I've noticed this sentiment swirling around lately in favor of making NPCs wear the All Good Things uniform, I think in part pushed by players (some of whom dislike the AGT uniform) seeing the quality of the work Cryptic has done in realizing it.
I want to lay out the arguments for it.
1) Brand Recognition
Dstahl says a major goal of the game moving forward is to be "more Star Trek". The All Good Things uniforms are a recognizable part of the IP. It tells serious Trek fans when this game is set, where it fits into the larger framework. The normal "standard" uniforms have more of a Star Wars or Mass Effect feel with the emphasis on leather, details, and texturing. It does INSTANTLY evoke Star Trek.
That isn't to say they don't belong on players ever or don't have a place. I just don't think the current defaults reinforce the brand and what era the game takes place in.
2) Consistency
NPCs tend to look confusingly distinct from one another by using the various default uniforms. If not for the color schemes and combadges, it would be difficult to tell who is a part of what faction. This is less a concern for players; you KNOW what faction they are by their behavior towards you and in what capacity you're interacting with them (teams or PvP).
The complexity of the uniforms and the variations doesn't make NPCs look uniform enough, however, and there's no clear schema for why one NPC wears a B02 uniform and another wears an A03.
3) Design Eloquence
Simply put, the standard uniforms look cool but seem to clash badly with the basic game design. The combination of scaled leather and cloth and vinyl has an interesting look when seen on a PLAYER when moving at a distance. Your eyes tend to focus on the whole player in an action encounter.
However, a lot of our interaction with NPCs comes in the bust portrait we get of them in pop up dialogues. The uniform textures draw my attention away from the NPC's face and end up emphasizing the collar, which is blocky, low polycount, and tends to clip with necks. That collar wouldn't be an issue with other players because I'm not up in other players' faces often enough to notice but the flaws are exaggerated in a close-up shot.
Meanwhile, the AGT uniform is plain. Plain may not be what I want out of my Captain or crew; I want to stand out. However, the random NPCs populating a starbase SHOULD be plain. They shouldn't draw attention to themselves or cause me to notice how generic they are or how often they're reused. NPCs SHOULD be plain, not busy or attention grabbing.
You could have some sensible variants like the addition of a Crusher labcoat or the AGT dress uniform from "Endgame". These might make a key NPC stand out. But they wouldn't stand out to the point that they look like they come from another universe.
Also, these uniforms are perfect for NPCs in that the collar is low. Collars are wear the art issues with uniforms tend to be annoyingly noticeable in pop up dialogues and contact conversations. Also, the worst feature of the costumes is the "Urkel pants" or cummerbund and that would be downplayed in the shoulders-up mission dialogues. It's also very "legible" on low end systems with lower graphics settings.
It makes the NPCs simple. Whether you see that as exceedingly simple or elegant, either result is an ideal outcome for generic NPCs. Its flaws are downplayed in mission dialogues and the flaws most exaggerated in mission dialogues (too many textures, distracting textures, blocky collars) are not present with this uniform. Above all, it ties the game into a context Trek fans can appreciate and more readily accept and contextualize. You see it and you know this is a game set in the era of the TNG finale, the Voyager finale and The Visitor.
It's not the most gracious work of art. It's not rugged. It's not detailed. But NPCs shouldn't be those things; players should embody those traits in contrast with NPCs. It does the job and nothing more, while having a familiarity to it and working well with the game's parameters.
Please consider shifting NPCs over to the All Good Things uniforms and making them the generic default.
Also, I think a nice simultaneous shift would be to get Dark Jedi to do a new boxart graphic for digital editions of the game, in conjunction with a uniform change.
The standard version emphasizes "ACTION" to an extreme unseen in other MMOs, including ones that are even more action based than STO (and yes, those exist). I feel like the poor guy is going to throw out his shoulder, particularly stretching that way in a leather outfit.
Get him to render up a new, moodier take on STO guy in a new default uniform (maybe one that includes Klingons, symbolic of the focus shift towards adding Klingon content) and have him work in the new Enterprise design from the upcoming contest and I think you'll have a winner that properly conveys the focus shift the game has undergone and is continuing to undergo.
Something like Starfleet guy (in AGT uniform) and a Klingon fighting back to back while eying eachother aggressively, with the Enterprise overhead. Much better context and selling point for the game. Work in a sexy Vulcan Science Officer, an Orion, a Gorn, and a Borg Engineer and you'd sell me on another boxed copy.
Seconded. They simply look more like the Star Trek we know -> "pajamas".
All those "cool" leather jackets seem to be fine for the "evil guys" from the Terran Empire or Section 31, but they don't really look Starfleet'ish when compared to what we are used to. Any and all episodes that have shown Starfleet's future - be them in TNG, DS9 or VOY - have used the AGT uniforms, and I don't see why this should be neglected in a game that falls into this exact time period.
Seconded. They simply look more like the Star Trek we know -> "pajamas".
All those "cool" leather jackets seem to be fine for the "evil guys" from the Terran Empire or Section 31, but they don't really look Starfleet'ish when compared to what we are used to. Any and all episodes that have shown Starfleet's future - be them in TNG, DS9 or VOY - have used the AGT uniforms, and I don't see why this should be neglected in a game that falls into this exact time period.
The leathery stuff works for players, for me, because the stars of the series sometimes dress "cooler". Like Kirk's bomber jacket. Players being cool and edgy is one thing. I kinda think the starbase staff maybe should be a bit generic unless great pains are bing made to have a character stick out.
The leathery stuff works for players, for me, because the stars of the series sometimes dress "cooler". Like Kirk's bomber jacket. Players being cool and edgy is one thing. I kinda think the starbase staff maybe should be a bit generic unless great pains are bing made to have a character stick out.
Sure, I didn't mean to argue its availability to the playerbase - heck, I use one of those designs myself for my Hazard Team character + BOs. It just feels ... I dunno, inappropriate to see it everywhere. It's not the Starfleet I'm used to.
I think if any of the 'Cryptic Uniforms' should be used the B-01 series should be considered as one of the top as visually it has the same look (general shoulder design) as TNG, DS9 and Voyager. For myself, I actually consider this one to be a great upgrade of the last uniforms we saw in ST Nemesis.
I will say that you presented your argument very concisely. Very well done, and if not for the fact that i personally hate those AGT uniforms and always have, i probably would have signed on. They are god awful, and i see no reason why just because some designer made some quick crappy future uniforms for an episode of TNG back in the day, i have to subject myself to seeing it everywhere now. (players that choose to wear it themselves when it comes to C-store exempted of course) In this case i'm alright with ignoring canon.
A million times no. Let cryptic make a game for god's sake. Seriously. :mad:
Why in the world would they go through the trouble of making their own canon have a lore reason for why all the people wear different uni's, just to change it to the most ridiculous canon uniform I've ever seen?
A million times no. Let cryptic make a game for god's sake. Seriously. :mad:
Why in the world would they go through the trouble of making their own canon have a lore reason for why all the people wear different uni's, just to change it to the most ridiculous canon uniform I've ever seen?
...
Think of it this way: then you could feel a little tinge of superiority when you see your crew'[s uniform in contrast with the NPCs.
A million times no. Let cryptic make a game for god's sake. Seriously. :mad:
Why in the world would they go through the trouble of making their own canon have a lore reason for why all the people wear different uni's, just to change it to the most ridiculous canon uniform I've ever seen?
...
I don't see what the problem with the current default NPC uniforms. They look a LOT better than the AGT uniforms. There are better ways for them to spend the time and resources than changing, as you say, something they created their own lore about. If they added it to the C-Store, well, people can choose those awful uniforms if they want. I just think its a bad idea to change it so everyone or the random SF personnel NPCs to it by default.
No. I could maybe agree on having all NPCs more standardized, but in truth they are fairly standard within each area. But if they were to be made standard, it should be on one of the generic uniforms, not a C-Store one.
No. I could maybe agree on having all NPCs more standardized, but in truth they are fairly standard within each area. But if they were to be made standard, it should be on one of the generic uniforms, not a C-Store one.
There is no C-Store release date for the AGT uniforms last I checked and I think a natural part of this would be sliding them into the core game, with something else taking that C-Store slot when the time comes.
I don't see what the problem with the current default NPC uniforms. They look a LOT better than the AGT uniforms. There are better ways for them to spend the time and resources than changing, as you say, something they created their own lore about. If they added it to the C-Store, well, people can choose those awful uniforms if they want. I just think its a bad idea to change it so everyone or the random SF personnel NPCs to it by default.
Subjectivity of liking the look or not, the AGT uniform is canon for this time period. We see it used in both the AGT episode and the Endgame episodes from Voyager, both set roughly 30 years in the future: AKA, STO's time period. There's nothing wrong with adding some canon to the game, especially in such a minor way, IMO.
Subjectivity of liking the look or not, the AGT uniform is canon for this time period. We see it used in both the AGT episode and the Endgame episodes from Voyager, both set roughly 30 years in the future: AKA, STO's time period. There's nothing wrong with adding some canon to the game, especially in such a minor way, IMO.
Adding it in the C-Store or making it optional uniforms for players is not a big deal....I'm simply opposed to them being the default uniform for all NPCs canon or not. I know thats just my view, but I find them hideous.
Subjectivity of liking the look or not, the AGT uniform is canon for this time period. We see it used in both the AGT episode and the Endgame episodes from Voyager, both set roughly 30 years in the future: AKA, STO's time period. There's nothing wrong with adding some canon to the game, especially in such a minor way, IMO.
I know thats just my view, but I find them hideous.
I get that, but a lot of people find the current design hideous. No matter what they pick someone's not going to like it. I'd just as soon see them choose something canon for the era, whether I really like the look or not.
ADDED: No problem. It just strengthens the case even more! Three peeks into the future, from three unique perspectives, reveal this same uniform. That has to account for something!
Subjectivity of liking the look or not, the AGT uniform is canon for this time period. We see it used in both the AGT episode and the Endgame episodes from Voyager, both set roughly 30 years in the future: AKA, STO's time period. There's nothing wrong with adding some canon to the game, especially in such a minor way, IMO.
Also in DS9's "The Visitor" and a transition towards it with the combadge in Voyager's "Timeless".
And this timeline does have elements of those timelines.
For example, Geordi commands the Galaxy-class USS Challenger (ala Timeless) and had three children by Leah Brahms (AGT, presumably Alandra, Bret, and Sidney). I believe Beverly commands the Pasteur. The Galaxy Dreadnaughts are in production. Much of the evnts from "The Visitor" played out much the same, except with Sisko disappearing a bit later; still, he remains gone (the ending shot of DS9 was even a callback to "The Visitor".) Jake published "Anslem" Hostilities with the Klingons DID increase, as seen in AGT and "The Visitor" and the Cardassians and Bajorans are allied. The Doctor fights for Photonic Rights, ala "Endgame". Jean-Luc Picard is even living back on the old family Vineyard, having retired as an ambassador to Vulcan in the later STO timeline supplements.
There are also differences, like Nog as the Enterprise's Chief Engineer, at least as of a few years ago. Data, not Riker commands the Enterprise, E not D. Voyager got home sixteen years ahead of its schedule in Endgame. However, most of the differences are pretty much confined to things that changed as a result of those specific episodes.
This is very much like the futures we glimpsed in the shows though, overall, with the primary differences boiling down to Picard's personal decisions, when Sisko disappeared (which rippled out to influence whether Jadzia lived), and when and if Voyager returned.
Adding it in the C-Store or making it optional uniforms for players is not a big deal....I'm simply opposed to them being the default uniform for all NPCs canon or not. I know thats just my view, but I find them hideous.
They're so much better than what current NPCs wear though.
I will only support this IF in addition to the dreadful AGT PJ's. All NPCs also get matching fuzzy bunny slippers and a old timey floppy sleeping cap. To complete the ensemble.
ADDED: No problem. It just strengthens the case even more! Three peeks into the future, from three unique perspectives, reveal this same uniform. That has to account for something!
In case I rambled on too long, I wanted to point out that Voyager's "Timeless" reused the combadge and was set slightly before the other glimpses, making it four glimpses that seem to agree.
Comments
The standard version emphasizes "ACTION" to an extreme unseen in other MMOs, including ones that are even more action based than STO (and yes, those exist). I feel like the poor guy is going to throw out his shoulder, particularly stretching that way in a leather outfit.
http://www.douglasshuler.com/images/federation-poster03.jpg
http://www.douglasshuler.com/images/federation-poster02.jpg
Get him to render up a new, moodier take on STO guy in a new default uniform (maybe one that includes Klingons, symbolic of the focus shift towards adding Klingon content) and have him work in the new Enterprise design from the upcoming contest and I think you'll have a winner that properly conveys the focus shift the game has undergone and is continuing to undergo.
Something like Starfleet guy (in AGT uniform) and a Klingon fighting back to back while eying eachother aggressively, with the Enterprise overhead. Much better context and selling point for the game. Work in a sexy Vulcan Science Officer, an Orion, a Gorn, and a Borg Engineer and you'd sell me on another boxed copy.
All those "cool" leather jackets seem to be fine for the "evil guys" from the Terran Empire or Section 31, but they don't really look Starfleet'ish when compared to what we are used to. Any and all episodes that have shown Starfleet's future - be them in TNG, DS9 or VOY - have used the AGT uniforms, and I don't see why this should be neglected in a game that falls into this exact time period.
They are the established canon uniform for this time line. If it worked for 3 episodes and 3 series why can't it work for STO?
The leathery stuff works for players, for me, because the stars of the series sometimes dress "cooler". Like Kirk's bomber jacket. Players being cool and edgy is one thing. I kinda think the starbase staff maybe should be a bit generic unless great pains are bing made to have a character stick out.
modern pajama's are still pajama's
I think this falls into the "more like Star Trek" category as well.
At the very least, please consider disabling kits and armor on random NPCs. They don't look like Star Trek anymore.
BEST.
IDEA.
EVAAAAAH!
Cryptic, crypic, please oh please. Cryptic cryptic this is what we needsss
A million times no. Let cryptic make a game for god's sake. Seriously. :mad:
Why in the world would they go through the trouble of making their own canon have a lore reason for why all the people wear different uni's, just to change it to the most ridiculous canon uniform I've ever seen?
...
Think of it this way: then you could feel a little tinge of superiority when you see your crew'[s uniform in contrast with the NPCs.
I don't see what the problem with the current default NPC uniforms. They look a LOT better than the AGT uniforms. There are better ways for them to spend the time and resources than changing, as you say, something they created their own lore about. If they added it to the C-Store, well, people can choose those awful uniforms if they want. I just think its a bad idea to change it so everyone or the random SF personnel NPCs to it by default.
This would make me so happy walking through ESD.
Please Devs, consider this!
There is no C-Store release date for the AGT uniforms last I checked and I think a natural part of this would be sliding them into the core game, with something else taking that C-Store slot when the time comes.
Adding it in the C-Store or making it optional uniforms for players is not a big deal....I'm simply opposed to them being the default uniform for all NPCs canon or not. I know thats just my view, but I find them hideous.
Also DS9's The Visitor.
ADDED: No problem.
Also in DS9's "The Visitor" and a transition towards it with the combadge in Voyager's "Timeless".
And this timeline does have elements of those timelines.
For example, Geordi commands the Galaxy-class USS Challenger (ala Timeless) and had three children by Leah Brahms (AGT, presumably Alandra, Bret, and Sidney). I believe Beverly commands the Pasteur. The Galaxy Dreadnaughts are in production. Much of the evnts from "The Visitor" played out much the same, except with Sisko disappearing a bit later; still, he remains gone (the ending shot of DS9 was even a callback to "The Visitor".) Jake published "Anslem" Hostilities with the Klingons DID increase, as seen in AGT and "The Visitor" and the Cardassians and Bajorans are allied. The Doctor fights for Photonic Rights, ala "Endgame". Jean-Luc Picard is even living back on the old family Vineyard, having retired as an ambassador to Vulcan in the later STO timeline supplements.
There are also differences, like Nog as the Enterprise's Chief Engineer, at least as of a few years ago. Data, not Riker commands the Enterprise, E not D. Voyager got home sixteen years ahead of its schedule in Endgame. However, most of the differences are pretty much confined to things that changed as a result of those specific episodes.
This is very much like the futures we glimpsed in the shows though, overall, with the primary differences boiling down to Picard's personal decisions, when Sisko disappeared (which rippled out to influence whether Jadzia lived), and when and if Voyager returned.
IE:
Player
BO1
BO2
BO3
Crew
That way, the player can actually customize the crews uniforms.
They're so much better than what current NPCs wear though.
In case I rambled on too long, I wanted to point out that Voyager's "Timeless" reused the combadge and was set slightly before the other glimpses, making it four glimpses that seem to agree.