Hey guys n girls, i was just wondering what the general opinion about the science power Photonic Fleet is. I rather roleplay a lot while im playing, and photonic fleet feel like ... your flying in a fleet of ships ... but they r totaly fake :S and dissapear its like "intercourse" withou the "climax" excuse the lingo :P
I find it to be very handy. You make a bunch of fake ships to distract your attackers. From a role-playing perspective you're simply confusing your foes sensors to make it seem like they're being attacked by multiple ships. It's saved my life more then once.
If I'm to understand correctly, Photonic Fleet is actually a result of combining the holographic emitters that now line almost every corrider of starships now, and the sensor arrays of the ship. In essence, turning the exterior of the ship into one big holo-emitter. It's not that you're confusing enemy ships; they're still taking damage when the photonic ships fire on them. They're very "real" holograms, but with the safety's off. And a phaser beam is still nothing but particles of light and heat, so rather easy for even a "fake" phaser to be very deadly, lol.
I like Cosmic_One's explanation. I have to admit, I've always found the idea of sentient holograms kinda stupid. (Red Dwarf'sd Rimmer is the only one I can take with a grain of salt) Why bother building ships when you can just send a fleet of holograms?
Like most hologram stuff in ST, it's quite silly when you think about it (phasers I can almost understand, but how do holographic torpedoes work?) but its a useful skill. They do decent enough damage, especially if you're lucky enough to summon multiple escorts.
I rather roleplay a lot while im playing, and photonic fleet feel like ... your flying in a fleet of ships ... but they r totaly fake :S and dissapear its like "intercourse" withou the "climax" excuse the lingo :P
Hah, that's my problem with this ability as well. :P
Matter of taste, obviously. Some people really love it, but I rarely use it as it just "feels wrong".
I kinda wish they were more like Sensor ghosts. Such was the one Worf made of the Romulan warbird while on the Hathaway in the TNG episode "Peal Performance"
The Enterprise thought it was real, but it didn't do any real damage.
So it would be more of an aggro-reducing tool than a DPS tool. In PVP they'd just be a "clutter the screen up and annoy people" tool though.
So I guess its one of those things you have to "accept" because this is a game and not a simulation.
The general idea as a electronic warfare tools is a good one,
Sadly the ingame version feels stupid because those ships do damage to others.
But thats a flaw of the entire holotech in trek, its just magic.
Take away the damage of the holoships, make them copies of the ships that generated them while cloaking the original ship.
Sorta like collecting the emissions of the original ship and projecting it to another place to evade incoming fire.
The general idea as a electronic warfare tools is a good one,
Sadly the ingame version feels stupid because those ships do damage to others.
But thats a flaw of the entire holotech in trek, its just magic.
Take away the damage of the holoships, make them copies of the ships that generated them while cloaking the original ship.
Sorta like collecting the emissions of the original ship and projecting it to another place to evade incoming fire.
ide rather not have holographic ships at all. Some1 was talking bout sensor ghosts before, would be nice if we got a skill that instead makes enemy ships target random points in space (for all i care it should be small radiating spheres that draw their fire) or replace it with something else in general. but thats NEVER going to happen. im just ... hoping ... idle ... but hoping ... :P rly cant help but dislike photonic fleet
From an RP or "real-world-logic-applied-to-Startrek" perspective, it sucks.
I wouldn't mind a more "Scramble Sensors" like effect where the enemy randomly targets holographic ships that are actually harmless. This could even be a power worth the damage losses, since if the enemy is wasting 2/3 of his shots on the holos, you'll last longer and can focus more on other offensive options.
Just to note guys, I believe the idea for photonic fleet came from voyager. There was an episode where they literally projected several photonic ships that fired on the enemy. (Khazon i think).
They didn't do any damage, though.
I actually like Mustrum's idea - it's at least closer to canon. It would be fun if the player ship would "split up" into four vessels, and three would be holographic copies. The players in the enemy team would have no idea which is the real one and would have to guess if it's the player or just a holographic illusion based on the target's movement or employed abilities. A little like in the shell game.
Yeah, I've gotta agree that photonic fleet doesn't make much sense outside of the game. I once tried to rationalize it by imagining that my ship was launching drone ships armed with phasers, torpedoes, and a holocloak, but then you have the problem of why you'd need the holocloak in the first place.
That being said, I do really like the photonic fleet as-is. I usually pilot sci ships, so I naturally need whatever dps help I can get. It always makes those "destroy 6 enemy ship squads" missions go faster, since I can just activate the fleet when I meet the last BB and get out quicker. I think Munstrum's suggestion makes a lot of sense (and it'd certainly be awesome in PvP), but I don't want to lose my firepower in the daily emblem grind.
If it's really a problem, change the name from "Photonic Fleet" to "Request Reinforcements," and remove the flicker effect from the ships. Problem solved.
If it's really a problem, change the name from "Photonic Fleet" to "Request Reinforcements," and remove the flicker effect from the ships. Problem solved.
shrug, like i said a few post before this. its prob never going to change, and i know some people who like it so .... yea .... guess ill have to get over it although your idea there would indeed solve it but then vice admirals have 2 requist assist powers
I'd assume the torpedoes work like solid objects on the holodeck work, to some extent. The holodeck does replicate some of the solid items in the simulations, realize.
So it probably replicates the torpedo and transports antimatter over in small quantities. (per TNG, it can be transported in small quantities).
That's how I assume it anyway. End result is ships that can fire and shoot torpedoes. Yay. Just what I need to cover my behind sometimes on my sci alt
Yeah, photonic fleet makes me think of the DS9 episode where the station's security protocol engaged. The ops replicator made a phaser emitter that started shooting at them, presumably drawing power from the replicator itself. So I imagine the holoemitters more or less create crude phaser emitters out of the photonic matter and then pump energy into them remotely. Kind of an interesting strategy, the weapons wouldn't be meant for surviving long, as they would be dematerialized and then recreated the next time.
Makes me wonder what's actually 'inside' the photonic ships. Obviously the shape could be a 'simple' hologram, but I imagine at least some of the exterior is materialized photonic matter, like the normal holodeck stuff. Then somewhere inside is the basic 'equipment' or 'structures' it needs to take the energy from the emitters and create propulsive energy, collimated weapon beams, and shields. But nothing like you'd see in a real ship, probably.
If it were in the normal holodeck, I could imagine the objects might not have anything inside that's really functional, since the emitters could just simulate any function with lights and movement. But if this was the case with photonic fleet, the emitters might as well just materialize photonic explosions directly on the enemy. It's apparent that this probably isn't so, so it's more like the emitters focus on creating something holographic where the ships are, which then are used to project weapons at the enemy. At least it seems so to me.
If it's really a problem, change the name from "Photonic Fleet" to "Request Reinforcements," and remove the flicker effect from the ships. Problem solved.
We have that, too. It's a separate ability called Fleet Support. I just love it when I'm able to engage Photonic Fleet and Fleet Support at the same time during the same battle!
I like Cosmic_One's explanation. I have to admit, I've always found the idea of sentient holograms kinda stupid. (Red Dwarf'sd Rimmer is the only one I can take with a grain of salt) Why bother building ships when you can just send a fleet of holograms?
Because it's just as bad if a hologram dies as it is if a person dies?
Because it's just as bad if a hologram dies as it is if a person dies?
so .... killing some1 with a holographic torpedo is double murder because ... not only does the enemy get destroyed but ... zomg the innocent hologram is dead!?
We seem to be assuming in this conversation that photonic fleet works the way traditional Trek holograms do, they've been traditionally explained, with light projections surrounded by forcefields and on-the-fly replication for things like food and bullets. However, since this is the early 25th century, we could assume that Starfleet figured out a way to reverse-engineer some of those advanced projection technologies Voyager found out about (i.e. isomorphic projection and particle synthesis) and implement them on a wide scale. It would iron out some of the inconsistencies (maybe).
Isn't that kind of an oxymoron? Either something is made up of energy (light) OR matter. Not both. As far as I remember the holodeck just uses force fields to make things "feel" real, they're still only projections.
However, since this is the early 25th century, we could assume that Starfleet figured out a way to [...]
Of course. Star Trek holograms are a giant pot of BS, anyways, and the franchise never displayed much consistency when it comes to photonic stuff. So in essence, it doesn't matter how STO deals with it, since the series already messed it up.
It still "feels" wrong, at least to me - and apparently some other players as well. *shrugs* I dunno, I would just prefer something more "classic", I guess. And not basically a copy of Fleet Support, whose only difference is that the trigger condition is balanced by the NPC ship's strength.
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Matter of taste, obviously. Some people really love it, but I rarely use it as it just "feels wrong".
The Enterprise thought it was real, but it didn't do any real damage.
So it would be more of an aggro-reducing tool than a DPS tool. In PVP they'd just be a "clutter the screen up and annoy people" tool though.
So I guess its one of those things you have to "accept" because this is a game and not a simulation.
agree totaly :P
Sadly the ingame version feels stupid because those ships do damage to others.
But thats a flaw of the entire holotech in trek, its just magic.
Take away the damage of the holoships, make them copies of the ships that generated them while cloaking the original ship.
Sorta like collecting the emissions of the original ship and projecting it to another place to evade incoming fire.
ide rather not have holographic ships at all. Some1 was talking bout sensor ghosts before, would be nice if we got a skill that instead makes enemy ships target random points in space (for all i care it should be small radiating spheres that draw their fire) or replace it with something else in general. but thats NEVER going to happen. im just ... hoping ... idle ... but hoping ... :P rly cant help but dislike photonic fleet
From an RP or "real-world-logic-applied-to-Startrek" perspective, it sucks.
I wouldn't mind a more "Scramble Sensors" like effect where the enemy randomly targets holographic ships that are actually harmless. This could even be a power worth the damage losses, since if the enemy is wasting 2/3 of his shots on the holos, you'll last longer and can focus more on other offensive options.
There was an episode where they literally projected several photonic ships that fired on the enemy. (Khazon i think)
It might be silly but it is canon.
I actually like Mustrum's idea - it's at least closer to canon. It would be fun if the player ship would "split up" into four vessels, and three would be holographic copies. The players in the enemy team would have no idea which is the real one and would have to guess if it's the player or just a holographic illusion based on the target's movement or employed abilities. A little like in the shell game.
That being said, I do really like the photonic fleet as-is. I usually pilot sci ships, so I naturally need whatever dps help I can get. It always makes those "destroy 6 enemy ship squads" missions go faster, since I can just activate the fleet when I meet the last BB and get out quicker. I think Munstrum's suggestion makes a lot of sense (and it'd certainly be awesome in PvP), but I don't want to lose my firepower in the daily emblem grind.
Me, too. I love Photonic Fleet. One of my favorites. For my science alt, this is one of the abilities I've concentrated on.
(wonders how one RP while playing)
shrug, like i said a few post before this. its prob never going to change, and i know some people who like it so .... yea .... guess ill have to get over it
So it probably replicates the torpedo and transports antimatter over in small quantities. (per TNG, it can be transported in small quantities).
That's how I assume it anyway. End result is ships that can fire and shoot torpedoes. Yay. Just what I need to cover my behind sometimes on my sci alt
Makes me wonder what's actually 'inside' the photonic ships. Obviously the shape could be a 'simple' hologram, but I imagine at least some of the exterior is materialized photonic matter, like the normal holodeck stuff. Then somewhere inside is the basic 'equipment' or 'structures' it needs to take the energy from the emitters and create propulsive energy, collimated weapon beams, and shields. But nothing like you'd see in a real ship, probably.
If it were in the normal holodeck, I could imagine the objects might not have anything inside that's really functional, since the emitters could just simulate any function with lights and movement. But if this was the case with photonic fleet, the emitters might as well just materialize photonic explosions directly on the enemy. It's apparent that this probably isn't so, so it's more like the emitters focus on creating something holographic where the ships are, which then are used to project weapons at the enemy. At least it seems so to me.
We have that, too. It's a separate ability called Fleet Support. I just love it when I'm able to engage Photonic Fleet and Fleet Support at the same time during the same battle!
Because it's just as bad if a hologram dies as it is if a person dies?
so .... killing some1 with a holographic torpedo is double murder because ... not only does the enemy get destroyed but ... zomg the innocent hologram is dead!?
We seem to be assuming in this conversation that photonic fleet works the way traditional Trek holograms do, they've been traditionally explained, with light projections surrounded by forcefields and on-the-fly replication for things like food and bullets. However, since this is the early 25th century, we could assume that Starfleet figured out a way to reverse-engineer some of those advanced projection technologies Voyager found out about (i.e. isomorphic projection and particle synthesis) and implement them on a wide scale. It would iron out some of the inconsistencies (maybe).
Of course. Star Trek holograms are a giant pot of BS, anyways, and the franchise never displayed much consistency when it comes to photonic stuff. So in essence, it doesn't matter how STO deals with it, since the series already messed it up.
It still "feels" wrong, at least to me - and apparently some other players as well. *shrugs* I dunno, I would just prefer something more "classic", I guess. And not basically a copy of Fleet Support, whose only difference is that the trigger condition is balanced by the NPC ship's strength.