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Should I scrap cruiser plans?

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
edited February 2010 in The Academy
Hey all - so I just read the "state of the game" update, and I read that Cryptic knows about and is "scrutinizing" the cruiser turn rate. Does this mean I should not play through with cruisers this time because those turning rates will probably improve in the future? I wish they hadn't been so cryptic about that in that article. They reference it and then go on to list "some" of the new things that are coming for STO, and don't include the turning rate in that list. What does that mean? Does anyone have more info?

Also, although I'm not happy to see we're getting a death penalty (hopefully it's optional, but I'm not holding my breath), I saw that we're getting the "respec" option. I just want to make sure that I'm correct here - does that mean that we, for our captain characters, will be allowed to go back and "deselect" skills we've invested skill points in (and get those points back) to focus more on what we want?

Thanks, everyone!
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Don't expect or hope the respect will be free. Be prepared to pay. If you love to respec like an ADHD kid, then be prepared to farm for them.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Cruiser Turn Rate: I play a cruiser and, while the turn rate is slow, I don't really see it as an *issue*. Likely, as I move up through the ranks and attain bigger/badder cruisers it may become more noticable, more of an issue.

    That being said, having played a cruiser for a little bit now I would suggest you seriously consider an escort -- especially if your CO character is a tactical officer. There are a LOT of cruisers in this game so sometime I wish I'd gone for an escort and gotten access to ships that you see a little less frequently.

    Personally, I suspect that your choice of ship is less important than your style of play. You can play any ship you like any way you like. Some are harder with certain play styles but they're all fun in the end.

    Death Penalty: Personally, I hope they choose to make it a life bonus as opposed to a death penalty.
    Jonbre wrote: »
    I just want to make sure that I'm correct here - does that mean that we, for our captain characters, will be allowed to go back and "deselect" skills we've invested skill points in (and get those points back) to focus more on what we want?

    That's generally what is understood to be a respec. However, Cryptic will have its own rules once the respec is released into the game. It may be exactly as you've described. It may be slightly different. But generally, that's the basic idea.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Yeah, a life bonus would be a lot better than a death penalty.

    Yes, I really am considering an escort - I am a tac officer, and there's no way I'm gonna play those horrid-looking tier 3 science ships. I had really been looking forward to playing the cruiser, but you're right - there are a lot of them.

    From the first response above, I think I'm maybe getting the definition of the respec wrong. Can someone explain it to me in small words so my brain doesn't hurt?

    Thanks for the responses!
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Don't expect or hope the respect will be free. Be prepared to pay. If you love to respec like an ADHD kid, then be prepared to farm for them.
    Jonbre wrote: »
    From the first response above, I think I'm maybe getting the definition of the respec wrong. Can someone explain it to me in small words so my brain doesn't hurt?

    All he's saying is that the respec will probably be a purchasable commodity either through the C-store or through some type of in-game vendor.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    bapaveza wrote: »
    All he's saying is that the respec will probably be a purchasable commodity either through the C-store or through some type of in-game vendor.


    chances are itll just cost energy points
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Bleh, don't worry about the future. Yeah yeah, sure. One day they'll allow respects. And hey, the first one will probably be free even. BUT: What if you hold off on the cruiser? It's patch day, you've just finished downloading and are about to hit 'ENGAGE' when a plane engine crashes through your roof, killing you instantly. Was it worth waiting? Respec ain't gonna help you none. Just play what you want and have fun with it. If a respec comes around, deal with it then.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Seems the main thing with a cruiser is to compensate for the crappy turning rate with weapons with wider firing arcs.

    I was debating cruiser vs escort, im glad I went with my escort, it handles like a fighter compared to the light cruiser that we all start with, easy to line up shots with the big guns.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Jonbre wrote: »
    Yes, I really am considering an escort - I am a tac officer, and there's no way I'm gonna play those horrid-looking tier 3 science ships. I had really been looking forward to playing the cruiser, but you're right - there are a lot of them.

    Good leave them to me. My charter is science officer and he id literally drooling to get one of those... :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I llove my cruiser just drop to min impulse as soon as I get within range. beam firing. Ripple firing 3 torps tubes with High yield 11 and spread. Pump front shields. Under 3k pump out 2 different lots of mines and watch them activate and fly past me. If they do survive to get behind they face another beam and torp tube plus more mines.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Teme wrote:
    Good leave them to me. My charter is science officer and he id literally drooling to get one of those... :D

    You mean the big giant disco ball? D: Eh. To each their own, I suppose. You're certainly welcome to my share of'em too, mate!

    In regards to Cruiser turn rates - that's going to be such a minor change that I doubt it will seriously affect your gameplay at all. If nothing else, when they finally adjust it (and I sure hope it's a positive adjustement), you'll be relieved at the change more then anything else. Fly what you want and what makes you happy, as other people have said. It's likely not listed because they're looking into the problem, rather then have a definate answer on what they're doing with it - as they figure that out, we will likely be told more information.

    You have respecs pretty well correct - current theories on the board are that they will require Energy Credits, or perhaps Starfleet Merits to achieve a Skill Point Respec (skill points go into the pool to be redistributed as you desire). They might make it available through the C-Store, but I remember them saying the contrary. But I have no direct source for that, so take it as mild speculation on my part.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Karvashio wrote: »
    chances are itll just cost energy points

    It's already been started there will be multiple ways to obtain respec's - specifically, a mechanism to purchase with in-game currency (energy? Exploration basdges?) or through the C-store (microtransaction).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    It's already been started there will be multiple ways to obtain respec's - specifically, a mechanism to purchase with in-game currency (energy? Exploration basdges?) or through the C-store (microtransaction).

    ...I didn't even consider multiple options. That seems fairly logical (and awesome) as well. :o

    EDIT: For the love of Mike, I fail at English today. :|
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Jonbre wrote: »
    Hey all - so I just read the "state of the game" update, and I read that Cryptic knows about and is "scrutinizing" the cruiser turn rate. Does this mean I should not play through with cruisers this time because those turning rates will probably improve in the future? I wish they hadn't been so cryptic about that in that article. They reference it and then go on to list "some" of the new things that are coming for STO, and don't include the turning rate in that list. What does that mean? Does anyone have more info?
    Not at present, although I do think those who complain about cruiser turn rates should be careful what they wish for - I can't see any way of giving cruisers a significant increase in turn rate without having to balance this by reducing their strength in other areas.

    In general, my advice would be not to choose cruisers if you don't like slow-turning ships.
    Also, although I'm not happy to see we're getting a death penalty (hopefully it's optional, but I'm not holding my breath), I saw that we're getting the "respec" option. I just want to make sure that I'm correct here - does that mean that we, for our captain characters, will be allowed to go back and "deselect" skills we've invested skill points in (and get those points back) to focus more on what we want?
    Yup, a respec will allow you to re-arrange your captain's skills, although the exact details of how the respec system will work have yet to be announced.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    bapaveza wrote: »
    Cruiser Turn Rate: I play a cruiser and, while the turn rate is slow, I don't really see it as an *issue*. Likely, as I move up through the ranks and attain bigger/badder cruisers it may become more noticable, more of an issue.

    .

    I believe the turn rate issue stems from just the Tier 4 cruiser, which evidently has the lowest turn rate in the game but nothing to make up for it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Roach wrote: »
    I believe the turn rate issue stems from just the Tier 4 cruiser, which evidently has the lowest turn rate in the game
    Indeed
    but nothing to make up for it.
    This is where I'd disagree. The Exploration Cruiser has vastly more crew, a significantly stronger hull and more weapon slots than the Tactical Escort and Long Range Science Vessel. In fact, like all cruisers, its only real weakness is its turn rate.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Jonbre wrote: »
    From the first response above, I think I'm maybe getting the definition of the respec wrong. Can someone explain it to me in small words so my brain doesn't hurt?

    Most likely: All your skills are set back to 0, you get all your spent skill points back and you can reallocate them where you like.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    The Exploration Cruiser is just fine the way it is - it requires a different play style is all. In fact all Cruisers do, in order to be used effectively. While escorts should really try to keep their nose on targets, cruisers really do not need to. In a cruiser you want to be able to effectively use both your front and rear weapons. The two easiest ways to do this is either broadside, or toggle between targets. I prefer to toggle, and so I also prefer multi-ship fights. At any time in PVP for example, I am hammering between two to three different targets with different weapons, I usually don't both turning much except to try and stay within the center of the fight. I also cruise on 1/4 to 1/2 impulse.

    Of note as well, the Sovereign handles MUCH better than the Exploration Cruiser.

    EDIT - I should note however, that if the Devs want to boost the turn rate that is fine with me because as a lot of people have said, it's not the turning in combat that's the issue. It's tracking down those pesky anomolies and the loot :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    It's VERY important for cruisers to use a turning console. I mount TWO Mk 10 consoles on my admiral Starcruiser, and it makes a huge difference in allowing turnfighting.

    This is especially important as you start doing the daily mission and mount a tri-cobalt torp. It's use is very touchy, but when it hits it is a game changer.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Don't expect or hope the respect will be free.

    Do expect the to be available in game for no real money cost. It has been stated SEVERAL times that it will be available in game and may show up in the C-store. The doubt is not on it being free, the doubt is actually on it even being in the C-store (though it probably will be).


    I would bet 260 C points that we will all get one free respec on each already existing character when the respec is put in.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I am digging my T3 cruiser. I also tried the escort, but because of my play style I get shredded. With an escort you have to be moving a lot bring your nose around let loose and get out of the way. With a cruiser I just chip away at em. Pretty much drop the shields and toss in the torps and mines. Looking forward to the T4.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I've enjoyed Cruisers so far. As the other responses in this thread point out, there are strategies to flying one based on the weak turn rate. One thing I have found is that often times the AI is trying to avoid the front of your ship by turning to where you aren't going. The solution to this is to line them up in your rear facing weapons, which usually takes a lot less turning than trying to keep them in front (since they are trying to avoid that). So, I usually approach an enemy, let them have it with my forward weapons, broad side them as they fly by, and then turn a little to hit them with my rear weapons, usually saving my torpedo specials until they are behind me as their shields are more likely to be down.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Jonbre wrote: »
    Hey all - so I just read the "state of the game" update, and I read that Cryptic knows about and is "scrutinizing" the cruiser turn rate. Does this mean I should not play through with cruisers this time because those turning rates will probably improve in the future? I wish they hadn't been so cryptic about that in that article. They reference it and then go on to list "some" of the new things that are coming for STO, and don't include the turning rate in that list. What does that mean? Does anyone have more info?

    Also, although I'm not happy to see we're getting a death penalty (hopefully it's optional, but I'm not holding my breath), I saw that we're getting the "respec" option. I just want to make sure that I'm correct here - does that mean that we, for our captain characters, will be allowed to go back and "deselect" skills we've invested skill points in (and get those points back) to focus more on what we want?

    Thanks, everyone!

    Eh don't worry about it. Just play the game and take things in stride. And the Cruider turn rate isn't THAT bad. I'm in a (T3) Heavy Cruiser at the moment . Yes, the turn rate is slow, but it's not crippling unless you avoid Weapon Arrays. Weapon Arrays + EPS Flow REgulators console are the saving grace for Cruisers which gives nasty broadsides. So you don't have to worry about lining up shots as much. Burn down a shield facing while turning fore or aft launcher up for the shot. Most of the time by the time you are line up the shield facing is gone.

    And there are thing you can do to help you turn rate. Allocate more power into you AUX subsystem using Display mode 3. (Instruction on how are in my Ship Power Guild linked in my .sig). Drop 10 from weapons and defense into AUX and it helps more then a bit. Also certain Captain skills and trait will give you power setting bonuses especially at very lower power settings.

    Starship Warp Core Training at Rank 9 and Warp Core Theorist trait will net you a +7 power settng bonus at power allocation of 25. The Starship SubSystem Efficiency skills and the Efficient traits will also give a power setting bonuses as well. Rank 9 in Aux Efficient nets another +8 power setting bonus at 25. Tossing in +5 from Efficient give another +1. Toss in another +5 from a BO will net another +1 for at total of +10.

    With just the skills combined and the Cruiser power setting bonus we get 7 + 10 + 3 or +20 for a net power output of 45/25 for AUX. Draw 5 power more from another subsystem (i.e. 50/30), and congratulations, you just reduced you turning rate by a factor of 1. Then you can add on other Power or Turning Rate engineering consoles. And there are untold temoprary bonuses which can add power to AUX and boost turn rate or just flat out add to turn rate: Emergency Power to Aux, Aux Batteries, Attack Pattern Alpha, Evasive Maneuvers, etc.

    Granted my Heavy Cruiser is no Escort, but with broadsides of frontal beam weapons, I can take down a shied facing by the time they get into 5-6km just into time for a High Yield Torpedo II volley. And say hello to exploding debris. And it's I've found its very easy to like up aft torpedo shots. Enmeis tend to cooperative nicely by staying on my tail as I turn. When I'm ready I switch turning directions and the nice cross my aft firing arc and another High Yield Torpedo volley.
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