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Klingon state of play.

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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Varrangian wrote: »
    Buddy, I was in the Beta forums when Jackapole promised use Klingons that we would not be relegated to moster play and that we would get more PvP. I've done my research on this game, you on the other hand like to read spin, but if you want to read the latest about the game how about these -

    http://www.startrekonline.com/node/2089

    I guess the SPIN I read back then and where we are at today was closer to the truth than what you were fed...

    Honestly I really don't care what you believe or don't believe, I made nothing up, I simply posted what turned out to be closer to "reality" and you just can't face it.:p

    BTW: I am NOT your "Buddy" Varranigian, keep that in mind next time you address me...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Dakma wrote: »
    I guess the SPIN I read back then and where we are at today was closer to the truth than what you were fed...

    Honestly I really don't care what you believe or don't believe, I made nothing up, I simply posted what turned out to be closer to "reality" and you just can't face it.:p

    BTW: I am NOT your "Buddy" Varranigian, keep that in mind next time you address me...

    :rolleyes: I hope you're efeelings are not hurt, but your sadly misinformed and blatantly ignoring the facts, most likely to feed so sad little need.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Varrangian wrote: »
    The reality is that they made this game for PvEers, PvP will never be a central part of the game play if any faction (including the KDF) is going to be anything more than monster play in this game, they have to have PvE. The Developers are not stupid their money comes from mostly PvEers, they are not going to sink development time/money into developing something that only PvPers can utilize. This is why the KDF must at least find a balance between PvP and PvE.

    Exactly my point. A pvp-centric faction ultimately only draws and retains the pvp-minded player.
    If the Dev's expect to ever see any growth or increase of players in any new faction and if we fans of said faction ever expect to see the growth and increase of attention from the Dev's, then more pve must be added to "give" the casual pve player something to do.

    As it stands we pvp'ers farm for emblems to get better gear for pvp and nothing more. I dare say that it the Deferi daily's did not pay out emblems the bulk of the KDF pvp'ers would not do them, much like the bulk of the KDF pvp'ers do not do the STF's. As a pvp-centric faction we have stalled in the mire.

    This loss of heart and meaning of the KDF is heavily evident in pvp matches, where now it seems we just attack the feds like a group of angry bees with no teamwork or desire to win. We just destroy them until the match is over, collect our emblems and move to the next match. The need and desire for victory no longer burns in our hearts and we have become shadows of ourselves.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Varrangian wrote: »
    :rolleyes: I hope you're efeelings are not hurt, but your sadly misinformed and blatantly ignoring the facts, most likely to feed so sad little need.

    I am realist which you call "misinformed" Varrangian, I see it for what it is and nothing more or less, nor was I under the impression that it was going to be more than was clearly stated when I did my research right before launch as you pointed out the date i joined the fourm.

    I got the game I was expecting, you obviously did not, nor do I think you ever will :rolleyes:

    As I stated before maybe you should have done a better job of researching before investing, instead of clinging on to old, outdated material you used in your decision making ;)

    As to my "efeelings" I have none because I take it for what this is, "just a game", a diversion from real life, maybe you should too! :cool:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    QUOTE=Jackalope;1121755]Seems like good ole Dan kicked off Klingon month in STYLE!

    First, let me apologize that info has been slow to get out. Believe it or not, December was supposed to "klingon" month. I have zero clue why it's Dec. 15th and still nothing, but I can tell you this WILL change (I just saw the threads yesterday).

    Secondly, yes, Klingon gameplay is almost entirely PvP. We are trying to get some PvE in (there's already a tad bit). And, if the players demand it, we'll add more content (like episodes). I want us to be agile as a company and respond to what the customers want.

    Third, I'll reiterate my point in the other thread. I'm most excited about playing a Klingon. I love combat in a bird of prey. Klingons are getting attention - from me. It's not as much as I'd want, but we have a foundation that we can grow into. If people like the federation gameplay, we can put that in for the Klingons. If players have a different set of requests for klingons, we can do that instead. We can make STO into the game that YOU want.

    I'll close with that. MMORPG's aren't just about release. They're about community and the years of gameplay. Disappointed that there isn't more Klingon gameplay? Play STO, tell us what you'd like and we can deliver that. Every passing day, we can make STO into what the fans want.


    Edit: Bumped jack's post to top of therad
    - mod
    [/QUOTE]

    This is the official response Jack had for the Klingons fans in beta, December 15th, before release after another Forum fire popped up and the Klingons knew very little of how the faction was to be.

    Yes, the fans wanted more pve content.
    Yes, they knew in advance that the KDF would be pvp, but they also believed ot when Jackolope said that more would be added if demands of the fans came in.

    My post was not wiether or not the fans of the KDF knew that they where pvp only. My original post was about the fact that without pve content , there is no lasting draw for the casual player to stay with any KDF alt's they may make.
    I wish I could make the link work, this thread was interesting read and shows that the KDF fans (most of whom left over it) wanted more content and said as much then before release.
    Ultimately what they said was true- the KDF faction is dying a slow crib death due to the huge lack of pve content.

    http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=42062
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Well you got more starting in Season 2

    Missions
    •8 New Klingon-only missions are available!
    •New Undine/Borg Themed Missions are available to all factions

    Recently you received the weekly series just as the feds did.

    But the simple fact remains if you read what I did, the same person whom Varrangian keeps posting about Jackalope said clearly: QUOTE: "Secondly, yes, Klingon gameplay is almost entirely PvP."

    Let me repeat it because you Klingons can't seem to grasp it "Klingon gameplay is almost entirely PvP."

    As I told Varrigan (who clings on to outdated, over a year old game conceptions) the turns games take from conception to market change multiple times and what was origionaly conceived most of the time never makes it to the final product.

    I research games before i buy them as I have been burned many times in the past and in December of 2009 they stated plainly that Klingons would be PVP based, why can't you Klingons seem to grasp that ?

    Since you knew that going in that it would be PVP based, now PVP is not good enough and you demand that all content stop for the Federation and make Klingon only content when the player numbers don't reflect that, even when there was more Klingons around it just baffles me.:confused:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    You know there is one more thing i wish to point out and up until recently I had completely forgot about was when i was leveling up as a Fed, I always have enjoyed PVP in other games so I thought I would try it out in STO.

    Well let me tell you about my early experiences with PVP and Klingons, it was not so much the fact that you all decloaked at one time and just ripped the hell out of the people on the Fed side but when the game was over all the Klings did was mock the feds and the verbage I won't repeat here.

    For a faction that depends on PVP, you Klingons shot yourselves in the foot.

    What ever happened to sportsman like conduct, such as gg, nice try maybe next time, well you know what I mean.

    People want to have fun, they don't like being the targets of peoples ridicule,especially in a game.

    Its no wonder very few que up against the Klingons...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Dakma wrote: »

    Let me repeat it because you Klingons can't seem to grasp it "Klingon gameplay is almost entirely PvP."

    :
    I grasp what you saying, I was there when it was first said.
    I'm not concerned that the KDF is a pvp only faction, but I'm concerned that being only pvp cripples the factions ability to draw and retain new players and grow the faction. Nobody likes to grind the same thing day in and day out without change. PvE content is needed to allow the KDF to grow, just as much as meaningful pvp is needed.
    Dakma wrote: »
    You know there is one more thing i wish to point out and up until recently I had completely forgot about was when i was leveling up as a Fed, I always have enjoyed PVP in other games so I thought I would try it out in STO.

    Well let me tell you about my early experiences with PVP and Klingons, it was not so much the fact that you all decloaked at one time and just ripped the hell out of the people on the Fed side but when the game was over all the Klings did was mock the feds and the verbage I won't repeat here.
    ...

    Kinda like assuming we don't grasp a concept?

    Bad sports live on both sides of the chasm- being asses is not a KDF only condition.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Dakma wrote: »
    Let me repeat it because you Klingons can't seem to grasp it "Klingon gameplay is almost entirely PvP."
    Here's something I don't think you're quite grasping: The "PvP-centric Faction" experiment failed. We tried it. Some of us are still gamely trying to make it work, but it isn't going so well... Doesn't matter who said what when in the past - the demonstrated empirical fact, right here and now, is that PvP-centric factions can only shrink, not grow.
    Dakma wrote: »
    Well let me tell you about my early experiences with PVP and Klingons, it was not so much the fact that you all decloaked at one time and just ripped the hell out of the people on the Fed side but when the game was over all the Klings did was mock the feds and the verbage I won't repeat here.
    Genuinely sorry you had that experience, but the majority of my matches end either in silence or in displays of good sportsmanship. Heck, a few matches have broken out into impromptu training sessions...

    Besides, Klingons definitely don't have a monopoly on trash-talk and poor sportsmanship - PvP enough anywhere, and you're bound to find some. Heh, in fact, last time I lost to Feds in space PvP, I was literally typing out "Congrats, Feds, well fought" when one of their number typed "EAT IT, Klinks." So I erased my message and left the map in silence.

    Of course, I took note of that Fed's name and made him my beyotch in the next two matches :p
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I'm curious if Klingons are the PVP faction?

    What are the Feds? <drum roll>

    PVP and PVP faction with tons of customization, ships, and protector of tribbles.

    eh.. so in reality the Federation are a PVP faction, so that means Klingons should be the same as the Feds :) Take away their PVE, maybe they'll learn to fire a torpedo without missing.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Dakma wrote: »
    I always research a game before I buy it / invest monthly, maybe you should have lol !

    I have been a gamer for many years and when I find a game of interest such as this one, I read the latest up to date news, as close to launch because lots of changes are made before release.

    Why would I bother reading what it was supposed to be in 2008, it makes little difference if its not what it is at launch now is it, especially when I know things change with games all the time ?

    Come on, seriously is that how you handle investments? if you do then you must waste a lot of money.....

    Bottom line is "It was not fabricated by the feds unless the writers of those articles who got the info directly from Cryptic had it in for the Klingons from the start, maybe because they were only going to play as a fed lmao!

    Its a ..........Conspiracy !!! :D

    He asked for PROOF, I supplied it, maybe you can't handle the truth when you see it for yourself....open your eyes and see it for what it really is, but then you couldn't complain could you?

    Your flat out delusional ;)

    THIS, THIS, AND THIS. There's a VERY thin line between hope and delusion. But it seems the hope will never die, and the reality is brutal enough for the die-hards (or so they're finding out...and the realization will dawn soon enough for the rest...) so maybe there's no need to kick them while they're down.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    The pain we all share here Klingon side. How many STO players have levelled a Klingon to lvl 20 and given up? Most members of the Fed fleet I am in have done so. I would be interested to see how many accounts have a Klingon player in a similar situation. Whatever lines we are fed about a lack of interest in the Klingon faction are mostly myths in my opinion. People give up on account of a total lack on content.

    I share the aspirations of most people in here. I would love to see a more solid levelling experience, more imersive PvP that feels like it has purpose, and just plain old mission content.

    Now the thing is, I think we have seen in the recent months the methods by which they can do this.

    Factionless content is gonna be bland, is gonna be a repeat of soemthing you have already done with your fed character, but at least its something to do. If the new weekly content is sprinkled with the paprika of a new Klingon mission at the rate of even one per series (even unrelated to the series) we would have a much broader and deeper levelling experience by next spring.

    What saddens me is although Crptic have grasped that regular content additions rather than whole chunks is going to satisfy more players, they have not cottoned on to the notion that the same applies for Klingons. I suggest we are happy to be thrown a bone now and then rather than waiting to roll out a major patch with a cluster of missions which we complete in an afternoon anyway.

    If they could just keep doing things which they have been doing recently things are gonna get better. BUT the faction neutral content is not enough alone - we need a few Klingon specific missions thrown into the mix to give us our flavour. I woudl suggest they work from the bottom up personally. This isn't much comfort for the current Klingon players I know, but it would give a body of new/casual people a reason to keep returning to their Klingon and prevent the player base of our fine faction from dying out.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    I agree new Klingon content, how ever fast/slow it may arrive, should begin at the lower levels first to facilitate growth of the faction.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Serpieri wrote: »
    I'm curious if Klingons are the PVP faction?

    What are the Feds? <drum roll>

    PVP and PVP faction with tons of customization, ships, and protector of tribbles.

    eh.. so in reality the Federation are a PVP faction, so that means Klingons should be the same as the Feds :) Take away their PVE, maybe they'll learn to fire a torpedo without missing.

    The klingons are more like a lack of PVE faction tbh
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    The klingons are more like a lack of PVE faction tbh

    We are the diversion faction. Something to do when your tired of your fed primary and need a little alt, it seems.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Maybe we could be more constructive?

    I really like the idea of using Klingon Houses as a form of Tournament Play. That would make PvP really mean something and it would reflect the Klingon ideal of pursuing glory and influence through combat. Win-win for RP and PvP alike.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    THIS, THIS, AND THIS. There's a VERY thin line between hope and delusion. But it seems the hope will never die, and the reality is brutal enough for the die-hards (or so they're finding out...and the realization will dawn soon enough for the rest...) so maybe there's no need to kick them while they're down.

    I wanted to make a reply, but instead I went to "find more posts" and reviewed.

    Now I'm just sad for you...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    Roach wrote: »
    I agree new Klingon content, how ever fast/slow it may arrive, should begin at the lower levels first to facilitate growth of the faction.

    This appears to be part of Dstahl's goal according to the Priority One interview.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited September 2010
    BTW, Thanks to the Dev's for the new Carrier updates on tribble.
    Showed the KDF some love and made a ship type much more fun.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    My opinion is STO wasnt very well thought out. The game feels like a console game not a PC MMO. It is full of cookie cutter content in an attempt to get the game to market asap. The Devs seems unconcerned with fixing bugs or listening to the playerbase. Instead they waste time adding lame items to the Cstore in an attempt to bleed as much money from the playerbase as possible before the game becomes financialy unsustainable.
    MMO have 2 years before they either succeed or fail. Cryptic is fully aware of this market trend thats why the lifetime membership fee is roughly 2 years of subscription fees. Ask yourself this question. Would you continue to play STO if it wasnt Star Trek. Probably not. Just like Star Wars , Star Trek has a massive fanbase. Cryptic used peoples love of star trek to market yet another cookie cutter mmo.

    Now for the bright side. Star Trek has a massive fanbase and many of those fans have tech jobs. This means unlike many games STO has alot of computer savvy players. Many of whom although may not say so publicly are working on an emulation of STO. This is the only pay to play game I subscribe to. I play mostly emulations of older games as the are community driven not corporate driven.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    The recent weekly missions show me that someone is putting a lot of effort into generating quality content. The recent Klingon faction enhancements show me that someone is listening to the player base. The new User Generated Content tools will add the dimension of providing a creative outlet for 'authors' and additional mission content for the rest of the customer base.

    This game has had its problems, and was not ready at launch. However, patience is paying off. Someone at Cryptic seems to give a darn, and it's starting to show. I wouldn't jump ship to play imagined superior emulations if I were you. The real thing is improving at a good pace, and is gradually approaching the sum of our dreams. In a year's time, I suspect the game we're playing will be so startlingly improved over the game that rolled out initially that we won't believe our eyes.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    The recent weekly missions show me that someone is putting a lot of effort into generating quality content. The recent Klingon faction enhancements show me that someone is listening to the player base. The new User Generated Content tools will add the dimension of providing a creative outlet for 'authors' and additional mission content for the rest of the customer base.

    This game has had its problems, and was not ready at launch. However, patience is paying off. Someone at Cryptic seems to give a darn, and it's starting to show. I wouldn't jump ship to play imagined superior emulations if I were you. The real thing is improving at a good pace, and is gradually approaching the sum of our dreams. In a year's time, I suspect the game we're playing will be so startlingly improved over the game that rolled out initially that we won't believe our eyes.

    Have you seen the new ships recently? A copy/paste job from the fed side with special powers that aren't so special. It seems they really were working hard on getting the models correct and the ships out before they had a riot going on...but to tell you the truth, I sure won't be flying any of these new ships because there is NO tactical advantage....The BOP is way too squishy, the support ship well, it's just that...the drones don't deploy 1/2 of the time, and the other ship...well, the special power only comes into play when you are in danger of blowing up...makes me feel like going out without shielding just to get the chance to bring more ships into the game....

    They are listening for getting content, but quality is what players on this side are looking for. What does it matter that we have many new toys if they don't function, or have little to no use?.... They are trying, but it needs to be quality work...not the art...that is fine, but the functionality needs work. It's still as though the KDF side is still odd to have around like a rudder on a duck's %$@.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    It seems to me alot Klingons should return to their federation characters. Klingons arent interested in pretty uniforms or new ship styles. Most of these people are Feds with a curious eye for playing a Klingon. They then expect all the percs and easy leveling that comes with playing a fed. When this doesnt happen the cry to change our beloved faction to become more like the federation. The worst mistake the Devs ever made was allowing people to play both federation and Klingon characters.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Alkeda wrote: »
    Klingons arent interested in pretty uniforms or new ship styles.
    Roleplaying Klingons are. Well, perhaps not in "pretty" uniforms or "new" ship styles, but surely in those that should be there.
    Alkeda wrote: »
    The worst mistake the Devs ever made was allowing people to play both federation and Klingon characters.
    I'm sorry, but that's BS. A player should always try out all factions simply to gain a better perspective and not suffer from tunnel vision like so many "pure" Feds that keep crying about the carrier do. Aside from that, playing more than one faction also eases the "grind" through content gaps as it preserves interest in the game as a whole - for just like all those Feds, there are also more than enough Klingons who keep complaining about how Cryptic doesn't like them, even though everybody has already heard it a thousand times and it's just become tedious.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    I was going to start a Klink toon few months ago and a buddy whom is in my NON STO fleet advised me to wait. SOOOooo I leveled 2 fed toons until he advised me to come to klink. I enjoy the Fed side alot...but am coming around to the klink side more and more. It is enjoyable but I did not have a toon at launch, only been klink for like 3 weeks now. IF this is better from what I have been reading then everyone here has my sympathy. My buddy has said that the content and gameplay is much better after returning from his 3-4 month layover of not playing so there is a difference.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Alkeda wrote: »
    It seems to me alot Klingons should return to their federation characters. Klingons arent interested in pretty uniforms or new ship styles. Most of these people are Feds with a curious eye for playing a Klingon. They then expect all the percs and easy leveling that comes with playing a fed. When this doesnt happen the cry to change our beloved faction to become more like the federation. The worst mistake the Devs ever made was allowing people to play both federation and Klingon characters.

    :rolleyes: I've been playing a Klingon since they were released in closed beta, don't tell me what I do or do not want or try to pretend because it might disagree with your ideas that I'm a closet Fed rat.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Varrangian wrote: »
    :rolleyes: I've been playing a Klingon since they were released in closed beta, don't tell me what I do or do not want or try to pretend because it might disagree with your ideas that I'm a closet Fed rat.

    I have to play a fed in order to get my needed STF fix or something like that, but I have fed Klink toon. I hate being called a closet fed...Bah *spit* :mad:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    I'm willing to wait for STF's to be better ( I want that second Borg BO), but over all I feel that these last two months have seen a huge improvement in KDF faction related play and I like it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    There are only a couple of outstanding KDF 'holes' that I care about:

    - Difficulty (or at least tediousness) of leveling around Captain/BG level because of no PvP matches and no missions...but that is just a minor annoyance. The dailies also mitigate the problem. Also, I probably won't care about this when my last alt gets to LG.

    - No K'Tinga Refit with Tac LC slots :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited November 2010
    Alkeda wrote: »
    Klingons arent interested in pretty uniforms or new ship styles.

    I want to play a Klingon in a game. I do not want to actually act like a Klingon. An actual Klingon may not care about uniforms and ship styles, but *I* do.
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