I rolled a Klingon Captain, figured I learn some PvP.
I just hit Cdr.
For the T2/LtC rank, I saw a lot of All Cruiser or near-All Cruiser teams.
Typically, they would run Extend Shields and Rotate Shield Frequencies (and I would imagine high shields) to keep their shield resistance at or near 100%; while focus firing our BoPs.
One particular team had it down pat. We'd change targets, out pops RSF and an ES from another ship.
Another group wasn't as organized and we managed to split em up. They still won but it was like 15-8 instead of 15-2.
Not complaining... it was/still is a solid and winning strategy.
Is this a trend, or something inherent to Tier 2 because meta options are limited.
I'm Cdr now so who knows.
Just thought I'd bring this up. Give props to whoever thought this up. Seek advice on dealing with it.
It's more powerful at T2 because your counter options are limited and largely unavailable at that tier.
However, what you described is a good deal more coordinated (and effective) than what most T5 teams do. That said, the cruiserball is becoming more popular at higher tiers too.
cruiserballs are all I've seen since three days before 1.2 released. I've actually specced... INTO.... a BoP for the science abilities that so wonderfully rip a cruiserball apart in seconds.
Odd thing though... I seem to be the only klingon science officer in existence, and my fleetmates stopped even trying to keep me alive.
I guess I'll wait until everyone else catches up with my massive epeen of the future. That'll be... oh... six more hours I think.
I have been playing cruiser since Closed Beta.. will play it until they shut the game down.
Through the 1.1 broken combat, through the 1.2 reballance.
I have seen some escorts that press me hard and can kill me if I make a single mistake. I know that it can be done.. I have seen it. I have had science ships knock the TRIBBLE out of me with Tykens rift and combos of powers. HARD FIGHTS.
I think people just need to adjust.. because I have seen good players in all ship types.
Sure, some people think Cruiser is FOTM now.. but I still see a lot of cruiser pilots out there who die faster than escorts.
No accounting for knowledge and skill....on both ends.. attacker and defender.
cruiserballs are all I've seen since three days before 1.2 released. I've actually specced... INTO.... a BoP for the science abilities that so wonderfully rip a cruiserball apart in seconds.
Odd thing though... I seem to be the only klingon science officer in existence, and my fleetmates stopped even trying to keep me alive.
I guess I'll wait until everyone else catches up with my massive epeen of the future. That'll be... oh... six more hours I think.
On klingon side, it's about 70% Tactical, 15% Engineer, 15% Science. Give or take a few percentages. :-P
i would soo love to get an all sci/sci team together to kick some all cruiser team's TRIBBLE and show everybody who's the real king of the battlefield.
on the other side i think the best pvp setup would probably be a group of 2 escorts 2 science ships and a cruiser.
i would soo love to get an all sci/sci team together to kick some all cruiser team's TRIBBLE and show everybody who's the real king of the battlefield.
on the other side i think the best pvp setup would probably be a group of 2 escorts 2 science ships and a cruiser.
I dunno, I kind of like 2 cruiser, 2 sci, 1 escort team or 2/1/2, maybe with a sci in an escort.
But yeah, I'm seeing more cruisers in the lower tiers now that I'm running a Commander Kling engineer alt. Although I was surprised to pop into a match where it was 5 feds vs 3 klingons, all of us in K'Tingas. We won, but I wasn't expecting to see that many klingon cruisers in a match.
At higher tiers, I still see the usual mix of 2-3 cruisers on a fed team, and 1-2 of those are usually assault cruisers
cruiserballs are all I've seen since three days before 1.2 released. I've actually specced... INTO.... a BoP for the science abilities that so wonderfully rip a cruiserball apart in seconds.
Odd thing though... I seem to be the only klingon science officer in existence, and my fleetmates stopped even trying to keep me alive.
I guess I'll wait until everyone else catches up with my massive epeen of the future. That'll be... oh... six more hours I think.
So what abilities (at Tier 2) do you use? What do you use at higher levels?
@Jaruslothran
I fly an assault cruiser fedside (I prefer the extra science slot but I find the star cruiser unattractive) so I know exactly whats used. I'm hard pressed to think of what I'd use to fight me (besides bringing more friends).
Klingon side I'm flying BattleCruiser.... just left my K'tanco for the K't'inga.
TSS wont do it because max shields is max shields and EP2S scrubs that debuff.
Tier 3 I see some options opening up but those same options open up for this tactic. When ES and RSF is on CD there will be RSP then EP2S.
The question still remains... whats tactics at various tiers would you use to combat All Cruiser Teams?
In a small capture and hold, the tactic didn't work so good. It was still useful. In the Arena and large maps, its a solid tactic.
Science Captains have Sub Nuc beam... but it has a longer CD than RSF and can be removed with Science Team. But unless you're running an all science team it wont help with successive applications of ES
I rolled a Klingon Captain, figured I learn some PvP.
I just hit Cdr.
For the T2/LtC rank, I saw a lot of All Cruiser or near-All Cruiser teams.
Typically, they would run Extend Shields and Rotate Shield Frequencies (and I would imagine high shields) to keep their shield resistance at or near 100%; while focus firing our BoPs.
One particular team had it down pat. We'd change targets, out pops RSF and an ES from another ship.
Another group wasn't as organized and we managed to split em up. They still won but it was like 15-8 instead of 15-2.
Not complaining... it was/still is a solid and winning strategy.
Is this a trend, or something inherent to Tier 2 because meta options are limited.
I'm Cdr now so who knows.
Just thought I'd bring this up. Give props to whoever thought this up. Seek advice on dealing with it.
I am leveling myself a new sci klink, I think I played the same group last night. Great battles and I had tones of fun.
I took quite a few cruisers with me last night here is my current config,
First I don't run a tac officer and I never intend to run with on on this alt. So here is the current config
Emergency to Shields 1
Emergency to Shields 1
Transfer Shield S 1 - Tachyon Beam II
Sci Team 1 - Haz II - Charged Particle Burst II
For this to work against a ball of crussiers spamming ES and green glow... heres the plan.
Equip an aux bat... Decloak at 6-7k out after using the bat.
Run EPTS 1 to get the shield resist buff.
Hit them with tachyon and a round of cannons... if they puff green stop cannons but leave the tacyon on... close to the 5k mark for the CPB (Still have crazy aux running)
(The tachyon with the aux bat is going to rip 1.5-2.5 shields the CPB will do the around same to each facing)
Now as your power starts to drop hit Transfer Shield S and Haz... to get the high aux power... cause most likely you are going to pop that cruiser and have to deal with his friend. You should have your second EPTS almost ready to help you out as well.
This works much better then trying to load up HY or CRF... as a Sci I have a subnuk if need it also... and Sensor Scan is awsome with an aux bat.
This should work just as well with either other capt type too.
Those where some great matches last night for sure.
cruisers are the most forgiving class for new players; they always have been.
They have the highest intrensic survivability against spikes.
They can do moderate to decent damage on autofire.
They get ignored for the higher damage targets. I.E.: escorts.
They can pack the most defensive buffs because of the large amount of engineering BoFF skills.
So there you go, easy to survive, easy to dps, easy to be ignored. The difference between a good cruiser and a bad healer is like night and day.
I would like to add:
They are iconic. The Enterprises were all Cruisers. You can't get more iconic then that.
Science and Escort had only one show each and no movies.
There are only 2 Tier 5 ships on the Federation side that are canon - Sovereign and Prometheus. Only the Sovereign was a movie ship.
I really enjoy my Engineer in a Cruiser. I hope that my Klingon Engineer will bring the same joy (so far it does fine.)
Typically, they would run Extend Shields and Rotate Shield Frequencies (and I would imagine high shields) to keep their shield resistance at or near 100%; while focus firing our BoPs.
I think I may have figured out what's going on here. Shield resists are supposed to softcap at 72.5% but they don't. I just got out of a match where I used evasive maneuvers + ramming speed + alpha + omega and did only 22K damage to a cruiser, didn't even actually get his shields down. That means the BLEEDTHROUGH from that ram was 22K. Assuming he's using a covariant rather than a resilient, that means I rammed him for god only knows what ridiculously high number of damage, and his shield resists were SO HIGH that only the bleedthrough mattered. (I did 24K to myself with that one.)
That was a second attempt at ramming him, which I decided to try because the first attempt resulted in 0 damage and only brought his shields down to 55% (I did 72K to myself on that one. POP!)
Clearly, shield resists are broke to hell and back.
When that bug gets fixed, we can all go back to ignoring complaints about escort damage.
I think I may have figured out what's going on here. Shield resists are supposed to softcap at 72.5% but they don't.
The last thing I heard on the matter is:
- Hull Resistance have a soft cap. There is a specific formula for determining them which makes 75 % or something the effective upper limit.
- Such a limitation does not apply for shield resistances. And it never did.
The only thing I can come up with why it might be that way: They don't worry about invulnerable shields, because it doesn't mean an invulnerable ship. If your hull can't take any damage, you can't be killed. But with invulnerable shields, you can still die by bleedthrough.
I have never tested it thoroughly, but if resistances on shields are additive does that mean that using RSF + EP-S + having shields at 125 settings makes your shields invulnerable ?
I have never tested it thoroughly, but if resistances on shields are additive does that mean that using RSF + EP-S + having shields at 125 settings makes your shields invulnerable ?
one high aux sensor scan and those resistances should be in the negatives^^
Tractor beam repulsors should easily push a cruiser out of another cruiser's extend shields, and possibly beyond the range of other heals if you can push far enough. And with cruiser maneuverability, they are going to be out of range for a fair while.
I have never tested it thoroughly, but if resistances on shields are additive does that mean that using RSF + EP-S + having shields at 125 settings makes your shields invulnerable ?
I can't say I have tested it thoroughly with checking and analyzing my combats luck, but looking at how my shields sometimes keep regenerating despite being under fire by an Escort... Yes, I think it works like that.
I thought those are only affecting hull resistances.
oh right could be don´t really know... they go pop anyway^^ but yeah the tooltip of sensor scan just says something like -xx% all damage resistance, so i guees it just means hull, but i´m not sure about that. but anyway cpb makes the shield go pop, psw prevents es.
I have never tested it thoroughly, but if resistances on shields are additive does that mean that using RSF + EP-S + having shields at 125 settings makes your shields invulnerable ?
You would be correct. The only catch is that your going to have to actually get the number to 100 or above for them to become completely invulnerable. Bleedthrough will still damage you, but I doubt many people will try and hit you at that point.
You would be correct. The only catch is that your going to have to actually get the number to 100 or above for them to become completely invulnerable. Bleedthrough will still damage you, but I doubt many people will try and hit you at that point.
Thats easy. Plenty of options. Eng in Sci vessel is probably the best candidate. That reminds me i have eng in science vesel with TSS 3 time to test some stuff
Thats easy. Plenty of options. Eng in Sci vessel is probably the best candidate. That reminds me i have eng in science vesel with TSS 3 time to test some stuff
Try rocking EPtS2, RSF, and 125 shield power. 30 seconds of win right there (bring a copy of RSP for 45 seconds of annoying bs).
If only that were true. It's both tragic and hilarious just how predictably people will stick to an invincible target.
Do you know how much I have to yell at my team for doing that?
them: "attack this guy hes almost dead!"
me: "he's got a wall of blue, invulnerable shields, and is gaining 4% hull per second change off of him."
them: "hes almost dead dude."
20 seconds later
me: "did you actually kill him?"
them: "no"
Do you know how much I have to yell at my team for doing that?
them: "attack this guy hes almost dead!"
me: "he's got a wall of blue, invulnerable shields, and is gaining 4% hull per second change off of him."
them: "hes almost dead dude."
20 seconds later
me: "did you actually kill him?"
them: "no"
Do you know how much I have to yell at my team for doing that?
them: "attack this guy hes almost dead!"
me: "he's got a wall of blue, invulnerable shields, and is gaining 4% hull per second change off of him."
them: "hes almost dead dude."
20 seconds later
me: "did you actually kill him?"
them: "no"
Do you know how much I have to yell at my team for doing that?
them: "attack this guy hes almost dead!"
me: "he's got a wall of blue, invulnerable shields, and is gaining 4% hull per second change off of him."
them: "hes almost dead dude."
20 seconds later
me: "did you actually kill him?"
them: "no"
I've been guilty of being the other guy... Tunnel vision when trying to kill people.. :rolleyes:
Comments
However, what you described is a good deal more coordinated (and effective) than what most T5 teams do. That said, the cruiserball is becoming more popular at higher tiers too.
Odd thing though... I seem to be the only klingon science officer in existence, and my fleetmates stopped even trying to keep me alive.
I guess I'll wait until everyone else catches up with my massive epeen of the future. That'll be... oh... six more hours I think.
Through the 1.1 broken combat, through the 1.2 reballance.
I have seen some escorts that press me hard and can kill me if I make a single mistake. I know that it can be done.. I have seen it. I have had science ships knock the TRIBBLE out of me with Tykens rift and combos of powers. HARD FIGHTS.
I think people just need to adjust.. because I have seen good players in all ship types.
Sure, some people think Cruiser is FOTM now.. but I still see a lot of cruiser pilots out there who die faster than escorts.
No accounting for knowledge and skill....on both ends.. attacker and defender.
On klingon side, it's about 70% Tactical, 15% Engineer, 15% Science. Give or take a few percentages. :-P
on the other side i think the best pvp setup would probably be a group of 2 escorts 2 science ships and a cruiser.
I dunno, I kind of like 2 cruiser, 2 sci, 1 escort team or 2/1/2, maybe with a sci in an escort.
But yeah, I'm seeing more cruisers in the lower tiers now that I'm running a Commander Kling engineer alt. Although I was surprised to pop into a match where it was 5 feds vs 3 klingons, all of us in K'Tingas. We won, but I wasn't expecting to see that many klingon cruisers in a match.
At higher tiers, I still see the usual mix of 2-3 cruisers on a fed team, and 1-2 of those are usually assault cruisers
@Jaruslothran
I fly an assault cruiser fedside (I prefer the extra science slot but I find the star cruiser unattractive) so I know exactly whats used. I'm hard pressed to think of what I'd use to fight me (besides bringing more friends).
Klingon side I'm flying BattleCruiser.... just left my K'tanco for the K't'inga.
TSS wont do it because max shields is max shields and EP2S scrubs that debuff.
Tier 3 I see some options opening up but those same options open up for this tactic. When ES and RSF is on CD there will be RSP then EP2S.
The question still remains... whats tactics at various tiers would you use to combat All Cruiser Teams?
In a small capture and hold, the tactic didn't work so good. It was still useful. In the Arena and large maps, its a solid tactic.
Science Captains have Sub Nuc beam... but it has a longer CD than RSF and can be removed with Science Team. But unless you're running an all science team it wont help with successive applications of ES
cpb3 , psw1 , snb , gw and sensor scan, apbeta-stacking... but the first 3 of the list are key and the cruisers pop. and what can the cruisers do?
So there you go, easy to survive, easy to dps, easy to be ignored. The difference between a good cruiser and a bad healer is like night and day.
I am leveling myself a new sci klink, I think I played the same group last night. Great battles and I had tones of fun.
I took quite a few cruisers with me last night here is my current config,
First I don't run a tac officer and I never intend to run with on on this alt. So here is the current config
Emergency to Shields 1
Emergency to Shields 1
Transfer Shield S 1 - Tachyon Beam II
Sci Team 1 - Haz II - Charged Particle Burst II
For this to work against a ball of crussiers spamming ES and green glow... heres the plan.
Equip an aux bat... Decloak at 6-7k out after using the bat.
Run EPTS 1 to get the shield resist buff.
Hit them with tachyon and a round of cannons... if they puff green stop cannons but leave the tacyon on... close to the 5k mark for the CPB (Still have crazy aux running)
(The tachyon with the aux bat is going to rip 1.5-2.5 shields the CPB will do the around same to each facing)
Now as your power starts to drop hit Transfer Shield S and Haz... to get the high aux power... cause most likely you are going to pop that cruiser and have to deal with his friend. You should have your second EPTS almost ready to help you out as well.
This works much better then trying to load up HY or CRF... as a Sci I have a subnuk if need it also... and Sensor Scan is awsome with an aux bat.
This should work just as well with either other capt type too.
Those where some great matches last night for sure.
They are iconic. The Enterprises were all Cruisers. You can't get more iconic then that.
Science and Escort had only one show each and no movies.
There are only 2 Tier 5 ships on the Federation side that are canon - Sovereign and Prometheus. Only the Sovereign was a movie ship.
I really enjoy my Engineer in a Cruiser. I hope that my Klingon Engineer will bring the same joy (so far it does fine.)
I think I may have figured out what's going on here. Shield resists are supposed to softcap at 72.5% but they don't. I just got out of a match where I used evasive maneuvers + ramming speed + alpha + omega and did only 22K damage to a cruiser, didn't even actually get his shields down. That means the BLEEDTHROUGH from that ram was 22K. Assuming he's using a covariant rather than a resilient, that means I rammed him for god only knows what ridiculously high number of damage, and his shield resists were SO HIGH that only the bleedthrough mattered. (I did 24K to myself with that one.)
That was a second attempt at ramming him, which I decided to try because the first attempt resulted in 0 damage and only brought his shields down to 55% (I did 72K to myself on that one. POP!)
Clearly, shield resists are broke to hell and back.
When that bug gets fixed, we can all go back to ignoring complaints about escort damage.
- Hull Resistance have a soft cap. There is a specific formula for determining them which makes 75 % or something the effective upper limit.
- Such a limitation does not apply for shield resistances. And it never did.
The only thing I can come up with why it might be that way: They don't worry about invulnerable shields, because it doesn't mean an invulnerable ship. If your hull can't take any damage, you can't be killed. But with invulnerable shields, you can still die by bleedthrough.
one high aux sensor scan and those resistances should be in the negatives^^
I thought those are only affecting hull resistances.
oh right could be don´t really know... they go pop anyway^^ but yeah the tooltip of sensor scan just says something like -xx% all damage resistance, so i guees it just means hull, but i´m not sure about that. but anyway cpb makes the shield go pop, psw prevents es.
You would be correct. The only catch is that your going to have to actually get the number to 100 or above for them to become completely invulnerable. Bleedthrough will still damage you, but I doubt many people will try and hit you at that point.
Thats easy. Plenty of options. Eng in Sci vessel is probably the best candidate. That reminds me i have eng in science vesel with TSS 3
Try rocking EPtS2, RSF, and 125 shield power. 30 seconds of win right there (bring a copy of RSP for 45 seconds of annoying bs).
If only that were true. It's both tragic and hilarious just how predictably people will stick to an invincible target.
Do you know how much I have to yell at my team for doing that?
them: "attack this guy hes almost dead!"
me: "he's got a wall of blue, invulnerable shields, and is gaining 4% hull per second change off of him."
them: "hes almost dead dude."
20 seconds later
me: "did you actually kill him?"
them: "no"
<- points
/facepalm
yep..............
I've been guilty of being the other guy... Tunnel vision when trying to kill people.. :rolleyes:
Yeah, we call that "Santa-lock" or "Blackjack-lock" in our fleet.
"Stop chasing Santa"
"But ... it's Santa!"
There are a couple feds I chase sometimes, but they aren't Santa or Blackjack.. but I understand the meaning