All this arguing could and can be avoided if you made the Death Penalty/Injury System with on/off switch and then everyone could enjoy every level of the difficulty slider with or without the DP/Injury System. This would let everyone be able to try out ever part of the system. If they want to play advanced with the DP/Injury System turned off they can, but then if they want to play the elite or normal level with it on they can.
This would also help resolve the problems that could occur in grouping/teaming. Let say Jeremy the leader of a team wants to play at the elite level and with a DP/Injury System on he can, the only thing his teammates have to do is play at the elite level, but do not have to use the DP/Injury System. No matter if you have the DP/Injury System on or off you can team up with anyone, but you have to play at the team leaders level, Normal, Advance, or Elite. When a player is automatically teamed with others, then you should be teamed up with in same level. Each player in the team have to play at the level of the team leader, but are not required to play with DP/Injury System on or off, no matter what the team leader has it set at. DP/Injury System should only affect the player that has it on or off and nothing else.
Last if you have two players playing the same level and both complete the same mission the one with the DP/Injury System switch on gets a better reward.
Normal with no DP = Average Reward
Normal with DP = Above Average Reward
Advanced with no DP = Average Reward
Advanced with DP = Above Average Reward
Elite with no DP = Average Reward
Elite with DP = Above Average Reward
I am very happy the Death Penalty/Injury System is gone from Normal (Default) play. I know this is what a lot of people wanted. I am not going to say a majority wanted or don't want it, because no one no matter what will really know either way unless a offical poll is taken either thru in game or something else and that would never really be 100% accurate, but closer then from forum polls.
All this arguing could and can be avoided if you made the Death Penalty/Injury System with on/off switch and added the difficulty slider so everyone could enjoy every level of difficulty with or with out a DP/Injury. This would let everyone be able to try out ever part of the system. I know alot of people that want the DP/Injury System on and I know a lot of people that don't want it, but still want to play at the elite level. A DP/Injury on/off switch would give them those options to have it or not to on all levels. I believe this would make more people happy with what is going on.
This would also help resolve the problems that could occur in grouping/teaming. Let say Jeremy the leader of a team wants to play at the elite level and with a DP/Injury System on he can the only thing his teammates have to do is play at the elite level, but do not have to use the DP/Injury System.
Last if you have two players playing the same level and both complete the same mission the one with the DP/Injury System switch on gets a better reward.
The only problem that might occur is that teaming would be fragmented from three options into six.
The only problem that might occur is that teaming would be fragmented from three options into six.
Aside from that, I'm a fan of options.
I don't believe it would have to be six options, no matter if you have the DP/Injury System on or off you can team up with anyone, but you have to play at the team leaders level, Normal. Advance or Elite. If it's automatically teaming you, then you should be teamed up with in same level. Each player in the team have to play at the level of the team leader, but are not required to play with DP/Injury System on or off, no matter what the team leader has it set at. DP/Injury System should only affect the player that has it on or off and nothing else.
Was it really necessary to post this message in 3 places? :rolleyes:
Started in the other thread, didn't realize I posted it twice in there (Thanks for letting me know) went back deleted one of them. I started this thread because everyone in the other thread started talking about other things.
nope. I would rather have no DP than a ridiculous "optional" one with an on/off switch...oh wait we already have that now that the complainers got their way.
No, the death penalty must be always on, and be a lot tougher than the current one. In fact there should be a chance of permadeath when you lose your ship.
And there should be no argumenting about this cause you know I am right.
People will always complain. Cryptic struck a reasonable compromise with the DP slider, removed the DP for normal and people are still complaining. To be honest, I really don't want the devs to continue to circle around this same issue for another month trying to please everyone.
All this arguing could and can be avoided if you made the Death Penalty/Injury System with on/off switch and then everyone could enjoy every level of the difficulty slider with or without the DP/Injury System. This would let everyone be able to try out ever part of the system. If they want to play advanced with the DP/Injury System turned off they can, but then if they want to play the elite or normal level with it on they can..............................................
Arguing? Who's arguing?
We don't argue here because we are all right and we think alike.
Except of course ask the majority of their customers what they want. Cryptic could easily get the input of every player with an in game poll. But instead, they choose to let the small number of people who post on the forums determine what they do.
No, the death penalty must be always on, and be a lot tougher than the current one. In fact there should be a chance of permadeath when you lose your ship.
And there should be no argumenting about this cause you know I am right.
I favor permadeath maybe they can add in that it gives you radiation poisoning like spock at the end of wrath of khan.
nope. I would rather have no DP than a ridiculous "optional" one with an on/off switch...oh wait we already have that now that the complainers got their way.
All I was trying to do is make all parties happy and from what I can understand you don't want to do that. You want your game your way and that's final.:(
There are a lot of people out there that want and don't want a DP at Normal, Advance, or Elite. Making the DP/Injury with a on/off switch would make a lot of people happy.
How would having an DP on/off switch effect you at all. You would have it on, I would have it off. Done move on.
So if the complainers got there way. So what are you calling all the people that pushed for the DP? Cry babies?
This idea would allow any player to play at any level they what with or without a DP. This would also fix any problems that are going to come up with auto teaming.
All good games have a DP.... and not an optional DP.
All games do not start out with a DP and when they are added the game starts to die off. Cryptic is doing a good job at trying to keep more players happy and keep that from happening. But of course we don't want to keep everyone happy that would TRIBBLE up your game now wouldn't it.
All good games have a DP.... and not an optional DP.
Please provide a 100% comprehensive list of all "good" games with a non-optional DP compared to a list of all "good" games so that we can see for ourselves that all "good" games do in fact fall under the non-optional DP list.
Please remember while compiling said list that not all games that may be considered "good" even have traditional death, if death at all, and not all games are MMOs.
Then when you can't provide said list please shut up and realize that not everyone thinks a game needs a DP to be good, and in fact some people think that a game with a DP is no longer as good.
Please provide a 100% comprehensive list of all "good" games with a non-optional DP compared to a list of all "good" games so that we can see for ourselves that all "good" games do in fact fall under the non-optional DP list.
Please remember while compiling said list that not all games that may be considered "good" even have traditional death, if death at all, and not all games are MMOs.
Then when you can't provide said list please shut up and realize that not everyone thinks a game needs a DP to be good, and in fact some people think that a game with a DP is no longer as good.
Even WoW.. and it IS a good game.. has a DP.. your equipment is damaged. SWG Used to have a DP and it was good... until they removed it to improbe the game for dribbling idiots like your self to enjoy... that made it a TRIBBLE game. Dark Age of Camelot had another equipment damage system and XP loss....
.... no DP should be optional... it should be there... or not there at all.
And maybe I should have pointed out I was talking about MMO's..
so DAoC
SWG (When it had one)
WoW
and now maybe this
Those are the MMO's I have spent time on.
Cant remember the DP of Planetside... think it was just the pain of spawning miles away from where you died
Even WoW.. and it IS a good game.. has a DP.. your equipment is damaged. SWG Used to have a DP and it was good... until they removed it to improbe the game for dribbling idiots like your self to enjoy... that made it a TRIBBLE game. Dark Age of Camelot had another equipment damage system and XP loss....
.... no DP should be optional... it should be there... or not there at all.
And maybe I should have pointed out I was talking about MMO's..
so DAoC
SWG (When it had one)
WoW
and now maybe this
Those are the MMO's I have spent time on.
Cant remember the DP of Planetside... think it was just the pain of spawning miles away from where you died
So, lets see, I don't want a DP. I don't die every five minutes. I have gone a couple of days in STO without dieing. Thus, according to your logic..........I don't exist. Good to know that is why you are dismissing my opinion: to you I am not here because I don't have a spot in your head that I fit into.
Aside from that, you personally feel that the DP in your list of games was, apparently, one of the deciding factors in them being "good" games. Not, you know, the rest of the content, quality of servers, marketing, community features, etc and so forth.
If you feel that STO should have a DP, then make sure whatever option is needed to enable it is turned ON for you and enjoy your DP.
I personally feel that STO does not need a DP, and I am not sure I want to have one at this time. Thus, I want said switch to have a NO-DP option. For me, the game will likely be made LESS enjoyable, and thus LESS good, with the addition of a DP.
We are two different people, with two different desires. Your desire to force your opinion (DP on) on me means that you feel that Cryptic should invalidate my desires over yours. Your only other option (you said DP on or no DP) invalidates YOUR OWN desires over mine.
The only way to make us both happy when playing is to give us a switch. We never have to be involved with each other in game, and me having no DP while you have a DP will not ruin either of our enjoyments of the game.
And if that switch gives you better drops as an incentive to turn it on, you will actually be running around with better equipment then me and as a result if we DO meet in PVP or Fleet Actions YOU will likely come out on top.
All games do not start out with a DP and when they are added the game starts to die off. Cryptic is doing a good job at trying to keep more players happy and keep that from happening. But of course we don't want to keep everyone happy that would TRIBBLE up your game now wouldn't it.
It dont TRIBBLE up my game, it just means after an hour I get bored.... there is nothing to make me use a strategy.... I can fly in and take on 6 ships...... kill one... then die... respawn and repeat until they are all dead..... a DP FORCES people to think... why do you think people are enjoying the Elite mode of Tribble? Because they are getting excited at the challage and they have something to loose... If there was no DP with elite mode.... it would be simply making things harder to kill........ would be boring like doing Infected or Cure... remember they are a challenge.. yet no DP... they are boring.
It dont TRIBBLE up my game, it just means after an hour I get bored.... there is nothing to make me use a strategy.... I can fly in and take on 6 ships...... kill one... then die... respawn and repeat until they are all dead..... a DP FORCES people to think... why do you think people are enjoying the Elite mode of Tribble? Because they are getting excited at the challage and they have something to loose... If there was no DP with elite mode.... it would be simply making things harder to kill........ would be boring like doing Infected or Cure... remember they are a challenge.. yet no DP... they are boring.
And yet some of us don't need a DP to be interested. I find Infected and Cure, without a DP, to be interesting, even after several runs of Infected and getting very good at it. Adding a DP would actually move it from interesting to FRUSTRATING, which would be more likely to get me to NOT recommend the game to others in the future, thus robbing Cryptic of potential income and new subscribers and such.
If you want DP, turn it on. Just let those of us that don't want it turn it off.
so DAoC
SWG (When it had one)
WoW
and now maybe this
To add to this list:
FFXI - You lose XP on death. You can even de-level.
City of Heroes/Villains - XP debt
Aion - XP debt (but you can pay in-game currency to clear it)
Guild Wars - Progressive stat penalties with each death
Warhammer Online - Stat penalties as well, if you choose to respawn.
Champions Online - Even Cryptic's other game has DP, albeit it's quite mild
EVE Online - You lose your ship and 50% of your gear. You lose the other 50% if you (or your friends) can't manage to loot your wreck.
Death penalties aren't rare in the MMO world. In fact, not having one seems to be the exception. And if the Injury System on Tribble goes live -- an optional death penalty -- that will be a first for me.
But yeah, people are afraid of change. Something as significant as a death penalty should really have been included at launch.
So, lets see, I don't want a DP. I don't die every five minutes. I have gone a couple of days in STO without dieing. Thus, according to your logic..........I don't exist. Good to know that is why you are dismissing my opinion: to you I am not here because I don't have a spot in your head that I fit into.
Aside from that, you personally feel that the DP in your list of games was, apparently, one of the deciding factors in them being "good" games. Not, you know, the rest of the content, quality of servers, marketing, community features, etc and so forth.
If you feel that STO should have a DP, then make sure whatever option is needed to enable it is turned ON for you and enjoy your DP.
I personally feel that STO does not need a DP, and I am not sure I want to have one at this time. Thus, I want said switch to have a NO-DP option. For me, the game will likely be made LESS enjoyable, and thus LESS good, with the addition of a DP.
We are two different people, with two different desires. Your desire to force your opinion (DP on) on me means that you feel that Cryptic should invalidate my desires over yours. Your only other option (you said DP on or no DP) invalidates YOUR OWN desires over mine.
The only way to make us both happy when playing is to give us a switch. We never have to be involved with each other in game, and me having no DP while you have a DP will not ruin either of our enjoyments of the game.
And if that switch gives you better drops as an incentive to turn it on, you will actually be running around with better equipment then me and as a result if we DO meet in PVP or Fleet Actions YOU will likely come out on top.
So what is your issue with a switch?
Listen cmptrwz... there is no point in arguing...... I am sorry for calling you an idiot... the only reason I did is because you told me to shut up... that really annoys me.
As you have pointed out we are 2 diffrent people.... we both have our own opinions of what is a good game........ we will never agree with each other even if both our opinions are valid.
My opinion comes from playing SWG.... once they tried to copy WoW but without a DP....... it killed the game.. except for the kids ... but thats a diffrent game.
All I was trying to do is make all parties happy and from what I can understand you don't want to do that. You want your game your way and that's final.:(
There are a lot of people out there that want and don't want a DP at Normal, Advance, or Elite. Making the DP/Injury with a on/off switch would make a lot of people happy.
How would having an DP on/off switch effect you at all. You would have it on, I would have it off. Done move on.
So if the complainers got there way. So what are you calling all the people that pushed for the DP? Cry babies?
This idea would allow any player to play at any level they what with or without a DP. This would also fix any problems that are going to come up with auto teaming.
There isn't a problem with outo teaming now.. you are notified that you are about to join a team on Elite Y/N.. click No.. problem solved.. when advertising to run a mission, like Guardian on the Edge of Never, You can Advertise, LFG Normal, FLG Advanced or LFG Elite. if people don't wnat to play on that level.. great,, they can make their own team or joins a group playing on their preferred difficulty.
There is absolutely no reason to change the system as it is on Tribble currently.
Just because YOU don't want a DP on Elite doesn't mean Cryptic needs to change the game to have 6 loot tables, 6 game modes, 6 grouping options just to satisfy you.
Either take the Compromise that Cryptic has already made for Normal Mode = no DP or move along.
the current system is perfectly acceptable and the DP system is light in any game mode already.. If you can't hack it.. maybe MMOs aren't for you.
the greater the risk, the greater the reward.. kicking up the difficulty but not having a DP negates the risk.. You could die 100 times and walk away with a Blue or a Purple from popping a Battleship, Yet have 0 risk.. making it a zerg fest.. that IMHO isn't right.. and with 0 Risk (no DP) in Elite mode, you should only get Battery drops from all AI you kill.. There is no risk in Elite without a DP. negates the whole purpose of having an Elite mode.. it would be Normal mode with slightly more difficult opponents.. and no risk..
the system as currently on Tribble is perfectly fine.. maybe adjust kits to scale with level in pricing (repair stations as well) and it would be Gold.
Comments
The only problem that might occur is that teaming would be fragmented from three options into six.
Aside from that, I'm a fan of options.
I don't believe it would have to be six options, no matter if you have the DP/Injury System on or off you can team up with anyone, but you have to play at the team leaders level, Normal. Advance or Elite. If it's automatically teaming you, then you should be teamed up with in same level. Each player in the team have to play at the level of the team leader, but are not required to play with DP/Injury System on or off, no matter what the team leader has it set at. DP/Injury System should only affect the player that has it on or off and nothing else.
Started in the other thread, didn't realize I posted it twice in there (Thanks for letting me know) went back deleted one of them. I started this thread because everyone in the other thread started talking about other things.
arguing avoided here ?
you're kidding right ?
.
Fixed for you, because that is the ONLY way you will ever avoid arguing, as far as MMOs are concerned.
And there should be no argumenting about this cause you know I am right.
Arguing? Who's arguing?
We don't argue here because we are all right and we think alike.
Argue....hmmmmph, the audacity!
:cool:
I agree
/10chars
Except of course ask the majority of their customers what they want. Cryptic could easily get the input of every player with an in game poll. But instead, they choose to let the small number of people who post on the forums determine what they do.
I favor permadeath maybe they can add in that it gives you radiation poisoning like spock at the end of wrath of khan.
All I was trying to do is make all parties happy and from what I can understand you don't want to do that. You want your game your way and that's final.:(
There are a lot of people out there that want and don't want a DP at Normal, Advance, or Elite. Making the DP/Injury with a on/off switch would make a lot of people happy.
How would having an DP on/off switch effect you at all. You would have it on, I would have it off. Done move on.
So if the complainers got there way. So what are you calling all the people that pushed for the DP? Cry babies?
This idea would allow any player to play at any level they what with or without a DP. This would also fix any problems that are going to come up with auto teaming.
*buys emote pack*
/shoo @ OP
Stop right there... there are NO happy people in STO. Period.
I am happy and I am currently logged into STO!
All games do not start out with a DP and when they are added the game starts to die off. Cryptic is doing a good job at trying to keep more players happy and keep that from happening. But of course we don't want to keep everyone happy that would TRIBBLE up your game now wouldn't it.
Please provide a 100% comprehensive list of all "good" games with a non-optional DP compared to a list of all "good" games so that we can see for ourselves that all "good" games do in fact fall under the non-optional DP list.
Please remember while compiling said list that not all games that may be considered "good" even have traditional death, if death at all, and not all games are MMOs.
Then when you can't provide said list please shut up and realize that not everyone thinks a game needs a DP to be good, and in fact some people think that a game with a DP is no longer as good.
Even WoW.. and it IS a good game.. has a DP.. your equipment is damaged. SWG Used to have a DP and it was good... until they removed it to improbe the game for dribbling idiots like your self to enjoy... that made it a TRIBBLE game. Dark Age of Camelot had another equipment damage system and XP loss....
.... no DP should be optional... it should be there... or not there at all.
And maybe I should have pointed out I was talking about MMO's..
so DAoC
SWG (When it had one)
WoW
and now maybe this
Those are the MMO's I have spent time on.
Cant remember the DP of Planetside... think it was just the pain of spawning miles away from where you died
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~ Phoxe
So, lets see, I don't want a DP. I don't die every five minutes. I have gone a couple of days in STO without dieing. Thus, according to your logic..........I don't exist. Good to know that is why you are dismissing my opinion: to you I am not here because I don't have a spot in your head that I fit into.
Aside from that, you personally feel that the DP in your list of games was, apparently, one of the deciding factors in them being "good" games. Not, you know, the rest of the content, quality of servers, marketing, community features, etc and so forth.
If you feel that STO should have a DP, then make sure whatever option is needed to enable it is turned ON for you and enjoy your DP.
I personally feel that STO does not need a DP, and I am not sure I want to have one at this time. Thus, I want said switch to have a NO-DP option. For me, the game will likely be made LESS enjoyable, and thus LESS good, with the addition of a DP.
We are two different people, with two different desires. Your desire to force your opinion (DP on) on me means that you feel that Cryptic should invalidate my desires over yours. Your only other option (you said DP on or no DP) invalidates YOUR OWN desires over mine.
The only way to make us both happy when playing is to give us a switch. We never have to be involved with each other in game, and me having no DP while you have a DP will not ruin either of our enjoyments of the game.
And if that switch gives you better drops as an incentive to turn it on, you will actually be running around with better equipment then me and as a result if we DO meet in PVP or Fleet Actions YOU will likely come out on top.
So what is your issue with a switch?
It dont TRIBBLE up my game, it just means after an hour I get bored.... there is nothing to make me use a strategy.... I can fly in and take on 6 ships...... kill one... then die... respawn and repeat until they are all dead..... a DP FORCES people to think... why do you think people are enjoying the Elite mode of Tribble? Because they are getting excited at the challage and they have something to loose... If there was no DP with elite mode.... it would be simply making things harder to kill........ would be boring like doing Infected or Cure... remember they are a challenge.. yet no DP... they are boring.
And yet some of us don't need a DP to be interested. I find Infected and Cure, without a DP, to be interesting, even after several runs of Infected and getting very good at it. Adding a DP would actually move it from interesting to FRUSTRATING, which would be more likely to get me to NOT recommend the game to others in the future, thus robbing Cryptic of potential income and new subscribers and such.
If you want DP, turn it on. Just let those of us that don't want it turn it off.
To add to this list:
Death penalties aren't rare in the MMO world. In fact, not having one seems to be the exception. And if the Injury System on Tribble goes live -- an optional death penalty -- that will be a first for me.
But yeah, people are afraid of change. Something as significant as a death penalty should really have been included at launch.
Listen cmptrwz... there is no point in arguing...... I am sorry for calling you an idiot... the only reason I did is because you told me to shut up... that really annoys me.
As you have pointed out we are 2 diffrent people.... we both have our own opinions of what is a good game........ we will never agree with each other even if both our opinions are valid.
My opinion comes from playing SWG.... once they tried to copy WoW but without a DP....... it killed the game.. except for the kids ... but thats a diffrent game.
There isn't a problem with outo teaming now.. you are notified that you are about to join a team on Elite Y/N.. click No.. problem solved.. when advertising to run a mission, like Guardian on the Edge of Never, You can Advertise, LFG Normal, FLG Advanced or LFG Elite. if people don't wnat to play on that level.. great,, they can make their own team or joins a group playing on their preferred difficulty.
There is absolutely no reason to change the system as it is on Tribble currently.
Just because YOU don't want a DP on Elite doesn't mean Cryptic needs to change the game to have 6 loot tables, 6 game modes, 6 grouping options just to satisfy you.
Either take the Compromise that Cryptic has already made for Normal Mode = no DP or move along.
the current system is perfectly acceptable and the DP system is light in any game mode already.. If you can't hack it.. maybe MMOs aren't for you.
the greater the risk, the greater the reward.. kicking up the difficulty but not having a DP negates the risk.. You could die 100 times and walk away with a Blue or a Purple from popping a Battleship, Yet have 0 risk.. making it a zerg fest.. that IMHO isn't right.. and with 0 Risk (no DP) in Elite mode, you should only get Battery drops from all AI you kill.. There is no risk in Elite without a DP. negates the whole purpose of having an Elite mode.. it would be Normal mode with slightly more difficult opponents.. and no risk..
the system as currently on Tribble is perfectly fine.. maybe adjust kits to scale with level in pricing (repair stations as well) and it would be Gold.
Nice Come back preach on.