Quoted from another thread. I think these observations deserve more attention and discussion. Do you or do you not agree with these observations?
- The best Klingon players are 90% dps, the best Federation players enjoy a better split. In any given match a federation team is likely to be slightly more balanced than a Klingon team, in that if the Federation team actually survives the alpha strike it is in a much better position than the klingon team. This is largely due to the fact that there really aren't any exceptional healers on the KDF.
- Federation teams need to plan on surviving the alpha strike. Because Klingons are used to wiping the opposing team in the first 5 seconds of the match they often do not pay much attention to surviving past 10 seconds. The result is either a "kill or be killed... very quickly" scenario for the KDF, once that kill very quickly option fails **** tends to hit the fans.
- Federation teams are significantly more likely to have a healer. At least, the good teams. Going back to point one, a pair of (good) healers can easily break even the strongest of alpha strikes. Once that alpha strike gets broken, the healers continue to buy their team enough time to score kills - which against an unhealed target is fairly easy.
- KDF rarely assembles premade teams. Because most federation players can be beaten using only cannons @25 weapons power and a litteral facerolling on the keyboard, Most klingons do not bother to team together.
- Most KDF fleets suck. With little actual though besides "lets get together and just play", there is generally a very lopsided balance on these premade fleets. In your average klink premade, your likely to see 3-4 raptors/birds of prey. Thats a recipe for disaster considering that only the most skilled teams can completely wipe out a competant team in a few seconds. GoD does that with blackjack and Santa Claws alone, but I haven't seen any other fleet able to do it.
- There has only been one really successful KDF pvp fleet. And that would be GoD. They largely win on the ability of their offense to instagib most opposition, but they will always bring at least one healer to keep their team alive if a few people survive into the 20 second mark. The quality of player on that fleet started out as REALLY high, recently though they got a few bad apples ( along the lines of "lol ventrilo is for wimps") with a mentality not geared towards teamplay, but of gankers. Santa told me they would be purging them soon.
- There is content on the Federation side. While also responsible for the large amount of new to pvp crowd, this little feature also attracts a larger crowd than only pvp will do. Sorry, I know twisting the knife hurts but I had to mention it.
On the points, in order:
1) I've not played any PvP map where I didn't lead the Klingon side in healing since the release of patch, which makes the first point valid. I might, in fact, be the only dedicated Klingon healer who plays consistently - as most Klingon cruiser Captains still put a lot of emphasis on damage BO skills.
2) The second point is very true - a BoP or Raptor is not survivable over time, and usually falls quickly if they fail to score a quick kill. No single healer can keep these ships alive vs focused fire by Feds.
3) See point #1. Klingon healing is almost an oxymoron.
4) True that, but it is also a quantity vs quality issue. Relative to population size the Klingons may actually have as many good players, percentage wise, as Feds. Klingons certainly have their fair share of medicore.
5 & 6) Recognizing that Faithborn basically gave GoD a backhanded ***** slap while complimenting Santa and Blackjack, the bottom line opinion is that Klingons are not competitive after the first 20 seconds because their ships lack survivability. I completely agree, and indeed that when you have to cite two of the very best damage dealers in the game as the exception to this rule... hello?
I believed this was true on Tribble during testing, and it is interesting that someone as skilled as Faithborn sees the truth in this. The bonus to healing and survivability was a huge nerf to Klingons because it plays to every advantage the Feds have - from the BO types to the ship characteristics. It is noteworthy that even the defense bonus from speed was reduced - which supports Fed ball tactics vs the run and gun Klingon style.
7) Interesting point, but we won't know until Season 2 if it even matters. May not apply to the rest of the argument.
I have concerns regarding Faithborns observations. If indeed the only Klingon premade to have success against Fed premades is having that success determined primarily by the results of the first half minute of a match, what does that tell us about the balance in PvP right now? It suggests to me what I thought when this patch was released - that the patch basically tilted balance heavily in favor of the Federation to compensate for the vast quantity of unskilled Federation PvP players.
Comments
Seriously? Picture: http://i46.tinypic.com/2mwto9h.png
Very even damage and some above-average healing on the Klingon side. And these are two pug groups.
2. This is true
3. This is not always the case unless you define healer as "any profession that is not DPS that is also flying a cruiser". I PUG a lot and I've seen my share of escort laden groups, but then I was a healer so I guess #3 is also true.
4. You're entirely forgetting about ground PvP. This is also due to the fact that we have overqueues for fed side RA PvP so we get what is given to us. If the premades aren't online, they're usually not pugging that I've seen.
5. I can neither confirm nor deny this without more exposure to more PvP.
6. Again, you're neglecting fantastic ground PvP fleets like CHC.
7. Troo story.
What really bums me though, is that so many klinks focus their heart and soul on that alpha strike. Once it fails (and against good healers, it usually will) they "Abandon hope all ye who enter here" for the match - The game isn't worth playing to alot of klinks if they can't win that burst damage. It is really rare to get a good healer on the klink side, and just about impossible to get a great healer - if a fleet can find one, you can bet that they would do anything to keep that person. Santa pesters me every day about it.
We had a klink leave last night from cracked when the game wasn't going his way.
Without derailing the thread by making it all about one fleet, GoD's roster is deeper than that. It has one extremely solid healer (Bombergirl@Zorena) on active duty, and others on standby.
At this point in the game's evolution, however, the alpha strike is the optimal Klingon strategy, and it would be illogical to build around anything else. Thus, you don't see the healers.
That said, the fleet definitely has its share of one-dimensional players who will be severely hurt by any set of changes that take the emphasis off the alpha strike.
I know that, What I'm saying is that its hard for fleets to get started on the klink side because every premade needs at least one healer to keep the team going past the 20 second mark. And even if GoD's roster is deeper than that (I know it is, read that post again
And GoD, even without Santa and Blackjack poses a very potent and powerful challenge. I can honestly say, there is no fleet that would stand against the original GoD (even 182 with the same players) - they are that good at carrying the advantage of the alpha strike and maintaining the staying power.
Personally I think for both sides as well as same faction pvp the quality is and will be at a standstill with a few exceptions, no need to list.
Reason for this comes down to a few things. Such as one style in current favor over another. More often then not it seems people will spec for that and come new patch respec again. I agree you need to go with what works, but limiting it by being reliant on a narrow and usually well known is not the answer either.
That includes group make up or even grouping issues as well. Only pushing as hard as it takes to win in avg battles.
Trying to win only over what you face now and past, having little thoughts for next..you have lost already. You do well at those fights I'm sure, then fail facing higher quality imo.
You can really only get as skilled around as good as the best you face. And every player or group is beatable even the elite sto. But the elite are the ones that make that a fairly rare thing and will most often not be beaten same way twice.
So if the groups now keep putting pressure and improving hopefully who you fight will step up the effort and make things a real fight. Maybe just wishful thinking but I'll hang on to hope.
True balance imo would mean finally having more then 1 or very few right ways to succeed. But since I do not think true balance is the the near future for any mmo it makes things harder to fix as a community i think.
The circle of pvp as it is. Some decide to cite a game mechanic or imbalance (some issues are ligit but not the end all reasons) as to the quality of play. Dev's then swing the might nerf hammer which usually fixes something and breaks another. So the cycle starts with new excuses as such.
*disclaimer some issues are big ones and limit play styles but seems there are always some players who show you can work around many things.
Long winded rap up here.
Sadly not everyone who enters into pvp is really a pvper. Facing weaker teams pugs or what not often leads to a drop in even good groups.
So as i see it we are all rather linked and end this with a request.
1:Those of use with limited pvp skills and experiences keep pushing to improve. If you must lose make the other team work as hard as you can.
2: You good and beyond players/groups please keep the bar set high. If you go into a round play to win, don't "take it easy" on less skilled teams. It is nice to soften the ego. But I think it often gives people a false perception of their skills hurting them more in growth.
#3 mid skilled players i leave out since largest % of pvpers likely end up around there. Most can learn or be taught to this point given time and efforts. But moving past in skills is pretty much on each person themselves so I can't say when those this group.
(I do not place myself in any group either low mid or highly skilled so speaking in general not up or down to any person)
I PUG. I'm not in a fleet that is organized for PVP. So I have to PUG. My Klingon isn't even in a fleet.
And I have to say, by and large, I've found ground PVP to be more satisfying overall.
Yeah, it's got its fair share of problems. And yeah, 5 on 1 suuuuuuuuuuuucks big time.
But overall I find it easier to get PUG teams working together in ground PVP and that in turn making the encounter more fun and balanced.
I don't know. This is all anecdotal. And might just be an abberation.
Perhaps, but it gives me the license to admit I mostly pug, too.
2. Yes Klinks are mostly DPS, concidering two of our ships styles, the raptor and the BoP are pretty much different variations on fed escorts. Then add in point #1 that Klingons have sub-par healing by design, and Klingons are forced to live up to their strengths, which is primarily DPS, that die very quickly. Concider then the options for Cruisers and Carriers. One, we can build sub-par healers and tanks, then be ignored while the feds just focus fire our wet paper dps canons. Two, we can build for dps with some kind of survivability. Smart feds will ignore the cruisers and go for 15 kills of raptors and BoPs, only focus firing on the harder to kill cruisers once those annoying mosquitoes are down. Concidering this, most BoP and Raptor pilots are then forced to kill quickly or be killed quickly, so again DPS wins out. On top of it, the Raptor is so very weak over all, that trying to keep one healed is pretty much a waste of time.
3. But all that said, we still constantly get told that the Klingons are Over Powered, because the mahority of the times, Klingons win. So its strange to hear someone come in, saying that the only good Klingon PvPers are in GoD, when quite a few vocal feds are saying the exact opposite.
So in conclusion, Klingon players are generally given the short end of the stick in heals and tanks, by design of the game, and therefore work on Klingon strengths, primarly DPS. Still, with all the short comings of the Klingon Faction, constantly we are told that Klingons are overpowered, because we constantly WIN, with tools that are honestly second string when compared to what the feds have available to them, and it shows just exactly how good the Klingon PLAYERS are.
I think the person who wrote the original quote would suddenly be changing their tune, if Klingons were given all the tools Feds are, with the skills Klingons have been weened on since first starting playing their Klingon characters. Players who are constantly told they are overpowered due to superior skills, and this with limited character skill options, would indeed be overpowered if given the tool sets fed players are given.
wall of text crits you for 100000 dmg, blah blah..
GoD had great games this night and we didn't win purely on decloaking and destroying fedballs up in seconds.
Yeah I get that. I also get Faithborns pretty much trying to say that only GoD is uber on Klink side, cause basically they're her guild, and everyone else sucks. I see it every PvP game "You all Suck, we're the only Uber ones out there, be like us and be uber".
Which is a shame, since there are plenty of other good Klink players out there outside of GoD that she seems to discount out of hand. Not saying I am one (I'm not) but her premise that only GoD is the other true PvPers Klink side and only they know how to heal is a bunch of PvP E-Peen balony.
As to Faithborn's comments:
1. "The best Klingon players are 90% dps, the best Federation players enjoy a better split."
I'd say it's probably closer to 95%. The advantages of cloak, picking your targets and focus fire vectors, angles of attack, etc plus the universal slots give BoP's some unique play style permutations no other vessel has and is the only ship I've seen that Hybrid Captains are pretty much all viable in. Prior to Season 1.2, I would face perhaps one Klingon dedicated healer in 20 matches and they simply could not hold up teammates under focus fire. After the patch it seems much hasn't changed save for the fact the individual ships they are healing are now more survivable so the healing can be spread around a bit to greater effect as DPS has definitely dropped.
2. "Federation teams need to plan on surviving the alpha strike."
Absolutely correct. As long as Klingon teams set up for major Alpha Strikes and that only, then there's no need to alter the basic corollary strategy. Outlast the first 20 seconds of a push and wear them down into excessive healing cooldowns unable to keep pace with damage. So far, this has worked against every Klingon team I have faced...and I do mean every single one with no exceptions.
3. Federation teams are significantly more likely to have a healer.
Again totally correct. Why? Could be any number of reasons. The Cruiser is the "iconic" ship for Feds while the BoP or Raptor is probably considered more so for the Klingons. Special Klingon-only features...such as cloak and its associated bonuses...translate more directly to DPS and attacking than healing and defending. There are simply numerically greater players on the Fed side so the odds of finding more of any type is certainly to be expected. Feds have no carriers so there's a whole ship class they can't play and I'd venture to say if there was a Fed carrier, more Cruiser pilots would switch to it than Escort pilots.
4. KDF rarely assembles premade teams.
My fleet and I have not been PvP'ing consistently in over three weeks but speaking specifically after the patch I see GoD asking for matches every night I'm on in the OrganizedPVP and PremadePVP channels and no one else. Hell, with all the games I've played I can only name GoD and Sto'Vo'Kor as Klingon fleets who still play that I recognize.
5. "Most KDF fleets suck. "
Again, I don't ever really see any on besides GoD and Sto'Vo'Kor so if they're the majority then no...they don't suck. But I'm sure behind the scenes floating around in Klingon space there's a whole plethora of role-playing fleets, sucky PvP'ers, and wanna-be's so you may be right. I just don't have enough information to answer that one intelligently.
6. "There has only been one really successful KDF pvp fleet."
Depends on your definition of success, but I get where you're going with this one. I have only had the opportunity to face GoD twice (once before 1.2 and once tonight) and although my fleet emerged victorious both of those games, I would have to agree they are currently the top of the Klingon competition that I have faced.
7. "There is content on the Federation side."
Since this entire commentary by Faithborn was quoted out-of-context here because it came from another thread to which I have no idea what the original posting was saying or in reply to, I'll say yes and no to this one. There is content for players coming up. But for me? As an RA5, I haven't had new content other than an STF in months.
As I said in my other post, there may be other really good PvP fleets and players on the Klingon side besides GoD and Sto'Vo'Kor but I have not seen them on any sort of consistent basis. In the 5v5 game we played against them this evening, their healer (Bombergirl aka Zorena) had over 280k damage and 800k healing (I'll have to check the FRAPS later for the exact numbers). I have never seen 800k healing from a Klingon. Not ever. And we're not talking the typical e-peen stroking screenshots people throw up of 40-minute Cap and Hold games but a true 5v5. That's healing like a champ in my book. If there are many other Klingon healers on that level then they are doing their faction a disservice by not playing.
Now, everyone helps their team in different ways. Neither Bombergirl nor I died once in that match. In that game I had over 600k damage and over 450k healing in a Star Cruiser and helped my team with consistent DPS pressure and healing past the Alpha Strike damage (sorry had to slip in some e-peen stroking of my own in there). Many, many times we had ships down to under 25% hull and Bombergirl brought them back from the brink. As to my personal experience...and I've played alongside Zorena on his Fed characters...I haven't seen another comparable Klingon healer.
Maybe they do exist. But just like the Loch Ness Monster, the Abominable Snowman, or successful Socialism....I'll just have to see it to actually believe it exists.
I PVP everyday and sometimes it's tiring trying to get the PUGS to work or follow common sense.
I've seen Klingons heal each other quite often, a lot of their Cruisers seem to run Extend shields as well.
Anyway, back to PUGS, I like getting a team going and keeping them after the match, because well... I'm kinda tired of people that add you to team, don't say a thing and then leave when the match is over.
Especially that one cruiser guy (you know who he is, he's that Brave Captain Kirk guy who thinks he's the best tank ever) that's always on your team that keeps flying towards that one carrier without anybody to back him, then... he's stuck in battle and 3 BOP's de-cloak and whoop him while two or three of us watch in horror. /ba-dum psssssh
No not at all. Let them have their pride and confidence, I actually appreciate that. And yes they are good, very good. What I'm saying is that faithbornes original quote I believe its point 5 and 6 state explicitly that only GoD doesn't suck, and only GoD is successful, smacks of prejudice, a prejudice made blatently obvious when you read further in this thead where faithborne comes right and states she shares the same vent as GoD, GoD and 182 share quite a few players, and that she is friends with GoD.
This in no way detracts from GoD, they are that good yes. What is does though is discounts all the other non-GoD players who are just as good as the majority of GoD's players. Faithborn even admits that GoD wouldn't be as good as they are without the contributions of only two players, which from inference means that while the others are good, they're only above average and no where near the playing fields of two players (and friends) that she holds in high regards.
Discounting the other good players in Klingon space simply because they do not belong to GoD, and saying they suck and are not successful, is what I'm complaining about.
This statement as I said doesn't distract from how good GoD may be, but simply states that the players in GoD are not the only ones who do not suck and who are "Successful".
Fair enough, but a question for you then. Has your team never lost to anyone that didn't belong to GoD and never did upwards of 800k healing? If so I'll conceed your point right here and now, that only GoD is good enough to beat you and yours.
On the other hand, if us mere mortals are capable of beating you and your team, with our mediocre healing and damage, it belabors your point. While Bombergirl doing 800k healing is indeed impressive, it also speaks of the tons of pretty much unmitigated damage that you were dishing out against GoD. Which means that in a 5v5 you were doing well over 800k damage, since I'm going to assume that in a fight like that, the other GoD members were also doing their healing as well, of various amounts.
So that would mean that no other non-GoD team would ever be able to mitigate at a minimum of 800k damage, which would mean that you've never lost to any other team because no other team could mitgate that much damage.
If this isn't true and your team HAS lost to other teams, with lesser amounts out healing, that simply means they don't NEED 800k healing, and aren't taking that much damage to require that much healing.
Why heal upwards of 800k if you're not taking that much damage?
ITT: people mistake my gender all the time.
GoD is the only klingon fleet that can claim wins against DoB, Section 31, 7th Core, AND 182. My definition of success in pvp is being able to tango with the best and come out victorious, as well as be a recognized name in pvp. Being active in premade vs premade also helps. If that doesn't include your fleet, then I'm sorry but I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.
Additionally, GoD exists on a completely different level from most klingon fleets - Kind of like DoB was in the first month of gameplay. In terms of firepower, most klingon alpha strikes can only kill 1-3 people at best before the federation side begins the comeback. GoD will kill them all, and then kill Santa Claws before they are unscrambled. GoD's offense is like bringing a minigun to a knife fight.
But of course, theres no actual reason to bring a healer because the entire federation team should be dead before they can react! Thats the mentality of most premade klingon groups, after all it does work against pugs without healers. Its easy to get comfortable with those results. But what happens when you get two REALLY good healers that can stop a 5 man spike? Don't answer that because most of the recognized fleets I said above actually have them. The result is that the klink team gets their asses handed to them - alot.
And to bounty's question; the post was a response to someone asking why all the good premades are on the federation side.
Habit... just like most guys refer to everything as a He regardless, I tend to refer to everything as a she. My mistake
Actually I do want to apologize... I had no idea of your gender and really didn't care... like I said most gamers will instant use the pronoun He... I tend to use the pronoun She... my mistake and I apologize.
Now let me say I agree totally with this post. Totally. I never said that GoD isn't Uber, never said they weren't that good, I never would say that. (by the way I'm unfleeted, and I'm not that good, so no need to apologize).
But where I disagree isn't anything in this post, I agree. What I disagree with is that you set the bar that GoD are mediocre players, and anyone who plays below the level of GoD sucks. Which isn't true, and actually does a dis-service to GoD.
GoD is indeed probably the greatest Klingon guild out there, and I'm not denying that one bit. What I'm saying though is that others don't suck... they're just not up to the level of GoD. Indeed, many Klingon players and fleets that are successful (which I would catagorize as having a higher win then loss ratio over all, probably higher win to loss then 75%) and who don't suck.
Maybe they're not at the level of certain GoD players, but they don't suck, and shouldn't be discounted. Indeed they may not be the top 1% players in the game, but having that distinction doesn't make them suck... just doesn't make them at the level of the top 1%.
I think I may not have enumerated on my point enough to make it clear. Yes, fleets have defeated any number of our 5 different teams. They all had to heal for upwards of 800k HP to do so. The difference is it is typically spread out over two, three, or four Cruisers. This was one man.
If by "mere mortals" you're referring to PUG teams, then you're right...I have never lost to a PUG team of any faction, before or after any patch, under any 5v5 game map when teamed with my slotted group of DOB fleetmates. As to the second part of that...again, I'd have to check FRAPS for the exact numbers...but no one healed within 550k of Bombergirl on his side if that helps illuminate the discussion in context somewhat.
Team yes....single player no. And again, he healed for 800k in a losing effort as we did win that game. His healing was remarkable and the reason that team is so good. Huge DPS numbers from Klingons isn't a rarity. Huge healing numbers is. And knowing when to heal...and with what type of heal...is an art he has mastered. I stated earlier others may exist, I just haven't met them yet.
Think about what it means for one man to heal that amount in a 5v5 match. How many times he completely repaired hulls and kept ships up and fighting to continue to pump heals into them. He healed for 800k because he was able to play a balancing act with limited resources to heal four other ships and mitigate that amount of damage. If you know of so many others on the Klingon side who can heal like that, then run...don't walk...back to Holodeck and get them to create a fleet. Three healers like that on one team would be literally undeafeatable.
But thats the problem. GoD is just about the only recognizable pvp fleet that can reliably fight with the active Federation fleet (honorable mention to Sto'vo'kor and Lore). Its not that GoD completely decimates the opposition that makes them good, its because they fight alot and fight hard. They have a recognizable name, and thats something that they earned from hard work.
It may be a disservice to say that there aren't any other good pvp fleets, but thats why I made that comment. lemme go look for the original post.
edit: here it is
But because she is the BEST, doesn't mean there are no other GOOD Klingon healers, and that anyone who isn't the best SUCKS. It just says one thing and one thing only, she's the BEST, the top in her field. The others may be good even great, but not at her level, doesn't mean the suck, just that they are not the BEST. It also doesn't mean they're not successful, just not as successful as she and GoD are. Again, saying anything who isn't the best sucks, is simply wrong, it just simply says they're not the best and have something to strive for.
Mind you, yes there are alot of Klingons and Klingons fleets that do suck, just like fed side, I'm probably one of them, without a doubt. And yet, its the folly of hubris to state that just because you're not the best you suck.
i'm not calling them TRIBBLE on a player level. I'm calling the pvp premade fleets TRIBBLE, but that was a comparison to federation premade fleets. The reason no other fleet approaches the level of GoD is because they are successful against other pvp fleets. Most premade klingon fleets pit the entire stratagy on the alpha strike, which is a horrible idea. DoB focuses pretty heavily on the alpha strike, but also carries healers in case the alpha strike fails. So when other klingon fleets would collapse in defeat, GoD can keep slugging back. I think its been said alot, but GoD's sluggings won't leave a mark - They'll kill you.
Again what it seems to me that you are saying that if you can't compete with the pinnacle of fed and klingon fleets, the best of the best you suck and are not successful (your words, only GoD is successful, and most Klingon fleets suck.).
Well and to me, that's wrong. Yes GoD is the pinnacle of their artform, that I'm not denying, simply because they can hold their own against the best the feds have to offer, again that makes the best fed side the best. Except, all us other Klingons who win constantly against fed fleets, 5v5, who fight and win, by your words suck, because they don't win against the cream that the feds have to offer. Yes we're average, or slightly above average, but we don't suck, we're just not the pinnacle of success you all are.
Mind you, I know Klingons who've barely won a match, and who actually are detriments to the team they're on. Yes they suck. I've seen Klingon fleets that all belonged to the same fleet who had less teamwork then a PuG. But I've been on any number of PuGs where we're won consistantly, had numerous klinks with over 200k healing, and high dps numbers. How they suck, and aren't successful when they're winning consistantly and putting out fairly decent healing numbers, and not only winning but consistantly decimating the other side, I just don't understand how they suck. Maybe they're not the pinnacle that GoD is, but they don't suck.
Because if only GoD is successful and doesn't suck because they win against the very best the feds have to ofer, then really you can say the opposite and say that really the only good feds are the top fed fleet, and the rest of the feds suck as well.
Then you can get into the concept that anyone who isn't the top in GoD sucks as well, since they're not at the level that GoD is, which then means anyone who isn't Santa and Blackjack sucks, because by your own comment no one can beat them when they are around.
A line has to be drawn and saying that only the best of the best sucks, means there is only one player that doesn't suck, and the rest of us do.
Again I agree, its sheer folly to not go into battle without at least one healer, and preferably more. I'm not denying that relying solely on DPS isn't folly, and that doing so makes you suck. Its the same thing that always playing your ship with all power to weapons is sheer folly, there are times you need to give up damage for survivability, or damage or aux. Any good player knows this. Heck I know this, and I'm no where near the pinnacle.
And I'm not saying that their isn't a good percentage of klingons who suck, there are, and just like every MMO out there, there are your DPS monkeys who equate DPS with winning, and can not comprehend why they can't DPS to win.
But there are plenty of Klingons who do get that, okay maybe a minority, but they exist, and also plenty of Klingons who do heal, and who don't solely rely on the alpha to win, who plan on the long term. Unfortunatly, as you say, the problem with PuGs is that you'll always get those one who two who don't get it, and you'll see it when the results come out on a 5v5 and out of 15 points the feds got, a very high majority belong to them. They tend to rage quit early. Same on fed side, once you find that weak link, you just constantly go after it time and time again, its the nature of PuGs.
But there are plenty of good, successful Klingons out there, who just have the misfortunate or the desire to not belong to GoD, and who simply are very good, but are consistantly saddled with bad baggage. They don't suck, they are very good, maybe not the best, but very good.
I guess I agree with your points, just disagree with the wording your had on your original quote.
Yes, Klingons need healing. Yes, many Kilngons are DPS monkeys who tactical out their BoP with no regard to survivability. But that still discounts the rest of the Klingons who do get it, and are simply enjoying doing what they are doing, which in winning consistantly, even when saddled with bad baggage, and are capable of keeping bad PuGs winning.
It speaks of who is better, the great player who can keep other great players winning, or the great player who can make bad players consistantly win?
well after not playing the game for 2 weeks I played today with my fleet, we went up against GOD, when we had the game at 13-8 we got lazy and starting goofing off and not playing smart and let them get back to 13 before we won.
fact is the game is boring, real boring.....healing is easy to do, dps is as well especially when your ship can turn on a dime.
truth be told most of our original members are bored or getting bored of the game and will leave or have left already.
If we had all our members in the game it would be like the first 3 months of the game.....DOB pwning all but really STO is too craptastic of a game to really even try anymore.
BTW the new SWTOR vid is better than all the last 3 lucas films put together. WOOT for TOR beta...hell ill even take a alpha, i mean i am paying for this beta....well not anymore