Since DS9 is just about my favorite ST, I can't agree more. While the current version isn't bad (IMO) it could use some love.
Like the OP said, open up the entrance to Quarks. PLEASE TAKE OUT THE STUPID RAMP. One way to save polygon load (so you can merge it to the rest of the promenade) is to add turbolifts like you had in Club 47 instead of that monstrous ramp. It might not be totally accurate, but it's better than that ramp.
I'm hopeful that all of the revamping done to the game really raises the bar for cryptic and causes them to do a revamp of all the social zones that need it and add functionally to those that don't have it. I've been impressed with the ESD updates so far mostly because it feels like they just put more work into it. I had always thought that ESD, like sector space, felt like a placeholder before rather then a finished product.
I really hope the changes made to starbase sierra are just the beginning, seems like it would need it the most with the weekly series starting up soon near there.
Been forever since I have watched much DS9, but he wouldn't let Kurn do his honorable death ceremony, then basically kills Kurn to get him to stop whining. Erasing his memory is essentially giving him an unhonorable death. The one known as Kurn is dead, with no honor in his death. And he would let other cultures do other things, so it seems to show his bias is against JUST Klingons.
There were a few instances of things like that, he seemed at times as though he had no respect for other cultures. But he did flip flop back and forth a little.
I think this was more that he was getting tired of the BS in dealing with Klingons.
I haven't watched DS9 in a bit either but I think it was just episode after episode of Sisko and company fighting Klingon, or observing a ritual, or dealing with Worf and Jaz coming into work sore, bruised and battered from the night before. As a boss I think I would quickly grow tired of it as well, despite being respectful of other cultures.
There is that and the fact that it would of been murder on the federation administered outpost by one of its key officers, ritual or not probably influenced his reaction as well.
Technically I think it could also be argued that since the Bajorians really owned the station that it would be up to them what is legal and what isan't but that getting into wayyyy to much trek for me at the moment.
A lot of great ideas. Opening up more of DS9 would be fantastic. All the places you mentioned, infirmiry, (formerly) Sisko's office, security office, etc. More civilians, crazy aliens, more weird clothing, whatever. More ships flying around to/from the wormhole. There was another thread that mentioned the "Assay Office" as a place for banking/inventory/etc.
*Tailor really should be Cardassian instead of Vulcan.
This I don't agree with. When I saw the tailor in ESD for the first time, I thought: "what, are all tailors in Star Trek Cardassians?" Just because it was that way during the show doesn't mean it will always be that way.
I'd like to see a lot more civilian population on the promenade. It was almost always packed and I think it would bring a lot of life to what DS9 feels like. Though I concede that just from a technical standpoint of having too many people might be difficult for some players' computers. Maybe if they added only a couple dozen random people walking about it'll help -- to make it feel as busy as ESD at least.
agreed! anyway... we have all sorts of NPC's walking around ESD, why not DS9?
and while there at it, how about some NPC freighters outside DS9. the place feels so unused as is where as in DS9 it was always busy
Make some countryboy raised by epic parents, Call Him John Sheridan and make him Captain of DS9. Instead of a Defiant. Give him a Emissary Class just for pure irony.
*Tailor really should be Cardassian instead of Vulcan.
Why? Garak is gone. Why must every tailor be Cardassian?
*OPS needs to allow us to walk into Sisko's old office. Put his baseball on the desk as a tribute to him.
Why would he have left his baseball anywhere?
*Runabouts, which are sold only at DS9, need to be given some kind of real in-game function. I hear the shuttle system is going to be cool. Are runabouts better than a standard shuttle? They should be.
They are better than standard shuttles. You can pilot them yourself, not use them as pets.
The infirmary and security station maps were done in one of the missions and are available in The Foundry. I'd imagine they could be hooked up easily if they had a use.
I have mixed feelings about deinstancing Quarks, primarily because leaving it instanced may allow for a couple of things:
1) Bar brawls, either as a player activity or, say, a daily that players can assist station security in shutting down. In general, instancing is good for allowing special rules to apply to an area that don't apply elsewhere.
2) The holosuites. If you leave Quark's cordoned off, you can have the holosuites uninstanced and constantly running a large program or two whose map would conflict with station architecture. Personally, I'd like Vic's and a persistent baseball stadium "always running".
Now, in terms of general polish, one thing I think would be cool and help justify a polish pass is if the Klingons got their own Nor. The Klingon/Cardassian borders are likely a weak spot in defense given how thin the Feds are spread and Cardassia's general lack of military.
Maybe around the time the Talos or Tarsus IV sector gets added (west of the Neutral Zone and slightly south of the existing maps). That area seems likely to have an abandoned Cardassian presence.
The Klingons could get a Nor even as DS9 gets some upgrades.
2) The holosuites. If you leave Quark's cordoned off, you can have the holosuites uninstanced and constantly running a large program or two whose map would conflict with station architecture. Personally, I'd like Vic's and a persistent baseball stadium "always running".
I can see Vic's being added as part of the uninstanced map, but the baseball stadium should get it's own instance. In fact, I think the other 2 Holosuites should have their own instances, where people can call up some of DS9's other Holosuite programs.
1) Like you said, the Baseball Stadium (can be turned into a type of minigame).
2) The Klingon Holoprograms. Like Kor's Battle of Klach D'kel Brakt.
3) O'Brien and Bashir's many holosuite moments. Like the Battle of Britain.
Been forever since I have watched much DS9, but he wouldn't let Kurn do his honorable death ceremony, then basically kills Kurn to get him to stop whining. Erasing his memory is essentially giving him an unhonorable death. The one known as Kurn is dead, with no honor in his death. And he would let other cultures do other things, so it seems to show his bias is against JUST Klingons.
There were a few instances of things like that, he seemed at times as though he had no respect for other cultures. But he did flip flop back and forth a little.
*Rips hair out, kills infants*
First of all, after Kurn was not allowed to do the suicide ritual, he tried to get himself killed by an alien on the station, he wanted to be dead any means, regardless of the consequences; honorable and dishonorable.
By surgically altering Kurn, Sisko gave him the best of both worlds (no pun intended); it allowed him to live a TRUE Klingon life which wasn't marked by the consequences of Worf's actions.
This is the same man who was nauseated at the site of massacred Cardassian women and children on Cardassia Prime and refused to drink to victory, and you're calling him a racist?
Please be more informed before you badmouth the emissary.
Why? Garak is gone. Why must every tailor be Cardassian?
I don't want every tailor to be Cardassian. I just feel that if you are going to have a Vulcan tailor and a Cardassian tailor, then the Cardassian tailor should be on Deep Space Nine and the Vulcan tailor should be on ESD.
He left his baseball on his desk when the Cardassians took over the station. Actually, he left his baseball on his desk when the Bajorans stormed the station back in season 2 too.
At the end of "What You Leave Behind" after Sisko has died, Kira is seen at his desk throwing his ball in the air and catching it. I would imagine, given how important Sisko was to both the war, and bajor, that they might leave his baseball on his desk as a kind of memorial.
I like the idea that we can still see his baseball in his old office. What you leave behind is not nearly as important as what you take with you.
They are better than standard shuttles. You can pilot them yourself, not use them as pets.
I haven't had a chance to sit down and compare specs on the runabout, standard shuttle, and delta flyer. I was just expressing that I'd like runabouts to be comporable to the delta flyer and shuttles in such a way that there would be some advantage to them over a shuttle, just as a shuttle should have some advantage over a runabout or delta flyer, and the delta flyer has some advantage over a runabout or shuttle.
I don't want it to be that runabouts are the weakest, shuttles the second weakest, delta flyer the best. Because then everyone is either in a delta flyer or shuttle and there's no reason to even have a runabout.
I've had my runabout since the very begining. I love it as a symbol of Deep Space Nine (the series) and always enjoyed the idea of them. I want to fly one instead of a shuttle or delta flyer, but I don't want to be handicapped as a result.
If the runabouts are the weakest, I was proposing that they be given a 'bump' to make them more viable.
Again, haven't looked at the specs closely (feel free to enlighten me, would love to know) but IF IF IF they suck compared to shuttles and the delta flyer, I'd like thme to be made less-suck.
The infirmary and security station maps were done in one of the missions and are available in The Foundry. I'd imagine they could be hooked up easily if they had a use.
They are??
Can you tell me how to find them (I don't use the foundary much but would like a peak) or possibly even post the pics.
He left his baseball on his desk when the Cardassians took over the station. Actually, he left his baseball on his desk when the Bajorans stormed the station back in season 2 too.
At the end of "What You Leave Behind" after Sisko has died, Kira is seen at his desk throwing his ball in the air and catching it. I would imagine, given how important Sisko was to both the war, and bajor, that they might leave his baseball on his desk as a kind of memorial.
I like the idea that we can still see his baseball in his old office. What you leave behind is not nearly as important as what you take with you.
My thoughts on the baseball; It would be neat to see it, but as you said Kira was tossing it when she took over. My thought would be given how important it was to Sisko that;
a) She would've given it to Jake Sisko.
b) She would've kept it (with Jake's blessing) as a memento of her friendship with Sisko.
As the last time we saw the ball was the scene described above, these are all just possible outcomes(including that it may still be in the office). However, I don't think Kira would've just left it there for someone who may not even appreciate it's value or signifigance. At the very best, maybe a replica of the original.;)
DS9 needs a touch-up, yes, but, I think compared to some of other starbases in game, it's pretty well off.
Yes, it is arguably the most iconic of them and deserves extra attention, but I'm saying we should hope for an improvement to the other stations first.
I'll be the naysayer here and say that DS9 should not be the next station to be madeover.
The order should be:
ESD
Qo'nos
Sierra
then maybe DS9
I respectfully disagree on the Sierra part and here's why. That to me is more of an outpost then a major hub. ESD orbits over the capital of the Federation and Qo'Nos is capital of the Klingon Empire, so those are given. DS9 sits next to the only transit point to the Gamma Quadrant (wormhole), not to mention its proximity to both Bajor and Cardassia. That and its much more iconic than Sierra (unless I missed the series Star Trek: 39 Sierra).
Yes, Sierra is the jumping off point to Romulan Space, but it is still a trek (no pun intended) to Rator and never really was nor do I think it will be a social hub even if it was revamped.
As I stated, I do agree that ESD and Qo'Nos have priority over DS9.
Deep Space Nine is the only interior which is TOO SMALL!
Heh. That's true. Although the new earth star base doesn't make the most sense either (at what point in the structure is the diameter that narrow?) While the devs are doing Starbases it may be time to think about the size of starbase exteriors in regards to scale as well.
Heh. That's true. Although the new earth star base doesn't make the most sense either (at what point in the structure is the diameter that narrow?) While the devs are doing Starbases it may be time to think about the size of starbase exteriors in regards to scale as well.
Again DS9 is not too Small. Look at the damn windows. It is too big.
Starbase Sierra is going to be a jumping off point for the new weekly, and is it is is vastly under-equipped.
It has no Tailor (though it appears to have been meant to).
It has no ship customization or selector.
It has no Chief Engineer or Chief Medical Officer.
Sierra was designed to be a hub and it needs to be brought up to par with the other 2.
I have to agree, DS9 definitely needs some Dev luv. Though it definitely looks similar to the DS9 from the show, it is just a little....*off*. Though I do think Sierra needs some luv too, Deep Space Nine is farther from ESD and is more iconic.
At the end of "What You Leave Behind" after Sisko has died, Kira is seen at his desk throwing his ball in the air and catching it. I would imagine, given how important Sisko was to both the war, and bajor, that they might leave his baseball on his desk as a kind of memorial.
Spoilers would've been nice. I'm only into season 3 right now.
Spoilers would've been nice. I'm only into season 3 right now.
P.S. Napoleon loses at Waterloo, The South surrenders and The Titanic sinks.
Sorry about that.
And before people go crazy cakes and respond to my post with the usual vitriol, I just want to point out that I was making a joke. So lighten up, Francis.
Comments
Like the OP said, open up the entrance to Quarks. PLEASE TAKE OUT THE STUPID RAMP. One way to save polygon load (so you can merge it to the rest of the promenade) is to add turbolifts like you had in Club 47 instead of that monstrous ramp. It might not be totally accurate, but it's better than that ramp.
The operations really needs the office there and it's missing the beam near where Miles would stand. You can see it here on the right hand side: http://www.ditl.org/internals/GDS9Ops1.jpg
Here's another shot of it: http://drexfiles.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/untitled-1.jpg
Also the lighting there should be warmer or darker. There's a lot of great shots here actually: http://drexfiles.wordpress.com/2010/03/28/ops-ds9s-operations-center/
Also the outside of DS9 needs to be much darker, just like you have going for the new ESD now.
Also, I agree with the other suggestions, Cardassian Tailor, Bashir's Infirmary etc.
I believe DS9 is the most fleshed out station shown in ST, so there's no reason it shouldn't be as accurate as possible.
I'm hopeful that all of the revamping done to the game really raises the bar for cryptic and causes them to do a revamp of all the social zones that need it and add functionally to those that don't have it. I've been impressed with the ESD updates so far mostly because it feels like they just put more work into it. I had always thought that ESD, like sector space, felt like a placeholder before rather then a finished product.
I really hope the changes made to starbase sierra are just the beginning, seems like it would need it the most with the weekly series starting up soon near there.
I think this was more that he was getting tired of the BS in dealing with Klingons.
I haven't watched DS9 in a bit either but I think it was just episode after episode of Sisko and company fighting Klingon, or observing a ritual, or dealing with Worf and Jaz coming into work sore, bruised and battered from the night before. As a boss I think I would quickly grow tired of it as well, despite being respectful of other cultures.
There is that and the fact that it would of been murder on the federation administered outpost by one of its key officers, ritual or not probably influenced his reaction as well.
Technically I think it could also be argued that since the Bajorians really owned the station that it would be up to them what is legal and what isan't but that getting into wayyyy to much trek for me at the moment.
This I don't agree with. When I saw the tailor in ESD for the first time, I thought: "what, are all tailors in Star Trek Cardassians?" Just because it was that way during the show doesn't mean it will always be that way.
agreed! anyway... we have all sorts of NPC's walking around ESD, why not DS9?
and while there at it, how about some NPC freighters outside DS9. the place feels so unused as is where as in DS9 it was always busy
Make some countryboy raised by epic parents, Call Him John Sheridan and make him Captain of DS9. Instead of a Defiant. Give him a Emissary Class just for pure irony.
I feel the same way.
Also, Darts Minigame FTW!
/signed
Why would he have left his baseball anywhere?
They are better than standard shuttles. You can pilot them yourself, not use them as pets.
I have mixed feelings about deinstancing Quarks, primarily because leaving it instanced may allow for a couple of things:
1) Bar brawls, either as a player activity or, say, a daily that players can assist station security in shutting down. In general, instancing is good for allowing special rules to apply to an area that don't apply elsewhere.
2) The holosuites. If you leave Quark's cordoned off, you can have the holosuites uninstanced and constantly running a large program or two whose map would conflict with station architecture. Personally, I'd like Vic's and a persistent baseball stadium "always running".
Now, in terms of general polish, one thing I think would be cool and help justify a polish pass is if the Klingons got their own Nor. The Klingon/Cardassian borders are likely a weak spot in defense given how thin the Feds are spread and Cardassia's general lack of military.
Maybe around the time the Talos or Tarsus IV sector gets added (west of the Neutral Zone and slightly south of the existing maps). That area seems likely to have an abandoned Cardassian presence.
The Klingons could get a Nor even as DS9 gets some upgrades.
I can see Vic's being added as part of the uninstanced map, but the baseball stadium should get it's own instance. In fact, I think the other 2 Holosuites should have their own instances, where people can call up some of DS9's other Holosuite programs.
1) Like you said, the Baseball Stadium (can be turned into a type of minigame).
2) The Klingon Holoprograms. Like Kor's Battle of Klach D'kel Brakt.
3) O'Brien and Bashir's many holosuite moments. Like the Battle of Britain.
And so much more.
*Rips hair out, kills infants*
First of all, after Kurn was not allowed to do the suicide ritual, he tried to get himself killed by an alien on the station, he wanted to be dead any means, regardless of the consequences; honorable and dishonorable.
By surgically altering Kurn, Sisko gave him the best of both worlds (no pun intended); it allowed him to live a TRUE Klingon life which wasn't marked by the consequences of Worf's actions.
This is the same man who was nauseated at the site of massacred Cardassian women and children on Cardassia Prime and refused to drink to victory, and you're calling him a racist?
Please be more informed before you badmouth the emissary.
I don't want every tailor to be Cardassian. I just feel that if you are going to have a Vulcan tailor and a Cardassian tailor, then the Cardassian tailor should be on Deep Space Nine and the Vulcan tailor should be on ESD.
He left his baseball on his desk when the Cardassians took over the station. Actually, he left his baseball on his desk when the Bajorans stormed the station back in season 2 too.
At the end of "What You Leave Behind" after Sisko has died, Kira is seen at his desk throwing his ball in the air and catching it. I would imagine, given how important Sisko was to both the war, and bajor, that they might leave his baseball on his desk as a kind of memorial.
I like the idea that we can still see his baseball in his old office. What you leave behind is not nearly as important as what you take with you.
I haven't had a chance to sit down and compare specs on the runabout, standard shuttle, and delta flyer. I was just expressing that I'd like runabouts to be comporable to the delta flyer and shuttles in such a way that there would be some advantage to them over a shuttle, just as a shuttle should have some advantage over a runabout or delta flyer, and the delta flyer has some advantage over a runabout or shuttle.
I don't want it to be that runabouts are the weakest, shuttles the second weakest, delta flyer the best. Because then everyone is either in a delta flyer or shuttle and there's no reason to even have a runabout.
I've had my runabout since the very begining. I love it as a symbol of Deep Space Nine (the series) and always enjoyed the idea of them. I want to fly one instead of a shuttle or delta flyer, but I don't want to be handicapped as a result.
If the runabouts are the weakest, I was proposing that they be given a 'bump' to make them more viable.
Again, haven't looked at the specs closely (feel free to enlighten me, would love to know) but IF IF IF they suck compared to shuttles and the delta flyer, I'd like thme to be made less-suck.
They are??
Can you tell me how to find them (I don't use the foundary much but would like a peak) or possibly even post the pics.
Only on the inside...
My thoughts on the baseball; It would be neat to see it, but as you said Kira was tossing it when she took over. My thought would be given how important it was to Sisko that;
a) She would've given it to Jake Sisko.
b) She would've kept it (with Jake's blessing) as a memento of her friendship with Sisko.
As the last time we saw the ball was the scene described above, these are all just possible outcomes(including that it may still be in the office). However, I don't think Kira would've just left it there for someone who may not even appreciate it's value or signifigance. At the very best, maybe a replica of the original.;)
The order should be:
ESD
Qo'nos
Sierra
then maybe DS9
Yes, it is arguably the most iconic of them and deserves extra attention, but I'm saying we should hope for an improvement to the other stations first.
I respectfully disagree on the Sierra part and here's why. That to me is more of an outpost then a major hub. ESD orbits over the capital of the Federation and Qo'Nos is capital of the Klingon Empire, so those are given. DS9 sits next to the only transit point to the Gamma Quadrant (wormhole), not to mention its proximity to both Bajor and Cardassia. That and its much more iconic than Sierra (unless I missed the series Star Trek: 39 Sierra
Yes, Sierra is the jumping off point to Romulan Space, but it is still a trek (no pun intended) to Rator and never really was nor do I think it will be a social hub even if it was revamped.
As I stated, I do agree that ESD and Qo'Nos have priority over DS9.
Heh. That's true. Although the new earth star base doesn't make the most sense either (at what point in the structure is the diameter that narrow?) While the devs are doing Starbases it may be time to think about the size of starbase exteriors in regards to scale as well.
Again DS9 is not too Small. Look at the damn windows. It is too big.
It has no Tailor (though it appears to have been meant to).
It has no ship customization or selector.
It has no Chief Engineer or Chief Medical Officer.
Sierra was designed to be a hub and it needs to be brought up to par with the other 2.
Now if Sector Space actually took time to cross, then I'd be inclined to agree.
Spoilers would've been nice. I'm only into season 3 right now.
He probably assumed since the series has been finished for over 10 years that everyone had seen it.
But people have to remember, there are new fans + old fans that never watched that series for one reason or another.
Sorry about that.
And before people go crazy cakes and respond to my post with the usual vitriol, I just want to point out that I was making a joke. So lighten up, Francis.