test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc

Fixing Klingon PVP: Increase delay on Shields after Cloak

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
edited March 2010 in PvP Gameplay
Klingon battle cloak is pretty powerful, but how about we "fix" it by just increasing the delay of how long it takes for the shields to come back online after decloaking?

This way the ingame tip that suggests keeping a torpedo salvo prepped actually applies. As is, by the time your torpedoes fly towards the enemy, the shields are already back up.
Post edited by Unknown User on
«1

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    How about we give it a 5 min delay, or better yet no shields at all due to malfunction on a 25% chance. oh sod it that might be too difficult how about just giving all fed ships an extra 10k damage on all wpn types to eliminate any of those pesky shields that just make it difficult
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Ardept wrote: »
    How about we give it a 5 min delay, or better yet no shields at all due to malfunction on a 25% chance. oh sod it that might be too difficult how about just giving all fed ships an extra 10k damage on all wpn types to eliminate any of those pesky shields that just make it difficult

    You call that balance? Please. Even if Klingon ships didn't have any shields and weren't allowed to cloak they've still got their FBP. Maybe things will be fixed if K ships have 1hp. Then that might make it slightly possible for the Feds to keep it close in spite of FBP.

    Brainless hyperbole is fun.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    You gotta love feds writing fixes for klingons.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Sigh... I guess it's too much to hope for some maturity?

    All I'm suggesting is for the delay to be increased long enough so that a torpedo salvo maybe has a chance of reaching the Klingon ship before the shields come back up. However it seems that the Klingon players would much rather have their auto-run/sneak attack buttons...


    Fine, would you prefer this suggestion be for special Federation sensors that automatically break cloaks on use?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    then u are mad, i hy3 salvo will destroy a ship without shields. so what you want is for a klingon to decloak cough then explode. nice idea......not
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Then maybe you should stop decloaking in front of people while their abilities are off CD?

    The whole idea of a delay is to force Klingon players to actually put some thought into WHERE and WHEN they decloak. Instead of just being able to decloak, automatically have your defenses up, and start unloading into the enemy.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Efaris wrote:
    Sigh... I guess it's too much to hope for some maturity?

    Is it too much to hope that feds one day will understand gameplay past PVE? Because seriously klingons have enough issues as it is.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    lol and what rear facing torps as well as front, or take a full broadside with beam overload, oh yes i am beginning to see a world of smart tactics for klingons there
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    hivewasp wrote: »
    Is it too much to hope that feds one day will understand gameplay past PVE? Because seriously klingons have enough issues as it is.

    Why do you guys continue to assume that just because we're Feds we don't understand PVP? Is it because we have more PVE content? So we must all be PVE scrubs?

    Based on your argument, does this mean you will be forbidden to use this argument once the Klingon PVE content comes out?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Ardept wrote: »
    lol and what rear facing torps as well as front, or take a full broadside with beam overload, oh yes i am beginning to see a world of smart tactics for klingons there

    Just don't uncloak. The end. Lrn2playlulz.

    But seriously, the hopeless no-win scenario you've just described is exactly like the one Feds face when fighting Ks with FBP, and when confronted with the gamebreaking idiocy of FBP, Klingons always reply with "Just don't shoot".
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    could it be because;

    1) When i hit evasive to escape the feds response as i flew out of range was to throw scramble sensors at me, gg.

    2) when i decloak and jam sensor a cruiser - on a new map so all CD's are up, the player makes no attempt to move to an active shield face or redirect shield power with redistribute shields, does not use sci team to clear and target, nor use rsp. the action at this point is to simply blow up.

    3) when decloaked and fighting another one player will always zoom in and sub me for 3s. could they have waited the few seconds it takes to get some aux power so as to actually disable me and save the other fed, apparently not.

    4) When i decloak and strafe the escort at the cap point to near oblivion does the cruiser with them assist in any way except to auto fire on my shield, no. I cannot imagine that at the very least they must have one heal to spare. Fed escorts (well a couple i see running about) if given a few seconds can destroy my ship and i only have 1 rsp. so now in a 2v1 vs a bop with no cc except jam sensors becomes a dual death for the fed team.

    this is from players at captain lvl who, even if they only pve, should have learnt something about the game and the way it works.

    there are a couple of players that plague me in t4 and both are escort pilots. i guess they have to rely more on the skills available because they are squishie targets and simple press spacebar get them killed, even in pve.

    Nothing above is rocket science, there is not anything that could be considere radical gameplay wise and should be the sort of thing that the vast majority of players ought to be doing as the norm. However, it is not the norm, the norm is to come to the forum on mass and complain that the shields on a kdf ship pop up too fast from cloak.

    Seriously
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    PSIRockin wrote:
    Just don't uncloak. The end. Lrn2playlulz.

    But seriously, the hopeless no-win scenario you've just described is exactly like the one Feds face when fighting Ks with FBP, and when confronted with the gamebreaking idiocy of FBP, Klingons always reply with "Just don't shoot".

    i understand fbp is being looked at, can't have something that makes the feds vulnerable, not to mention every ship, inc fed, will be able to mount cannons after the patch. sub is being looked at or so i keep hearing. all this is done, so on top of those things were not allowed to have shields at the start of a fight, or we have to fail at cloaking to everyone now except an engi, but then they can tank right.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Efaris wrote:
    Why do you guys continue to assume that just because we're Feds we don't understand PVP? Is it because we have more PVE content? So we must all be PVE scrubs?

    Based on your argument, does this mean you will be forbidden to use this argument once the Klingon PVE content comes out?

    Look at my sig, I know the situation for feds; as well as the one for klingons... there's an insane difference in pvp experience and team play between both factions.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Fly a Klingon BoP up to T5.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    DIMadman wrote: »
    You gotta love feds writing fixes for klingons.

    Is that better or worse than the Klingon "working as intended" stock answer?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rohn wrote: »
    Is that better or worse than the Klingon "working as intended" stock answer?

    If you didnt play one to T5; you can't compare; let alone understand how to "fix"...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Efaris wrote:
    Klingon battle cloak is pretty powerful, but how about we "fix" it by just increasing the delay of how long it takes for the shields to come back online after decloaking?

    This way the ingame tip that suggests keeping a torpedo salvo prepped actually applies. As is, by the time your torpedoes fly towards the enemy, the shields are already back up.

    Well as far as i know ,the mentioned Torpedosalvo isnt for the opening when everyone uncloaks but for the Battlecloak when a BoP tries to get out ...Torpedos shot at the BoP while he is engaging Cloak will follow him even if he reaches Full Cloaked Status ...if they then hit him he may be in Cloak but he has 0 Shields on all facings so basically is Dead. Cloak and Battlecloak arent that vulnerable at the opening but Battlecloak is more or less a russian roulette when you try to get away (Cloak cant be engaged while in combat so no need to go further into detail here).

    So all i want to say ,there is no need for your increased delay ...as BoP pilot you have the chance to get away alive with battlecloak but if you as a Fed would watch out for someone doing that and actually see it as an opportunity to kill him easier you would help yourself more then in writing this above quoted.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    hivewasp wrote: »
    If you didnt play one to T5; you can't compare; let alone understand how to "fix"...

    Claiming that one side can't properly evaluate the systems of another is complete hogwash, plain and simple. We're not talking about forming opinions sight unseen, with no experience or context upon which to draw.

    In fact, just about every real disparity (not the normal grousing) in a PvP game I've ever seen has usually been (rightly) identified by the opposing side. Waiting on the owner of an OP ability to admit it and request a nerf, well, yeah, that happens very rarely.

    One thing I will say, there are plenty of people who can't see the obvious even when it's right in front of their faces (or refuse to admit it). That goes for all tiers, in all games with PvP.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rohn wrote: »
    Claiming that one side can't properly evaluate the systems of another is complete hogwash, plain and simple. We're not talking about forming opinions sight unseen, with no experience or context upon which to draw.

    Well... in this thread it has been made pretty clear that quite a lot of fed are clueless about the way battlecloak works; or cloak itself. And in almost all my pvp matches; I see feds doing things that have me laugh. All I know is that my klingon would have a hell of a time trying to kill my fed in PvP. But it's more amusing to play the underdog than the OP side ;)

    PS: there is no OP side... I truely believe they are very well balanced lthough different; the real issues are the differences between class abilities and how some abilities cant be countered, either because of design (snb); or bugs (vm that isnt always removable by science team; or disable shields that can totally bug out the shields)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    PSIRockin wrote:
    Just don't uncloak. The end. Lrn2playlulz.

    But seriously, the hopeless no-win scenario you've just described is exactly like the one Feds face when fighting Ks with FBP, and when confronted with the gamebreaking idiocy of FBP, Klingons always reply with "Just don't shoot".

    Yeah why shoot? When you can ram; have science snb; vm; have escorts focus on attack and cruisers on healing :)

    It's not like all ships have fbp... it's not like they all run full aux; and if they do; fbp will be their only dps source while running so if you dont shoot; they do no damage... you can fire your "disable target subsystem aux" on them while using full aux power; so your dps will be low and the feedback ridiculously low as well.

    The only two ships likely to have fbp with any real danger level; carriers and bop's... bop's structure is so much a joke you can probably one shot them from a ram (i one shot a science vessel that way, it was pristine then boom); as for carriers; slow enough that you can drag the fight away from them or mostly ignore them until you got rid of the others
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Efaris wrote:
    Why do you guys continue to assume that just because we're Feds we don't understand PVP? Is it because we have more PVE content? So we must all be PVE scrubs?

    Based on your argument, does this mean you will be forbidden to use this argument once the Klingon PVE content comes out?

    I play both pvp Klingon and Federation. Feds play like Alliance in WoW and Klingon play like Horde. Why that is I don't know. I enjoy klingon pvp a lot more than Fed. Since I play both I think I can say that, something needs to be done to balance out the K vs the F, Klingon as we know should be powerful, but imo Klingon are way to powerful, I know this because as I said I play both.

    I bet a Klingon LT. Commander could take a Fed RA5 to 50% before getting canned. That is just how I see it when I play my Klingon.

    What I do see happening when the Klingon are nerfed and they are going to be nerfed that is definitely coming down the line is pvp will disappear completely for FvK.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I play both and while I am no expert at PvP the only thing I see wrong with the cloak in with Klinks is that you can activate pretty much any BO's ability when cloaked and when you uncloak its there. Personally I feel that is the only thing that needs to be looked at. I mean I get to line up a ship hit RFC 1 and HYT 2 and FBP 1 and then uncloak and release havok on a bunch of feds.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I play both and while I am no expert at PvP the only thing I see wrong with the cloak in with Klinks is that you can activate pretty much any BO's ability when cloaked and when you uncloak its there. Personally I feel that is the only thing that needs to be looked at. I mean I get to line up a ship hit RFC 1 and HYT 2 and FBP 1 and then uncloak and release havok on a bunch of feds.

    I forget which powers are available while cloaked but no one in their right mind is going to activate RFC while cloaked and llose time on target or hit FBP when you aren't being fire at.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Airwen wrote:

    I bet a Klingon LT. Commander could take a Fed RA5 to 50% before getting canned. That is just how I see it when I play my Klingon.

    .

    How much you would like to wager?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Honestly I think the OP is a really silly suggestion. Just how long do you think it takes for torpedoes to get say 5km, about the range you can expect a Klingon to decloak at? Its more than a few seconds, factoring in reaction time, and there is no reason to expect you're even facing them when they decloak.

    You don't keep a salvo ready for a decloaking Klingon, you keep it ready for a cloaking BOP, because those torpedoes will track long after they cloak, but I guarantee you they will never get there before the 3s it takes for the BOP to completely cloak unless you happen to be right on top of them when they cloak.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rohn wrote: »
    Claiming that one side can't properly evaluate the systems of another is complete hogwash, plain and simple. We're not talking about forming opinions sight unseen, with no experience or context upon which to draw.

    You are 100% incorrect. You have no knowledge of the decision and delicate timing involved in battle cloaking if you have not played the class at a sufficient high level, and PvP changes from tier to tier as well.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Foxrocks wrote:
    Honestly I think the OP is a really silly suggestion. Just how long do you think it takes for torpedoes to get say 5km, about the range you can expect a Klingon to decloak at? Its more than a few seconds, factoring in reaction time, and there is no reason to expect you're even facing them when they decloak.

    You don't keep a salvo ready for a decloaking Klingon, you keep it ready for a cloaking BOP, because those torpedoes will track long after they cloak, but I guarantee you they will never get there before the 3s it takes for the BOP to completely cloak unless you happen to be right on top of them when they cloak.

    Forget keeping a salvo ready. Just keep a Charge Partlcle Beam ready and poof, no cloak.

    As for decloaking, do you have any idea how much damage is done by 5 quantum mines to a cloak BoP?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I am for whatver will make playing a Klingon at RA level fun enough that more people will do it. In fact, I WANT the average Klingon to be better than the average Fed. Easy win in PvP is NO FUN!

    I want to go in there and get my TRIBBLE handed to me until I learn how to adapt. I know my role - kill as many BoPs as I can before focus fire eats my lunch. Even if "as many as I can" is ONE. Or .5 or .25. As long as I get better, it's a win.

    Let 'em have naked bridge officers, cloak, w/e as long as me and a decent premade can win SOME of the time, I'm in.

    Glannon
    USS Sociopath NCC-99420-D
    Advanced Escort
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    As a Bg I would recommend reducing the amount of hull strength that the fed ships have.
    That way it will help level the playing field for us klingons. I've compared hull strength of each class and even the fed science vessel has a higher hull than a BG level bop.

    Make cannons slower on escort class ships since most of them can completely destroy most ships rather quickly from what I've seen. Also lowering the turn rate on fed ships is recommended. Shield strength on fed ships needs to be lowered and their little happy bubble they like to use needs to be removed completely.

    Do all of that then I will say that a 5 min cool down is a good idea.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    The only thing I really want changed is SNB. Its insane as it is. Have it act as a phaser only it brings down 1 random subsystem 100% of the time. I'd be quite happy with that.
Sign In or Register to comment.