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elite must be elite...

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Hi there, the idea to implement that difficulty slider is really a good way to strike a balance between the casuals and that freaks :)

but... please make elite more difficult. It's too easy, after a short while, there is no more challenge, especially in space.

When a team of 5 ship (full epic equipped, with the experience since the close beta) do that space missions even on elite, lol... I don't talk about bosses, they are more challenging, (for the first tries) until you know the tactic.

One of my friends said and that fits it perfectly... "It's like Hello Kitty..."

The problem is, some of our community (doesn't matter if they play that game or not, lol) have nothing other to do, then flaming, crying, trolling,... They are against all challenging issues.... that starts with a real "elite-mode" and ends with special items (which makes you outstanding, but you have to invest time to get them -> omega items)... I know there exist in each community, but the major goal of cryptic must be to filter that out, but at the moment I have that bad feeling that it is your major focus to satisfy them. Because all really cool ideas on your list will be canceled when they got a certain level of crying.

The players like me, who loses step by step their motivation (or quit already), need some more challenges (Fighting, Crafting, Minigames,...).

You made a real great job with the season 2 and I tested it several hours!! And I see the new missions, new levelcap, minigames,... and a lot more which could raise our motivation...
But when I hear that some friends are Vice Admiral (from lvl 45) after 4 hours,... there is something wrong...

I don't need any feedback from cryptic on that issue, I only want that you keep that in mind for next releases...

To the community, if you have any additions, comments or if you agree that issue, please feel free...
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Elite should not be easy by any means. There should be equal reward. Special Accolades that you only get from running on Elite.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    adapt damage strength, damage resistance (to raise only that both, will be sobering), rewards (% chance to loot green, blue... or max-mk), special accolades, limitations in time, enemies will change their focus (eg. the doctor or will fire all at one target), enemies will flee or hide, borg could repair their interlinks,...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I think the exact opposite though. Making Elite versions, and supplying those who play them bigger rewards in the form of the best and uber equipment, only turns the game into a rat race.

    And it's a rat race that Cryptic can never win, and never keep that group happy without more and more releases of crazier and crazier stats. They then have a permanent part of their development devoted to keeping balance between all the crazy boosts and the content.

    Other larger companies can play that game. Not sure Cryptic should or could.

    --

    You want Elite? How about have unique and cool titles and accolades for it? Maybe make a Super Elite, where you play at Elite level, but only get one life, and when you lose a ship, if you didn't abandon it, you're gone. Where, when you lose a ship, you have to pay to get another one and re-equip it.

    Give the Super Elite tougher consequences for their accolade earnings. They'd probably need to add abandon ship in earlier for these folks, an early version of Self Destruct without the damage boost? Make it to cap without a death and get a unique title that can only be earned by doing so well for so long.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    People expect predictability and it's not easy dishing out new content very often. Hopefully the Weekly Content updates will bring us some challenges.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    "I took my full T10 heroic geared raid that's been running together since 3.3 came out on the PTR to ICC hard modes and we steamrolled it, obviously content is too easy!"

    This argument doesn't hold water.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Fact- the only hope for a mmo is player vs player

    Fact- anything else will always fail to deliver at some point

    Fact- people that do not utilize player vs player will leave sooner then those that do

    Fact- unless they know how to work a game like glorious me

    the evidence is clear
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Elite should have a better than average drop ratio for items, but not items that can only be acquired through elite play.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    what i worry about with creating elite pve content is that the people who do it continually thirst for a new challange and we could get into a situation where an awefull lot off developer time is spent on say the top 10% of the games popuation like ive seen in other games.

    open world territory control involving both pvp and pve content is the way to go imho . not raids =) but its only my opnion and we will have to just wait and see how the developers veiw is in the future
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    My motivation for playing on Elite is the challenge and not for any rewards.
    Although having some Accolades/Titles for Elite players would be nice..
    :)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    attacko wrote:
    Fact- the only hope for a mmo is player vs player

    Fact- anything else will always fail to deliver at some point

    Fact- people that do not utilize player vs player will leave sooner then those that do

    Fact- unless they know how to work a game like glorious me

    the evidence is clear

    LOL, funny. Pretty sure none of those are facts. Besides, if your facts were true, we'd still see a number of MMOs running that aren't (Tabula Rasa, say).

    ---

    But Super Elite... say someone wanted that ultimate title... they play through content or PvP on Super Elite, but die and don't eject? They start over from level 2(skip the intro). That would be a real challenge, and fun to see folks accomplish it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    point is mmos focus on the casual player these days largely because there are far more of those than the serious I want though challenges with great rewards players and in the end it all comes don to money in th till.

    For PVE I am prett much casual love to do space stuff on elite, but due my focus I would get slaughtered ont he ground part after. In WoW the same I raided, but with an half mind and these days that is all that is needed.

    No if you want challnge in an mmo you got two options: PVP or EVE :) though PVP is not to great atm as is to be expected I hope it improves and it surely gives me more joy than PVE.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    My motivation for playing on Elite is the challenge and not for any rewards.
    Although having some Accolades/Titles for Elite players would be nice..
    :)

    you got it... thats also my thinking behind that... rewards could also things which doesn't infect the community like titles, uniforms,... items would be nice, but itemhunting is everytime a double-edged sword.

    today the longterm challenge is missing, totaly... but cryptic make a real good job and Im sure that they will make us happy!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Canmore wrote:
    open world territory control involving both pvp and pve content is the way to go imho . not raids =) but its only my opnion and we will have to just wait and see how the developers veiw is in the future

    I definitely agree with this. This is what I was expecting from STO when Cryptic first announced it was going to be Federation vs. Klingon (not: Feds always get 90% of the map, and Klings get 10% and there's nothing you can do about it.) Sector space and the fact that STO isn't an MMO (it's only as much of an "MMO" as GW, D2 b.net, CoD are) get in the way of implementing a meaningful PvP system though :(.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Heres a way to make things more harder for you, use MKI equipment from start to finish on elite mode, after you done that you may come back and ask for more. :rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    ...and all that with the danube class :/
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Bomook wrote: »
    I definitely agree with this. This is what I was expecting from STO when Cryptic first announced it was going to be Federation vs. Klingon (not: Feds always get 90% of the map, and Klings get 10% and there's nothing you can do about it.) Sector space and the fact that STO isn't an MMO (it's only as much of an "MMO" as GW, D2 b.net, CoD are) get in the way of implementing a meaningful PvP system though :(.

    I also thought this before release, I like EVE's open world philosophy it makes players actions matter. If my actions don't matter once I hit level cap & get fully geared, why play this game over any other game? I played beta for Warhammer Online & loved their seige pvp where the pvpers seiged strongholds in a tug of war game which could lead to seiging an enemy capital & winning a server reset of all the strongholds back to a 50/50 split. This mode of play had a few benefits, extra pve areas, titles, and extra xp. Even if it had no rewards I'd still like it because it represents a changeable world. WoW has some examples of this too, but for the most part it has a sterile unchanging landscape that isn't as endearing as EVE's 0 security space or Warhammer's tug of war sieges. I think Warhammer went wrong with only having 2 factions fighting instead of having a network of all the different races fighting each other. Instead of Dwarves vs Orcs, it could have been orcs vs dwarves vs chaos vs humans vs dark elves vs elves vs orcs vs dwarves vs dark elves vs elves vs chaos. My head hurts.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Xaben wrote: »
    Hi there, the idea to implement that difficulty slider is really a good way to strike a balance between the casuals and that freaks :)

    but... please make elite more difficult. It's too easy, after a short while, there is no more challenge, especially in space.

    When a team of 5 ship (full epic equipped, with the experience since the close beta) do that space missions even on elite, lol... I don't talk about bosses, they are more challenging, (for the first tries) until you know the tactic.

    One of my friends said and that fits it perfectly... "It's like Hello Kitty..."

    The problem is, some of our community (doesn't matter if they play that game or not, lol) have nothing other to do, then flaming, crying, trolling,... They are against all challenging issues.... that starts with a real "elite-mode" and ends with special items (which makes you outstanding, but you have to invest time to get them -> omega items)... I know there exist in each community, but the major goal of cryptic must be to filter that out, but at the moment I have that bad feeling that it is your major focus to satisfy them. Because all really cool ideas on your list will be canceled when they got a certain level of crying.

    The players like me, who loses step by step their motivation (or quit already), need some more challenges (Fighting, Crafting, Minigames,...).

    You made a real great job with the season 2 and I tested it several hours!! And I see the new missions, new levelcap, minigames,... and a lot more which could raise our motivation...
    But when I hear that some friends are Vice Admiral (from lvl 45) after 4 hours,... there is something wrong...

    I don't need any feedback from cryptic on that issue, I only want that you keep that in mind for next releases...

    To the community, if you have any additions, comments or if you agree that issue, please feel free...

    Yeah right now its just a prolonged battle, since the enemies have more HP and shields, but nothing my cruiser can't handle.

    You will be suprised for season 2 Vice admiral encounters though. There a random SCi ship eats resilent shield with 2 FBP reflections lol.
    I'm just happy that I din't encounter hirogen there yet lol.
    Those TRansphasics scaled would be disasterous *lol*

    Well i have to admit: I usually use regneratives, and another ship with a different setup, maybe my shields would have survided longer if I'd taken my assault cruiser into battle
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I'd like a more difficult setting than Elite as well. And for the record, I'm not a beta player who's running with a full five man team of people who have been playing together for six months: I'm a new player who's only been playing for about a month and am already adapting to Elite. Elite was nice for a while, but now I'm ready to kick it up another notch.

    Rewards don't need to be better: the challenge is it's own reward. However, I think a somewhat juicier drop rate for rare items would entice more players into Elite which would provide more teaming opportunities which is nice.

    A difficulty slider would be great. I want to be able to crank it up and make the difficulty truly challenging. But without that, a tougher Elite setting or another setting or two above Elite would be really welcomed.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Personally I'm fine with Elite as it stands now. I'd rather Cryptic focus elsewhere.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    attacko wrote:
    Fact- the only hope for a mmo is player vs player

    Fact- anything else will always fail to deliver at some point

    Fact- people that do not utilize player vs player will leave sooner then those that do

    Fact- unless they know how to work a game like glorious me

    the evidence is clear

    reminds me of:

    Charlie Mackenzie: Hey Mom, I find it interesting that you refer to the Weekly World News as, "The paper." The paper contains facts.
    May Mackenzie: This paper contains facts. And this paper has the eighth highest circulation in the whole wide world. Right? Plenty of facts. "Pregnant man gives birth." That's a fact.

    ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I'm a new player but I agree that elite should be harder, I've been playing mostly on Elite with my Tac (I didn't notice there were difficulty settings until he was L5) and nothing but elite on my sci toon.
    I don't consider myself an elite player, but I do consider myself to be a better then average player.

    As the difficulty level stands I think it's a better way to L2P. Instead of abandoning the mission and lowering the difficulty I just change my tactics or do a different mission or two for gear or badges to strengthen up weak areas on BO's, captain, or ship and try again.

    I started playing this weekend, so I'm still very much a Nub (two toons are L6 and one is L7) and am probably doing just as much wrong as I am right but I'm having fun and that's what matters.

    I can't really say how much harder to make it since I'm not Uber, just better then average but regardless of actual skill level, no matter how difficult devs make it they still have to balance it to be winnable, thus it's all numbers, if you know what skills and gear you need for your ship, captain, and BO's then it becomes routine no matter how difficult it may have seemed at first and that's true of any PvE-Oriented MMO and contrary to a previous poster's belief, there are plenty of successful MMO's that cater to the PvE crowd just as there are plenty of successful MMO's that cater to the PvP crowd.

    With that said, I love PvP, but it isn't necessary for a game to be fun for me, either. Examples: I played on an RP-PvE server on WoW, way back in the day I played UO from launch and stayed on PvP side (Felluca, IIRC) when the split came, and I am still an active player on Age of Conan on the Cimmeria server (RP-PvP) which is FFA-PvP except in home cities/quest hubs....Although I haven't played more then an hour all together since I started STO.
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