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Federation NEEDS Battle Cloak

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Lets even the odds, the Defiant has been SEEN in DS9 cloaking in mid battle, the same as a BOP when the Federation withdrew from DS9. Stop giving the Klingons everything and if you are going to be correct about it, the Retrofit Defiant and the Galaxy X should both have a battle cloak. So what's the problem with that, the Klingons have it and it increases their attack power by an insane amount. They like to cloak mid battle and run away so they can heal up and come back.

Why the hell can't we?

It maybe fun for BOP to decloak and take out a whole cruiser shield facing a one attack but it is not fun for the rest of us. So how about we even the odds... or would that upset the Klinks. After all, fairness is everything right?

And before anyone says BOP's can't do that, YES they can, my entire starboard shield facing totally collapsed during one attack with a Klingon BOP, I have type XI Covarient Cap X 3 shields. So don't tell me that decloak buff isn't overpowered.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Don't forget to mention carriers while you're at it. :rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    There's no reason the Defiant can't have it. It's already a kind of sucky ship.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Valias wrote:
    Don't forget to mention carriers while you're at it. :rolleyes:

    Nah, Carriers are alright, I don't actually think there that back because they have drawbacks. Battle cloak and BOP's don't seem to have many set backs at all because you can't just swat them out of the sky.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Just because you cant handle a BoP does not mean the rest of the galaxy can't. :rolleyes:

    Feds should not be having cloaks at all, period, even the Dreadnaught and Defiant Retro cloaks are too much IMO and were only put in there because whiners were very vocal about having a cloak.

    If you want a battlecloak so bad then go play Klingon.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Here we go again.... I see this one getting locked soon...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    There's no reason the Defiant can't have it. It's already a kind of sucky ship.

    Ah but the Defiant can battle cloak, DS9 Season 5 - A call to Arms, it cloaks with Martoks Bird of Pray while evading the Dominion fleet when they leave DS9. It would allow the Defiant to stand toe to toe with the Bird of Pray and allow PVP to be much more balanced. I can see all the Klingons complain when their Negh'var's shields go down in one swooping attack.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Defiant = Raptor. If the Defiant gets battle cloak, then the Raptor gets it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    I think you misread me. I said there's no reason the Defiant CAN'T have it. As in I have no objections.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    This is one of those shocking moments where I actually agree with DC. While I was against Fed cloaks to begin with now that we do have it the Defiant's should be a Battle Cloak it might make that somewhat lackluster ship better.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Naevius wrote:
    Defiant = Raptor. If the Defiant gets battle cloak, then the Raptor gets it.

    Then why not have a Federation equivlant to the Bird of Pray, for example, a Venture class ship used in Insurrection.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Lets even the odds, the Defiant has been SEEN in DS9 cloaking in mid battle, the same as a BOP when the Federation withdrew from DS9. Stop giving the Klingons everything and if you are going to be correct about it, the Retrofit Defiant and the Galaxy X should both have a battle cloak. So what's the problem with that, the Klingons have it and it increases their attack power by an insane amount. They like to cloak mid battle and run away so they can heal up and come back.

    Why the hell can't we?

    It maybe fun for BOP to decloak and take out a whole cruiser shield facing a one attack but it is not fun for the rest of us. So how about we even the odds... or would that upset the Klinks. After all, fairness is everything right?

    And before anyone says BOP's can't do that, YES they can, my entire starboard shield facing totally collapsed during one attack with a Klingon BOP, I have type XI Covarient Cap X 3 shields. So don't tell me that decloak buff isn't overpowered.

    The Defiant had a ROMULAN cloak. That cloaking device was destroyed when the USS Defiant was blown up by the Breen.

    First and foremost, Federation ships shouldn't have cloaks period. The lack of cloaks was written in canon, and reinforced later by reference to the Treaty of Algeron.

    Secondly, even if the Federation developed cloaks based on the current state of affairs in the galaxy (war with the Klingons, the destruction of Romulus) there is no certainty they would develop one which operates the exact same way that the device which was aboard the original Defiant operated.

    Federation ships don't need battle cloak. It's fine how it is. And it's also fine being limited to the 2 ships which currently have it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Alexraptor wrote: »
    If you want a battlecloak so bad then go play Klingon.

    ^This.

    Seriously, why do so many people want to homogenize the game? Federation players seem to think that if Klingons have something that they don't, that they should get the same thing. You already have cloaks on two ships, and you only got it because you begged for it. Please be happy with that. Battle cloaks are a KDF thing (and Rommies whenever they come out), and NOT a UFP thing.

    On a side note, if you can't handle a BoP firing at you, then I recommend rethinking your strategy or don't PvP.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Nah, Carriers are alright, I don't actually think there that back because they have drawbacks. Battle cloak and BOP's don't seem to have many set backs at all because you can't just swat them out of the sky.

    I am ALL FOR IT !!!!!! Even giving you a LTC Universal slot BO.



    BUT......


    The Defiant & Gal-X would have to:

    **Lose shield value
    **loose a Aft Weapon slot
    **Lose 10% hull value vs their class sister ships
    **Lose either a Sci or Eng console slot.


    But Really, Those 2 ship IMO should have had Battle Cloaks anyways. I would welcome more Feds to blowz up in KvF pvp if it meant you got it and would use it against me!!!

    Koraxx
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Why are Klingons complaining about this, the battle cloak has been an unfair advantage to the Federation from day one... perhaps if it wasn't exploited all the time, we would not ask for it. A battle cloak on one or two Federation ships would help bring balance back into the game, what is the problem with that?

    Besides, Cryptic has already destroyed canon for this game so you cannot have it both ways.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    all together now...

    The Treaty is Broke, Let Us have Cloak
    The Treaty is Broke, Let Us have Cloak
    The Treaty is Broke, Let Us have Cloak
    The Treaty is Broke, Let Us have Cloak
    The Treaty is Broke, Let Us have Cloak

    :) (self ammusment...carry on)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Why are Klingons complaining about this, the battle cloak has been an unfair advantage to the Federation from day one... perhaps if it wasn't exploited all the time, we would not as for it. A battle cloak on one or two Federation ships would help bring balance back into the game, what is the problem with that?

    Besides, Cryptic has already destroyed canon for this game so you cannot have it both ways.

    Ok, now you have gone nutty again. How can someone exploit a power when they are using it for what it was designed for; not to mention when a BoP goes into cloak he is a real easy target for a few seconds.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    sithterror wrote: »
    But Really, Those 2 ship IMO should have had Battle Cloaks anyways. I would welcome more Feds to blowz up in KvF pvp if it meant you got it and would use it against me!
    Good point. I always disliked Defiants being more sturdy than my BoP. Let's give them the Enhanced Battle Cloak while we're at it. Easy prey. :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    See this is what none of you seem to understand, the game needs balance and what I'm proposing can give that. Either that or just take away the battle cloak all together, or get rid of the buff that it produces. Klingons have had it too easy for too long.

    As much as you want to flatter your own egos... its not your tactics or communication that wins it, its your overkill and unfair abilities and technology.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Don't forget: when a Federation Escort gets Battlecloak, this means the Klingon escort-equivalent should get it too and when a Federation Cruiser gets it, the Klingon Battlecruisers should get it too.
    After all it's canon as per Voyager: "Prophecy" where the Klingon ship decloaked and recloaked during the battle with Voyager.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Why are Klingons complaining about this, the battle cloak has been an unfair advantage to the Federation from day one... perhaps if it wasn't exploited all the time, we would not as for it. A battle cloak on one or two Federation ships would help bring balance back into the game, what is the problem with that?

    For me, it's about having a faction identity. It's not about having an "OP" ship, but rather that the KDF should have it's own look and feel...and the same for the Federation. Battle cloaks should remain Klingon only. If you want something that can counter it's ability, then ask for a detection grid or something...Oh, wait. You already DO have a counter like this...it's called a Nebula ship. :rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    I think the Feds need more then a battle cloak. What i mean to say is there is other stuff that needs fixing or needs to be re-thought about.

    Battle Cloaks are a KLINGON on thing. I mean come on. I know of one thing that needs to be REDONE totally and thats orbital Strike... That should be first... Battle Cloak to me is way at the bottom. I fly the Defiant-R and flown the Galaxy X and i am content with the fact they CAN CLOAK at all.

    I have 3 Fed Characters and 1 Klingon which is the lowest level possible so as that shows i am a fed character. Like i said We need a lot more done then just a BC.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    For me, it's about having a faction identity. It's not about having an "OP" ship, but rather that the KDF should have it's own look and feel...and the same for the Federation. Battle cloaks should remain Klingon only. If you want something that can counter it's ability, then ask for a detection grid or something...Oh, wait. You already DO have a counter like this...it's called a Nebula ship. :rolleyes:

    Preach it brotha! Sing it loud from the highest mountains!

    (In other words....word.)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    The Defiant had a ROMULAN cloak. That cloaking device was destroyed when the USS Defiant was blown up by the Breen.

    First and foremost, Federation ships shouldn't have cloaks period. The lack of cloaks was written in canon, and reinforced later by reference to the Treaty of Algeron.

    Secondly, even if the Federation developed cloaks based on the current state of affairs in the galaxy (war with the Klingon's, the destruction of Romulus) there is no certainty they would develop one which operates the exact same way that the device which was aboard the original Defiant operated.

    Federation ships don't need battle cloak. It's fine how it is. And it's also fine being limited to the 2 ships which currently have it.

    Only to argue @ you to a point.

    First, most Treaties get tossed when there is an actual War going on. Tho both sides will try and hold to a loose value of said treaty so they don't lose popular support. Doesn't mean it is a facade they work in their own favor.
    Maybe we need the Organian's to come and teach us both a lesson :D

    Secondly, I would not doubt Section 31 or some other Black Op group wouldn't develop a better model of the Phase-cloak....seems that incident happened despite the treaty being in effect. Yet, we also have soft canon that every fed ship has cloak available and needs an Admirals Security code to authorize it use. However, going back to Treaties....seems Federation also dabbled in Eugenics which we supposedly put a stop too. So we have the Incident at the institute where the modified flu virus acelerated human aging and we have Dr. Bashir and his 3 looney friends. Doesn't mean Section 31 didn't reverse Engineer part of it....find the remains of the original from the Defiant's demise or even acquire a few through "Black Market" Romulans' seeing as they are in a Prime position to do just that.

    In the end, the future is wide open in this game. Policies change with each administration despite what part of the populace wants and doesn't want. If cryptic were "To make it So"....i wouldn't have an issue with it, being it was just on those 2 Federation ships. The Romulan's got their own version.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    For me, it's about having a faction identity. It's not about having an "OP" ship, but rather that the KDF should have it's own look and feel...and the same for the Federation. Battle cloaks should remain Klingon only. If you want something that can counter it's ability, then ask for a detection grid or something...Oh, wait. You already DO have a counter like this...it's called a Nebula ship. :rolleyes:

    That was my argument as to why Feds should not have cloaked ships to begin with as well as no KDF Sci ships, but I digress people want everybody to be the same, then they will realize how boring that is.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    For me, it's about having a faction identity. It's not about having an "OP" ship, but rather that the KDF should have it's own look and feel...and the same for the Federation. Battle cloaks should remain Klingon only. If you want something that can counter it's ability, then ask for a detection grid or something...Oh, wait. You already DO have a counter like this...it's called a Nebula ship. :rolleyes:

    Excuse me but Tachyon Detection Grid is a really bad ability, you must not have played Federation enough to see that. Very well, then the Federation should have Holographic Masking Technology from the USS Incursion and Transphasic Torpedoes on intrepid class starship that can blow up a borg cube in one shot. Enought cultural identity for you. Not to mention the phase cloak.

    Oh and no quantum slipstream drive for Klingons either, thats a Federation thing.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    For me, it's about having a faction identity. It's not about having an "OP" ship, but rather that the KDF should have it's own look and feel...and the same for the Federation. Battle cloaks should remain Klingon only. If you want something that can counter it's ability, then ask for a detection grid or something...Oh, wait. You already DO have a counter like this...it's called a Nebula ship. :rolleyes:

    That is a good point and very Relevant to the whole issue.

    Could it be percieved as Canon-identity that the cloaks could have been "Battle Cloaks" but just weren't used in the episodes due to drama and writing? I seem to recall the Defiant being able to cloak pretty fast prior to and post battles, maybe it was his command decision to not cloak during combat to reduce damage to his fragile lil' ship??

    While being a Klingon and happy for the side i play on, i just don't think these 2 ships would upset game play or imbalance canon, but it would peeve some people and prove that Battle cloaks don't make one OP, the skills and their use do.

    Lest how I see it,
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    As much as you want to flatter your own egos... its not your tactics or communication that wins it, its your overkill and unfair abilities and technology.
    Weird. This means both KDF as well as Starfleet have overkill and unfair abilities and technology, considering that I also win PvP on my Fed characters.

    I think we have a paradox!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    And before anyone says BOP's can't do that, YES they can, my entire starboard shield facing totally collapsed during one attack with a Klingon BOP, I have type XI Covarient Cap X 3 shields. So don't tell me that decloak buff isn't overpowered.

    I'd like to take a moment here and apologize to the whole community, because I've been dropping cruiser shield facings on my bird of prey. Somehow the combination of beam overload + cannon scatter volley (both version 1) followed by a full aux CPB3 seem to drop shields, so I'd like to apologize for doing that. I normally follow up with photonic shockwave and allow my klingon teammates to open up on the exposed hull.

    Of course, it's what a duo of a well played sci vessel + defiant could do, but apparently we have battlecloak so that makes the entire attack run OP. Subsequently, I think DC has been the victim of one such attack run this past weekend.

    PS: RSP (lol), sci team + EPTS > RSF combo, EPTS + TSS combo all restore your shields wonderfully.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Excuse me but Tachyon Detection Grid is a really bad ability, you must not have played Federation enough to see that. Very well, then the Federation should have Holographic Masking Technology from the USS Incursion and Transphasic Torpedoes on intrepid class starship that can blow up a borg cube in one shot. Enought cultural identity for you. Not to mention the phase cloak.

    Oh and no quantum slipstream drive for Klingons either, thats a Federation thing.

    Touche`!! :)


    Espionage perhaps? A treaty made to have been broken prior to War? Wasn't in Canon, so where does that leave us??
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    We need a carrier yes but only a small one such as the akira claas, but what do we want a battle cloak for exactly?
This discussion has been closed.