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Lag Rubber banding (New Issue)

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
I have been playing this game since the last week of beta till this point and have had absolutely no issues with lag or rubber banding till 5 days ago. Now I was running Windows 7 Ultimate Beta till just recently when I had to put full version on and could only afford Window 7 Professional. I also am forced to run satellite internet and I know it isn't the best for gaming but I live 13 miles to far for DSl and I have called and bothered comcast and at&t as much as I can and they won't bring their service here and at&t is our local phone service but even though I have been on satellite I have still enjoyed WoW, Lord Of the Rings, Eve Online and City Of Heroes (also made by Cryptic) with no connection, lagging or rubber banding issues. It only seems to be STO doing this and only recently. Here is info that milehighscott asked me to post.

ISP: Hughes Net
Location: Georgia, U.S.
Service Type: Satellite (Played WoW,Lord Of the Rings,Eve and City Of Heroes made by Cryptic with NO connection problems)
Windows 7 Professional 64 bit
Wired
Network Adapter: Nvidia nForce Networking Controller driver version 1.0.1.211 date: 10/17/2008
Modem: Hughes HN9000 : Can't find flash version

I just don't understand how it can go from me playing this game hours and hours on end without a hitch to all the sudden this. Makes no sense and it didn't start till the last 2 updates.:(
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    you are lucky to be able to play with hughes net. I personnel know a dozen of people on hughes that have been told by hughes they do not support online gaming and will not guarentee the gaems would work.
    now milehighscott is a very good person to work with. if any user that can help then scott is the one you want to work with.

    you can start by looking at his post with troubleshotting hints (should be a sticky) like doing a tracert to the patchserver or to a game server. run the nettest
    Posting the results and he also have other tools you can use to gather information on your connection


    (like making sure your nic driver is up date, if you use nvida forceware unistall the forceware manager. etc)

    milehighscott FAQ link http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=118737
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yeah heard of hughes net problems to but this is the first game I ever had trouble with and that was just recently. As for the nvida forceware I am not sure if I have that all I see is Nvidia Display Control Panel, Nvidia PhysX and Nvidia Stereoscopic 3d Driver in the programs/remove window. The further I go into this stuff the more over my head it gets.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rithisak wrote: »
    I have been playing this game since the last week of beta till this point and have had absolutely no issues with lag or rubber banding till 5 days ago. Now I was running Windows 7 Ultimate Beta till just recently when I had to put full version on and could only afford Window 7 Professional. I also am forced to run satellite internet and I know it isn't the best for gaming but I live 13 miles to far for DSl and I have called and bothered comcast and at&t as much as I can and they won't bring their service here and at&t is our local phone service but even though I have been on satellite I have still enjoyed WoW, Lord Of the Rings, Eve Online and City Of Heroes (also made by Cryptic) with no connection, lagging or rubber banding issues. It only seems to be STO doing this and only recently. Here is info that milehighscott asked me to post.

    ISP: Hughes Net
    Location: Georgia, U.S.
    Service Type: Satellite (Played WoW,Lord Of the Rings,Eve and City Of Heroes made by Cryptic with NO connection problems)
    Windows 7 Professional 64 bit
    Wired
    Network Adapter: Nvidia nForce Networking Controller driver version 1.0.1.211 date: 10/17/2008
    Modem: Hughes HN9000 : Can't find flash version

    I just don't understand how it can go from me playing this game hours and hours on end without a hitch to all the sudden this. Makes no sense and it didn't start till the last 2 updates.:(

    I too have the same problem and I"m using Hughes net. My brother and I were both playing STO on the hughes net thing and played for 6 hours a couple days before all these new patches and it seems to rubberband too. but now I don't even move at all or even see the power levels come up.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rithisak wrote: »
    Windows 7 Professional 64 bit
    Wired
    Network Adapter: Nvidia nForce Networking Controller driver version 1.0.1.211 date: 10/17/2008

    For starters if you have this program

    Uninstall Nvidia Application Firewall - This is a known issue initializing OLE/COM before STO can run. It is installed with Nvidia chipset drivers, not graphics card drivers. Look for Forceware network access manager as an installed program and uninstall it.

    I found some interesting posts on the Nvidia forum, it appears disabling RSS for your network adapter may fix your issue.

    http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=108794

    http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=100637&st=120

    Note: To get the admin rights for the command prompt instructions below, go to Start - Programs - Accessories - Right click Run as administrator on Command Prompt
    To disable RSS, follow these steps:

    1. Use administrative credentials to open a command prompt.
    2. At the command prompt, type the following command, and then press ENTER:
    netsh int tcp set global rss=disabled

    To determine the current status of RSS, follow these steps:

    1. Use administrative credentials to open a command prompt.
    2. At the command prompt, type the following command, and then press ENTER:
    netsh int tcp show global
    Receive-Side Scaling

    Receive-Side Scaling (RSS) resolves the single-processor bottleneck by allowing the receive side network load from a network adapter to be shared across multiple processors. RSS enables packet receive-processing to scale with the number of available processors. This allows the Windows Networking subsystem to take advantage of multi-core and many core processor architectures.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I can't seem to find the forceware that your talking about when I look in control panel, programs all I see Nvidia related is Display Control Panel, Nvidia Drivers, Nvidia Physx and Nvidia Stereoscopic 3d Driver and I did a search from the start button search and it came up with nothing but I did the 2nd part of your post about disabling RSS and I got excited because for 45 minutes the longest I have been able to stay on since this issue occurred everything ran just as smooth as you please but halfway through a ground mission rubber banding hit. Odd thing though was I was able to click on my Science Kit powers and they worked like they should my weapon fire normal but when I tried to move I kept getting pulled back. For a moment there there was a glimmer of hope and some excitement,

    Also I tried to connect using Proxy US and EU and both kept timing out after numerous attempts. It will however always connect when it is set to None.

    Update: 2nd time I logged in I was able to go for about the same amount of time 45 mins to an hour and was on my way to Image System when it hit me again. So the positive part is with just that one RSS change I was able to go almost an hour without a problem whereas before it was only averaging 5 to 10 minutes.

    Update: 3rd time I logged in made it to system for Doomsday mission but this time it only lasted 3 minutes before rubber banding hit in the mission going against the first 3 birds of prey. Was feeling good about it lasting longer but after the 3rd time and it's short stint very depressing.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I would suggest you try a different network adapter if you have one available to see if that helps. The Nvidia forums seems to have quite a few people reporting problems with that network adapter and Vista / Windows 7 OS. Make sure you pick up a PCI card or USB NIC that has drivers for Windows 7 64bit.

    It could very well be it's your satellite internet access, they seem to state they don't support online gaming.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Not really sure what PCI card or USB NIC or trying a different network adapter are and as easy as it would be to blame the satellite i just don't see it cause it woulda been an issue from the start which it wasn't and I see others who don't have satellite have this problem. I can still log into CoH, WoW and Eve and play all day with no issues. If I woulda had this issue in STO from day one then I would probably agree my satellite was an issue but for this to just start in the past two patches that were really a day or days apart.

    Ok I found PCI card or USB NIC on Newegg but I wouldn't have a clue which would be the best to get nor if they would help with this satellite modem. I would be willing to give it a shot but I would like to know more about them from someone if that is ok.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rithisak wrote: »
    N If I woulda had this issue in STO from day one then I would probably agree my satellite was an issue but for this to just start in the past two patches that were really a day or days apart.

    Sounds like a issue between your network adapter, your network adapter driver, Windows 7 64bit, and the game. The Nvidia support forum has quite a few posts of people having problems with that adapter and 64 bit Vista and Windows 7.

    If you haven't updated the nForce network driver yet, I would do that to start.

    http://www.nvidia.com/object/nforce_vista_win7_64bit_15.49.html

    If this doesn't update your network adapter driver, you may have to try a different network adapter.

    Your computer should have one available PCI expansion slot that will allow you to install a dedicated non Nvidia network adapter. Do you have any friends or family members that are computer hardware savvy (they build their own systems) and that you trust to work on your PC?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Well I don't have a problem putting it into my pc myself just put a new hard drive in this one few months back but I have just never messed with this particular type of hardware so wouldn't be to sure of setup I also saw ones that go into the usb port which would be better one that fits in usb or one that you put into the tower and I am tight on cash so can't spend a whole lot without feel the wraith of the other half.

    Few Places I have seen them:
    http://www.geeks.com/products_sc.asp?cat=644

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=Network+Adapters&x=0&y=0

    And on a quick scan of several of them I didn't see any that said Windows 7

    Downloading the nForce network driver. Pretty big file at 210mb's
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rithisak wrote: »
    Well I don't have a problem putting it into my pc myself just put a new hard drive in this one few months back but I have just never messed with this particular type of hardware so wouldn't be to sure of setup I also saw ones that go into the usb port which would be better one that fits in usb or one that you put into the tower and I am tight on cash so can't spend a whole lot without feel the wraith of the other half.

    Few Places I have seen them:
    http://www.geeks.com/products_sc.asp?cat=644

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=Network+Adapters&x=0&y=0

    And on a quick scan of several of them I didn't see any that said Windows 7

    Downloading the nForce network driver. Pretty big file at 210mb's

    Yeah the nforce is the whole driver and application suite, I didn't see a separate current official download for just the nic.

    If you go the USB adapter route, make sure it supports Windows 7 64 bit.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Well I installed it and at the end the window came up saying not sure if program installed correctly and it gives you the two options to reinstall of it installed correctly. After that I went to device manager and went to the network adapter and it was still showing the old driver.

    While it didn't update my network driver it did however change my graphics driver from the 9621 to 8.15.11.9038 and gave me two nvidia control panels in the device manager.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    While at work last night I was scanning the forum for things people might have done to fix their rubber banding issues and some looked promising like:

    Turn Frame rate stabilizer and Auto Stabilize frame rate ON and set frame rate limiter to 120 and also turn Dynamic Lighting OFF. I tried them and unfortunately it didn't work.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Tried to download drivers for my Gforce that people said worked 190.62 but it wouldn't download for me from the website so still using 196.21 and still having same issues.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Had a little better luck today. I didn't change a thing and was able to complete 3 missions. 1 space combat, 1 space data survey and 1 planet data explore then it started rubber banding when I warped out of system back to Hromi Cluster.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    interestingly enough I am on Hughesnet and did not have any problems until the two patches that occured on thur/fri one after the other a week ago. Whether the patches are the cause or not is an unknown factor. Since my son and I are having the exact problems described by (Mayak in the Lag and Disconnects Thread)

    Quote: Can run just fine for awhile but then run into 10-30 minutes of an unresponsive client. I can let it sit and it'll eventually clear up. The client appears to receive from the server just fine. Other players run smooth around my ship, the chat box runs normally even though I can't converse myself. Even on missions, while I'm stuck in one spot with an unresponsive client the screen updates perfectly coming from the server. For example, in a defend zone mission, I can see other players blowing up the enemy and the progress indicator in the quest box on the right updates as they kill them.
    Even though you pump in commands through the client trying to get it to clear, the idle message from the server pops after ten minutes. It's like the client can receive perfectly but just stops sending during this period."Unquote

    I have done all the recommended checks/drivers etc, but there are two of us using the same connection (son on laptop I'm on Desktop) with the same exact problems whether playing ingame solo or together (when ingame together both our characters stop responding as in the quote above). A ticket was submitted last night after we verified this was the same problem we were having.
    ok Just some feedback from a fellow satellite user useful or not.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Unfortunately I am glad that I am not the only one with this problem. If it wouldn't have been for the patches we would probably been fine right now. Someone posted they wished Cryptic would start rolling back their patches to see which one caused the issue. I kinda like that for us it was the last two however it does bother me that i can't get the nettest to run for me it just times out which just adds more confusion to me of how I was running smooth till the last two patches.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    If nettest is hanging, you have an issue outside of the STO client.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yeah I know and tech support said contact them to see about opening more ports so the game can get full access and every friggin time I call my ISP I can never get anyone that speaks decent English so the whole conversation basically goes with me saying HUH? What you say? I can't understand you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    i dunno if this is the issue but when you installed windows 7 did you do a clean install? vista had issues with checking every tiny bit of packets going in and out of the computer before releasing it for use. that code might still be there if it was done a poor install. (which frankly is a very frequent problem with windows installers)

    secondly, there are posts about which ports to have open in firewall, i had to setup my windows firewall to allow for these ports to be forwarded so that my issue with rubberbanding would stop. it succeeded.

    lastly, the nvidia network card gave me serious issues when i was using it even with updates to the drivers. the only thing different now on my machine is a usb wireless adapter for a dual band N network im on.

    every once in a while when the server has alot of people on or when they have done a recent patch overnight i will get a little bit of rubberbanding but i would expect that as they are squashing bugs. i would also suggest that if you have a router with the hughes system you check its settings as well to make sure you aren't trying to play through TWO firewalls and set it up to allow those ports to be forwarded for the game as well.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    My windows 7 is an upgrade for my vista. Was told it wasn't a stand a lone version but an upgrade version but I was also running Windows 7 Beta before that. I also just got off the phone with Hughes net and it didn't go well at all the way they see it if your connected to the internet then there is nothing to trouble shoot and they do not offer any support involving any game is what he told me and for some reason he had it stuck in his head I needed help with xbox live even after I told him repeatedly that xbox had nothing to do with this conversation. Every friggin time i call them I get mad as !*@&#. Also would getting a static IP from them help? I need to find someone that knows Hughes net and what changes I can make cause their tech support will not help.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yea, Hughes is useless.

    I'm at my wits end with them. I can tell you it's not the router or any firewalls causing this and there's far too many of us with the same problems. I haven't seen a Hughesnet poster yet that said they were running free and clear without this client send problem.

    Cryptic can see if Hughes will work with them on this issue if they want to save the player base coming from that ISP. I'm going to run until the 30 free is out then quit playing if it's not resolved by then.

    Hughes won't talk to us (their subscribers) about the issue for the simple fact it concerns a game. Only hope left is for Cryptic to give them a call and see what can be done about it. I don't have another ISP option available to me or I'd dump Hughes. Only other option besides Cryptic involvement is to stop playing.

    The status quo is just an exercise in futility which is a privilege I'm not willing to pay for.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yeah I am stuck with Hughes too no other options. AT&T provides phone service for this area and my community is right off a highway and AT&T's boxes are in the community but they say they will not make DSL or their new service available for our area.

    I just ran about 5 missions with no problem then the banding hit.

    I just wish I knew how to go in and look to see if there was an issue and how to open up blocked ports etc so atleast the nettest would work but Hughes Tech won't help.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Sorry if this is something you already tried, but have you selected US proxy in the launcher options and tried that? Game traffic will be over TCP 80 and not TCP 7000-7500.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    problem is that built-in satellite latency will always make playing the game problematic. There is not much Cryptic can do about that. (as was posted by a dev (months ago) ealier post (either here or in the champion online fourm not sure which forum has the post)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Yeah I try it on a daily basis both US and EU and they always time out and when set to none connects everytime and fairly fast. No need to say sry don't know if you tried any input to help me fix this is welcomed input. I did do what you suggested and order a new Network Adapter lastnight asked some people on New Egg in the A+ Hardware forum what would be a good one and they responded with this.

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833166002

    and since it didn't cost to much I went ahead and figured what they hey worth a shot.

    Still what irritates me is being able to play Cryptics City Of Heroes with no problems and played it for 5 years till I moved to this one. Never bothered with Champions since CoH and Champions just on the outside looked so similar. Also played WoW with no problems but I ended up hating that game and Eve posed no problems either and played that roughly 4 to 5 years before leaving it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Heh, AT&T ran fiber to less than 1/4 mile of my house and they claim the same. "Not offered in my area."

    Anyway,

    I'm confident it's not a router or firewall issue. I don't have enough information on nettest to determine why it might be crapping out, whether there's a max latency it hits and just craps out which would happen for all sat links which would happen regardless if that's the case. I have no firewalls up, no routers in the mix, and all hardwired connections for today.

    I've bypassed my router for today and plugged directly into the modem. I noticed we're both using an H9000 modem. You have two different machines with this problem, I have a laptop... going to move past all that and go to the common factor of the modem.

    The behavior we're experiencing tells me the downlink is operating just fine through the banding spell. But, we're running into issues with either the sat uplink or Cryptic's server just flat out stops responding to client requests for some unknown reason.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    PegasusMD wrote:
    problem is that built-in satellite latency will always make playing the game problematic. There is not much Cryptic can do about that. (as was posted by a dev (months ago) ealier post (either here or in the champion online fourm not sure which forum has the post)


    Please take this info and stuff it somewhere else please.

    Latency is not the issue here.

    We accept a 1-2 second delay. This problem is an entirely different animal. Posts such as these are 100% not constructive to solving this issue.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Rithisak wrote: »
    Yeah I try it on a daily basis both US and EU and they always time out and when set to none connects everytime and fairly fast. No need to say sry don't know if you tried any input to help me fix this is welcomed input. I did do what you suggested and order a new Network Adapter lastnight asked some people on New Egg in the A+ Hardware forum what would be a good one and they responded with this.

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833166002

    and since it didn't cost to much I went ahead and figured what they hey worth a shot.

    Still what irritates me is being able to play Cryptics City Of Heroes with no problems and played it for 5 years till I moved to this one. Never bothered with Champions since CoH and Champions just on the outside looked so similar. Also played WoW with no problems but I ended up hating that game and Eve posed no problems either and played that roughly 4 to 5 years before leaving it.


    I've already tried a spare net card of a totally different make I had lying around and the problem persists.

    This animal is a complete blockage of the STO client to the server and in that direction only.

    I've even brought up CoH and ran it side by side with STO. CoH runs smooth while STO sits and spins with full server updates of other player's movements, quest progression, chat box, etc... no other players skipping or jumping as you'd normally see from a true latency issue.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    I had a wireless router setup but I forgot the password when I tried to connect the kids laptop and had to do a reset and couldn't get the settings right it did connect automatically after the reset but was very very slow and I tried numerous settings just couldn't find the right setup even after hitting the forums and linksys said my warranty was up and wanted $30 to go through the settings so I had this router disconnected since before I started STO and yesterday I ran the game with my firewalls down and virus temp disabled just to see and was pretty much same result sometimes when I connected the banding was instant and sometimes I was able to knock out 4 or 5 missions before it started banding again.

    That is disappointing to hear about the network adapter might just return it then if it didn't help you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2010
    Ok, progress.

    milehighscott pointed me at a post that helped get nettest working. So, it's not just hughesnet completely locking it down.

    I thought I had my firewall (Norton's) shut down. I ended up having to kill all the Norton's processes to fully disable it. Nettest went through finally. The results aren't pretty but it's progress.

    It looks like nettest and the client operate from some of the same files the way the patcher acted while I ran nettest side by side.

    Anyway, have gone back into Norton's and looked at Star Trek Online and Game Client's settings on the firewall. When set to "auto" as was the default, no nettest. When both were allowed nettest works.

    Point is, if you have a software firewall you may have to go into the processes in the task manager to completely kill it even if you've disabled it through the software itself. Something is blocking your ports and it's not hughesnet.
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