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New Vet Reward System

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
I like the fact STO did a vet reward system for sub accounts. But in reality, it is very little incentive to keep paying month after month. I would like the vet system to be distinctive to sub accounts as there are distinctive rewards for lifers:
  1. The reward is based upon the amount of time paid for and not from account creation
  2. The reward be awarded once every 90 days of paid time. E.g., I create account on 7/13/2010, paid for one month - off for two weeks, then paid for the next 60 days with time card. So on 10/25/2010 I would get my first vet reward.
  3. Minor c-store credit reward for every 270 days of paid playing time, free respect for every 360 days, and one free toon slot every 450 days
  4. The vet rewards should have distinctive accolades, items for vets only, and, if there is a bonus power item, that item can be bought in a lifers only section of the C-Store:
  • 90 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece
  • 180 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece
  • 270 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece; silver phaser/bat'leth (matches damage to level; +.02 acc, and +5 damage bonus on Borg and Undine NPC; can be bought in lifer c-store); 10 c-store credits
  • 360 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece; distinctive sub ship emblem; free respect
  • 450 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece; silver beam array (can pick one of phaser, disruptor, so on; matches damage to level; +.02 acc, and +5 damage bonus on Borg and Undine NPC; can be bought in lifer C-Store); extra toon slot
  • 540 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece; can change U.S.S. or I.K.S. to fleet name/abbreviation G.o.D. , -H.O.C.-, 182.; 10 c-store credits
  • 630 day reward: Accolade w/title; distinctive sub vet pip costume piece; golden phaser/bat'leth (matches damage to level, +.02 acc, +2 crit chance, +5 damage bonus to Borg and Undine NPC; can be bought in lifer c-store)

The bonus power reward can rank up silver, gold, platinum, titanium and so on, and an be bought by lifers in the store a.s.a.p as they choose to do so.

I really believe that such a system would help keep people with sub accounts interested with a reason to play/renew, and may appeal to some subs who have left. Each reward is distinctive with accolade, title, and costume piece, longer rewards carry other distinctive rewards, and power rewards can be used by lifers if they wish to purchase them.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    If we have gotten any reward i havent noticed.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I like the fact STO did a vet reward system for sub accounts. But in reality, it is very little incentive to keep paying month after month. I would like the vet system to be distinctive to sub accounts as there are distinctive rewards for lifers:

    No. Like it or not, the Lifers paid as much as the monthly subscribers will over X number of months. They just did it upfront. So anything different given to monthly subs before the point where both monthlys and lifers have paid the same amount is bogus.

    But I do get a kick out of your Big Bang Theory references. Great show isn't it? :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Mikus wrote:
    No. Like it or not, the Lifers paid as much as the monthly subscribers will over X number of months. They just did it upfront. So anything different given to monthly subs before the point where both monthlys and lifers have paid the same amount is bogus.

    But I do get a kick out of your Big Bang Theory references. Great show isn't it? :D
    Yes, great show. Especially how the quote basically shows Sheldon's desire/want overriding his intelligence/common sense.

    Like it or not, after X months the Lifers play free, subs do not. What is the incentive for subs to stay? That is a basic business question Cryptic needs to ask itself if it does not plan on making this game F2P. Lifers have already dumped A amount of money into the game, and what is Cryptic going to do to make sure I dump A amount of money into the game? The current system does not do it. It is basically giveing me what the lifers got, but not all of what they got. Lifers have a distinctive title, why not sub and based upon how long they have support the game? Lifers get LB, subs have to pay for them - where is there incentive in that? Especially in a game that is lacking so much, and no incentive to become a lifer. So, again, what is Cryptic going to do to get A amount of money from me for less rewards Lifers get?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    ...'respect' is never free...it must be earned.

    Getting my account to twenty months should be one of the priorities for Cryptic. It is not bogus to want to keep my money flowing into their coffers. It is bogus to propose an either/or choice for the continuation of my participation. If anything, it makes little sense to deprive me of reward because someone else paid for their twenty months upfront. Cryptic already has their money...they might want to get mine.

    I approve of rewards for lifetime and yearly subs. They should get something for demonstrating faith in the game. I should also get something for continuing to participate. Time it out. Give something small that slowly accumulates to the level of lifer/yearly awards by the time we get to the twenty month point. I don't subscribe to the idea that it's all perks for the lifer/yearly until I somehow match their investment. After all, I get fifteen dollars closer to them every month.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Hmm... and all this time I thought everybody was getting the same veteran rewards.

    So basically this boils down to give me more or I'll leave?


    Buh-bye. ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    If I read this right, you want to reward monthly sub accounts w/ damage bonuses? You do know the Vet rewards are given regardless if you are a sub or LT account holder right? Granted they are not by character creation date or as earth shaking as some other MMO vet rewards but they are pretty nice. Of course we haven't seen the Captain's yacht yet. Vanity ship or not, it could be nice.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    These threads always make me laugh. It's kind of funny how desperate they are to have something to be "better" than those of us who bought lifetime subs.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Mikus wrote:
    Hmm... and all this time I thought everybody was getting the same veteran rewards.

    So basically this boils down to give me more or I'll leave?


    Buh-bye. ;)
    I have no problem leaving. (I am not sure where I suggested I am leaving over this suggestion?) I have not suggested anything that the Lifers have, just in a different mode. Lifers have a special title, suggested the same thing but in different mode. Anything that is a powered item can be avialiable to Lifers in a special section of the store ASAP. (Lifers pay becuase they will play beyond 20 months, technically, for free.)

    The rewards we get are almost everything the lifers get, and, when the existing vet system was setup, some lifers cried foul and wanted their money back.
    Capulet wrote: »
    If I read this right, you want to reward monthly sub accounts w/ damage bonuses? You do know the Vet rewards are given regardless if you are a sub or LT account holder right? Granted they are not by character creation date or as earth shaking as some other MMO vet rewards but they are pretty nice. Of course we haven't seen the Captain's yacht yet. Vanity ship or not, it could be nice.
    No you did not read it right. I suggested a system that rewards a person based upon the amount of time they purchased. They are paying into the system to earn these rewards - similar to Lifers who dumped money in to play for free after 20 months, I think it works to 20 months. Also, anything that is powered is availiable to Lifers in a special section of the C-Store because after 20 months Lifers are playing for free.
    Aris wrote:
    These threads always make me laugh. It's kind of funny how desperate they are to have something to be "better" than those of us who bought lifetime subs.
    Glad I made you laugh. This is in no way suggesting subs are better. Technically, we do hold the attention of management more since they have to find way to get our money over a period of time besides C-Store items. In my case, the C-Store is a waste as I mainly play KDF. Maybe I could show I'm better by having a Blue Title?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    The thing is, we did not pay for only twenty months. We paid for the lifetime of the game. We recieved a discount for buying our subscription time in bulk, same as anyone who paid for a one year subscription, or a six month subscription. Your feelings of inadequacy or whatever it is that drives you to say that veteran rewards should not go to lifetime subscribers are your own problem.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    The thing is, we did not pay for only twenty months. We paid for the lifetime of the game. We recieved a discount for buying our subscription time in bulk, same as anyone who paid for a one year subscription, or a six month subscription.

    Sssh. Don't make their point for them. ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    the Veteran rewards are listed here: http://www.startrekonline.com/veteran_rewards

    ...you want them to change up what they allready announed to all of us?

    i dont think so!

    You can make suggestions what to do after those 400 days, or to add something to it...
    but dont suggest to change what they have promissed allready or it will become yet another failed promotion.

    I only agree that these bonuses are not realy that good...
    access to the lifers table? that thing was more useless then Risa from day 1 !!!
    Captains Yacht? ... might be nice... if it is the one from ST Insurrection!? (or do we get one for every ship?... as a skill maybe?)... oh Vanity Ship right... will be a Runabout Clone.

    level boost to lvl 16?
    *meh*
    if anything i want the leveling to be slower! and by 400 days i have 10 Chars at Vice Admiral anyway ;P
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Aris wrote:
    The thing is, we did not pay for only twenty months. We paid for the lifetime of the game. We recieved a discount for buying our subscription time in bulk, same as anyone who paid for a one year subscription, or a six month subscription. Your feelings of inadequacy or whatever it is that drives you to say that veteran rewards should not go to lifetime subscribers are your own problem.
    Wow, my feelings of inadequacy. Now you made me laugh. I'm sorry, but you seem to be taken this personally. I am suggesting a new way for STO to keep sub accounts and increase the server population, and increase cash flow. I am sorry you fail to see that this is the hope here - to increase sub accounts/server population for the game. I suggest certain item that Lifers already have, and powered items which can be purchased by lifers when they wish - and for the very reason you point out - you paid for the lifetime of the game. Now Cryptic is dumping things like GX into the C-Store to get more money from you. But, I have bought points for one thing I wanted, two extra slots. I mainly play KDF and Cryptic is not getting more money out of me besides my sub - and now, since KDF really seems dead, I may be moving on soon - and that means more to Cryptic right now then your Lifer account. Because that is one less sub, and one less buyer for C-Store items. And when enough subs leave and C-Store is not floating the boat, the game closes or goes F2P - that's great for the lifetime of the game.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    You are right, I do take it a bit personally when someone decides that my money wasn't good enough, and thus I should be asked to pay for something that other players get for free by sheer virtue of the fact that I paid my account in full up front. My account is no less valuable than yours or any other. I am still a paying customer, not some vagabond who snuck in on a technicality.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Aris wrote:
    You are right, I do take it a bit personally when someone decides that my money wasn't good enough, and thus I should be asked to pay for something that other players get for free by sheer virtue of the fact that I paid my account in full up front. My account is no less valuable than yours or any other. I am still a paying customer, not some vagabond who snuck in on a technicality.
    Understood, but not my intent. Let me try it this way. You paid up front for a Lifer. That is fine, and if this game last for four years as a paid MMO, then kudos. But, you paid and you got your rewards, and again, kudos. So, working on the premise that this game does not go F2P within 18 months of launch, after the 20 month, I am paying to support your game play - C-Store is an exception since there is no guarantee it will generate money, nor from everyone who plays. So, what is my incentive to keep paying to and beyond the 20th month? Nothing. What I am suggesting is a vet reward system which gives a title to a sub based upon how long they have supported the game - you did a "lifetime" support and show that with your title. There are bonus power items which I have to unlock but over a period of time, you being a lifer, and since Cryptic needs your money from the C-Store, a reasonable option is to give access to the vet power bouns item asap in the C-Store. Almost every other thing I suggested that would be sub vet reward goes well beyond the 20 month (600 days).

    BTW, when Lifers whine for this that and the other thing, or scream foul that sub should get this that or the other thing, it implies we are vagabonds here to support Lifers.

    But in all reality, for all we now, there are three outcomes which would shaft Lifers: the game goes F2P (especially within 20 months); they cancel the Lifers program becuase there is a healthy sub population to support the game and Lifers become a drain on the system (even if 15% of lifers return as subs, that is an increase in revenue); they shut the game down due to lack of funds.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    discriminating against a small portion of the population is not a way to get more subs and keep existing subs. In fact it is an excellent way to further ruin an already seriously damaged reputation. It seems to me your suggestion is more about trying to further harm Cryptic than to help them.

    Why should a Lifer pay for their vet rewards. That is not a vet reward. That is blatant railroading. Cryptic needs to avoid blatancy.

    Sorry, I can never agree with a blatant act of discrimination and even segregation. Who would group with a lifer if they do less damage than a sub?.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Ayenn wrote:
    discriminating against a small portion of the population is not a way to get more subs and keep existing subs. In fact it is an excellent way to further ruin an already seriously damaged reputation. It seems to me your suggestion is more about trying to further harm Cryptic than to help them.

    Why should a Lifer pay for their vet rewards. That is not a vet reward. That is blatant railroading. Cryptic needs to avoid blatancy.

    Sorry, I can never agree with a blatant act of discrimination and even segregation. Who would group with a lifer if they do less damage than a sub?.
    Your false conclusion and question are answered above. The Lifer program already incites what you claim a good vet reward system would do.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I'm all for normal subscribers getting the same perks as lifers over time, like the Captain's table and access to the liberated Borg captain. However, I see no need to give monthly subscribers better veteran rewards than lifetime subscribers. In fact I think that advocating something like that is rather sad.
    Before I entered the Cryptic forums I thought that Trekkies would be a bit nicer than your average 21st century human being. I was wrong.

    A few examples of what I encountered so far:

    "The Galaxy-class is far more powerful than the Sovereign. Look how big her phaser arrays are. I have the TNG Technical Manual, there is no data on the Sovereign, but the Galaxy ist clearly more powerful."

    "Haha, lifers are idiots, the game will be dead within a week and all their money will be gone."

    "What? Lifers get a special social area where nothing happens and a blue forum title. FOUL! Lifers are evil, they troll the forums and eat little babies."

    "What? Non-Lifers get access to the captain's table as a veteran reward? Lifers unite, keep the scum out of our holy place!"

    "MINE, MINE, MINE, I bought five copies of STO for all the exclusives, nobody else may have them, they are MINE!"

    "The Federation gets ships with cloaks? The Klingon faction will DIE from that! The Federation doesn't deserve cloak!"

    I want my illusion back that Trekkies are nice.:(
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    K-Tar wrote:
    I'm all for normal subscribers getting the same perks as lifers over time, like the Captain's table and access to the liberated Borg captain. However, I see no need to give monthly subscribers better veteran rewards than lifetime subscribers. In fact I think that advocating something like that is rather sad.
    Before I entered the Cryptic forums I thought that Trekkies would be a bit nicer than your average 21st century human being. I was wrong.

    A few examples of what I encountered so far:

    "The Galaxy-class is far more powerful than the Sovereign. Look how big her phaser arrays are. I have the TNG Technical Manual, there is no data on the Sovereign, but the Galaxy ist clearly more powerful."

    "Haha, lifers are idiots, the game will be dead within a week and all their money will be gone."

    "What? Lifers get a special social area where nothing happens and a blue forum title. FOUL! Lifers are evil, they troll the forums and eat little babies."

    "What? Non-Lifers get access to the captain's table as a veteran reward? Lifers unite, keep the scum out of our holy place!"

    "MINE, MINE, MINE, I bought five copies of STO for all the exclusives, nobody else may have them, they are MINE!"

    "The Federation gets ships with cloaks? The Klingon faction will DIE from that! The Federation doesn't deserve cloak!"

    I want my illusion back that Trekkies are nice.:(
    As long as money exist, and we are on a user pay system, no we are not. Besides, pure socialism/borderline communism in all probability would not work. But that is another philosophical thread elsewhere.

    Again, you got your rewards ASAP and basically paid for 20 months up front (LB is not a vet reward and subs need to buy it for one or both sides). And, again, if the game lives as a pay to play game beyond 20 months, then bonus for Lifers. For subs it's, what's my incentive as Lifers basically play free? I played CoH/V for four years, and one of three major reasons is the CoH/V Vet Reward System. Do Lifers not see subs getting PO'ed paying in 20+ months time as a really good incentive for subs to not to play STO anymore?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    K-Tar wrote:
    I'm all for normal subscribers getting the same perks as lifers over time, like the Captain's table and access to the liberated Borg captain. However, I see no need to give monthly subscribers better veteran rewards than lifetime subscribers. In fact I think that advocating something like that is rather sad.
    Before I entered the Cryptic forums I thought that Trekkies would be a bit nicer than your average 21st century human being. I was wrong.

    A few examples of what I encountered so far:

    "The Galaxy-class is far more powerful than the Sovereign. Look how big her phaser arrays are. I have the TNG Technical Manual, there is no data on the Sovereign, but the Galaxy ist clearly more powerful."

    "Haha, lifers are idiots, the game will be dead within a week and all their money will be gone."

    "What? Lifers get a special social area where nothing happens and a blue forum title. FOUL! Lifers are evil, they troll the forums and eat little babies."

    "What? Non-Lifers get access to the captain's table as a veteran reward? Lifers unite, keep the scum out of our holy place!"

    "MINE, MINE, MINE, I bought five copies of STO for all the exclusives, nobody else may have them, they are MINE!"

    "The Federation gets ships with cloaks? The Klingon faction will DIE from that! The Federation doesn't deserve cloak!"

    I want my illusion back that Trekkies are nice.:(

    I’m afraid I agree with you. Every time Cryptic releases something new there’s countless people complaining that it’s “unfair” and threatening to quit playing if they go through with it. Really until Cryptic actually penalizes you for not subscribing for a certain amount of time why complain. As for the lifetime subscriber perks I have a compromise. Make the Liberated Borg, “Career Officer” Title, and “Lifetime Combadge” costume piece, veteran rewards at 20 months.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Again, you got your rewards ASAP and basically paid for 20 months up front (LB is not a vet reward and subs need to buy it for one or both sides). And, again, if the game lives as a pay to play game beyond 20 months, then bonus for Lifers.

    I didn't get my vet rewards early. I got a pre-order bonus and then a present from the Cryptic staff for showing faith in them. Then the present became a veteran reward. I was among the people who wanted to open the Captain's Table to all, and Cryptic found a reasonable way to do it. I'm also for a way that everybody can unlock a liberated Borg captain.
    For subs it's, what's my incentive as Lifers basically play free?

    Hm, because you like the game? Because of the new content they will release? Why is the game less fun if someone plays it for free? Do we somehow affect your gameplay?
    I played CoH/V for four years, and one of three major reasons is the CoH/V Vet Reward System. Do Lifers not see subs getting PO'ed paying in 20+ months time as a really good incentive for subs to not to play STO anymore?

    Where does it say, that CO lifers are excluded from the rewards? And I'm pretty sure that the 400 day mark is not the end for STO. We haven't even reached the 200 day mark. Just wait until you have the 400 days reward. If Cryptic hasn't announced a 500 day reward by then you can still quit.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I don't know about anybody else but I am not playing for free yet. At the price tag for LT sub I essentially prepaid 16 months of subs in return for it I don't get billed any further. It hasn't been 16 months yet so I haven't got my money's worth much less one single month of free play.

    Also I got the title, badge, repec, and XP bonus for my lowbies right around 100 days. We get our vet rewards the same as monthly subs do and we are not playing for free yet.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I’m afraid I agree with you. Every time Cryptic releases something new there’s countless people complaining that it’s “unfair” and threatening to quit playing if they go through with it. Really until Cryptic actually penalizes you for not subscribing for a certain amount of time why complain. As for the lifetime subscriber perks I have a compromise. Make the Liberated Borg, “Career Officer” Title, and “Lifetime Combadge” costume piece, veteran rewards at 20 months.
    People will complain one way or another. But I am not complaining about what Lifers got:
    1. LB for both factions
    2. 5 instead of 3 toon slots
    3. Some very nice QoL items like user specific lounge, captains table and so on
    4. Specific title
    5. Specific Costume piece
    I am trying to inject a bit of business logic. Those are some of the examples Cryptic used to entice people to buy a Lifetime membership. And in 20 or so months, they basically play free. Kudos to them that did buy a life time membership. And they have numerous things to distinguish them, and again, kudos to them. Now what is Cryptic going to do for those that sub and have no interest in the Lifer program, but also have no incentive to pay month after month but only every now and then when, for arguments sake, the RSE become a playable faction? None really. The existing rewards are futile, they are only some of the lifer's rewards, and from a sub's stand point, not very good incentive.

    I do not want what the lifers have - those are their rewards. I would prefer a real reward system for subs based upon the amount of time paid to play. And just as Lifers have some nice rewards others have to pay to use - LB for each side, two extra slots to equal the five Lifers have - there are some sub rewards a Lifer would pay to use - but before a sub can use them, and to help generate C-Store capital. It is a good business model, and from Cryptic's stand point, a good business decision.

    For those that played CoH/V, look at it this way - how many times did you see a vet with a good reward and you said, I can't wait till I get that vet reward. In this case, a Lifer buys a silver bat'leth, and the sub would say, I can't wait till I get that reward - no differently then we would have to buy an LB now.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    If this game lasts for the next fifty years, at no point will any of us be "playing for free". We still paid our subscription fee, same as anyone else playing the game. We simply did it up front. Your argument is inherently flawed because of that assumption.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    K-Tar wrote:
    I didn't get my vet rewards early. I got a pre-order bonus and then a present from the Cryptic staff for showing faith in them. Then the present became a veteran reward. I was among the people who wanted to open the Captain's Table to all, and Cryptic found a reasonable way to do it. I'm also for a way that everybody can unlock a liberated Borg captain.
    This is not about what Lifers did get and what subs did not get.
    K-Tar wrote:
    Hm, because you like the game? Because of the new content they will release? Why is the game less fun if someone plays it for free? Do we somehow affect your gameplay?
    I like a lot of things, including the rewards my bank gives me to use my money for loans. It may create some resentment for sub, so yes. As I am sure if I searched hard enough I would find a Lifers only fleet just like RP fleets. It can create a sort of elitism - and in some cases has. You are among some it has not. But not my point.
    K-Tar wrote:
    Where does it say, that CO lifers are excluded from the rewards? And I'm pretty sure that the 400 day mark is not the end for STO. We haven't even reached the 200 day mark. Just wait until you have the 400 days reward. If Cryptic hasn't announced a 500 day reward by then you can still quit.
    I don't understand the CO comment. That is a link to the City of Heroes/Villain vet reward which created much support and loyality to the game - again - one of three reason I stayed with CoH/V for years.

    I am not talking about creating a better reward system for subs. I am talking about a system that is similar to Lifers, and a reward system based upon the amount of time one has paid to play.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Aris wrote:
    If this game lasts for the next fifty years, at no point will any of us be "playing for free". We still paid our subscription fee, same as anyone else playing the game. We simply did it up front. Your argument is inherently flawed because of that assumption.
    Sorry it is not flawed. You are arguing from the logical point of man is a bi-ped, a chicken is a bi-ped, therefore a chicken is a man. (can't wait for those jokes and retorts :) ) Logically, and mainly from a business point of view, if a lifer after 20 months does not average $15/month in C-Store sales, a lifer will become a drain on the companies capital. Logical, fair, and totally a practical assumption.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    They made the deal. They offered the price. Obviously, they felt the exchange was fair. So did we. Why is it that now you feel the need to insist on a change?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Sorry it is not flawed. You are arguing from the logical point of man is a bi-ped, a chicken is a bi-ped, therefore a chicken is a man. (can't wait for those jokes and retorts :) ) Logically, and mainly from a business point of view, if a lifer after 20 months does not average $15/month in C-Store sales, a lifer will become a drain on the companies capital. Logical, fair, and totally a practical assumption.

    Lifers are a drain on a companies capital? I am so glad you are not running any kind of business. Monthly subs hand over month to month and may leave at any point without notice. Lifers handed over 16 months of sub fees before the product was even finished and are less likely to leave because of vested interest. The capital lift month one gave the company more funds to continue development than the $15 x sub #'s would have been possible especially considering per month subs were not even billed until month 2! And what do you think Lifers do month to month without a sub fee greeting their every credit card statement? They buy C-store items.

    You are suggesting Cryptic dump all over their lifers because they already have our money so are now a "drain"? Wow, great business practice.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Aris wrote:
    They made the deal. They offered the price. Obviously, they felt the exchange was fair. So did we. Why is it that now you feel the need to insist on a change?
    To the lifer program? None. If anyhting I feel they should revert some of the vet rewards to be only lifer rewards like the LB. Again, I'm not asking for a better system than the Lifers. I'm just asking for a better system for the subs. You have your career title and costume piece to go with it. Most of the rewards I listed in my example are similar, but it just changes to show how long a sub has paid to play - as you have shown your's for life. You have a liberated borg, for both sides I believe, which a sub has to buy for each side. That's fine and that's fair for Lifers. I am talking about a system that also rewards a sub (and most powered rewards are well beyond 600 days (about 20 months)). Lifer's would have a section in the C-Store where you can buy it if you want and when you want. (So for arguments sake, you can buy a golden bat'leth for 280 CP, and if this reward is around the 24 to 27 month mark, I have paid more then you to receive the reward. This game does need to generate C-Store revenue, and this would be another way of doing it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Capulet wrote: »
    Lifers are a drain on a companies capital? I am so glad you are not running any kind of business. Monthly subs hand over month to month and may leave at any point without notice. Lifers handed over 16 months of sub fees before the product was even finished and are less likely to leave because of vested interest. The capital lift month one gave the company more funds to continue development than the $15 x sub #'s would have been possible especially considering per month subs were not even billed until month 2! And what do you think Lifers do month to month without a sub fee greeting their every credit card statement? They buy C-store items.

    You are suggesting Cryptic dump all over their lifers because they already have our money so are now a "drain"? Wow, great business practice.
    Wooh, talk about taking facts out of context. Made it clear, after X amounts of months, yes, Lifers are a drain on capital. Do you really think Cryptic does not know that, or factored that into their long term forecast for the game profits/loss column? At what point am I calling for Cryptic to dump Lifers? None. At what point am I calling for Lifers to be made or forced to pay more? None. Am I calling for as better reward system for Sub? Yes. At the expense of Lifers? No. In fact, depending on what price a powered item sells to a Lifer for, technically, I may pay a little more becuase of the amount of time I have to play and pay to play to unlock it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    We have still paid to play. Two years from now, we will still have paid to play. There is no magic switch where the game is suddenly "free". We are paying customers.
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