in practice. The Borg alerts are a perfect example. As soon as I see a Connie or two warp in, I know we won't win it. I don't know what the best solution would be whilst still including them, but it's discouraging the way it is now.
Much easier than gating, since the code is already in game.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Cannon: Scatter Volley much?
Matthew/Shiduri@zekesulastin
This sig dedicated to the many random objects the Mythbusters crew has blow to smitherines