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I want to be a villain

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
edited February 2010 in The Academy
Why humans can't be bad boys?

I don't understand. If klingons can be good guys, why humans or betazoids or vulcans can be on the right? faction?
Post edited by Unknown User on

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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Totally agree. I dont understand why all evil faction species have to look so ugly... having TRIBBLE, mutated foreheads, lizardmen, Predators, baldies (Orions) and such. I dont think evil needs to look like piece of ****. Make some evil faction race one can look at without vomiting.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Excorant wrote: »
    Totally agree. I dont understand why all evil faction species have to look so ugly... having TRIBBLE, mutated foreheads, lizardmen, Predators, baldies (Orions) and such. I dont think evil needs to look like piece of ****. Make some evil faction race one can look at without vomiting.

    How about Romulans?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MiG-77 wrote: »
    How about Romulans?

    Yea they are fine. I also liked Klingons in the mission to the past, where they still looked good (before mutation that made them monsters).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Problem is World of Warcraft and the factions. Good guys and bad guys. But REAL world is different. Humans can be bad guys. Klingons can be good guys. Ferengi can be... ferengi... i think that is discriminating to say that all gorn are badass because they're ugly or that all andorians are good guys... with their temper!!!!

    END THE DISCRIMINATION!!!!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Excorant wrote: »
    Yea they are fine. I also liked Klingons in the mission to the past, where they still looked good (before mutation that made them monsters).

    Actually the original look of the Klingons is because of a genetic virus that was caused by super soldier experiments by the Klingons. The virus was later cured and the Klingons returned to their natural big scary look.

    also you can still make a character on the klingon side with all the looks you are after. but they are not included by default because I suspect that Klingons are not likely to allow weak humans or other "pathetic" races into their great empire of warriors, there could be rare exceptions.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    The Klingons aren't evil...they truly belive that the Federation has been infiltrated by the Undine threat..or arent taking the threat seriously enough. The Federation and the Klingons are at odds..but neither one is "Good' or "Evil" they are warring factions with different ideas on how things should be done.

    Also direct quote from an in-game source

    "The Undine have infiltrated every power in the Alpha Quadrant. We warned them all. The Federation, the Cardassians, even the Romulans. We have freed the Gorn and the Nausicaans. But the Federation refuses to listen and instead opposes us at every turn. It falls to the honor of the Klingon Empire to eradicate this threat, and we shall no matter the cost...."
    --- Cmdr. Korak
    Klingon Defense Force

    This pretty much sums up the Klingon view of things. Opposed to the Federations slow way of doing things, yes. Evil, no.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Unkoala wrote:
    Problem is World of Warcraft and the factions. Good guys and bad guys. But REAL world is different. Humans can be bad guys. Klingons can be good guys. Ferengi can be... ferengi... i think that is discriminating to say that all gorn are badass because they're ugly or that all andorians are good guys... with their temper!!!!

    END THE DISCRIMINATION!!!!

    ...were we playing the same game...? After Warcraft II: Through the Dark Portal, Blizzard (or, more specifically, the guy they have writing the majority of their Warcraft game lore, Chris Metzen) decided to take a major shift in the way they were writing the series. Warcraft Adventures (a cancelled game) was about the adventures of a young half-orc named Thrall and his reuniting of the Horde, who had after their defeat became lethargic. It did a fair amount to paint at least some of the Alliance in a poor light.

    That lead directly into Warcraft III, where Thrall has already broken out the majority of the Orcs and is making a break for a place they can call home and get back to how they were before Gul'dan and Ner'zhul's bargin with the Burning Legion. Through it and the Frozen Throne expansion, the Alliance actually got a bit of mud slung in their face (Arthas slaying his own father, Garithos being a total racist jerkfase and forcing the grand majority of the remaining High Elves to break off from the Alliance) and of the two new factions introduced (the Night Elves and the Scourge) only one of them was totally, unrepentantly evil. Even the Night Elves had their moments of evil, though it was mostly arrogant isolationism on their part (Kalimdor was their continent, and they were going to torch anyone that tried to take their territory). Even the climax at the World Tree for Reign of Chaos had a brighter message - that the Horde and Alliance weren't evil, and those purple, fanged rabbits weren't so bad.

    Cue World of Warcraft, with the Night Elves and Forsaken plot-railing their ways into their respective fashions. The grand majority of 'vanilla' (read: pre-expansion) quests for the Horde were actually of a fairly noble sort, with a lot of their problems being the Alliance refusing to let old politics die hard. Meanwhile, the Alliance itself was rife with corruption and backstabbing from within, and only once you got out past a certain point started having you actually antagonize the Horde (who by that point had actually been antagonized by the Alliance for a while).

    After WCII:TtDP came out, Metzen specifically went out of his way to highlight the fact that the only truly 'evil' groups in the game were the Burning Legion and the Twilight's Hammer cultists (and any groups that were resident members), and maybe some of the dumber monsters roaming around (like the Quillboars and Centaur). This continued all through the grand majority of the lore for World of Warcraft.

    Neither faction was good or evil, per se. Certain members of it were (WoW: Wrath of the Lich King finally pointed out that while the Apothecary Society of the Forsaken was moustache-twirling evil, that they weren't all that bad; Some of them genuinely just wanted to be left the crud alone, Sylvanas among them), but that was a problem with both factions (Lady Prestor had a lot of political power for an obviously evil bint for a while, and didn't get ousted from her position of power until Wrynn came back; And then there were a number of open assaults by the Alliance leading up to that point as well, under individual commanders). They were in opposition, yes, but not evil.

    That's the exact same kind of feel I get from things in STO at the moment - the Klingon Defense Force isn't evil, they just don't like the Federation. They're an arrogant, war-like people that are tired of all of this dishonorless TRIBBLE they've been fed. They may not be nice, but evil? Come on, that's grade school logic.

    That's like calling the Moors evil during the Crusades - the truth is eye opening.

    EDIT: Hah! I salute the coders of the word filter, well played, sirs. o7 Cleaned it up even further then I had previously.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Darkstahr wrote: »
    "The Undine have infiltrated every power in the Alpha Quadrant. We warned them all. The Federation, the Cardassians, even the Romulans. We have freed the Gorn and the Nausicaans. But the Federation refuses to listen and instead opposes us at every turn. It falls to the honor of the Klingon Empire to eradicate this threat, and we shall no matter the cost...."
    --- Cmdr. Korak
    Klingon Defense Force

    This pretty much sums up the Klingon view of things. Opposed to the Federations slow way of doing things, yes. Evil, no.

    Ok... can the federation be fighting on the wrong side? If we've been infiltrated... oh my... SULU IS A UNDINE!!!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I half expected that to be a possibility in the lead up to release. I was reasonably sure that one could choose their own path, kinda like Morrowind or something. But as far as I've seen in the week I've owned the game, it's pretty much rank and stats. Wich is fine, don't get me wrong, I love this game. But wouldn't it be a riot if you could lend your friend a hand in battle, then as soon as he beamed down to some planetoid you could ransack his ship and steal his dilithium chrystals? Hell if you get caught, that's on you, bro.

    On the other hand, they may have gotten it right. It might be kind of a bummer to have to fend off NPCs and half of your team that have turned against you in the middle of a mission. But it is my sincerest wish that this is only just the beginning for this game.

    Also, I think the "human" looking Klingons were the mutated ones.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Unkoala wrote:
    Why humans can't be bad boys?

    I don't understand. If klingons can be good guys, why humans or betazoids or vulcans can be on the right? faction?

    Well I'm not human but I'm Federation,

    what part of this game makes you think we are not the bad guys though?

    If anything, I look at the Federation in STO to be more of a "mirror universe' bad version compared to any that were portrayed in any of the shows.

    Just about every mission you do involving space combat comprises of talking to some poor alien race and hearing their obviously one sided view of the missions story, and then blowing the frak out of some other poor alien race without even asking them their side of the story.

    We are not really that interested in peaceful negotiations because we are at war the brass say.. well just because one side is at war, it doesn't always mean the other sides are.

    On a side note, it would be kewl if we could choose not to be in the Fed or Klink factions and be neutrals paving the way for pirates and traders and the like. However IMO, there would have to be substantial content added to the game for this to come close to happening.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    The Federation of STO is genocidal enough to put the Third Reich to shame.

    How is that not evil?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Aaaaand /thread!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I certainly feel like a collaborateur. I frequently bully other Ferengi, I blew up half the fleet of my Orion Syndicate business partners, and instead of paying Nausicaans to be my bullies... I blow up their ships, too. It may not add to the pretty boy factor on the KDF side, but I want to play my Ferengi there, too. Its where I belong - not in a Federation that doesn't even have currency (officially).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Maybe they will let you play the mirror universe later then you can be human and bad.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Kevscar wrote: »
    Maybe they will let you play the mirror universe later then you can be human and bad.

    We're already in a mirror universe, cause the STO Federation is bad.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    PRE-EDITED: This message was pre-edited to save the feelings of those it may offend.
    .....................was the result of bad mission writing and not meant to portray the federation as the third riech.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Roach wrote: »
    PRE-EDITED: This message was pre-edited to save the feelings of those it may offend.
    .....................was the result of bad mission writing and not meant to portray the federation as the third riech.

    ...Well, TRIBBLE. Now I'm curious.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    um dude the humans ARE the evil empire now thanks to the crappy timetravel movie and they way this game is made
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    There are villains? I thought there were only factionalized differing political views and cultural opinions in star trek and within those political and cultural factions there were individuals that violate common and formal laws constituting a social contract who are termed "criminals". If that is what you are looking to do then no, you can never be a villain because that would be a too in-depth of a game mechanic for such a broad game play environment as is presented by STO.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Yeah, there really oughtta be a rogue human element in this game--or rather, a "rogue anyone" faction, with outlaw stations, special or even custom-built starships, etc. The missions and story ought to be branching as well (something like Dragon Age, but MMORPG style), and while that *may* be planned by the devs (I have no idea... it would be cool), at the moment I do not believe it is a possibility.

    Seriously, just being able to buy some black market Romulan, Klingon, or Cardassian warships and arms and raid the federation would be cool... What if we actually had to defend Sol once in a while from our own.... calling even the rookies into a raging space battle (not everyday, but it would be cool.... like once when they released trolls into the Ultima Online cities, where normally they couldn't come, and EVERYONE was a target).

    I would also like to see more player sponsored events and content. Heck, I would just like to have a real conversation with someone on the game for once. So far, encounters with other real human beings have been sparse on here. :mad: However, I know the game is new, and I am sticking it out for at least a few more months to see what comes.
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