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XP and Missions lacking now No changing instances

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Ok I am always finding that every single level I do not have enough missions to make it through the levels. That means I have to grind through the DSE and explorations. I have had to make up for an entire level before doing this. The only thing that made it even half way decent was to be able to change the instance to find one that was actually populated.

What fun is it to warp in find yourself alone and since there is no distance set between where you warp in and where enemies can be you are dead in seconds. Why because you are alone and surrounded by about 6 ships that are already firing on you before your load screen is down.

In that case I would just die and change instance as soon as I came back so I could find people to play with. Now you can go in by yourself and be destroyed. Oh yeah let's pump up that fun factor there. Way to go.

So far lack of xp and lack of missions force grinding and now your forced grinding is even mind numbingly boring. Let's face facts the game was made too easy and people made it to admiral before you wanted them to. Now that they are there you are putting in a way to waste people's time and force them not to level.

Heck why not just go with EVE's route and just put real time advancement in so you can have people pay you to only log in for 5 minutes a month? You know this reminds me of the other cryptic title Champions Online where they did not have enough content there either. So I am guessing you really do not learn from your mistakes from previous titles.

I mean you release less than half of a game by completely ignoring the Klingon side. Then you have less content than you should to level your players without a senseless grind. Now you make even the grind sub standard.

Yeah I think I have had about as much fun as I can stand. Sorry I did not use exploits and was just exploring the game and took my time. Now I am forced to hate my time in the game. No thanks not paying you to be bored.
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    DSE and explorations are there for a reason (i.e. they are part of the content). Try not simply doing all the episode content, or at least space them out between the rest of the games content. Do so and miraculously there is no grind.

    You can also still change instance, just not simply by a menu option anymore. You can exit and re-enter, which often puts you in a fresh one.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    DSE and explorations are there for a reason (i.e. they are part of the content). Try not simply doing all the episode content, or at least space them out between the rest of the games content.

    Oh you mean I should only have 1/3 of a level doing the pitiful few missions for my level and make the rest up in explorations and DSE's as content?

    I view actual content as stuff that you only need to do one time for the xp to count and make it to the level before missions run out.

    Not do about 20 DSE's and then another 10 explorations and then the very few actual missions. I am so friggin bored doing the same thing over and over and over again.

    That is one of the things that makes a game like WoW omg I said it so good. You do not have to grind the same repeatable missions to get where you need to be. There are at least triple the missions per level than actually needed to level. I know you say that they have had more time to do this. But let's face facts you should have enough unique missions to at least level a character without a grind.

    But then to force the grind to be gated. Can only do explorations so often. Can not change instances to make it so you are not just sitting with your thumb where the sun don't shine because you are forced to.

    God I hate fanbois that will defend a sub par product and say "OMG this is the best thing since sliced wonder bread"

    I paid for it....it is boring.......it was mad sub par.....why defend junk? They have barely fixed anything and like CO they are knee jerking within the first month to people hitting level cap in less than a week.

    Cryptic has not learned and it is obvious no matter how many games they put out will not learn from mistakes of the past.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I did a whole 1 DSE going from Ensign to RA5. On average, something like two exploration missions (i.e. the quest not the individuals ones) per level. After which I hit RA5 still with plenty of episode content below my level. In fact below my rank.

    We have someone in our fleet who has the problem you discribe. All they did was episode content and then had to grind repeatable content (in bulk) until they got a new episode. Its the approach, not what's available.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    OP's point is HE DOESNT LIKE THE DSE so why should he be forced to do just so he can lvl, i totally agree, should be enough story (unique missons) to lvl each rank
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    incanus wrote:
    OP's point is HE DOESNT LIKE THE DSE so why should he be forced to do just so he can lvl, i totally agree, should be enough story (unique missons) to lvl each rank

    Yeah, I know and you don't have to. That's my point. I am not however saying the game doesn't need fleshing out.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    incanus wrote:
    OP's point is HE DOESNT LIKE THE DSE so why should he be forced to do just so he can lvl, i totally agree, should be enough story (unique missons) to lvl each rank

    He doesn't have to. I stopped doing explorations quite early on because they were incredibly boring and always had more than enough missions to get up to RA. The OP's clearly missing many storyline missions or outright misrepresenting his position.

    There are loads of legitimate things to complain about. Being forced to grind exploration is surely not one of them.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I disgaree: For every rank there are only about 5 main missions so in order to advance in rank you have to do the patrols, DSEs and/or exploration missions.
    Many people don't like exploration because very often you get the "aid the planet" mission which isn't worth the xp and the credits you have to spend. So DSEs are the only other option.
    Not allowing to change instances in DSE make completing them rather annoying.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    You know out of all the exploration missioms "aid the planet" while completely useless is the least I come across.

    More often or not its a space encounter or a collection mission, with later levels involving a lot more ground combat.

    The not changing instances is there to stop an exploit (i.e. it allowed one to bypass the 5 min reset).
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Netherous wrote:
    He doesn't have to. I stopped doing explorations quite early on because they were incredibly boring and always had more than enough missions to get up to RA. The OP's clearly missing many storyline missions or outright misrepresenting his position.

    There are loads of legitimate things to complain about. Being forced to grind exploration is surely not one of them.

    I have done this on two toons. I have been to every starbase that I can get to for my level. I have checked with each NPC and have talked to every starfleet contact.

    I am sitting right now on my one toon at LC10. The only missions that I have available to me are CO1's and 2's. Oh and I am less than 1/3 of the way into LC10. I did not do any of the CO 0 missions until I hit LC10 and to my dismay just like my other character lack of content and a grind. I totally detest the DSE missions and the explorations. Explorations because I will do them all and the enemies are all my level for say the first one. While the difficulty changes to meet my level the SP reward does not so they are almost not worth my time but I am scraping for every SP I can get to level up. I have to do them all because of the forced timer involved.

    I am just disappointed that this has happened on two different ones. On the new one I even did the DSE's fleets and explorations as soon as they were available and still have run out of missions.

    It is not that I am missing anything or even entire story lines. I have even compared what I have done with my fleet mates. They said that they too had to grind and exploit to level.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Every good MMO provides for enough missions that you don't have to go out and grind until you're the right level for episodic content.

    Having said that, almost every MMO I've played where I started with a pre-release client, I've noticed that adding additional missions to fill the void is an always developing process. I remember reading the patch notes on the City of Heroes message boards for the first few months and always seeing "Added more missions in the 24-28 range," etc.

    My hope for Star Trek Online is the same. I'm not complaining, but I do dread logging back on this morning and having to do those Deep Space and Exploration missions just so I can get to the "good stuff."
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Just sigh...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Onyx_PghPA wrote: »
    Every good MMO provides for enough missions that you don't have to go out and grind until you're the right level for episodic content.

    Having said that, almost every MMO I've played where I started with a pre-release client, I've noticed that adding additional missions to fill the void is an always developing process. I remember reading the patch notes on the City of Heroes message boards for the first few months and always seeing "Added more missions in the 24-28 range," etc.

    My hope for Star Trek Online is the same. I'm not complaining, but I do dread logging back on this morning and having to do those Deep Space and Exploration missions just so I can get to the "good stuff."

    See that is exactly one of my points. They just went through this same BS problem with the other title. You are going to tell me that these people did not notice the huge gaps they were leaving. Even more so when they just went through it on another game.

    Sorry but I think it is becoming too much of a common phrase it is an MMO they can fix it later. There should be some basics that are done right the first time. Leveling mission basic content should be one of them not pay us to be bored for monthes while we figure things out.

    I have found that the MMO's that really stick around you can take at least and I mean at least 3 different ways through the story lines to level.

    While I agree that this may not seem like a major problem to some and there are other things that need to be fixed I agree. But this is one that should not be passed by. Remember that they will have a lot of first time MMO players just because of the title itself. To put them into grinding and not have a good story line to keep them going will not work. Star Trek fans in general want that story line. They loved the series for it. They did not love to see a ship fight the same battle for say three episodes straight just to get to the next story idea.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    No gaps here while leveling. I simply spaced out the content types.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    You know out of all the exploration missioms "aid the planet" while completely useless is the least I come across.

    More often or not its a space encounter or a collection mission, with later levels involving a lot more ground combat.

    The not changing instances is there to stop an exploit (i.e. it allowed one to bypass the 5 min reset).

    Sadly I forgot which Nebula it was (I think it was one where you get badges of the 3rd order) but in this nebula there were exactly 2 mission types: adi the planet and scan 5 thing. Of these 2 mission types 90% were aid the planet....

    So you say you got to RA just by doing the main missions and exploration? To me that is the same thing as doing DSE to level up: grinding.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    No gaps here while leveling. I simply spaced out the content types.

    I would agree with this, i had no lvl gaps when i was playing, on that it was seamless. I did mostly explore and main mission almost exclusively.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    No gaps here while leveling. I simply spaced out the content types.

    I find it hard to believe that you are the sole person in this game that did not have to do any DSE mission or exploration mission more than one time.

    That is what I am talking about it is nothing but grinding. Content is new stuff constantly not do a couple of missions then go and do the stuff you have already done a bunch more. Then do a handful of crumbs before doing oh look the same grinding missions done before.

    You did the grind yourself you are just saying that it is a type of content. That is not a type of content it is forced grinding plain and simple and very very very boring.

    Only so many times I want to kill 9 ships wait 5 min kill another 9 wait 5 kill another 9 ok complete take again rinse and repeat. Only so many times I want to find the terminals or locate chunks of rocks on some planet run in a circle and even though you are looking for different things you know right where they will be because Oh same exact map different skin. This one is snowy and now this one is forest but same path.

    To me the real content are the story driven missions. Sure DSE's and explorations the first time. But not over and over and over and over and ...................... get my point? Should not be 5 level story missions when you hit the level then back to the same old thing that you have already done a dozen plus times already. That is not content that is been there done that got the friggin t-shirt fodder because they rushed it.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    So that would make any content, no matter what it is and whatever the game, simply grinding.

    Fundmently I may agree, but grind is mostly about perception. A grind at its core is basically just killing stuff for no reason, other than to get XP. Episodes and to a lesser extent explorations provde a story, just as quests do in other games. DSEs are pure grinding.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    FyreBlayd wrote:
    I find it hard to believe that you are the sole person in this game that did not have to do any DSE mission or exploration mission more than one time.

    That is what I am talking about it is nothing but grinding. Content is new stuff constantly not do a couple of missions then go and do the stuff you have already done a bunch more. Then do a handful of crumbs before doing oh look the same grinding missions done before.

    You did the grind yourself you are just saying that it is a type of content. That is not a type of content it is forced grinding plain and simple and very very very boring.

    Only so many times I want to kill 9 ships wait 5 min kill another 9 wait 5 kill another 9 ok complete take again rinse and repeat. Only so many times I want to find the terminals or locate chunks of rocks on some planet run in a circle and even though you are looking for different things you know right where they will be because Oh same exact map different skin. This one is snowy and now this one is forest but same path.

    To me the real content are the story driven missions. Sure DSE's and explorations the first time. But not over and over and over and over and ...................... get my point? Should not be 5 level story missions when you hit the level then back to the same old thing that you have already done a dozen plus times already. That is not content that is been there done that got the friggin t-shirt fodder because they rushed it.

    I said I did 1 DCE, the whole time I was leveling. I also said on average I did two exploration missions (ie. the one requiring three to be completed) per level. I did not simply do the episode/patrol content and then bulk "grind" explorations. Therefore the feeling of any grind was never present. It also meant I was above the level curve for the episodes I was given.

    I am also most certainly not the only person who's found things fine.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    So that would make any content, no matter what it is and whatever the game, simply grinding.

    Fundmently I may agree, but grind is mostly about perception. A grind at its core bascially is just killing stuff for no reason, other than to get XP. Episodes and to a lesser extent explorations provde a story, just as quests do in other games. DSEs are pure grinding.

    Good end content is like you said still a grind of some sort. But a grind with a point. Meaning, your grinding for a reason, more materials, better gear, a special achievement or unlocks, so on and so on.

    It has a purpose! Grinding here at end level has no purpose other than the grind itself of killing things without any real reward besides the same junk you always get. one you might, just might receive some kind of satisfaction, hence enjoyment, whereas here, you are left as empty and bored as you started, every single time.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Yeah, end game at the moment is nothing but a grind as we are just farming badges. However that's not what this thread is about. Its about getting there.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    DSE and explorations are there for a reason (i.e. they are part of the content). Try not simply doing all the episode content, or at least space them out between the rest of the games content. Do so and miraculously there is no grind.

    You can also still change instance, just not simply by a menu option anymore. You can exit and re-enter, which often puts you in a fresh one.

    I do this all the time and not had to grind yet.

    As for changing instances, I haven't had a problem changing in the "enemy signal" encounters - so what have I missed?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    It's presented in an MMO format. MMO is practically the definition of 'a grind'.

    Maybe Bioware can change that, but I'm skeptical. It's practically a requirement of the genre.

    That said, I've no had to grind anything in this game yet. I pretty much ignore the 'crafting' system, and content otherwise has been seamless to Admiral.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    I did not simply do the episode/patrol content and then bulk "grind" explorations. Therefore the feeling of any grind was never present.

    I do that as well: I do my main mission (and only the one that is of the same lvl as I am), then the patrol mission adn then I notice something: I'm only halfway through to the next grade. So what do I have to do? Either I do pure grinding by doing DSE or masekd grinding by doing "exploration" missions. You do both to get to the next grade. And exploration missions may have "content" but it's always the same.
    It's aid the planet, go to station (that's always on an asteroid) and either you have to "investigate" (which means kill all enemies on board said station) or defend it from enemies, beam to planet to scan for something and so on and so on.
    It's like a deja vu: You're doing stuff you've doing for ages. I feel like Bill Murray in Groundhog Day....
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Sorry I really don't know what else to say. Maybe its just a difference in perception of grinding. Exploration missions don't take long, so more time is spent doing episodes and patrols.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Dryan wrote:
    Sorry I really don't know what else to say. Maybe its just a difference in perception of grinding. Exploration missions don't take long, so more time is spent doing episodes and patrols.

    Yeah, I guess it's really perception. I feel that exploration missions take far longer and I really enjoyed DSEs because of the teaming.;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Yeah, I guess it's really perception. I feel that exploration missions take far longer and I really enjoyed DSEs because of the teaming.;)

    The funny thing is the ground combat is actually really good. I mean it is, but there is just no reason to use your skills or build up top BO's because all you have to do is hit 1 and 2 on you auto win everytime. It has rolls, flanking, exposes, deployables medicines, etc the foundation is there for a exhilerating ground combat. Its just not made for you to use them considering how ridiculously weak the foes are,
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    pierrat wrote: »
    The funny thing is the ground combat is actually really good. I mean it is, but there is just no reason to use your skills or build up top BO's because all you have to do is hit 1 and 2 on you auto win everytime. It has rolls, flanking, exposes, deployables medicines, etc the foundation is there for a exhilerating ground combat. Its just not made for you to use them considering how ridiculously weak the foes are,

    Each to his own. What I don't like about ground combat is the sheer number you have to kill. That's not Star Trek it's Steven Seagal against the rest of the universe.:p
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Each to his own. What I don't like about ground combat is the sheer number you have to kill. That's not Star Trek it's Steven Seagal against the rest of the universe.:p

    I hate that too. Ground combat missions are little more than button-mashing shootouts. At least they go fast when you figure out how to use cone exploit attacks non-stop.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I don't really think that you can count exploration as proper content like the storyline missions it's so very "been there done that", I only did a couple DSEs on my way to RA5 but I did do a load of exploration and a fair amount of pvp too, tho with the pvp xp nerf that'll be worse for filling in gaps.
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