test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

RSP Changes? Tribble

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
edited March 2010 in PvP Gameplay
I'd post this in Tribble but for some reason I can't. Maybe you need to copy a char over or somethign before you can post.

Anyway, I saw the post about the big 3 and I wanted to know what they're doing to RSP. I don't see anything about it in the patch notes, even though I didn't look too hard. Basically, if they don't at least lower the duration on this ability, no one is going to be pvping so I'm curious as to whether or not I'll be playing this game again in the future.

Keep the flames out please I could care less about trolls. All I want to know is if the ability is being changed, and if so, to what. Thanks
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I heard that they're nerfing multiple RSP's so that can't be stacked. Although this may have just been a rumor.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    RSP doesn't need a nerf. Yes its frustrating and annoying, but it is entirely balanced by its ridiculously long cooldown. 15s of life for an escort/raptor/sci ship and then they can't use it again for ~3 minutes. For cruisers/BCs its their only way to shield tank. EPtS is pathetic for that, and if they went with 2 science teams, how are they going to do hull repair? And if all they have is multiple RSPs, then they are much less effective overall.

    The current idea, however, is to make SNB even more of an IWIN button and make it remove buffs, like RSP, FBP, attack patterns, really just anything as I understand it. That, of course would solve the "problem" with RSP.

    You may like that idea initially, but think about that. If there is a science captain on the opposing side, and you are an escort or science ship that depends on RSP, you may as well not even have it, because every time you try to put it up, it could be stripped immediately. That is not right.

    RSP is already counterable through several methods. Power drain from target subsystems or Tyken's, system disables from target subsystems or boarding parties, simply waiting for it to expire, using torpedoes, or plainly even continuing to shoot endlessly at it doing bleedthrough damage.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I never had any problems with Rsp.

    With my Scence Vessel I'am not even using RSP in PvP, I favor extend shields, since I have so many Shield Heals/Buffs... a 3min cooldown skill with 15sec duration is not viable enough for me.

    When I encounter one of those perma RSP Cruisers with my Raptor, I simply ignore him, because through wasting all his Engineer slots for RSP he is pretty much useless for his team anyway.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    LnD-Rash wrote: »
    When I encounter one of those perma RSP Cruisers with my Raptor, I simply ignore him, because through wasting all his Engineer slots for RSP he is pretty much useless for his team anyway.

    Well... thats one way to see it; another is to consider that while he self heals; he can still do full dps on your team; killing quite a few. And that's one target you're not killing; so 1 less potential point for your team. Just make sure you get your priorities right; kill whoever will die faster first.

    The ability to remove buffs is one of the fundamental things that were missing from STO; the other being the ability to buy gear/skills to raise your chances to resist a debuff / lessen their effect .
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    hivewasp wrote: »
    Well... thats one way to see it; another is to consider that while he self heals; he can still do full dps on your team; killing quite a few. And that's one target you're not killing; so 1 less potential point for your team. Just make sure you get your priorities right; kill whoever will die faster first.

    The ability to remove buffs is one of the fundamental things that were missing from STO; the other being the ability to buy gear/skills to raise your chances to resist a debuff / lessen their effect .


    I love those cruisers. They make a great target for aceton field. But if the rest of your team can't keep up with the damage from one silly RSP cruiser, then clearly the team has bigger issues.

    Really its not relevant if you can't kill the person. You can kill all their teammates (granted its an issue if they were all RSP cruisers). I've lost matches where I never got killed.

    Personally I don't like RSP, the cooldown is too long to make it useful which keeps me from bothering with it. My escort captain doesn't use it, my science ship captain doesn't use it, and my Negh'var captain only has 2, and only because there aren't any better options for engineer BOs to heal my own shields.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Foxrocks wrote:
    I love those cruisers. They make a great target for aceton field.

    I'm one of them; and I still shoot for 1600ish damage per deck under most aceton fields... and take no damage from the DOT. Maybe they should buff Aceton field... because I see it as a wasted slot; like DEM.
    Foxrocks wrote:
    But if the rest of your team can't keep up with the damage from one silly RSP cruiser, then clearly the team has bigger issues.

    I am usually top damage... from both teams. I need 5 seconds to shoot something down unless they RSP. I insta die on FBP though :)
    Foxrocks wrote:
    Personally I don't like RSP, the cooldown is too long to make it useful which keeps me from bothering with it.

    I have 4 RSP; and most of the time I don't use them... only in emergencies; but most of the time fed damage is so average/low that I can regen my shields with just emergency power to shields + dampening field. With my engineers its RSF + Emergency to shields. But RSP remains an option in my arsenal if I need a breather.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I'll just reply to everyone at once.

    RSP is OP. Evidence - Everyone uses it, and cruisers use as many as they can hold.

    The solution was to make it only last 7 seconds, but I guess they're not even going to do that.

    I read the Subnuc change. While I love the idea of removing all buffs, I don't think it's enough. That's only one class of player with the ability to counter it. Also depending on how they implement that, it could be very OP as subnuc is today.

    To the guy who's not using RSP - Clearly you're very bad. Not much more to say. Extends shields is nice, but it has no value if you can't keep yourself alive.

    Anyway, it seems the only hope at this point is that the dps nerfs will make RSP seem less overpowered. Frankly though I think this game is dead and it's sad they couldn't even figure out these basic, horribly OP skills.

    Side note - The FBP change might make it even more powerful than it was before. Whoever said it should affect shields is an idiot of the highest order. Not only that but it's going to work on all weapon types now. If this skill wasn't overpowered before, it's definitely going to be in the new iteration. Hopefully the damage will be toned down a ton to compensate.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    JustTray wrote: »
    Side note - The FBP change might make it even more powerful than it was before. Whoever said it should affect shields is an idiot of the highest order. Not only that but it's going to work on all weapon types now. If this skill wasn't overpowered before, it's definitely going to be in the new iteration. Hopefully the damage will be toned down a ton to compensate.

    300% to 1:1 (100%) for FBP3; so quite a drop already. But yeah the reflection on shields is bad; on the other hand you can hardly one shot yourself anymore. So you should have time to stop attacking and find another target; or wait for a snb to remove it.

    As you said; only science officers will have it; but there are only 3 classes too. So potentially 33% players; though the ratio may be off a fair bit; I think the game has a majority of (gimped) tactical officers (first chars); and science (alts + mains); with a minority of engineers.

    Guess feds can see the ratio better when running in stardocks; just count the shirts of each colour... Klingons all look alike ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Wait they are actually buffing the most overpowered skill in the game? I mean as if being totally shut down without any way to counter it for 30 seconds wasn't enough? Now it will remove the one thing that might keep you alive long enough to put up any kind of a fight? Guess I don't have to worry about ever resubscribing.
    Unless I am missing something and they are removing the lockdown side of it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Unless I am missing something and they are removing the lockdown side of it.

    You are. They are.

    http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=142292
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Edgecase wrote: »

    Thank god there may be hope for this game yet, I might just consider resubscribing.
    To actually be able to have a FIGHT and not a lockdown contest.
    Will probably skip a month tho while they iron things out.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Wait they are actually buffing the most overpowered skill in the game? I mean as if being totally shut down without any way to counter it for 30 seconds wasn't enough? Now it will remove the one thing that might keep you alive long enough to put up any kind of a fight? Guess I don't have to worry about ever resubscribing.
    Unless I am missing something and they are removing the lockdown side of it.

    i guess ur talking about sub nuc, the skill before its current change forced players skills to be on a forced timed cd. It didn't completely shut down the ship, as the ship is still mobile.

    The combo of ss,subnuc,vm, or subnuc,vm was the killer combo that locked down ships for like an eternity. Players can only use ST to counter the effect, but ST randomly removes debuffs. So with the patch there is another ability to remove debuffs. I think the ST, and ET remains on the same CD.

    But back to the topic of the thread, with my current Star Fleet Eng, i run 3x RSP. I was told one time I abuse the skills, because apparently I wasn't an ez kill/point. There was also times, when a science player would sub nuc/vm, and I ST out luckily, I hit rsp before the killer combo, and was only half dead, when i hit ST to use another rsp, to atleast fight back for a duration, before the bleedthru from the cannon fire destroyed me. (also the eng skills, combined with ep to shields, can also increase shield regen.) These are tools to survive the encounter, not rofl stomp, i pwn ur face/ship. some players out there just want to obliterate other players in a 1 sec, and if they can't, well they start using that "Universal translator" to let everyone know what they are thinking. Then they run to the forums to post their "opinion"

    I guess imo, RSP is a practical counter for eng against sci players.

    And a cruiser left alone, not touched, can really bring those beams down on the opposing players.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    RSP is just a mere nuisance really. Its a reverse FBP that acts like a deterent where best action is to CC the ship and leave it alone, kill another ship and then return back to the RSP user after the effect is gone.

    Really no big issue.

    FBP, SnB and VM on the other hand....
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    JustTray wrote: »
    I'd post this in Tribble but for some reason I can't. Maybe you need to copy a char over or somethign before you can post.
    You need to sign up for Tribble access before you can post in the Tribble forums.
    JustTray wrote: »
    Anyway, I saw the post about the big 3 and I wanted to know what they're doing to RSP.
    The Big 3 post mentions chaining of -any- ability:
    snix wrote: »
    The chaining of any ability is also being addressed.
    There is no specific mention by QA/DEVs of any specific ability other than FBP, SNB, and VM.

    We are waiting to hear more information.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Thanks for the Update Matt. Now that they FINALLY have respecs I can actually fix my Klingon to not be worthless in his Negh'Var with full epic mark x anti proton so I'll give this game another chance.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I hope they don't nerf RSP. That's the only thing that makes cruisers tanks. Honestly, without RSP a cruiser will die in about 5 to 10 seconds, even with resistance maxed out with an engineering team. And that's against a single escort or BoP. So much for the much vaunted cruiser hull strength.

    The majority of people complaining are apparently upset that their escort or BoP can't kill every ship in less than 10 seconds.

    If they do nerf it, at least nerf the insane levels of dps or make shields and hulls much more effective.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Izzx wrote:
    I hope they don't nerf RSP. That's the only thing that makes cruisers tanks. Honestly, without RSP a cruiser will die in about 5 to 10 seconds, even with resistance maxed out with an engineering team. And that's against a single escort or BoP. So much for the much vaunted cruiser hull strength.

    The majority of people complaining are apparently upset that their escort or BoP can't kill every ship in less than 10 seconds.

    If they do nerf it, at least nerf the insane levels of dps or make shields and hulls much more effective.

    That or they forgot about target shield subsystems on someone that uses RSP and now they just burn a CD with nothing to show for it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Personally, I don't think RSP is overpowered. It's more of an annoyance than anything.

    I usually end up countering it with Tyken's or something.

    But regarding those saying that FBP hitting shields is bad, I don't get it? The damage is being cut down to a third of it's current value... and a portion is being absorbed by shields. How is that worse than going directly to the hull?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yeah RSP is just 15 secs long with a very long cooldown, though the new FBP changes might be going the wrong way lol

    Besides with Target shield subsystems it's a moot point all together.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    JustTray wrote: »
    Anyway, I saw the post about the big 3 and I wanted to know what they're doing to RSP. I don't see anything about it in the patch notes, even though I didn't look too hard. Basically, if they don't at least lower the duration on this ability, no one is going to be pvping so I'm curious as to whether or not I'll be playing this game again in the future.

    Oh please, as an engineer RSP is the only thing we have that lets us be useful in PvP. If they nerf that then I'm nothing but cannon fodder.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    The elephant in the room here is that spamming of single BOff powers (some in particular) is a NECESSITY to PvP.

    It is so major a factor, that changing the mechanics of one power (like VM) or the method of cool downs completely upsets the ability to play entire classes of either ships or captains.

    Powers should enhance, augment, provide edges, and provide chances to turn the tables. Their spamming should not be the core of game play.

    Yes, I generally use 3 RSPs in PvP (though I will sometimes get the odd idea to use less or more). As a cruiser, I ALSO have plenty of powers to heal and support my team mates. 3 RSPs is just under half of the total 7 engineer slots, and there seems to be ZERO difference between each rank.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    RSP can be countered very easily (especially by an Escort)

    Really nothing needs to be done with it until they fix Engineering BO abilities to make them useful vs. Cannon spam.

    If anything Tac Team needs to remove 1 TSS debuff.
Sign In or Register to comment.