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PvP in it's current format is a flop and should be chaged.

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
edited April 2010 in PvP Gameplay
PvP in its current format is a flop, and I believe that in it's current format that it is not working.

Why? Never enough Klingon players online to finish missions.

PvP should be that you verse all Star Trek Universe Characters, not just Fed's Vs Klingon's.

They should have it as:-
Vulcan Vs Ferengi or Klingon's Vs Terran's or even Klingon's Vs Klingon's.

The problem should not be rectified by having player vs NCP.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Yeah, You're right.
    It's annoying that the klingons have ALL THE ADVANTADGES in PvP: where is the cloak for the tacticals?
    Why devoloping the 4 major races in star trek and don't make them available to the players?
    Why having to fight Cardassians, Borgs and Romulans if you can't do PvP with them, like the klingons? I mean: You fight Klingons as a Fed and you fight Feds as a Klingon, but you fight also cardassians and romulans...... why they shouldn't be playable as factions, with their own ship classes, ranks, missions and territories? :mad:
    Also, the PvP queues are useless and meanless: why you can't engage an enemy player directly, like the NPCs in the blocks accessible to fed players?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    You don't need Klingons to finish your PVP missions.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Foxrocks wrote:
    You don't need Klingons to finish your PVP missions.

    And this is the reason there are no KDF players. Since a FED player has to "join the darkside", the current KDF base is what you will more than likely have for the lifespan of the game. As one FED migrates, one KDF player leaves.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Alpino2 wrote: »
    Yeah, You're right.
    It's annoying that the klingons have ALL THE ADVANTADGES in PvP: where is the cloak for the tacticals?
    Why devoloping the 4 major races in star trek and don't make them available to the players?
    Why having to fight Cardassians, Borgs and Romulans if you can't do PvP with them, like the klingons? I mean: You fight Klingons as a Fed and you fight Feds as a Klingon, but you fight also cardassians and romulans...... why they shouldn't be playable as factions, with their own ship classes, ranks, missions and territories? :mad:
    Also, the PvP queues are useless and meanless: why you can't engage an enemy player directly, like the NPCs in the blocks accessible to fed players?

    I'm wondering why you believe the Federation should have cloaks?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Alpino2 wrote: »
    Yeah, You're right.
    It's annoying that the klingons have ALL THE ADVANTADGES in PvP: where is the cloak for the tacticals?
    Why devoloping the 4 major races in star trek and don't make them available to the players?
    Why having to fight Cardassians, Borgs and Romulans if you can't do PvP with them, like the klingons? I mean: You fight Klingons as a Fed and you fight Feds as a Klingon, but you fight also cardassians and romulans...... why they shouldn't be playable as factions, with their own ship classes, ranks, missions and territories? :mad:
    Also, the PvP queues are useless and meanless: why you can't engage an enemy player directly, like the NPCs in the blocks accessible to fed players?

    yawn cry more
    the fact is klingons dont have all the advantages in pvp they just have a cloak
    it is NOT an i win butten
    its people like you who want to solo everything and if a better player kills you you cry and whine and beg for a nerf.
    truth be told ive been seeing an influx of noobs on the klingon side. who are all fighting leke feds not bieng able to co ordinate attacks or heal. the fact is teamwork is required and when you zoom off trying to solo things your gonna die
    likewise if the crusers in your group are selfish with the heals your probbly all gonna die
    a good group of feds can beet a good group of klingons because of all the advantages the fed ships have
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Eyewrenchi wrote:
    PvP in its current format is a flop, and I believe that in it's current format that it is not working.

    I'm starting to believe that this thread is a flop and in it's current format isn't working.

    -10 points
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Jason151 wrote: »
    a good group of feds can beet a good group of klingons because of all the advantages the fed ships have

    By all the advantages you mean ......

    - Their inability to mount DC/DHC on anything but escorts ?
    - Their lack of counters to cloak ?
    - Their ship's lesser agility compared to Klingon's
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Gabrelle wrote:
    By all the advantages you mean ......

    - Their inability to mount DC/DHC on anything but escorts ?
    - Their lack of counters to cloak ?
    - Their ship's lesser agility compared to Klingon's

    sensor scan is a fine cloak detector
    what about there incresed hull and shields?
    escorts are meant to be the dps types,.. u dont see manny people with cannons on klingon crusers even tho they can equip them if u want cannons for crusers use turrets (whic i infact do) or single cannons with the 180 arc

    less qq more ltp
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Jason151 wrote: »
    sensor scan is a fine cloak detector
    what about there incresed hull and shields?
    escorts are meant to be the dps types,.. u dont see manny people with cannons on klingon crusers even tho they can equip them if u want cannons for crusers use turrets (whic i infact do) or single cannons with the 180 arc

    less qq more ltp

    I hate to agree with such a hostile post but, I agree.

    Nose to nose, toe to toe, feds are going to come out on top.
    As for maneuvering my T4 escort flies rings around BoPs.
    Cannons on a lumbering cruiser is just not a good idea, maybe fun for a gimmick but not if we are trying to compare max/min against max/min.
    When playing FvF and FvK PvP matches I really notice how much tougher feds are than klingons.

    So Xolia? Why do klingons win?
    1) The cloak is a huge advantage in cracked planet. I no longer do that match with my fed because of that.
    2) I honestly think the average klingon player is a better PvPer than the average fed player. I think they spend more time max/min their ships and character builds.

    And in the commander bracket, I am not sure why, but when I was a commander I think I won maybe 2 matches out of the countless I have played. And my friend Bipsie is a commander right now and she is in the same boat. The klingon damage in commander is just outrageous and I am not sure why.

    The upcoming changes to VM/SNB and DR from shield power are going to really hurt the klingon sci/BoP insta gank crews. I have a feeling its going to be a little more diverse after the patch.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Jason151 wrote: »
    sensor scan is a fine cloak detector

    much in the same way that not all klingons fly birds of prey, not all feds are science officers. currently the skills that i heard of that "counter" cloak are : sensor scan, charged particle burst, gravity well, vent warp plasma, and supposedly fire on my mark (a note about it was mentioned for tribble ages ago but i never heard of it being implemented in holodeck). of all those skills listed, only sensor scan and charged particle burst can be used as a pre-emptive ability; while everything else is either reactionary at best, or will only catch an idiot off guard (vent warp plasma).

    so yes, cloak is a bigger advantage than you make it out to be. i agree that its not an end all be all ability, but with the ability to better plan out your mode of attack, and with people getting smarter with maxing out burst dps, the only way a fed will survive an engagement with a cloaked player would be to have a finger hovering over the RSP key, and from then on its a matter of "whose burst dps is higher?"
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Jason151 wrote: »
    sensor scan is a fine cloak detector p

    As a science class player who pvp alot, this quote got me laughing so hard, I almost pee my pant :eek::rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    blkjag wrote: »
    As a science class player who pvp alot, this quote got me laughing so hard, I almost pee my pant :eek::rolleyes:

    i dunno what your talking about, my fleets science ships catch people in cloak all the time. If you want an even stronger scan, throw up aux to 100 and get an engineer to put the eps transfer skill on you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    blkjag wrote: »
    As a science class player who pvp alot, this quote got me laughing so hard, I almost pee my pant :eek::rolleyes:

    I've caught a few BoP's out with sensor scan. Maybe your not using it right :p

    It's worth noting that Jason151 said Fine cloak detector, not omg awesomesauce win Win WIN! cloak detector.

    As for the rest of it. Get aligned with a good pvp fleet, get some skill, get a chat client like teamspeak or vent and you'll be surprised on how fun it is to PvP against klingons. And once you get good you'll be hard to beat. Most games my fleet and I have played vs klingons we've either won or been 1 or 2 points from winning. Either way its a hell of a lot of fun.

    I believe that most of the complains are due to playing with PUG's and since the feddies are more commonly the choice of new players its not uncommon to get relatively newbie (not to be mistaken for nub) players at all levels of the game.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    If you are using sensor scan JUST to try and find cloaked ships, then you should be taken to the nearest airlock and shot. Sensor scan is one of the biggest resistence debuff in the game (for me its currently -58% all dmg resistence to target).

    Anything that falls in its range is debuffed for 30secs. A well organized team can easily focus fire 1-2 targets at that time.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Great Idea. There are hardly 5 klingon BGs left, so just add 4 more fractions without content wich nobody ever plays.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    The main issue for me in PvP is: its horrible fast. In 5 vs 5 battles the situations is "solved" pretty fast. Respawn points are bad located. Fights are done in few seconds. All you can do is, hit few buttons as fast you can and watch who died. Reaction time to things are very fast or you die soonish.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Eyewrenchi wrote:
    PvP in its current format is a flop, and I believe that in it's current format that it is not working.

    Why? Never enough Klingon players online to finish missions.

    Unless you're playing in an alternate dimension where everybody plays as a Fed, you're mistaken. I've never had problems finding Klingons to shoot at (playing from the UK).
    Eyewrenchi wrote:
    PvP should be that you verse all Star Trek Universe Characters, not just Fed's Vs Klingon's.

    They should have it as:-
    Vulcan Vs Ferengi or Klingon's Vs Terran's or even Klingon's Vs Klingon's.

    The problem should not be rectified by having player vs NCP.

    How many times have you seen Vulcans running around shooting at anybody? Even if they did, are you going to balance every faction and every ship so that they do not have any major advantage over each other? If you want to shoot everything and anything, maybe EvE Online would be better for you since that game has unrestricted space.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    I'm KdF, Raptor, BG5...

    Let me see, where are ALL my advantages are...

    Cloak - useless in Salvage, works pretty well in the other maps, to deliver devastating alpha strike, still get send to the junkyard, if the feddies play as team.

    Weapons, let me see.. fed has access to the same base weapons then I do, but wait.. there arn't much
    KdF BG's left, I can't do any of the special force task thing'ies, where Feddies get all there nice rare equipment.
    Same counts btw also for all other equipment as well -> advantage Federation.

    And yes, we DO have the advantage in PvP, because PvP is all we CAN do. Ships, skills, equip, playstyle
    is all optimized for PvP and we want our rounds to be fast over to get to the next round, because this is the
    way for us to level up. How we do this, it is called TEAM WORK - seems to be a foreign concept to the
    majority of the so called Federation players, but this is a different story.

    Quite sure there will be a nerv for team work on KdF coming quite soon as well... maybe, no more team chat for us? Ventrilo / TS / Skype used by KdF results in ban? Or maybe we change the rules of engagement to
    5 Fed vs. 1 KdF :confused:

    And yes, there are plenty of post like this on the board, how FOTOM KdF is and I'm quite frankly can't hear it anymore and was so free to leave some steam in this whinging post - sorry :o
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    NickiGraus wrote: »
    Cloak - useless in Salvage, works pretty well in the other maps, to deliver devastating alpha strike, still get send to the junkyard, if the feddies play as team.

    the alpha strike is devestating if the opponent can't counter it. On the otherhand if you invest to heavily into that initial burst and fail to bring support (and the feds survive the strike) then your in extremely hot water and fighting a downhill fight.

    this is the typical and generally fatal error of the klingon faction: assuming that the enemy won't survive the alpha strike.


    other than that though, klinks are fine. if anything cryptic needs to buff player IQ on both sides. seriously.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    faithborn wrote:
    this is the typical and generally fatal error of the klingon faction: assuming that the enemy won't survive the alpha strike.

    I'm lucky, playing Europe hours, not US hours - majority of feddies go BOOMMM :D

    still a few tough feddie cookies out there - unfortunate, you are the only one (feddie) in your PuG - focus fire :p

    I don't want to be rude, but you can reduce the PvP most of the time to a 2 (feddie) v 5 (focus fire on the skilled feddies) fight - pls accept my apologize feddie, who ever you are, if you are the chosen one. It just means,
    we take you seriously and want to cuddle ya, all the time.. with our cannons :rolleyes:

    Uhm, off topic, who cares
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    This is not the proper area of the forums for this discussion.

    Moving this thread to the PvP Gameplay section.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Phoxe wrote:
    This is not the proper area of the forums for this discussion.

    Moving this thread to the PvP Gameplay section.

    Oo We don't want it!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    NickiGraus wrote: »
    I don't want to be rude, but you can reduce the PvP most of the time to a 2 (feddie) v 5 (focus fire on the skilled feddies) fight - pls accept my apologize feddie, who ever you are, if you are the chosen one. It just means,
    we take you seriously and want to cuddle ya, all the time.. with our cannons :rolleyes:

    most of the time, a good team will break you though.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    True I would like to see a free for all nuetral zone where we just lay in wait and jump any old hapless Bird of Prey that comes along. And yes, maybe we should have Cardassian and Romulan factions to add some spice to our lives and even some Ferengi freighters to score some loot off of.

    However I do not mind the que system, I dont see many Feds on, but lots of Klingons waiting around so they can get some XP (that kinda sux) they should have more xp missions. I do think we need to be able to 1v1 2v2 ect ect instead of waiting around untill the 5 or 10 miniums are filled.

    klingons have cloak...Feds dont, get over it...I think the Feds field a more rounded ship. Klingons are better PvPers as a whole, because thats what they have too do, to get decent XP. Feds could be, if they would get out there and do it, but there is a lot of bad press about how OP the Klingons are and it scares the inexperienced Capt.

    I do not agree, I think its because they know how to Capt. their ships and use pack tactics. Feds need better communication, we need to be on vent or gamespk, smoke signals, something besides trying to type, fire, turn, dive, fix shields and alll the other junk that comes along with combat.

    I Capt. a escort in PvP, as soon as I unload those Heavy guns/w rapid fire, I become the Taunt...I love it...sometimes I win sometimes I dont...but rarely does 1 Klingon warship take me out...it takes 2+...on a good day.

    just my 2 credits worth
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    faithborn wrote:
    other than that though, klinks are fine. if anything cryptic needs to buff player IQ on both sides. seriously.

    Where can I sign up for that?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    faithborn wrote:
    i dunno what your talking about, my fleets science ships catch people in cloak all the time. If you want an even stronger scan, throw up aux to 100 and get an engineer to put the eps transfer skill on you.

    I be curious to see your set up for this.. I have significant amount of points in the proper area.. run with trac or sensor deflector, and still the skill does not work right for me.. Hopefully, you can share with me offline your set up. I do run aux very high

    What I did not know was the eps transfer , that good to know.. thanks :)


    Also, I do use sensor scan in battle all the time...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    I'm running 3 sensor consoles and can happily pop em out in an escort.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    blkjag wrote: »
    I be curious to see your set up for this.. I have significant amount of points in the proper area.. run with trac or sensor deflector, and still the skill does not work right for me.. Hopefully, you can share with me offline your set up. I do run aux very high

    What I did not know was the eps transfer , that good to know.. thanks :)


    Also, I do use sensor scan in battle all the time...

    While it's not me that does the actual popping, one of our guys scans and then moves with evasive manuevers. it gives him a much wider range of scanning.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    OP -
    I would love to see all factions open based on yoru current fed level. Since the games PVE revolves around fed story lines I think it would be great to allow for feds to be able to get a klingon of that level by choosing that faction. At least at RA5 this would solve the lack of klingon players right now and with upcomign factions to be player allowed it would be nice to actually be able to play romulan without having to level up from scratch on nebula and pvp farming.
    Want to pvp at low level klingon side? have a fed of that level......or allow for people to downgrade the level choice on klingon side, so essentially a fed RA5 could play a KDF commander level. the gear and points would still need to be earned so the klingons woudl start off weak but with matches woudl get stronger and stronger.
    IMO this owuld kill the boring TRIBBLE klingon side of things and create a healthy KDF population.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited April 2010
    Reminds me of Tabula Rasa almost that Aku.

    At certain points being able to clone yourself and choose an alternate profession -or in this case faction- with the cloned character

    Can't see it happening though, this games easy enough to grind as is. If it did happen I'd be more expecting to see new Romulan players start off as say Lt Commander 6 (like Klingons starting at lt 6) and then Cardies if they happened at Commander 6.
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