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I don't want re-anything, please.

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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    I think that if you bring an officer of the appropriate rank (i.e. within x many ranks of you), then you should be able to solve issues.

    For example, as a Rea Admiral, my commander science boff should be able to heal these people while my ensign science might be unable to. This would encourage people to read dialogue and chose an appropriate team for a mission.

    What if they refit an older mission to require a boff to stay in one location for engineering and another engineering boff (or player) to go to another place to accomplish an objective?

    Darren:

    I think the whole point of this is to make soloing missions less saqtisfactory than teaming up.

    If anything, I think the Engineering and Science endings need to be less happy. (Ie. maybe Engineers save the ship and the Captain but the crew dies and Science Officers save the crew but the ship and Captain are lost.)

    I think it misses the point in a solo player can get a totally happy ending out of this.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    exploration and ground combat RE - Vamp is totaly needed. sorry to burst your bubble :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011

    I think the whole point of this is to make soloing missions less saqtisfactory than teaming up.

    I don't think the point of this is to encourage teaming at all. I think it is simply a case where Gozer thought the tacs would appreciate being able to melt the Orions more than they would appreciate being able to rescue the wounded. If the point had been to encourage teaming, then the science and engineering classes wouldn't have been able to accomplish the rescue on their own, either. As an engineer I get to save crew/ship/captain. How am I encouraged to team?

    I don't think teaming thru the PVE is even mentioned anywhere as something they have thought to encourage...or did I miss that somewhere? Not sure why I'd want to team thru PVE and if I had to bother with finding players of certain classes to get all the accolades or to see all of the cool mission outcomes, I'd be pretty irritated.

    Also, as this is the first mission played post-tutorial, I wouldn't want to be Mr. Noob, right outside of Sol, having to spam into chat "hi....anyone wanna team up for mission uno...oh...I need an engineer....?" STF team gathering is already bad enough.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Darren:

    I think the whole point of this is to make soloing missions less satisfactory than teaming up.
    Actually, I rather think it's to make teaming up *more* satisfying than soloing. And yes, there is a difference. ;)

    I'd just like to say that the mission works fantastically. We need more instances where our choices matter. Choices which open options up and close options down are integral to RPGs.

    With regards to the resource being used to revisit these episodes... it's worth it! The game technology is a lot better now than at launch. If a new player joins the game they are going to enjoy these episodes and the weeklies a lot more than the original content. Remastering is a cost effective way to improve the overall quality of the game.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    boglejam wrote: »
    IAs an engineer I get to save crew/ship/captain. How am I encouraged to team?

    Maybe I didn't pay close enough attention but my take was that I save the physical ship as an Engineer but that most of the crew still dies. Whereas a Sci Officer saves the crew but not the ship.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    anazonda wrote: »
    This. Territory contol is evil... It will spawn Griefers.

    if territory control is off in its own sector for pvp'ers how is it going to spawn greifers... there is enough pve content in the game for the non pvp crowd, it's time to give the pvper's some love here gents.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    And I guess you want this game to have low ratings still.....just an FYI, there is a chance that NEW players will come to STO...and I'd rather have them get a better impression than I did during Headstart :rolleyes:

    this; I agree whole heartedly with this.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Darren:

    I think the whole point of this is to make soloing missions less saqtisfactory than teaming up.

    If anything, I think the Engineering and Science endings need to be less happy. (Ie. maybe Engineers save the ship and the Captain but the crew dies and Science Officers save the crew but the ship and Captain are lost.)

    I think it misses the point in a solo player can get a totally happy ending out of this.

    Why would they wanna make one of the First missions one plays in the game, have an UN-happy Outcome for first time players??? :confused:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    The team working on "re-mastering" is likely not the same team working on the foundry and other such updates, so chill. Whether they were re-mastering episodes or not has no bearing on the speed of the foundry update.

    +1 exactly.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why would they wanna make one of the First missions one plays in the game, have an UN-happy Outcome for first time players??? :confused:

    Right!
    BTW I replayed the Azzura mission on tribble - I mean the newest one. To be honest: If they re-do all of the missions like this one, I'll create an new character just to re-play them all again and again!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    metaQ wrote: »
    Right!
    BTW I replayed the Azzura mission on tribble - I mean the newest one. To be honest: If they re-do all of the missions like this one, I'll create an new character just to re-play them all again and again!

    The remastered version scales with level, meaning you actually can replay them with level.

    My hope is that one person like Gozer can crank out a remastered episode every week, maybe alternating between the top 8 or so Fed missions the the existing KDF missions, without interfering with Featured Episodes.

    I'd take my Klingon alt more seriously if I had access to all 8 KDF missions at Lt. 6 at a heightened level of quality and could replay them for meaningful rewards even as Featured Episodes continue to mount up.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Maybe I didn't pay close enough attention but my take was that I save the physical ship as an Engineer but that most of the crew still dies. Whereas a Sci Officer saves the crew but not the ship.

    I may have misinterpreted it, myself...but yeah, you save the ship as an engineer. Last time I saw the wounded people on the ground, they were still alive and writhing. The ship survives and goes to Earth - where I am assuming the repair crew wouldn't just step over them and fix stuff without getting them help since there isn't any danger....?

    The reason they all die on the tec mission is because the ship doesn't survive, either.....
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    boglejam wrote: »
    I may have misinterpreted it, myself...but yeah, you save the ship as an engineer. Last time I saw the wounded people on the ground, they were still alive and writhing. The ship survives and goes to Earth - where I am assuming the repair crew wouldn't just step over them and fix stuff without getting them help since there isn't any danger....?

    The reason they all die on the tec mission is because the ship doesn't survive, either.....

    Do they all die with the ship in sci version or do they beam out as healed?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Do they all die with the ship in sci version or do they beam out as healed?

    For a science captain, they get up when you heal them, and you have them all go down to the transporter pad where they await beam out. (All beam out together when you escort the last two from the engine room, if I recall correctly.)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    How would you propose changing this so that a happy ending still requires three players teaming up?

    'Cause that's the goal I'm seeing here. I think they're trying to re-engineer these missions to require social interaction more by allowing you to complete them solo but having the outcome itself be less than pleasing without three players, minimum.

    If that's the goal, it's frankly stupid.
    DaveyNY wrote: »
    Why would they wanna make one of the First missions one plays in the game, have an UN-happy Outcome for first time players??? :confused:

    For this reason, for one. Almost everyone is going to be starting out solo.

    Additionally, it only encourages you to bring three of the 'right' people along. Three science officers? Ship still asplode. Three tacs? Three utter failures at the entire point of being there in the first place.
    The remastered version scales with level, meaning you actually can replay them with level.

    There's at least one good thing out of this.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    If that's the goal, it's frankly stupid.

    I agree. I don't think there has been any official dev discussion anywhere that the intended goal is to make PVE more team oriented. Someone just threw that up as an opinion in here. And unique outcomes only being achievable if the team is diverse? Why would any dev think thats a good plan? Short answer - I don't think they do.

    I think gozer just figured most tacs would be the killer types and like melting the orions and wouldn't care too much about the hurt crew. He may need to reassess this after the feedback - but hey...thats why these things go up on Tribble first.

    For those of you who think anything needs to be more team-based or social - join a fleet, go to the social hubs, or team-spam and do an STF. Not everyone is an RP'er or a fleetie and just because we are all in the same instance doesn't mean that most of us want that much to do with any of the rest of us. :D
    There's at least one good thing out of this.

    I think the mission is pretty good actually...a lot better than it was. Just needs some tweaks.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    boglejam wrote: »
    I agree. I don't think there has been any official dev discussion anywhere that the intended goal is to make PVE more team oriented. Someone just threw that up as an opinion in here. And unique outcomes only being achievable if the team is diverse? Why would any dev think thats a good plan? Short answer - I don't think they do.

    I think gozer just figured most tacs would be the killer types and like melting the orions and wouldn't care too much about the hurt crew. He may need to reassess this after the feedback - but hey...thats why these things go up on Tribble first.

    For those of you who think anything needs to be more team-based or social - join a fleet, go to the social hubs, or team-spam and do an STF. Not everyone is an RP'er or a fleetie and just because we are all in the same instance doesn't mean that most of us want that much to do with any of the rest of us. :D



    I think the mission is pretty good actually...a lot better than it was. Just needs some tweaks.

    There is an accolade for completing all three objectives. I kinda doubt that would be there if they weren't trying to steer people towards eventually running this through with a diverse team for the best outcome.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    There is an accolade for completing all three objectives. I kinda doubt that would be there if they weren't trying to steer people towards eventually running this through with a diverse team for the best outcome.

    different outcomes, but not "the best" outcome. Unless you are strictly playing for the cheevo. Err, sorry... accolade.

    Gives fleets something to do and feel cool about I guess but I don't think the devs want to go down the road of making people team to do missions in order to get the "happy ending" (no snickering please, kids). If they want to make an extra carrot for teaming, fine. But when you start making it required, you are in for bad times.

    I am almost willing to bet that Gozer will tweak this mission so that tacs don't end up feeling like heartless b@st@rds in the end. If he doesn't, sorry tacs - we all know you are caring, wonderful people even if you leave those poor wounded people to die a painful, radiation-filled, exploding death.... :D

    Possible fixes....
    A.) Change the Sci class sub-mission to something other than healing the wounded. Then they could let all of the classes heal the wounded while the sci guys do something else science-ie.

    B.) Change the NPC animation to where the wounded are all lying still instead of writhing on the deck. Eng and Tac classes get the "They're dead, Jim" text bubble from their BO while Sci class gets "they're almost dead, Jim. Poor guys are all unconscience..." text bubble and then does magic science stuff to get them up and off the ship.

    There. All fixed. I accept payment in C-store creds, Gozer. :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Suggestion:

    Whether or not Tac changes to be more of a police style objective (which would be my hope), change the science role from saving the crew to immunizing you and your BOs/teammates from suffering the same infection.

    Bam. Their crew lives in every outcome then. The question then becomes whether you and your teammates/BOs fight with a radiation poisoning debuff, which a science officer can remove by examining the crew.

    Nobody leaves anyone to die. Science just figures out how to immunize the good guys long enough to fight through the Orions.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    The remastering is causing serious dynamic lighting issues for the ATI video card players who STILL have this problem after a year.

    I played the mission on Holodeck all the way through with DL on with 3 lights. No problems, clear through to completion.

    Did it again with the same toon on Tribble. Same settings. I crashed so badly I had to reboot my computer. I crashed no less that 4 times before I gave up.

    Obviously, the addition of the cool rotating lights and other lighting effects means I can no longer play this mission with dynamic lighting turned on and probably all of the "remastered" missions as well.

    Thanks?:mad:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    The remastering is causing serious dynamic lighting issues for the ATI video card players who STILL have this problem after a year.

    I played the mission on Holodeck all the way through with DL on with 3 lights. No problems, clear through to completion.

    Did it again with the same toon on Tribble. Same settings. I crashed so badly I had to reboot my computer. I crashed no less that 4 times before I gave up.

    Obviously, the addition of the cool rotating lights and other lighting effects means I can no longer play this mission with dynamic lighting turned on and probably all of the "remastered" missions as well.

    Thanks?:mad:

    Me and a fleet mate did the new remastered mission. Both of us have ATi cards and neither of us crashed at all with only 3 lights for the DL effects.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Is DX11 support out for STO? I found that helped me in other ATI-favored games where my card was crashing the game.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Is DX11 support out for STO? I found that helped me in other ATI-favored games where my card was crashing the game.

    To be fair, the game is crashing your card not the other way around.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    ELITE-Kaos wrote:
    Me and a fleet mate did the new remastered mission. Both of us have ATi cards and neither of us crashed at all with only 3 lights for the DL effects.
    What's your point? Are you trying to say the problem does not exist?

    Seriously?

    This issue is SO gamestopping and SO prevelant, it is absolutely infuriating! It has been this way for a year now with absolutely no word or even achknowledgement from Cryptic on what is being done about it.

    Players have even tried meetings between Cryptic and ATI to iron out tjhe problem with CRYPTIC eventually not cooperating!

    What the hell?

    Fix this guys. This is one of the main reasons I leave this game. And when more games become available, this issue amoungst others will be my main reasons for playing them instead.:mad:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Is DX11 support out for STO? I found that helped me in other ATI-favored games where my card was crashing the game.
    THIS is the ONLY game I have EVER had this issue with. The game is doing this.

    Players heve tried discusiing this with Cryptic tech support, but they STILL deny knowledge or say they can't replicate it. :confused:

    At this point, all excuses are moot. They are stonewalling. It is obvious.

    Why is the question I can't answer.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    THIS is the ONLY game I have EVER had this issue with. The game is doing this.

    Players heve tried discusiing this with Cryptic tech support, but they STILL deny knowledge or say they can't replicate it. :confused:

    At this point, all excuses are moot. They are stonewalling. It is obvious.

    Why is the question I can't answer.

    Huh. I had stuttering and lighting probs with my Nvidia 460, but in the release notes of the nvidia drivers, they said it was a known issue. Turned off dynamic lights and shadows (or lowered the max lights and shadows to 3..can't remember now) and it took care of the issue.

    Sucks this happens with ATI cards, too. I've seen a few posts about it but nothing too jazzed up. I mean, between ATI and Nvidia, you have to figure thats at least 75% of the GPU market and probably closer to 90% pf the "gamer" PC user market. If the problem was as major as you say, shouldn't it effect a lot more of the playerbase?

    As to why Cryptic is "stonewalling"...maybe they just don't like your attitude? :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Boglejam wrote:
    As to why Cryptic is "stonewalling"...maybe they just don't like your attitude?
    Attitude? I'm payin here bud. And this has gone on for way to long with way to many lies.

    Msybe the guy from Red Shirt will comment here, he was at the meeting between Cryptic and ATI. Stonewalling is a consevative accounting of Cryptic's attitude.

    I know a blue name means belying one's own interest over that of the companie's, so I understand the leap to defend.
    :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Attitude? I'm payin here bud. And this has gone on for way to long with way to many lies.

    Msybe the guy from Red Shirt will comment here, he was at the meeting between Cryptic and ATI. Stonewalling is a consevative accounting of Cryptic's attitude.

    I know a blue name means belying one's own interest over that of the companie's, so I understand the leap to defend.
    :)
    It also doesn't help when the game advertises its affiliation with nVidia so brazenly. I'm not sure what the deal is between Cryptic and nVidia, but it certainly *appears* to be the case that Cryptic are happy to let critical bugs slip by so long as they're "only" affecting AMD cards.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    If the cutscenes can be polished to look better then fine. But that has nothing to do with the blatant contradiction of the shows and movies of a starfleet captain leaving sick people to die, regardless of what their training was at the academy.

    Oh please, they leave people to die all the time in Star Trek across ALL the series (not as much with TNG; but it wasn't an issue with TOS, DS9, or ENT); so quick claiming this as a 'Trek contradiction'. I'm so tired of the 'not Trek' crowd having a fit because they have to fire a phaser, or leave a no name NPC to die - happened in the shows often enough there is no contradiction.

    That said, if it really bothers peopel maybe they could just add a line to the TAC and ENG versions that, due to their actions, the players ship was able to beam all the crew out (assuming the ship still explodes)

    Lastly, repeat and remember - STO is a Star Trek game; NOT a Star Trek simulator.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Walshicus wrote:
    It also doesn't help when the game advertises its affiliation with nVidia so brazenly. I'm not sure what the deal is between Cryptic and nVidia, but it certainly *appears* to be the case that Cryptic are happy to let critical bugs slip by so long as they're "only" affecting AMD cards.
    Absolutely, it just adds insult to injury thinking this may all be some "backroom deal" between Cryptic ans InVidia to procure much needed develpoement funds prior to launch.

    A dev response is highly unlikely at this point as they have simply stopped addressing this issue publicly other than to say, "We don't know, can't replicate."

    It is unbeleivable as it is not just 2 or 3 players as the lifers keep trying to insinuate. It is a lot pf players with the latest ATI cards.

    Oh, and to make specific comment about the remastering itself. It all looks fine. My only concern was the beginning cut scene goes on way to long. Tighten that up.
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