I was a big fan of the combat experience in "Klongo Academy". Granted, the game is dated, being about 7 or 8 years old, but why is it that a game from an earlier era/decade has the ability for ships to do complete loops and this one doesnt? I'm not programer or developer, but this seems like a not too tough thing to program. It is very annoying to not be able to turn fully on that axis.
Up/down. Y axis. It is odd that once you start to pull up, you reach a certain angle and cant increase it. Sometimes there are enemies directly above me and i cant just oull up. It just doesnt make sence.
There are a couple of missions where you have to circle up/down to get where you want, and it's a tad annoying but I've gotten used to it. No real biggie.
Up/down. Y axis. It is odd that once you start to pull up, you reach a certain angle and cant increase it. Sometimes there are enemies directly above me and i cant just oull up. It just doesnt make sence.
Turn and go up at the same time and you kind of corkscrew directly upwards.
Up/down. Y axis. It is odd that once you start to pull up, you reach a certain angle and cant increase it. Sometimes there are enemies directly above me and i cant just oull up. It just doesnt make sence.
What if only one ship in a class of ships could do that? Not every ship in the Navy is a submarine right?
The only ship I have ever seen do 360 Y axis loop was the Defiant. Oh, and Voyager did a barrel roll once, will full power to inertia dampeners and prep time.
You are flying a bloody Great Starship not a nimble fighter. Did you ever seen any in the episodes and films.
Dude, it is space. There is no gravity or at least not enough that can account for a ship that can only hold a certain angle on that axis. That argument make no sence. It is a game mechanic issue 100%. it has nothign to do with being big or small or fast or slow or nimble or clumsy.
You are flying a bloody Great Starship not a nimble fighter. Did you ever seen any in the episodes and films.
Wrath of Khan I remember The USS Enterprise floating straight up behind Khan it was one of the only times I have ever seen a Star Fleet ship do such a maneuver. The ships may have been facing each other as well, I haven't watched the movie in ages.
Dude, it is space. There is no gravity or at least not enough that can account for a ship that can only hold a certain angle on that axis. That argument make no sence. It is a game mechanic issue 100%. it has nothign to do with being big or small or fast or slow or nimble or clumsy.
Actually, it is. Cryptic went with the "tall ship" design, don't ask me what that means, I don't know. Anyway, last State of the Game they said something about looking into allowing more axis control.
It makse no difference if it was in a movie. I'm talking about physics!!! If a ship pcan pull up 10 degrees, than it can pull up for 360 degrees. there is no static up or down in space. it is truly relative. So i want to fly around like a fool doing loops all day? no. But I would like to be able to fly as real life physics should allow.
Wrath of Khan I remember The USS Enterprise floating straight up behind Khan it was one of the only times I have ever seen a Star Fleet ship do such a maneuver. The ships may have been facing each other as well, I haven't watched the movie in ages.
To be frank, its the way human interpret space. WWII dogfights for instance, even if one side had height advantage, eventually they all merged into a single plane (plane as in 2D section in a 3D environment). Its just he way humans normally process information. Even if you could go 360 or barrel roll on the Z axis, you will eventually return to the same 2D plane, its just confusing for some people, so they left it out.
Anyway, I'm new to these boards and dont want to get a reputation of a whiner. I'm having fun wih the game but would think it is cool to get roll rate in the game and full Y axis movement. I dont want to pontificate on the subject.
Anyway, I'm new to these boards and dont want to get a reputation of a whiner. I'm having fun wih the game but would think it is cool to get roll rate in the game and full Y axis movement. I dont want to pontificate on the subject.
No no no no, trust me, there are WORSE people on the forums. NEVER venture into the STO discussion forum...EVER. Your claim is valid, and as I said, they are looking into changing it, lemme get the link...
Anyway, I'm new to these boards and dont want to get a reputation of a whiner. I'm having fun wih the game but would think it is cool to get roll rate in the game and full Y axis movement. I dont want to pontificate on the subject.
I think in order to something like that on a Star Ship you would have to have some kind of thruster to push the ship up in such an direction. The ship engines really don't propel the ship straight up and down. I could see the event of pushing the ship up done much slower through a thruster, but a huge ship going straight up in space would then have to have another thruster to stabilize it when it got to the desired height which should be a very slow maneuver.
Height might not be the desired term, since there is not height in space, perhaps desired destination would be better.
Up/down. Y axis. It is odd that once you start to pull up, you reach a certain angle and cant increase it. Sometimes there are enemies directly above me and i cant just oull up. It just doesnt make sence.
Actually its the X axis your talking about, Y is left and right, X is roll forward, Z is Roll sideways. I am a (learning) game programmer, and if I were to see the source code, I would assume they have some sort of IF statement keeping the X axis from going past certain angles. So if you deleted this constraint it should rotate 360, but then again, they may be programming different to what I think. I'm still learning and have only programmed through Visual Basic and Dark Basic Classic (it sucks, but good to learn).
I too would love to see full 360 loops in game, but I can foresee a slight problem in my own case, don't know about anyone else.
When I start turning in combat I tend to lean in my chair the same way.
Throw in a 360 degree loop and I can foresee many chair related incidents in my future
But its worth the risk !!!
IF we can do a roll with our ship while it is flying then that might effect the turn rate factor. I think to do a roll like when you fly in and blow up a ship and you want to roll 360 like a fighter jet because you are showing off how you flew in and blew it up, it would have to be another key that you press that wouldn't effect the turn rate factor.
I agree it would be a very cool effect.
Also, I don't think you would fall out of your chair because the ship has its own gravity thus if the ship was upside down you would still be standing in place which ever way the ship position is. So it wouldn't really matter, I just don't see a huge ship kind of like a 777 doing a full 360 roll to one side all the time.
Actually its the X axis your talking about, Y is left and right, X is roll forward, Z is Roll sideways. I am a (learning) game programmer, and if I were to see the source code, I would assume they have some sort of IF statement keeping the X axis from going past certain angles. So if you deleted this constraint it should rotate 360, but then again, they may be programming different to what I think. I'm still learning and have only programmed through Visual Basic and Dark Basic Classic (it sucks, but good to learn).
A parameter to limit what you can and can't do with which ever ship class you have is correct.
I think in order to something like that on a Star Ship you would have to have some kind of thruster to push the ship up in such an direction. The ship engines really don't propel the ship straight up and down. I could see the event of pushing the ship up done much slower through a thruster, but a huge ship going straight up in space would then have to have another thruster to stabilize it when it got to the desired height which should be a very slow maneuver.
Height might not be the desired term, since there is not height in space, perhaps desired destination would be better.
There is no up or down in the absence of gravity. Up and Down are relative to the direction gravity is pushing or pulling.
Just take my word for it, there is no convincing excuse why we canna do a loop in space. It is just game mechanics.
There is no up or down in the absence of gravity. Up and Down are relative to the direction gravity is pushing or pulling.
Just take my word for it, there is no convincing excuse why we canna do a loop in space. It is just game mechanics.
Exactly. The game doesn't allow it right now. But to make it fair I think a one button push to do the effect so it doesn't effect the turn factor would be great. The roll is an effect that we haven't seen happen in Star Trek before on a big ship. To add it, shouldn't be hard to do as long as it only does a visual effect. There are no excuses in my statement. AND to move straight up and down in space today, the Space Shuttle has thrusters to do such a maneuver, thus the ships in the game will need to obtain the same kind of equipment to do the same thing.
I new i wasnt the only one who almost fell out of my chair!
I set my camara for Free Movement. Having it follow where your ship is going is very limiting. You need to be able to look around. Trust me you will be very happy with this change.
Exactly. The game doesn't allow it right now. But to make it fair I think a one button push to do the effect so it doesn't effect the turn factor would be great. The roll is an effect that we haven't seen happen in Star Trek before on a big ship. To add it, shouldn't be hard to do as long as it only does a visual effect. There are no excuses in my statement.
I could be happy with that change. I just want to move directly up/down without having to corkscrew for 10 mins.
Wrath of Khan I remember The USS Enterprise floating straight up behind Khan it was one of the only times I have ever seen a Star Fleet ship do such a maneuver. The ships may have been facing each other as well, I haven't watched the movie in ages.
Check the scene again. When Kirk orders the Enterprise to descend it goes down as if it was an elevator, no change of pitch, yaw, or roll. When it rises up behind the Reliant the Enterprise's pitch angle is no more than it 30 degrees -- in other words, no greater than the angle allowed in STO.
In ST II: WoK the Enterprise never, ever pitches down at 90 degrees as some would like to do in STO. It goes up and down similar to a submarine maintaining the xy-plane as it's primary point of reference.
Dude, it is space. There is no gravity or at least not enough that can account for a ship that can only hold a certain angle on that axis. That argument make no sence. It is a game mechanic issue 100%. it has nothign to do with being big or small or fast or slow or nimble or clumsy.
It makse no difference if it was in a movie. I'm talking about physics!!! If a ship pcan pull up 10 degrees, than it can pull up for 360 degrees. there is no static up or down in space. it is truly relative. So i want to fly around like a fool doing loops all day? no. But I would like to be able to fly as real life physics should allow.
If you want a game that follows real life Newtonian physics, than this is not the game for you. You could try EVE. This particular game is for better or worse set in the Star Trek universe. In the Star Trek universe capital ships such as Cruisers never perform loops and never pitch up or down more than about 30 degrees. You will never see ships upside down to each other or at 90 degree angles on the z-axis to one another. No, it's not realistic. But it is Star Trek.
If they wrote the game the way you want it to, it might very well be a fun game, and it would certainly be a more realistic game -- but it would not be a Star Trek game. Capital ships in Star Trek just don't do the things you want them too -- in fact, as far as I can recall, even the Runabouts don't pitch up or down more than 30-40 degrees. I haven't seen enough Defiant episodes to comment on what the Defiant can or can't do -- but certainly the Cruisers don't do loops or Barrel Rolls, and don't pitch down more than about 30 degrees.
Comments
As to why they decided on this model of space flight, I never heard a reasonable explaination.
Turn and go up at the same time and you kind of corkscrew directly upwards.
What if only one ship in a class of ships could do that? Not every ship in the Navy is a submarine right?
Dude, it is space. There is no gravity or at least not enough that can account for a ship that can only hold a certain angle on that axis. That argument make no sence. It is a game mechanic issue 100%. it has nothign to do with being big or small or fast or slow or nimble or clumsy.
Actually, it is. Cryptic went with the "tall ship" design, don't ask me what that means, I don't know. Anyway, last State of the Game they said something about looking into allowing more axis control.
To be frank, its the way human interpret space. WWII dogfights for instance, even if one side had height advantage, eventually they all merged into a single plane (plane as in 2D section in a 3D environment). Its just he way humans normally process information. Even if you could go 360 or barrel roll on the Z axis, you will eventually return to the same 2D plane, its just confusing for some people, so they left it out.
No no no no, trust me, there are WORSE people on the forums. NEVER venture into the STO discussion forum...EVER. Your claim is valid, and as I said, they are looking into changing it, lemme get the link...
http://www.startrekonline.com/node/1182
At least I thought they said something about it....oops
Height might not be the desired term, since there is not height in space, perhaps desired destination would be better.
When I start turning in combat I tend to lean in my chair the same way.
Throw in a 360 degree loop and I can foresee many chair related incidents in my future
But its worth the risk !!!
Actually its the X axis your talking about, Y is left and right, X is roll forward, Z is Roll sideways. I am a (learning) game programmer, and if I were to see the source code, I would assume they have some sort of IF statement keeping the X axis from going past certain angles. So if you deleted this constraint it should rotate 360, but then again, they may be programming different to what I think. I'm still learning and have only programmed through Visual Basic and Dark Basic Classic (it sucks, but good to learn).
I agree it would be a very cool effect.
Also, I don't think you would fall out of your chair because the ship has its own gravity thus if the ship was upside down you would still be standing in place which ever way the ship position is. So it wouldn't really matter, I just don't see a huge ship kind of like a 777 doing a full 360 roll to one side all the time.
There is no up or down in the absence of gravity. Up and Down are relative to the direction gravity is pushing or pulling.
Just take my word for it, there is no convincing excuse why we canna do a loop in space. It is just game mechanics.
I set my camara for Free Movement. Having it follow where your ship is going is very limiting. You need to be able to look around. Trust me you will be very happy with this change.
I could be happy with that change. I just want to move directly up/down without having to corkscrew for 10 mins.
ROFL
//....... ten characters siting on a wall.......
Check the scene again. When Kirk orders the Enterprise to descend it goes down as if it was an elevator, no change of pitch, yaw, or roll. When it rises up behind the Reliant the Enterprise's pitch angle is no more than it 30 degrees -- in other words, no greater than the angle allowed in STO.
In ST II: WoK the Enterprise never, ever pitches down at 90 degrees as some would like to do in STO. It goes up and down similar to a submarine maintaining the xy-plane as it's primary point of reference.
If you want a game that follows real life Newtonian physics, than this is not the game for you. You could try EVE. This particular game is for better or worse set in the Star Trek universe. In the Star Trek universe capital ships such as Cruisers never perform loops and never pitch up or down more than about 30 degrees. You will never see ships upside down to each other or at 90 degree angles on the z-axis to one another. No, it's not realistic. But it is Star Trek.
If they wrote the game the way you want it to, it might very well be a fun game, and it would certainly be a more realistic game -- but it would not be a Star Trek game. Capital ships in Star Trek just don't do the things you want them too -- in fact, as far as I can recall, even the Runabouts don't pitch up or down more than 30-40 degrees. I haven't seen enough Defiant episodes to comment on what the Defiant can or can't do -- but certainly the Cruisers don't do loops or Barrel Rolls, and don't pitch down more than about 30 degrees.