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STO should have been...

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
I really wish cryptic would have done some research.. If only they had looked at this one game and thought what they could have done in a MMO space combat setting
Star Trek: Bridge Commander is a space combat simulation game for the PC, published by Activision and Totally Games in 2002, based in the Star Trek universe.

Quote {according to one website, since Star Trek Bridge Commander was released, over 4600 mods have been released for the game and those mods have been downloaded over 9 million times; so if that does not make this game one of the most popular Star Trek Games of all time.}

This is the game Cryptic should have tried to make... some youtube vid showing off the updated fan made mods.

ALL IN GAME SHOTS...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuKeLIJdJ5E&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RC4q-63yu-0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZDuDwi6yXo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RytEOjrau-w&feature=related

This a 2002 game can you imagined what STO could have been if they ran with this type of space combat and bridge officers idea.....
Oh to dream..lol:rolleyes:
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    If I wanted to play bridge commander, I'd go play bridge commander.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    nileight wrote: »
    If I wanted to play bridge commander, I'd go play bridge commander.

    Hey.... Just saying they could have taken a few pages out of that book to make STO a better game..
    So don't get all twisted about it...
    Have to laugh at people who think any comment someone makes not praising cryptic is a personal attack against them...
    :D:D:D:D:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    On the plus side the thread isn't about that STO should have stayed true to Perpetuals design.
    On the down side... Those threads are hilarious.



    Ah well... As a niche game STO is doing semi well catering to the masses.
    A game like Bridge Commander does not.

    So saying the game would have been better is personal opinion.
    The only thing they could take from that game is navigating from the bridge.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Brolarter wrote: »
    Hey.... Just saying they could have taken a few pages out of that book to make STO a better game..
    So don't get all twisted about it...
    Have to laugh at people who think any comment someone makes not praising cryptic is a personal attack against them...
    :D:D:D:D:

    On the contrary, your reply is the laughable one. o.o He merely stated his opinion.

    I am inclined to agree with him. Not everyone WANTS another Bridge Commander. It was a good game, but not my(and I am willing to bet I am not alone in this respect) favorite type of gameplay.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Brolarter wrote: »
    Have to laugh at people who think any comment someone makes not praising cryptic is a personal attack against them...

    Well, what did you mean by your first post, then?
    Brolarter wrote: »
    This is the game Cryptic should have tried to make...

    Seems like at least a personal attack against their game, if not the company itself... ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Apples and oranges. Cryptic had to make an MMORPG that was accessible to many players, and accessible to many non-gamers (Trekkies who wanted to play). Bridge Commander is a video-game-playing-Trekkie-super-fanboy's-wet-dream about what Star Trek might be like IRL.

    Trailers are fun and exciting and all. But actual gameplay falls pretty flat compared to STO, plus doesn't bring much to the table compared to what STO already does.

    I will take STO as a successful MMO than an unsuccessful, inaccessible, ghost-town simulator anyday. Besides, the general consensus is that STO's strongest aspect is the space combat (I agree), so I don't see much merit in the "Bridge-Commander-Argument" (especially since it's been brought up, and discussed, and largely dismissed a bazillion times). Bring something new to the table or post in one of the other hundred threads.

    EDIT: I forgot, search results on the STO forums time-out after a while. The "bazillion times" link is just a search for "bridge commander" with over 500 threads.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Just stating my opinion.
    Didn't take it as a personal attack against me or cryptic.
    Not that I would care either way.
    Gotta laugh at people that think any response to them is a personal attack.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    nileight wrote: »
    Just stating my opinion.
    Didn't take it as a personal attack against me or cryptic.
    Not that I would care either way.
    Gotta laugh at people that think any response to them is a personal attack.

    Yeah, I find it funny how defensive people are on forums when someone holds an opinion contrary to theirs. X)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    the space combat on the videos did not exactly blow me away. i prefer the look of sto.

    but i did like the bridge officer look.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I would not exactly want STO to look or feel like Bridge Commander. Cryptic could, however, take a few parts from the game and implement them into STO for cooler gameplay. ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Keep in mind that Bridge commander is not an MMO. Part that made the came cool would be infinitely harder to do in an MMO environment. Not impossible, just still ahead of today's technological practicality.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    So, you want the game models to have higher polycounts but worse texturing? and the user interface to be worse? and the bridge officers to have voice but stiffer animation and worse modeling?

    I'm thinking nostalgia doesn't necessarily make for a better game - though it can be an influence.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Making a post stating what you think STO should have been makes no sense to me.

    1) Unless you have a time machine you can't change what has happened.

    2) The game wasn't made specifically for you, but for a wide audience. Other players may disagree with your opinion.

    3) It is what it is. If you like the game then play it, if you don't like it then don't play it.

    4) If you have specific suggestion that you'd like to make as to how the game could be changed/improved in a way that would cause you to enjoy the game more then I recommend that you make it. Cryptic has made a lot of additions and improvements to the game that were suggested right here on the forums.

    I don't think that you're personally attacking the game or anyone else. I just think that it is a waste of time to discuss what, in your opinion, STO should have been. Especially when this topic has already been beaten to death in over a hundred threads since the game launched.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Sorry, Never played Bridge Commander before so I can not say one way or the other how I would feel having the MMO based of it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Making a post stating what you think STO should have been makes no sense to me.

    (=| In summary |=)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Bridge Commander is a fine game, but it's incredibly focused on pleasing the true blue Trekkies at the expense of everyone else. STO is a more well rounded, more accessible game, and it's all the better for it.

    Plus all the other stuff that STO has too.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    pr1983 wrote: »
    Bridge Commander is a fine game, but it's incredibly focused on pleasing the true blue Trekkies at the expense of everyone else. STO is a more well rounded, more accessible game, and it's all the better for it.

    Plus all the other stuff that STO has too.

    And this is the core of it. Those youtube clips didn't really give a sense of anything other than ships flying around and a fps view of a bridge. While I am sure there are a number of tweaks that can and will be done to the current engine, I don't see from that example what you are suggesting 'should have been'
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    pr1983 wrote: »
    Bridge Commander is a fine game, but it's incredibly focused on pleasing the true blue Trekkies at the expense of everyone else. STO is a more well rounded, more accessible game, and it's all the better for it.

    Plus all the other stuff that STO has too.

    Pretty much spot on.....
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Cryptic is starting to do a better job pleasing the "True Blue Trekie" audience, I think. I'm happy I can sit in my Captain's Chair, sit behind the desk in my ready room & etc.

    Hopefully they work on some of the story issues that some of us have.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Cryptic is starting to do a better job pleasing the "True Blue Trekie" audience, I think. I'm happy I can sit in my Captain's Chair, sit behind the desk in my ready room & etc.

    Hopefully they work on some of the story issues that some of us have.

    Did they add sitting in chairs tech to the ready room when I wasn't looking?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Cryptic is starting to do a better job pleasing the "True Blue Trekie" audience, I think. I'm happy I can sit in my Captain's Chair, sit behind the desk in my ready room & etc.

    Hopefully they work on some of the story issues that some of us have.

    agreed. i'm as dyed in the wool as any trek fan, and i love how far they've gone with this game to make it feel like star trek.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Brolarter wrote: »
    I really wish cryptic would have done some research.. If only they had looked at this one game and thought what they could have done in a MMO space combat setting
    Star Trek: Bridge Commander is a space combat simulation game for the PC, published by Activision and Totally Games in 2002, based in the Star Trek universe.

    Yet another thread I thought was a joke but turned out not to be! Really, Bridge Commander Online? Really?

    You think they didn't do research? Really?

    I say if you want to play Bridge Commander buy it or load it. If STO was a BC clone it would never have made it beyond beta. It would have been lambasted and criticized into nonexistence. BC is a good game but it is not MMO material.

    I really thought this was a joke post...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Did they add sitting in chairs tech to the ready room when I wasn't looking?

    No they haven't.

    There are a lot of things STO should have been and there are also a lot of things they have done to make it more accessable to new trek fans. The game has been improving dramatically as time has passed and they have done a fine job in most areas. There is no need for inverted or vertical flight, this is not Descent nor are most people willing to drop the money on a controller capable of fully handling 6dof flight characteristics. Flying 6dof with a keyboard is possible, but it sucks and would require a complete revamp of the game to compensate for ypr and the z axis on individual ships. Balance would become even harder to manage and there would be griping from the majority of the subscriber base.

    Flight from the bridge would be tedius in the end though, personally, I would prefer it for sector space as an option. Fighting from the bridge takes it into the realm of a simulator which would alienate the physically handicapped population though the same can be said for 6dof.

    Ground combat is being revamped, and unlike SWG's NGE, it needs it badly. Cryptic has seen this and is responding. Given the development time that they were afforded, they took a huge risk and have released a (mostly) playable game with a fair amount of low level content.

    One thing that needs serious attention is high level content now, particularly on the Klingon side, but they need content period. Once someone hits level cap, it is a choice of running dailies, rolling a new char, PvP (desperately needs work), or rerunning old missions in a seriously overpowered ship.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Did they add sitting in chairs tech to the ready room when I wasn't looking?

    No, but you can jump into the chair and use the /sit_bridge emote. It works well enough for now.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I modded Bridge Commander and Legacy for four years. Trust me, STO is superior in every regard unless you simply wish to sit on your bridge and stare at a viewscreen. If you actually want to LIVE in Bridge Commander, you have to go to the tactical view which is a very flat version of combat. Spam phasers, spam torpedoes, turn around and fire rear torpedoes, etc. That's it. a few mods allow you to do gimmicky things, but overall it's flat. In STO, you have your abilities and a more intuitive power management system. It's not clunky, and you don't have to change screens to use abilities.

    The AI is flat out TRIBBLE. It does the same things as above while flying in a circle around you. At least the AI in STO will use abilities, do figure eight patterns, and try to avoid exposing a single facing to you.

    I'll give you that Bridge Commander LOOKS a lot more like Star Trek, but it's boring like hell after 5 minutes. The original game without mods is lackluster. If you want to make STO more like BC, give us back the BO voices from Beta and have them replace the computer voice in ship combat callouts. Anything more would be annoying.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    well i love the sto ship combat, i found bridge commander ship combat clunky, if i didnt use the tac officer to auto attack and fly the ship, my **** would miss most of the time, as distance and angle were hard to tell and so my torpedoes would miss alot.

    its true that I prefer the scale of BC and Excalibur to STO, but in terms of fun and adrenaline i like sto ship combat, plus i think its cool how cryptic has implemened the various, attack pattern alpha or directed energy modulation or rotate shield frequency into clickable powers.

    If you look at the videos for excalibur you will see what i mean by scale, like the torpedoes and energy weapons like canon weapons arent almost as big as the ships themself like in STO, the torpedoes and cannon weapons in sto are big, and the ship scale is small.

    In excalibur its very canon, but again its just a nit pick.

    Now i can give you a post of what BC should have been.

    http://bridgecommander.filefront.com/file/Galaxy_Charts;102501

    some features.
    - Added Strategic Command GUI, available when the War Sim is online, which contain various features:
    - 'news system' allows to you to easily check whats going on in the galaxy
    - 'War/Race Stats' allow you to easily check how races are compared to each other and the personal stats of the player (like how many kills, deaths, playing time, and so on).
    - 'database' allows you to have a majorly detailed look at the characteristics of any ship class of your race.
    - 'System Development' allows you to develop and improve the sets/systems that belong to your race, by placing or selling starbases, or improving the set's economic value / strategic value / default defence value
    - 'Military Command' allows you to take control of your race's diplomatic negotiations and military fleet, to offer peace treaties or order attack on enemy systems.

    - And also made several tweaks and fixes in the code from GC v1.
    - New major feature implemented: the Galactic War Simulator
    - Besides various UMM configuration values, this feature can be toggled ON/OFF in GC's config menu in UMM.
    - Changes the operation of some normal GC features, such as RDF and the Galaxy Map.
    - Ships of X race can conquer systems from enemy races by attacking them, and defeating it's defence forces (Random Defence Force - RDF).
    - Races will periodically attack their enemies. (Random Attack Force - RAF)
    - Basic Economy running: each race gains each second the sum of it's systems Economy value as "Funds". These funds are the basic (and only) resouce used in the war: to buy ships and etc.
    - Ships now carry a price tag, depending of it's systems and so. To be able to add ships to the game (either by a RAF, RDF, on some other means), it's race will need to have that amount of funds available to pay for the ship.
    - RAF and RDF amount of ships and classes of ships to use are now "randomly" calculated based on attacking/defending system importance.
    - System in the Galaxy Map receive a different color coding: green->player region / blue->selected destination / yellow->neutral system red->hostile system / light blue->allied system
    - Ships will be divided in fleets, and their behavior in the game, thanks to a new AI, will be much more "intelligent". Ships will follow the lead ship of their fleet, coordinate fire with the lead ship, try to dock in a base to repair/resupply if needed, and more.
    - The player always commands his fleet, which can be seen, with details of each ship's actions, in a little "Fleet Status" windows which appears in your screen's top-right corner when in tactical view.
    - Saving System: users can save the game to continue playing another time, selecting the saved game to load in UMM.

    plus many more.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Any STAR TREK game were one can actually fight from the bridge will always be better then a STAR TREK game were one can only fight in a arcade 3D style i think. But i'm sure the next company that get the IP to make the next STAR TREK MMO will make this happend, me i just think the STO engine cant handle that challenge. So sad for a 2010 game.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    thats your opinion. bridge view is nostalgia, you get bored of it. only thing i like to see is the bridge shaking.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    In Cryptic's defense, they really didn't have the time to make the game how it should have been. CBS wanted the game out in a certain time frame. Cryptic said we have an engine already we can use so CBS said here you go. Since Cryptic was an established company the chances of them failing like Perpetual did.

    Funny way back when on the Star Trek forums when STO was still a part of Perpetual, myself and a few others knew the game was doom for failure due to lack of info, many others were more optimistic about it. Hell, Perpetual didn't even have a website, that company was horrible.

    In the past I had voiced my disappointment with Cryptic's STO, I was a little frustrated at the time. They are doing the best with the time and resources that they have. The game is improving, slowly but it is getting a little better as time goes. I do agree STO does need a major makeover and refit. As long as they they keep our subscriptions intact I would be willing to purchase STO all over again if they made STO the way it should have been.

    Overall Cryptic, you all are doing a good job, keep it up. You'll get STO where it should be, I just hope you guys have the time to do so.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    tyyy wrote: »
    Any STAR TREK game were one can actually fight from the bridge will always be better then a STAR TREK game were one can only fight in a arcade 3D style i think.
    For you, and admittedly for a lot of other people, that's probably true. A lot of people, myself included, enjoy the third person view while engaging in space combat.

    That being said, I do honestly hope that Cryptic adds the option to operate your ship, and engage in combat, from a bridge point of view. I personally would never use that option, but I also believe that MMOs should have as many different options possible for all of the various players' tastes.

    tyyy wrote: »
    But i'm sure the next company that get the IP to make the next STAR TREK MMO will make this happend, me i just think the STO engine cant handle that challenge. So sad for a 2010 game.
    The problem with this statement, that we've all seen many times on these forums, is that if Cryptic's Star Trek MMO fails it's likely that CBS will simply give up and we'll never have another Star Trek video game ever.

    Would that really be a preferable situation to you?
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