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NGE social backlash all over again.

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
***ORIGINAL POST***

I would like to put this in prospective and reffer to a situtaion in MMO HISTORY that the Devs can actaually look back at and relate to.

Remeber when SOE in one fail swoop destroyed it's own game and then divided what was left of its player base? I'm refering to the player base part of it. They divided the games community into Elders and non-elders. From that day forward SWGs in-game chat and forums where a battle ground of hate fuled by the social status between the two. Mainly due to gifts given to the Elders no one else could ever obtain. But they where really good gifts....not so much the same in STO at this time. But it is starting already.

But the point I am making here is. It's ok to show lifers you appreciate them. But not make the rest of the player base feel lifers are more important then the rest.

***HERE'S WHY.....when someone with a immature nature and low self esteem feels they have been put in a position of high social status they are going to flaunt and taunt. Well.....this REALLY ****es everyone else off. Then your problems start. Problems this game doesn't need.***

***ORIGINAL POST****



EDIT: This post pointed out what happend in SWG AFTER the NGE to the community when it was divided. It did NOT compare the NGE to this patch in any way. You read what you wanted to read if that's what you took from this.

And I never mentioned once anything about wanting LTS items. I just don't want to be called a STO pesant by LTSers. Lol.

Reguardless....my point was proven perfectly by the way you all are treating eachother in this thread. =(
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Lifer's are getting a few trinkets, that is all. Doesn't change the gameplay. BTW, this was mention weeks ago, I don't know why peopl are up in arms today.

    I appreciate a new thread on the issue. I thought this issue was forgotten.


    :rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    No offense, but I don't think this is anywhere near the scale of the SWG NGE. Also, I fail to understand how the NGE divided SWG's player base at all. I think everyone was royally screwed by that one equally, not just a select group.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    What destroyed SWG wasn't the goodies. It was the NGE itself.

    Also unlike the gift of the Elders, anyone can get the current lifer benefits at any time they want them. Its not a limited deal. You can get on the program whenever you like. The Elder gift you either got or you didn't ever get it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    mmogamer35 wrote:
    I would like to put this in prospective and reffer to a situtaion in MMO HISTORY that the Devs can actaually look back at and relate to.

    Remeber when SOE in one fail swoop destroyed it's own game and then divided what was left of its player base? I'm refering to the player base part of it. They divided the games community into Elders and non-elders. From that day forward SWGs in-game chat and forums where a battle ground of hate fuled by the social status between the two. Mainly due to gifts given to the Elders no one else could ever obtain. But they where really good gifts....not so much the same in STO at this time. But it is starting already.

    But the point I am making here is. It's ok to show lifers you appreciate them. But not make the rest of the player base feel lifers are more important then the rest.

    ***HERE'S WHY.....when someone with a immature nature and low self esteem feels they have been put in a position of high social status they are going to flaunt and taunt. Well.....this REALLY ****es everyone else off. Then your problems start. Problems this game doesn't need.***

    I dont think we have got to that yet but its heading that way for sure.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    From what I've seen, it's self-important non-lifers causing the issues. After a bunch of topics complaining about the fact that we have a blue forum name, one lifer made a joke thread about it, and a non-lifer with a sense of humor made another. Since the immature non-lifers couldn't take a joke, the problem continues today.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I am sorry op but the bitterness surrounding the NGE had nothing to do with elder or non elder. It had to do to the shafting people got.


    Quite frankly I am offended that you even compare the two. SOE can burn in a cataclysm of flames and it will never erase the damage they have done to Elder or non elder alike.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Here's what I learned in this thread:

    Non-lifer complaint about favoritism.

    Lifer reply: Not true.

    Lifer Reply: Not true.

    Lifer Reply: Not true.

    Non-lifer reply: True.


    It's like there's a conspiracy to prove the thread starter right in 4 replies or less...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    NinetyNine wrote:
    Here's what I learned in this thread:

    Non-lifer complaint about favoritism.

    Lifer reply: Not true.

    Lifer Reply: Not true.

    Lifer Reply: Not true.

    Non-lifer reply: True.


    It's like there's a conspiracy to prove the thread starter right in 4 replies or less...

    Poor person: Rich people want you to stay poor!
    Rich person: No we don't.
    Rich person: No we don't.
    Rich person: No we don't.
    Another poor person: I'm not rich yet, so yeah they do.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    mmogamer35 wrote:
    I would like to put this in prospective and reffer to a situtaion in MMO HISTORY that the Devs can actaually look back at and relate to.

    Remeber when SOE in one fail swoop destroyed it's own game and then divided what was left of its player base? I'm refering to the player base part of it. They divided the games community into Elders and non-elders. From that day forward SWGs in-game chat and forums where a battle ground of hate fuled by the social status between the two. Mainly due to gifts given to the Elders no one else could ever obtain. But they where really good gifts....not so much the same in STO at this time. But it is starting already.

    But the point I am making here is. It's ok to show lifers you appreciate them. But not make the rest of the player base feel lifers are more important then the rest.

    ***HERE'S WHY.....when someone with a immature nature and low self esteem feels they have been put in a position of high social status they are going to flaunt and taunt. Well.....this REALLY ****es everyone else off. Then your problems start. Problems this game doesn't need.***

    You are way off , it had nothing at all to do with elders status, SWG was destroyed becuse of Lightsaber envy , "its not fair he is a Jedi and I'm not" thats it in a nut shell
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    These perks are in no way on the scale of what happened with NGE. Sorry, that station lifers get, the ugly comm badge (which no one in their right mind would use), the special chat channel, the stupid blue name on the forums thing, none of it, Is in any way game changing or any more socially stratifying that some one saying they are a lifer on the forums or in game. Hell, I see the station and the chat channel as safe zones they can go and not worry about flack from people who have a problem with lifers and just kick back with each other with no concern for being dismissed as lifers or ignored because of "lifers have no say" attitudes.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    AtomicFB wrote:
    I am sorry op but the bitterness surrounding the NGE had nothing to do with elder or non elder. It had to do to the shafting people got.


    Quite frankly I am offended that you even compare the two. SOE can burn in a cataclysm of flames and it will never erase the damage they have done to Elder or non elder alike.

    /agreed
    10 char
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I remember the NGE from SWG and it had more do with the way they borked combat and skills. It wasn't the Elder vs Non-Elder debate that was a problem. I rember how disappointed I was about not being an Elder for, oh, about 3 seconds, then I got over it.

    The perks for lifers here are nothing special. The captains Table allows us to do the same thing everyone else can do at DS9. Also the Cap's space station uses the same VFX as Solar Winds. That's right, the Solar Winds PvP that no one plays because the solar wind effect strains some peoples video cards.

    Its really not a big deal.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I love how every time something happens in an MMO that changes something on ANY level, SOEs Star Wars is brought up. The soon follow up will be Cryptic = TRIBBLE I'm sure.

    Everyone needs to calm the heck down. It's a Space Station....right next to *GASP*....ANOTHER SPACE STATION!!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Poor person: Rich people want you to stay poor!
    Rich person: No we don't.
    Rich person: No we don't.
    Rich person: No we don't.
    Another poor person: I'm not rich yet, so yeah they do.

    Close, but this is about perceptions, not practice.

    Poor person: Rich people don't care about poverty.
    Rich person: Yes we do.
    Rich person: Yes we do.
    Rich person: Yes we do.
    Another poor person: Um, no, you really don't all that much.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    well the biggest difference is STO started out as the NGE

    the current issues are more related to a lack of good public relations
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I personally don't mind the lifer perks, I look at it as we get advanced access because I am hoping they implement another system for those that have paid for a year worth of subscription or two. They can call it what they will but I do believe those that show they are willing to keep paying and playing in the long run like the lifers should get the benefit also.

    I have to say so far the perks aren't a wow factor to me, yeah the station is nice and looks good but then you lose communication with part of the player base so not something I personally want, as to the blue on our names... well I don't see how that is a big deal. Yay... my name is in blue..... seriously its a decent perk but don't worry about it, we don't know what the future will hold and until they put non lifer names in a red text and in chains I don't see a problem.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    From what I've seen, it's self-important non-lifers causing the issues. After a bunch of topics complaining about the fact that we have a blue forum name, one lifer made a joke thread about it, and a non-lifer with a sense of humor made another. Since the immature non-lifers couldn't take a joke, the problem continues today.

    Yes alot of NonLifers are up in arms over nothing. But need I remind you that the thread created by the Lifer, the flame war was already forsee able? Yea a number of us got it, it was a bit funny. But this is the interwebz. Start a fire, expect and explosion. Everyone that went in that thread and played along with the joke, myself included. Are as much to blame for the fire. Lets not try to buck off the blame now because its not funny anymore and its gotten ugly.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Staran wrote: »
    Lifer's are getting a few trinkets, that is all. Doesn't change the gameplay. BTW, this was mention weeks ago, I don't know why peopl are up in arms today.

    I appreciate a new thread on the issue. I thought this issue was forgotten.


    :rolleyes:

    IT DOES CHANGE GAMEPLAY

    jesus christ almighty, do you not understand that there are two sections of in-game areas / content that the rest of us can't access unless we pony up an obscene amount of money? Yes I say obscene because actual content and not C-Store cosmetic changes, should apply to every single one of us not just people who have a bigger wallet than others.

    They are catering to people with more money. They've basically said those with less money aren't worth a damn. You can try to spin it all you want, this isn't even read-between-the-lines type of smuggery, it's right there in our faces.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    NinetyNine wrote:
    Close, but this is about perceptions, not practice.

    Poor person: Rich people don't care about poverty.
    Rich person: Yes we do.
    Rich person: Yes we do.
    Rich person: Yes we do.
    Another poor person: Um, no, you really don't all that much.

    Again, you're right, it's about perceptions. The only people having this perception that lifers are somehow "better" are the ones who aren't lifers.

    See the OP for example. Because people who paid anywhere from 240 to 300 bucks for a subscription to a game got a blue name, a room, a title and a combadge, somehow we think we're better, and Cryptic only cares about lifetime subs. Not true in either case.

    The season 1 update? Paid for, at least in part, by us lifers. Part of Season 2, that's supposed to be much more content-heavy? Paid for, at least in part, by us lifers. Over the short term, we're financing a major part of the development of this game. Now, most of us don't give a TRIBBLE about having gotten the bonuses, and wouldn't have cared if we didn't get anything. However, members of the dev team made this stuff for us - on their own time, supposedly - just to say thank you for giving them a paycheck.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Personally, I don't see what all the fuss is about. Lifers made an upfront commitment to a game that, from reading most of the forum threads, wasn't going to last a year. Here's yet another thread that, while it doesn't expressly state it's going to fail, talks about how the game it going to hell.

    It's all a bunch of pixels. If some Lifer with low self-esteem tries to use his "status" to make you feel bad, what does it say about YOUR self-esteem when he succeeds? Grow thicker skin. A blue name should not cause you emotional distress just because you don't have it.

    Finally... the comparison to NGE is inappropriate. NGE took the existing WORK people put in to becoming Jedi and made it worthless. Cryptic is just rewarding the people that paid them more money up front. Maybe in two years they'll give the monthly subscribers that stuck it out that long something cooler than the Lifers have, since they've paid more money.... who's to say?

    But, if all the doomsayers are correct and the game DOES fail within a year... you can laugh at all the lifers that got screwed. So there is a bright side, right?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    mavgeek wrote: »
    IT DOES CHANGE GAMEPLAY

    jesus christ almighty, do you not understand that there are two sections of in-game areas / content that the rest of us can't access unless we pony up an obscene amount of money? Yes I say obscene because actual content and not C-Store cosmetic changes, should apply to every single one of us not just people who have a bigger wallet than others.

    They are catering to people with more money. They've basically said those with less money aren't worth a damn. You can try to spin it all you want, this isn't even read-between-the-lines type of smuggery, it's right there in our faces.

    Wait, you're saying a room that's a lamer version of Sol is changing gameplay, simply because some people can't get to it?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Wow, NGE comparison? Seriously?

    Cryptic hasn't pulled the rug out from under us by stripping out half of the gameplay mechanics. I don't see any comparison at all here.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yes alot of NonLifers are up in arms over nothing. But need I remind you that the thread created by the Lifer, the flame war was already forsee able? Yea a number of us got it, it was a bit funny. But this is the interwebz. Start a fire, expect and explosion. Everyone that went in that thread and played along with the joke, myself included. Are as much to blame for the fire. Lets not try to buck off the blame now because its not funny anymore and its gotten ugly.

    It was already going on, which is what inspired the lifer to make the thread. Did it help it along? Maybe, but it's not like it was going to end if that thread wasn't made.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    mavgeek wrote: »
    IT DOES CHANGE GAMEPLAY

    jesus christ almighty, do you not understand that there are two sections of in-game areas / content that the rest of us can't access unless we pony up an obscene amount of money? Yes I say obscene because actual content and not C-Store cosmetic changes, should apply to every single one of us not just people who have a bigger wallet than others.

    They are catering to people with more money. They've basically said those with less money aren't worth a damn. You can try to spin it all you want, this isn't even read-between-the-lines type of smuggery, it's right there in our faces.

    Its a bar, only a bit more shiny then the new one in the Neutral Zone. But it has absolutely nothing that is gamebreaking. Infact, it comes up short in the fact that most of the stuff they DO need to interact with, is not in the Captains Table. Its still at Sol, SB39, DS9, K7 and BGO. They arent catering to people with more money. The Tribble testers got a better item (the tribble of borg) then the Lifers got as a thank you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    NinetyNine wrote:
    Here's what I learned in this thread:

    Non-lifer complaint about favoritism.

    Lifer reply: Not true.

    Lifer Reply: Not true.

    Lifer Reply: Not true.

    Non-lifer reply: True.


    It's like there's a conspiracy to prove the thread starter right in 4 replies or less...

    LOL! 99...you're so smart and pretty and funny. You're the only one here who can see a clear picture on these forums.

    To the other folks:

    1) I'm pointing out a clear social problem that is growing. Not QQing. Stick your head in the sand if you like.

    2) I was pointing out the "SOCIAL" backlash of the Elder/Non-Elder problem in SWG after the NGE to STO. Not the NEG itself to STO.

    3) Don't tell me their wasn't a problem in SWG between Elder and Non-Elder Jedi. I was there from the start and read thousands of posts over the years of hatred between the two. And I seen it in-game on a daily bases.

    I just don't want to see that come to STO. And I'm sorry I made a post about it. But the problem won't go away until Kids that are lifers stop telling non-lifers they are better than them.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    mavgeek wrote: »
    IT DOES CHANGE GAMEPLAY

    jesus christ almighty, do you not understand that there are two sections of in-game areas / content that the rest of us can't access unless we pony up an obscene amount of money? Yes I say obscene because actual content and not C-Store cosmetic changes, should apply to every single one of us not just people who have a bigger wallet than others.

    They are catering to people with more money. They've basically said those with less money aren't worth a damn. You can try to spin it all you want, this isn't even read-between-the-lines type of smuggery, it's right there in our faces.

    Please. It doesnt affect gameplay at all. There is zero you can do on the station that you couldn't do elsewhere much easier. They even added another social area for all players in the same patch. So even the 'a zone to socialize with klingons' excuse doen't apply.

    All the stuff that actually affected actual gameplay in this patch went to each and every player of the game. Including you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    The only people having this perception that lifers are somehow "better" are the ones who aren't lifers.

    Over the short term, we're financing a major part of the development of this game.


    Lulz. I edited out the parts where you didn't totally contradict yourself. Also, since there weren't any parts like that, I edited out the redundant parts where you contradicted yourself in a repetitious manner.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    It was already going on, which is what inspired the lifer to make the thread. Did it help it along? Maybe, but it's not like it was going to end if that thread wasn't made.

    So because it was already going, and not making it wasnt going to stop it. It makes it okay to give those griefers something to point at?

    Sorry but like I said, those involved are just as much to blame. You included.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    So can I still get a lifer account... I didn't do it because I didn't trust it. I like the game.. But they can have there fancy room... we still can pwn a lifer in pvp right.. lets keep the fighting in the phasers..
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    mmogamer35 wrote:
    I would like to put this in prospective and reffer to a situtaion in MMO HISTORY that the Devs can actaually look back at and relate to.

    Remeber when SOE in one fail swoop destroyed it's own game and then divided what was left of its player base? I'm refering to the player base part of it. They divided the games community into Elders and non-elders. From that day forward SWGs in-game chat and forums where a battle ground of hate fuled by the social status between the two. Mainly due to gifts given to the Elders no one else could ever obtain. But they where really good gifts....not so much the same in STO at this time. But it is starting already.

    But the point I am making here is. It's ok to show lifers you appreciate them. But not make the rest of the player base feel lifers are more important then the rest.

    ***HERE'S WHY.....when someone with a immature nature and low self esteem feels they have been put in a position of high social status they are going to flaunt and taunt. Well.....this REALLY ****es everyone else off. Then your problems start. Problems this game doesn't need.***

    If you really want the perks offered to lifetime subscribers, then buy a lifetime subscription. Problem solved.
This discussion has been closed.