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Making STO "More Star Trek". Ideas...including Cryptics original concepts.

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
A month ago there were a couple of threads and interviews with the Devs and Mr Daniel Stahl himself(The interview with Zack from Hailing Frequency) regarding future plans and updates for STO in 2011. We know that there a many new things being done for future updates including a revamp of ground combat being a major focus for season 4 in April, but the main element that I was interested in was when DStahl said he wanted to make the game "more Star Trek" it imediatly got me thinking about certain aspects that would make STO a much more enjoyable Trek experience, So I thought I would share a few ideas on what I think would make the game feel more Trek.

When STO was first in development with Perpetual Entertainment, some of the original art work and concepts were kept when Cryptic beamed aboard as the new developers of the game, and some still remain in the game today.(the P'Jem planet surface and the deralict ship in the DSE's were among the few originaly designed by PE).
One of the things that didnt make it however was the unique and very Trek like interface. The PE version looked a little more realistic to the plain blue we currently have in game and Is one of the features I think need to be changed/tweaked. In reality, Cryptic just need to add more yellow and purple to the LCARS UI to make it a little more authentic.

Original PE UI: 1stouizv1.jpg
2- 13554.jpg

One of the other things that realy bugged me was when I first saw the epic trailer for STO. I remember saying how it was going to be one of the best Star Trek games ever.(Which realy it is...it just need's a little more pollish).
The one thing that stands out to me though was the scene where you see a klingon boarding party on a Galaxy class bridge. The bridge that was in the video was amazing and looks just like the one from Generations.

Everything about it looked awesome from the lighting to the LCARS displays, and It got me so excited...until Cryptic realesed screens on the Bridge sets. Now this is a really big thing in my book on making this feel more like a Star Trek game, the bridges at the moment dont realy feel that epic and Fed like at the moment.
The Klingon bridges look awesome its just the Fed's, especialy the Galaxy class bridge. I mean... the "Prototype" bridge layout is just plain. (And still has an Akira at the rear computer screen). Cryptic if you want to make the STO more trek, bring back your original bridge modells...they were ace.

Original Cryptic Galaxy class Bridge: 1TrailerScreen_09b.jpg 2Star_Trek_Online_Galaxy_Bridge_Screenshot.jpg 328.png

Another thing that I love about STO is the space combat. That for me makes the game really special, as there is nothing that is as unique at the moment. The one thing that bug's me with STO currently is the ship materials and textures, they just look cartoonie. Originaly (In the same trailer as the formentioned Galaxy bridge) the ships looked awesome and very cannon, especialy the Galaxy class.

The markings, windows and Aztech design were all origanaly planed but were removed from the game as it progressed and evolved into what we know as STO today. Now I know its a little too much, but please change those (or even better update) the 4 current ship sklins to something more "Trek" like.

Original Cryptic Ship Textures: 1 star_trek_online_pcscreenshots23442screenshot_2008_08_15_13_50_25_copy_copy.jpg 2galaxyqn6.jpg

Well, that sums up just a few little graphical bits that I think would make the STO experience more trek. Of xourse thes are just my personal opinions on making it better, and I'm sure everyone else has other ideas on chnging the game, so post all your ideas on what you think would make STO a better Star trek experience.

Live long and Proper.
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    i agree with you on many points.

    the overall 'blue' haze that sto has got needs to go. More canon texture and color schemes need to be included if the game is to feel more trek. Also those corridors are miles better than cryptic.

    I seem to remember Fallen was a third person game that I still have and you could walk on the corridors of the Defiant if I am not mistaken and there were no problems with the camera, so cryptic needs to stop making excuses.

    The corridors they have now in size, texture/color are just way off. So overall the artists need to sit down watch more star trek, look at other star trek games that did it right and emulate it best they can. All we can do is hope.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Cruis.In wrote: »

    The corridors they have now in size, texture/color are just way off. So overall the artists need to sit down watch more star trek, look at other star trek games that did it right and emulate it best they can. All we can do is hope.

    Preferably the DS9/Voy/Ent episodes that were shot in Digital, and not the TOS/TNG episodes shot with older methods.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    If I remember right, the imgae of the corridor is from the famous Suctritia. he's the guy who's done those awesome STO ship charts.

    Excellent...Im glad we aprove on changing the current "blue" color scheme.(Glad its just not me) Those shots of the pre-alpha are awesome though. Why did Cryptic change the Galaxy bridge from that image to the ones we have now.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Actually. If you want a bridge a lot like the Original Galaxy Bridge. the "Order" Bridge from the Galaxy Pack is the closest thing you'll get to the Classic Enterprise-D Bridge.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Actually. If you want a bridge a lot like the Original Galaxy Bridge. the "Order" Bridge from the Galaxy Pack is the closest thing you'll get to the Classic Enterprise-D Bridge.

    I currently do have that set as my default Bridge...thing is the prototype is probable the "Most" cannon in design(minus captains quaters and turbo lift hallway's).

    The order bridge has the right colours, but that being said it still has all that blue LCARS display's and the indentations on the main tactical pillar(whare picard sits) is not there. Although thats just being
    picky.lol.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Dead horse time. not digging for it but the lcars thing is a rights problem. There is also a way to have a fan made fix for it that's been available for a while if you search for it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    While the "all-blue LCARS" thing bugged me a bit at first, I also looked at it this way:

    You can see a noted difference in the quality of LCARS from S1 of TNG to Nemesis. There are even hints in the shots of the very-far-off future in Voyager that LCARS continues to evolve (into something they call "TCARS" - http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/TCARS -- and if you notice, it's all blue there). I just see the all-blue look as the current stage of LCARS in 2409.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Sanford42 wrote:
    While the "all-blue LCARS" thing bugged me a bit at first, I also looked at it this way:

    You can see a noted difference in the quality of LCARS from S1 of TNG to Nemesis. There are even hints in the shots of the very-far-off future in Voyager that LCARS continues to evolve (into something they call "TCARS" - http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/TCARS -- and if you notice, it's all blue there). I just see the all-blue look as the current stage of LCARS in 2409.

    Thats a very good point actually. I was watching an episode of Voyager the other day and they had a Fed ship from the future that had all blue LCARS. I still think they should redo the Galaxy bridge to the one they were originaly going to have. All the cannon bridges should look like there TV counterparts, and the Cryptic bridges can stick with there blue LCARS displays.

    Also...Im aware of the LCARS texture replacement to change the look of the some of the LCARS in game, but to tell the truth I would rarther not tamper witrh the vanilla copie, and let the Dev's eventually fix things up.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    I think tht we need to go way beyond discussing skins, lcars, and corridors if we're talking about how to make this game "more Star Trek." Stories and game mechanics are the biggest components. Admirals need to be admirals. The Federation needs to act like the Federation. Exploration should be more than a box of repetitive grinding.

    Diplomacy, first contacts, canon, lore, consistency, and episodic content... these types of things need to continue and become a vital core of gameplay, rather than tacked on features to play while killing Klingons for no good reason.

    Also, puzzles, quests, and mysteries have done much to make the game feel more like Trek.

    So, I think the devs have been moving in the right direction, but there is still a long way to go. UGC will help a lot, especially if we can get branching dialogue and other abilities to create diplomacy missions. So too will a complete revamp of exploration, if it actually involves exploration, discovery, etc.

    For all new content and new features, Cryptic would be wise to ask themselves over and over again: "How does this fulfill the established mission of the Enterprise... to seek out new life, to explore strange new worlds and civilizations, to boldy go..."
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Kirkfat wrote: »
    I think tht we need to go way beyond discussing skins, lcars, and corridors if we're talking about how to make this game "more Star Trek." Stories and game mechanics are the biggest components. Admirals need to be admirals. The Federation needs to act like the Federation. Exploration should be more than a box of repetitive grinding.

    Diplomacy, first contacts, canon, lore, consistency, and episodic content... these types of things need to continue and become a vital core of gameplay, rather than tacked on features to play while killing Klingons for no good reason.

    Also, puzzles, quests, and mysteries have done much to make the game feel more like Trek.

    So, I think the devs have been moving in the right direction, but there is still a long way to go. UGC will help a lot, especially if we can get branching dialogue and other abilities to create diplomacy missions. So too will a complete revamp of exploration, if it actually involves exploration, discovery, etc.

    For all new content and new features, Cryptic would be wise to ask themselves over and over again: "How does this fulfill the established mission of the Enterprise... to seek out new life, to explore strange new worlds and civilizations, to boldy go..."

    That's what this thread is for...Ideas. Texture skins and other things are just my personel things I would like Cryptic to add at some point. The Galaxy class bridge for instance was already intended to be cannon, but was changed when launced. I just want them at some point to swap/improve it to how it was origanlly going to be. I do agree however we do need consistency.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    I have to say, I really like the blue LCARS and if they do revert to the original colours I hope there is a way to keep the blue for those that like it.

    I played the episode with the Guardian of Forever yesterday and it is one of those moments that I just wanted to shout "Yes!" at the screen... it was a truly Trek moment, and I hope that they keep up the good work.

    That said, until I can go multi monitor and plug in a touchscreen monitor or two and have the sector map in an LCARS interface on one, crew life stats on the other and use another screen to walk around the ship (and just basically turn my desk into the bridge) I won't be truly happy. :p
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    While not necessarily 'more like star trek," this does impact how they should change the interface.

    (=| Gestalt Psychology and the STO Interface |=)


    Did you know that Engineering Team I and III have the same icon? As does every other power?

    Did you know this makes the game difficult on the 3-bar display setup as you can't tell which is which without waiting for a tooltip?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    While not necessarily 'more like star trek," this does impact how they should change the interface.

    (=| Gestalt Psychology and the STO Interface |=)


    Did you know that Engineering Team I and III have the same icon? As does every other power?

    Did you know this makes the game difficult on the 3-bar display setup as you can't tell which is which without waiting for a tooltip?

    Never had a problem with the same icon for eng 1 and eng 3, I know where I put them on my hot bar, no difficulty there.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    While not necessarily 'more like star trek," this does impact how they should change the interface.

    (=| Gestalt Psychology and the STO Interface |=)


    Did you know that Engineering Team I and III have the same icon? As does every other power?

    Did you know this makes the game difficult on the 3-bar display setup as you can't tell which is which without waiting for a tooltip?

    That looks allot easier to undertand, especially for each levell. I also recall that when Perpetual Entertainment were developing the game, the interface concept was truly "Trek". The icons were awesome, like photons were actual photon icons and a TMP redalert icon was for the fire button. If I can find an image of the original concept I will post it, as it would look so awesome to add to our current LCARS UI.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Sigh. Yet another "this doesn't feel like trek!" thread.

    Of all the things there are to nitpick in this game, why do we seem to have the same six threads repeated over and over and over? And strangely, each time, they are presented like they are groundbreaking, never-mentioned-before ideas that would be momumental improvements to the game if only the devs would just listen.

    The reason I say this is because almost all of the issues mentioned in this - the 40,000th (ok..thats an estimate) "this isn't trek enough" thread - have been discussed 39,999 times before, with dev commentary on every issue, including explanations of why things are the way they are, what they can't change, what they would like to change, and in some cases, time estimates on when they will be changed.

    Can you at least do some forum searches prior to posting these things so we can cut down on the repetitiveness? Some pretty good unique observations that OP may or may not have are probably being missed when lumped in with the same old complaints that have already been discussed to death.

    Thanks. Not trying to flame or anything. Just tired of all the duplication.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/...s/stouizv1.jpg

    http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/...llis/13554.jpg



    (link isn't working just go to first page lol)



    I was heartbroken when that ship wasn't put into STO :(

    I was amazed by it during the world premier in Las Vegas (and I was in Vegas at the Trek Convention which made me even more pumped!), and that ship just seemed extremely unique in a way.

    Cryptic really needs to make that a new T5 ship haha...or maybe the first T6....? :eek:

    Oh and the original interface seems more "Star Trek" than the current one. Maybe Cryptic can add some aspects to it? :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Original PE UI: 1 http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/...s/stouizv1.jpg 2http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/...llis/13554.jpg

    I was heartbroken when that ship wasn't put into STO :(

    I was amazed by it during the world premier in Las Vegas (and I was in Vegas at the Trek Convention which made me even more pumped!), and that ship just seemed extremely unique in a way.

    Cryptic really needs to make that a new T5 ship haha...or maybe the first T6....? :eek:

    Your link doesn't work. I wanted to see that ship. :(
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    boglejam wrote: »
    Your link doesn't work. I wanted to see that ship. :(

    It's the first link on this thread :) well really the second, but one has to admit this ship is breathetaking :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    As far as ship textures go, yes, fully agreed. I wanted my galaxy class to look more like the late generations/ds9/enterprise style than the brightly coloured tng one.

    the bridge textures don't bother me as much as i'd simply like them to be made smaller. there are rarely other players on my bridge if at ALL, so a smaller space should be easy imo. even the corridors etc, imo they could still function on levels where there's fighting involved and still be smaller.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    pr1983 wrote: »
    As far as ship textures go, yes, fully agreed. I wanted my galaxy class to look more like the late generations/ds9/enterprise style than the brightly coloured tng one.

    the bridge textures don't bother me as much as i'd simply like them to be made smaller. there are rarely other players on my bridge if at ALL, so a smaller space should be easy imo. even the corridors etc, imo they could still function on levels where there's fighting involved and still be smaller.

    I've alway wondered, does the bridge size option (small medium, large) actually do anything in the long run?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    I've alway wondered, does the bridge size option (small medium, large) actually do anything in the long run?

    it's not bridge size; it's ship layout. if you choose large, your corridors are longer on the lower decks. small means shorter distances between rooms, iirc.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    It's the first link on this thread :) well really the second, but one has to admit this ship is breathetaking :)

    Ah, thanks. Actually, I like the interior corridor more than the ship model. :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    boglejam wrote: »
    Ah, thanks. Actually, I like the interior corridor more than the ship model. :)

    Same. It's funny how the concept ideas are at times better than what's in game right now lol.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    pr1983 wrote: »
    it's not bridge size; it's ship layout. if you choose large, your corridors are longer on the lower decks. small means shorter distances between rooms, iirc.

    Ah. Didn't know :p And yet I've been here sinse Headstart :o:o:o
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Same. It's funny how the concept ideas are at times better than what's in game right now lol.

    Not really. It just goes to show that you can have pie-in-the-sky ideas and really awesome concepts but that if they are so awesome and cutting edge you can't deliver them, they weren't really that useful in the first place.

    Perpetuals failure to deliver is a good example in why you should set attainable goals.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    some things I think to make it more star trek...

    Lose the admiral ranks,
    make captain the top rank with medals, commendations, or some other term to denote captain ranks.
    at level cap make some side paths to work into, and have those lead to admiral and make it a pet class. and other sort of prestige classes, but always allow players to remain captains..star trek is all abut captains, its not about admirals.

    Add more science.

    this to me is a large problem, I don't feel like I am exploring scientific anomalies, and quite often some of the mission text is dumbed down to sound pretty un-trek.
    Anyone that is a loyal star trek fan can understand some more complex ideas, we need more quasars, black holes, dark matter...all that even if its fudgy, the series was fudgy too, its the psuedo science we need.

    Exploration that has impact

    Going into those star clusters is a decent start, but there needs to be some sort of continuous records or persistence there. I think if we made a large empty sector block, and had players explore empty systems then create ucg content in them instead of just a random mission might be neat.
    exploration is the toughest part of the game I think to get right because it can never be as diverse as the players want it to be.

    I think for it to really work the community and cryptic need to shape it together, and maybe top rated ucg authors could get some kind of special ucg ranking that allows them to create exploration missions or something.

    More factions

    Romulans and the dominion should be first in that order, but eventually these factions need to be playable and in game...star trek is all about empires clashing and interacting.
    And hopefully when they do implement them there will be some kind of territory control.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    It amazes me that so many people refuse to listen to developers about necessities of design, software limitations, and feasibility. I say push limits but also understand them. Most of the suggestions in this, and other threads like it don't push anything. They only repeat the same old tiered mantras.

    Ranks are not going to change due to feasibility issues. Due to licensing limitations some textures, structures, and designs are not going to change. Dues to software limitations a LOT of architecture is not going to change like hallways and bridges.

    Other than those things and others that will not change that have mentioned by developers what reasonable things can be done to enhance the Star Trek "feel" to STO.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    I have updated the first page now with the proper links. They work fine now. And just to point out, this is not a nitpicking thread and I have done my research to look for other threads like this. There are other threads regarding making STO more trek, but I didn't find another thread relating to what Cryptic originally had in game to what we've got now.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Ayenn wrote:
    It amazes me that so many people refuse to listen to developers about necessities of design, software limitations, and feasibility. I say push limits but also understand them. Most of the suggestions in this, and other threads like it don't push anything. They only repeat the same old tiered mantras.

    Ranks are not going to change due to feasibility issues. Due to licensing limitations some textures, structures, and designs are not going to change. Dues to software limitations a LOT of architecture is not going to change like hallways and bridges.

    Other than those things and others that will not change that have mentioned by developers what reasonable things can be done to enhance the Star Trek "feel" to STO.


    Ranks can be changed....you give them a different name besides admiral.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited January 2011
    Astropath wrote:
    Ranks can be changed....you give them a different name besides admiral.

    I really never understood why they insisted on doing it the way they did anyway....now we have a galaxy full of Admirals.

    The should have just said You are a Captian level 1-30 and given a specialization ( Tactics OPs Science etc.)

    It would have been so much simpler, but the admiral rank feeds egos (even though it means nothing) and that's all that matters. :rolleyes:
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