same everyone says it takes hours and hours... doesn't really sound fun just something people do for "OMGLOOT"
Um... you don't get great loot. First time I did it, I got a green item as the drop. Talk about a waste of 5 hours for something I could have gotten inside of 10 minutes. Second time, the guy leading told use how to do the need/greed so we all got the same purple at the end. Nothing over the top great since could get the same doing enough dailies but at least it wasn't green again.
OK just so people know I'm as casual as a gamer can get 1 maybe 2 hours every day or two. Personally I can run a newbie PuG through this in about 1:30mins maybe 2hrs depending on the team. If I get a PuG of experienced guys we usually do this in under an hour, although I know it's going to become slightly trickier when season one releases (plasma jets etc). Seriously though this mission is far from impossible and is in NO WAY geared towards hardcore gamers. It was a little frustrating the first time I did it but now it's easy as hell.
When we get to the final room if I'm in a newbie group I'll spend 5mis explaining what to do. One new group I lead got to the queen without a single person falling in and the 4 nodes where taken down in one lap. I don't really care about the rewards I just do it for the fun, but seriously if this in nerfed it will mean it can be done with little or no team work and it will just become like every other ground mission (kill, move on, kill, move on) and then it won't be fun anymore.
/me wonders what the point of this thread is other than to try and make all the people that do enjoy it feel bad.
You are likely right, Coderanger, but can you blame people who only want some character progression once max level is reached.
Is it fair that B'tran cluster has bugged content, aka the enemy confrontation that has no spawns. Is it fair that those 5th order badges and bridge officer points pile up with nothing to spend them on? Is it fair for people who enjoy space combat missions to be forced to play wack a mole with the clusters looking for a working space mission.
I wont even go into crafting or pvp. People want to feel like they have accomplished something, that they have defined their character a tiny bit more with each log in. Any mmo on the market will tell you that putting all your eggs in one basket, like raiding, is a recipe for disaster.
I don't want to raid, and i don't want to interfere with those who enjoy that type of gameplay, but in this state STO offers nothing, nothing, for casual oriented roleplayers like myself.
OK just so people know I'm as casual as a gamer can get 1 maybe 2 hours every day or two. Personally I can run a newbie PuG through this in about 1:30mins maybe 2hrs depending on the team. If I get a PuG of experienced guys we usually do this in under an hour, although I know it's going to become slightly trickier when season one releases (plasma jets etc). Seriously though this mission is far from impossible and is in NO WAY geared towards hardcore gamers. It was a little frustrating the first time I did it but now it's easy as hell.
When we get to the final room if I'm in a newbie group I'll spend 5mis explaining what to do. One new group I lead got to the queen without a single person falling in and the 4 nodes where taken down in one lap. I don't really care about the rewards I just do it for the fun, but seriously if this in nerfed it will mean it can be done with little or no team work and it will just become like every other ground mission (kill, move on, kill, move on) and then it won't be fun anymore.
I should say something to this and that 3 hour one I did the second time. I can see why Mothball would say under 2 hours. He is right. Remember I said the second time (just under 3 hour run) that someone got stuck and couldn't move. Took about 20 minutes to get his replacement.
Then one guy was having issues with the jumping and always went into the plasma. Finally we put him in the center platform to clear the path ahead and went smoother. That team could have done it under 2 hours if not for the stuck team mate and one team mate not jumping too well. And I was the second most experienced one on the team and only did it once before. And my first time was before you *HAD* to upload the virus. (Early bug that was fixed) So running smoothly without 1 getting stuck and the other with jumping issues that team could have been done in under 2 I'd think.
And we did take a 15 minute break during it too not to mention unplanned AFKs
This mission is not that hard.......... it just takes some coordination and team work.
It is actually pretty well done, small and easy compared to most PvE Raids in other games.
Hell, most PvE raids in other MMO's take weeks (if not longer) to get past the first room, let alone to the Boss. This can be done from start to finish in a few hours.
I think they did a pretty good job designing it for the casual PvE player.
I did it with 3 Friends and a friend of one of those friends. We died allot, especially in the Last room, but got it done in about 3 hours from start to finish. That was with all of us but the friend of a friend never doing it before and one other who just hit RA5, 10 minutes before going.
Have 2 fed RA5 admirals...one tac and the other sci/doc. Have no interest in it based on quest line being too long, and takes too much time for little reward. Not worth my time.
You are likely right, Coderanger, but can you blame people who only want some character progression once max level is reached.
Is it fair that B'tran cluster has bugged content, aka the enemy confrontation that has no spawns. Is it fair that those 5th order badges and bridge officer points pile up with nothing to spend them on? Is it fair for people who enjoy space combat missions to be forced to play wack a mole with the clusters looking for a working space mission.
I wont even go into crafting or pvp. People want to feel like they have accomplished something, that they have defined their character a tiny bit more with each log in. Any mmo on the market will tell you that putting all your eggs in one basket, like raiding, is a recipe for disaster.
I don't want to raid, and i don't want to interfere with those who enjoy that type of gameplay, but in this state STO offers nothing, nothing, for casual oriented roleplayers like myself.
Again I refuse to be placed into a category of trying to make others feel bad. I am highly frustrated ,because I want to complete this mission ONE TIME. I am a lifetime member. I have been with the game since day one of Open Beta. I enjoy the game. I just would like to complete the mission once. Post after post on here says the same thing I haven't tried it or that they have tried it and given up.
As my mother often said NO ONE CONTROLS HOW YOU FEEL EXCEPT YOURSELF.
dunno about him but for me yeah why make another character? booooring. although I suppose it is the only thing left to do.
Rolling alts is a part of every MMO. I do not find it boring I like trying new races/class/build combinations. I was such an altoholic for a while I had 3 accounts I was paying for to hold all my characters in EQ2. I finally had to quit the game consumed all my time.
Again I refuse to be placed into a category of trying to make others feel bad. I am highly frustrated ,because I want to complete this mission ONE TIME. I am a lifetime member. I have been with the game since day one of Open Beta. I enjoy the game. I just would like to complete the mission once. Post after post on here says the same thing I haven't tried it or that they have tried it and given up.
As my mother often said NO ONE CONTROLS HOW YOU FEEL EXCEPT YOURSELF.
Forgive me but, you say you have been with the game since day one of open beta yet your join date is feb-03 which would mean you where never in OB as Open Beta ran from January 12 to 26, 2010.
OK just so people know I'm as casual as a gamer can get 1 maybe 2 hours every day or two. Personally I can run a newbie PuG through this in about 1:30mins maybe 2hrs depending on the team. If I get a PuG of experienced guys we usually do this in under an hour, although I know it's going to become slightly trickier when season one releases (plasma jets etc). Seriously though this mission is far from impossible and is in NO WAY geared towards hardcore gamers. It was a little frustrating the first time I did it but now it's easy as hell.
When we get to the final room if I'm in a newbie group I'll spend 5mis explaining what to do. One new group I lead got to the queen without a single person falling in and the 4 nodes where taken down in one lap. I don't really care about the rewards I just do it for the fun, but seriously if this in nerfed it will mean it can be done with little or no team work and it will just become like every other ground mission (kill, move on, kill, move on) and then it won't be fun anymore.
3 Weeks the mission has been out. I have no job at this time. When I am awake I play Star Trek unless I am spending my time on Monster looking for a job. The rest of the time is Star Trek. Even if I was the absolute worst player to ever live the odds say I should have finished the mission ONCE. I have not finished it. Instead I have had to deal with players who will try non stop or 1 member of the team will just drop out of the mission forcing us to look for another player. So many people quiit I started putting the people who just dropped on my ignore list.
World Of Warcraft has some of the absolute worst RAID INSTANCES. These Raids can take LITERALLY HOURS ,but they always can be completed. This mission specifically the part tied to DEEPER INTO THE MYSTERY. In reality should be completed within 15 minutes ,but that assumes EVERY SINGLE PLAYER on the team will know what is going on and how to complete the mission.
When I run this I Spend my time knocking the borg off the other players who have jumped with me. I have tried to be a follower I have tried to be the leader. It is nearly impossible to get a group together for this mission that can complete it.
However or whatever I say. I am just in the wrong and obvivously have no idea what I am doing.
Forgive me but, you say you have been with the game since day one of open beta yet your join date is feb-03 which would mean you where never in OB as Open Beta ran from January 12 to 26, 2010.
Follow the link note the time stamp 01-24-2010, 03:40 PM be sure you have your facts right. Did it ever occur to you my join date means the date I got my key from the box and offically signed up????
It can be done by 3 people (less is not possible, since you have to lower the shields). And I would 5 player instances hardly call raiding.
It is sold as a raid, but I agree it really doesn't seem like enough to call it one. I would like them to add more solo content in place of zones like this.
I have completed this mission every single day since it was released. Sometimes in PUG (Pick Up Groups) sometimes not. Sometimes it took a while (Some of the worse PUGs) and sometimes it went smoothly. The best time I have done was just over an hour (I usually quote 1:15 rounding up) from start to finish.
It doesn't take a lot of time to complete. It isn't insanely hard. It is, in fact, a little bit of fun. The most fun I have had playing this game so far (other than face rolling some noobs in T1 PvP). It was also the first time that anyone has actually been forced to play their role, use some tactics, and work as a cohesive team. That is why people think it is hard, for one of the aforementioned reasons.
There is a learning curve, which is an investment in time, which will only better you as a STO player - to learn your class, to develop a cohesive team, and develop tactics together. Stop banging your heads, and revise your strategy.
/me wonders what the point of this thread is other than to try and make all the people that do enjoy it feel bad.
Dear Coderanger, I am sure you and the rest of the dev staff are quite proud of your STF episodes. Unfortunately you bring a brand new mechanic into the game at end game and expect everyone to be happy about it and not become frustrated. If this kind of game play was fostered throughout the game, I believe it would have received a much better reaction from the player base. Making content exclusive to a certain kind of player base while alienating the rest only causes resentment. On a scale of 1-10 difficulty you went from 2 for level 1-45 and then a difficulty 9 from 45+. No room for getting use to that kind of game play.
All the horror stories make me not want to try the STF episodes. I have not heard much praise, only frustration from players.
Dear Coderanger, I am sure you and the rest of the dev staff are quite proud of your STF episodes. Unfortunately you bring a brand new mechanic into the game at end game and expect everyone to be happy about it and not become frustrated. If this kind of game play was fostered throughout the game, I believe it would have received a much better reaction from the player base. Making content exclusive to a certain kind of player base while alienating the rest only causes resentment. On a scale of 1-10 difficulty you went from 2 for level 1-45 and then a difficulty 9 from 45+. No room for getting use to that kind of game play.
All the horror stories make me not want to try the STF episodes. I have not heard much praise, only frustration from players.
Exactly the point yet I am accusseed by the DEV of trying to make others unhappy. I wasn't nor have I been interested in doing anything but making the game better for me My opinion is my opinion and doesn't reflect how others feel unless they somehow agree with me.
I just can't bring myself to join a fleet or do Infected. In LOTRO, I have been a avid raider, I'm in a big active kin (fleet here). I don't know, I have been 95% STO since release. It has been refreshing to play cooperatively (accepting invites, auto-grouping, war zones, PvP). I feel the "MMO" part just fine, even though some others out there do not.
I feel the only part I don't want to do is talk (ventrilo) or chat very much in game. I will chat to be helpful, but thats about it. I think its the games design. You might need others to be cooperative, but you don't need to puzzle out how to defeat something because of a bunch of gaming gimmicks a boss might have that if you don't follow a script you can't win.
Infected may be the most similiar to a normal MMO style quest there is. And that's why I'm avoiding it. I may get the itch to get more into it and join a fleet and all that at some point. But right now I am enjoying the freedom from having to do so.
/me wonders what the point of this thread is other than to try and make all the people that do enjoy it feel bad.
YOU DIDN'T JUST FAIL
YOU FAILED EPICLY. The player base is not a cult of idiots or blind followers. When you made this post it was a direct attempt to rally the troops to make me look bad. It is safe to say the majority of the posters saw thru your thinly veiled attempt. If someone should feel bad it is use for trying to use your position to quash my opinion.
What is the most amazing thing I have a post that I have been keeping alive since 01-30-2010, 12:42 PM http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=90956. It has had 70 Replies and over 1,367 views. Never once has a single Dev said a word about it. Perhaps if I had done the post in a way that was critical of the design or something similar to this post maybe it would have gotten a response.
The Bottom Line: We can talk all we want and post all our ideas and it will FALL on death ears as my post demonstrates ,but present a complaint with legitimate proof and YOU WILL JUMP ALL OVER IT LIKE BEES TO HONEY.
Like I've said elsewhere, the problem with Infected, is that it is the VERY FIRST tactical training raid that any player new to STO will experience. At maximum level.
Let me explain: Other MMOs put in a ramping curve of tactical difficulty, at 10% of max, you get your first instance runs, which team pulling and basic boss tactics.
At 25% this gets harder, with more dangers of pulls going bad, and more complex bosses.
At 50%, more pulls, effort has to be put in to prevent multi-pulls from turning into wipes, boss tactics get yet more complex.
75% starts meaning that more than 2 groups is a guaranteed wipe, and unless a dual pull goes perfectly, you will wipe. Boss fights often require player to stand in certain places, or die instantly.
Max level refines all these skills. You ever fight Heigen the Unclean in WOW? The floor kills you in 2 shots. A good tank MIGHT be able to pull off a double trash pull, but it exhausts healer mana.
And to compound that, every class in STO has pretty much identical HP, armor, and DPS values. So the FIRST jumping puzzle, instead of being at say, LtC with a non-lethal floor, is at max. There's no Commander mission that requires players to deal with adds while beating a main boss. It's all just lumped in to one mission.
Sure, SOME of us can deal with it. The ones that cannot, fail. A lot of those would do better if they were eased in to the concepts as they levelled up.
If the dev that designed the Infected posted here (I think it was Gozer) I would say the same thing to his (virtual) face. I find The Infected enjoyably shooty but a bit bland until the final room, at which point I just get annoyed. The new changes increase the annoyance factor for me. I'm not a big fan of gameplay that makes you jump through hoops and I'm really not a fan of the infinitely respawning drones that serve mostly to annoy and occasionally interrupt while you're trying to jump. Adding more instadeath places that basically disallows the use of the minimal cover mechanic built into the game just pushes it over into 'never bothering again' territory.
Comments
dunno about him but for me yeah why make another character? booooring. although I suppose it is the only thing left to do.
QFT!
What is the point? Have a couple of new abilites? Thats all?
ya no thanks!
Um... you don't get great loot. First time I did it, I got a green item as the drop. Talk about a waste of 5 hours for something I could have gotten inside of 10 minutes. Second time, the guy leading told use how to do the need/greed so we all got the same purple at the end. Nothing over the top great since could get the same doing enough dailies but at least it wasn't green again.
When we get to the final room if I'm in a newbie group I'll spend 5mis explaining what to do. One new group I lead got to the queen without a single person falling in and the 4 nodes where taken down in one lap. I don't really care about the rewards I just do it for the fun, but seriously if this in nerfed it will mean it can be done with little or no team work and it will just become like every other ground mission (kill, move on, kill, move on) and then it won't be fun anymore.
You are likely right, Coderanger, but can you blame people who only want some character progression once max level is reached.
Is it fair that B'tran cluster has bugged content, aka the enemy confrontation that has no spawns. Is it fair that those 5th order badges and bridge officer points pile up with nothing to spend them on? Is it fair for people who enjoy space combat missions to be forced to play wack a mole with the clusters looking for a working space mission.
I wont even go into crafting or pvp. People want to feel like they have accomplished something, that they have defined their character a tiny bit more with each log in. Any mmo on the market will tell you that putting all your eggs in one basket, like raiding, is a recipe for disaster.
I don't want to raid, and i don't want to interfere with those who enjoy that type of gameplay, but in this state STO offers nothing, nothing, for casual oriented roleplayers like myself.
I should say something to this and that 3 hour one I did the second time. I can see why Mothball would say under 2 hours. He is right. Remember I said the second time (just under 3 hour run) that someone got stuck and couldn't move. Took about 20 minutes to get his replacement.
Then one guy was having issues with the jumping and always went into the plasma. Finally we put him in the center platform to clear the path ahead and went smoother. That team could have done it under 2 hours if not for the stuck team mate and one team mate not jumping too well. And I was the second most experienced one on the team and only did it once before. And my first time was before you *HAD* to upload the virus. (Early bug that was fixed) So running smoothly without 1 getting stuck and the other with jumping issues that team could have been done in under 2 I'd think.
And we did take a 15 minute break during it too not to mention unplanned AFKs
It is actually pretty well done, small and easy compared to most PvE Raids in other games.
Hell, most PvE raids in other MMO's take weeks (if not longer) to get past the first room, let alone to the Boss. This can be done from start to finish in a few hours.
I think they did a pretty good job designing it for the casual PvE player.
I did it with 3 Friends and a friend of one of those friends. We died allot, especially in the Last room, but got it done in about 3 hours from start to finish. That was with all of us but the friend of a friend never doing it before and one other who just hit RA5, 10 minutes before going.
Again I refuse to be placed into a category of trying to make others feel bad. I am highly frustrated ,because I want to complete this mission ONE TIME. I am a lifetime member. I have been with the game since day one of Open Beta. I enjoy the game. I just would like to complete the mission once. Post after post on here says the same thing I haven't tried it or that they have tried it and given up.
As my mother often said NO ONE CONTROLS HOW YOU FEEL EXCEPT YOURSELF.
Rolling alts is a part of every MMO. I do not find it boring I like trying new races/class/build combinations. I was such an altoholic for a while I had 3 accounts I was paying for to hold all my characters in EQ2. I finally had to quit the game consumed all my time.
though I have not tried it yet and likely never will since it cant be done with three people I am told. Oh how I love raids ..not
It can be done by 3 people (less is not possible, since you have to lower the shields). And I would 5 player instances hardly call raiding.
Forgive me but, you say you have been with the game since day one of open beta yet your join date is feb-03 which would mean you where never in OB as Open Beta ran from January 12 to 26, 2010.
3 Weeks the mission has been out. I have no job at this time. When I am awake I play Star Trek unless I am spending my time on Monster looking for a job. The rest of the time is Star Trek. Even if I was the absolute worst player to ever live the odds say I should have finished the mission ONCE. I have not finished it. Instead I have had to deal with players who will try non stop or 1 member of the team will just drop out of the mission forcing us to look for another player. So many people quiit I started putting the people who just dropped on my ignore list.
World Of Warcraft has some of the absolute worst RAID INSTANCES. These Raids can take LITERALLY HOURS ,but they always can be completed. This mission specifically the part tied to DEEPER INTO THE MYSTERY. In reality should be completed within 15 minutes ,but that assumes EVERY SINGLE PLAYER on the team will know what is going on and how to complete the mission.
When I run this I Spend my time knocking the borg off the other players who have jumped with me. I have tried to be a follower I have tried to be the leader. It is nearly impossible to get a group together for this mission that can complete it.
However or whatever I say. I am just in the wrong and obvivously have no idea what I am doing.
Follow the link note the time stamp 01-24-2010, 03:40 PM be sure you have your facts right. Did it ever occur to you my join date means the date I got my key from the box and offically signed up????
01-24-2010, 03:40 PM http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=81229
It is sold as a raid, but I agree it really doesn't seem like enough to call it one. I would like them to add more solo content in place of zones like this.
It doesn't take a lot of time to complete. It isn't insanely hard. It is, in fact, a little bit of fun. The most fun I have had playing this game so far (other than face rolling some noobs in T1 PvP). It was also the first time that anyone has actually been forced to play their role, use some tactics, and work as a cohesive team. That is why people think it is hard, for one of the aforementioned reasons.
There is a learning curve, which is an investment in time, which will only better you as a STO player - to learn your class, to develop a cohesive team, and develop tactics together. Stop banging your heads, and revise your strategy.
Dear Coderanger, I am sure you and the rest of the dev staff are quite proud of your STF episodes. Unfortunately you bring a brand new mechanic into the game at end game and expect everyone to be happy about it and not become frustrated. If this kind of game play was fostered throughout the game, I believe it would have received a much better reaction from the player base. Making content exclusive to a certain kind of player base while alienating the rest only causes resentment. On a scale of 1-10 difficulty you went from 2 for level 1-45 and then a difficulty 9 from 45+. No room for getting use to that kind of game play.
All the horror stories make me not want to try the STF episodes. I have not heard much praise, only frustration from players.
Exactly the point yet I am accusseed by the DEV of trying to make others unhappy. I wasn't nor have I been interested in doing anything but making the game better for me My opinion is my opinion and doesn't reflect how others feel unless they somehow agree with me.
I feel the only part I don't want to do is talk (ventrilo) or chat very much in game. I will chat to be helpful, but thats about it. I think its the games design. You might need others to be cooperative, but you don't need to puzzle out how to defeat something because of a bunch of gaming gimmicks a boss might have that if you don't follow a script you can't win.
Infected may be the most similiar to a normal MMO style quest there is. And that's why I'm avoiding it. I may get the itch to get more into it and join a fleet and all that at some point. But right now I am enjoying the freedom from having to do so.
Same,
Mainly because so many elitists won't let me group because I'm a tac/science vessel
Did you just finish work a few hours ago?
I would like to do it but time and patience with other people is lacking. I am sure I would like. I do enjoy the game.
YOU DIDN'T JUST FAIL
YOU FAILED EPICLY. The player base is not a cult of idiots or blind followers. When you made this post it was a direct attempt to rally the troops to make me look bad. It is safe to say the majority of the posters saw thru your thinly veiled attempt. If someone should feel bad it is use for trying to use your position to quash my opinion.
What is the most amazing thing I have a post that I have been keeping alive since 01-30-2010, 12:42 PM http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=90956. It has had 70 Replies and over 1,367 views. Never once has a single Dev said a word about it. Perhaps if I had done the post in a way that was critical of the design or something similar to this post maybe it would have gotten a response.
The Bottom Line: We can talk all we want and post all our ideas and it will FALL on death ears as my post demonstrates ,but present a complaint with legitimate proof and YOU WILL JUMP ALL OVER IT LIKE BEES TO HONEY.
Let me explain: Other MMOs put in a ramping curve of tactical difficulty, at 10% of max, you get your first instance runs, which team pulling and basic boss tactics.
At 25% this gets harder, with more dangers of pulls going bad, and more complex bosses.
At 50%, more pulls, effort has to be put in to prevent multi-pulls from turning into wipes, boss tactics get yet more complex.
75% starts meaning that more than 2 groups is a guaranteed wipe, and unless a dual pull goes perfectly, you will wipe. Boss fights often require player to stand in certain places, or die instantly.
Max level refines all these skills. You ever fight Heigen the Unclean in WOW? The floor kills you in 2 shots. A good tank MIGHT be able to pull off a double trash pull, but it exhausts healer mana.
And to compound that, every class in STO has pretty much identical HP, armor, and DPS values. So the FIRST jumping puzzle, instead of being at say, LtC with a non-lethal floor, is at max. There's no Commander mission that requires players to deal with adds while beating a main boss. It's all just lumped in to one mission.
Sure, SOME of us can deal with it. The ones that cannot, fail. A lot of those would do better if they were eased in to the concepts as they levelled up.
Actually I'm pretty sure it's to make the content designers feel bad.
And frankly, I find the final room annoying and unenjoyable myself.
You do realize that Coderanger is DEV
You know that using the engineer exploit (which will be fixed with the next patch) is a widespread strategy to do "Infected"?
Yes?
I also know he mostly works on backend stuff.
If the dev that designed the Infected posted here (I think it was Gozer) I would say the same thing to his (virtual) face. I find The Infected enjoyably shooty but a bit bland until the final room, at which point I just get annoyed. The new changes increase the annoyance factor for me. I'm not a big fan of gameplay that makes you jump through hoops and I'm really not a fan of the infinitely respawning drones that serve mostly to annoy and occasionally interrupt while you're trying to jump. Adding more instadeath places that basically disallows the use of the minimal cover mechanic built into the game just pushes it over into 'never bothering again' territory.