I found out a couple days ago there were people quitting the game, after being MAX LEVEL less than a week after launch and having nothing to do.
Im enjoying the game piece by piece and have done REAL exploration of the world i play in. With the except of getting a Fed to 6 so i can ''start'' my real character, and the latter half of T2 (lacking T2 cruiser and all), i have taken my time leveling.
I enjoy missions, i fly around searching for new things, check out my boundaries, chat to friends and fleet members, help out a few lowbie fleet members with their missions and done a fair bit of pvp to hone my skills.
Im only CM2. Sometime next week, i will hit Captain. But i find no real reason to burn the midnight oil getting to the end.
I recently spoke to one of the players flying around in a carrier, and asked them a few questions about the universe we play in. I knew the answers yet he did not, because he burned rubber getting to the end thinking ''the end level is where its at'' just like most mmo's. He was under the impression that the end of the game is where you really start playing. Like the entire leveling experience was just an annoyance that had to be gotten through with the least amount of trouble and most amount of efficiency.
It really reminds me of a lot of players back in wow, who burned through 1-60, 60-70 and 70-80 just to get to raiding. They couldnt care less about the leveling portion and would gladly have ''bought'' a ready made end level character had it been legal.
Happens in every single MMO. A certain type of player will ALWAYS rush to max level; it's just what they do. They don't really know how to play any other way. This isn't a judgment - play how you want! I know I do. Just saying, it's not odd... This is a documented and common type of player.
lol ... exploration ... thats a good one ... tell me tough, how do you explore a planet when you cant beam down cause you dont have a mission ?
and exploring sector space also seems kinda dull ...
oh, and the reason why people quit is simply because there is no content ... sure, you can make up stuff and pretend your a starfleet explorer but really, you dont need to pay a monthly sub to do that, just buy x3 and get a space game thats actually motivational and gives you stuff to do.
If people are having fun, and they have time, they will keep playing. Then once they make Admiral, if there isn't anything to do, they get bored.
I'm like the OP. I'm smelling the roses as I go. Taking my time. But then again, I also don't have a ton of time to play to make level quicker. Otherwise, I would probably have leveled up quickly as well. Still trying to smell the occasional rose along the way. lol.
Ugh i've been having PC problems so I AM JUST redeeming my code! I was at Lieutenant Commander before the the problems but i'll continue at my ole steady boring pace. Maybe i'll hit Admiral in April or something, don't really know.
There are different reasons why some people reach max before others. It isn't necessarily because of "duping" or cheating and sometimes its not because they are rushing. For instance, they may just have longer periods to play than others and thus are able to accomplish more per "game session". Whilst others have less interruptions and enjoy a more "intense" gameplay session (i.e. not hanging about, but still they read quests etc).
Look at me as an example, I play about 6 hours at night. I don't touch the game during the day, and yet I've hit Captain 8. I didn't rush by ANY standard and have no actual intentions to get the RA5 quickly. I read every quest and enjoy it. And yet, the leveling process in the game is such that the player is actually propelled very quickly through the levels in comparison to other games. Even WoW isn't THIS quick for leveling.
Now, some could say that this was Cryptics intentions, in that they don't want people the "average" player to hang around very long at the lower levels. We dont know what their mindset is on this. Just as we don't know what their mindset was in terms of what they define as an "average" player.
Suffice it to say that the leveling in this game is very quick in comparison to other, and not everyone is actually TRYING to rush through the game. Nevertheless, people are hitting Admiral very quickly and they aren't necessarily to blame for that.
Very true. Last character I levelled in WoW (A paladin), while min/maxing, using XP boosting trinkets and heirlooms, ignoring crafting, I managed an average 1.75 hours per level. If I were truely rushing in STO I could easilly do 1 level every hour, even at captain level. By grinding Exploration Cluster missions.
The thing is, that in WoW there were distractions.Crafting, exploring (proper exploring), travelling from town to town etc, that STO just doesn't have, so more people will be levelling up faster than normal.
I'm not saying increase travel time (god no) but adding a proper crafting system and proper exploration would be nice.
Mini games too, like the gambling machines or chess, or kal'toh or whatever other alien board games are out there.
People are different, some may enjoy a slow detailed ride others may like the race. Some may only have an hour or two a day, others may be insomniacs. How fast one levels shouldn't be a matter of harsh judgement, or any judgement at all really.
Now complaining that there isn't more to do should be alieviated a bit with the borg content having opened up, but a customer paying for a game could very easily expect that the content just released should have been in the game from day one of live.
Reasonable folks probably would give Cryptic an easier time than some have here. Not everyone in this world is reasonable though and that's just how the world is in every endeavor humans partake in.
I'm already an Admiral. I didn't rush. I'm an insomniac so I've probably logged more hours than you in a shorter span of time. When you reach Admiral I'd suspect your hours played will be similar to mine (try /played). Please don't make asumptions and assign them to classes of people. This leads to bigotry and fosters ignorance.
If you don't like bellyaching in the forums try just haveing a chuckle at the poster and skip that thread if it bothers you.
Overall I'm still optimistic about the game, but I will concede one big thing. I'm only Commander 4 but so far there has been minimal interesting content along the way. There are a few different missions but most follow one of a set designs just with the order of objectives mixed around and text changed to make it seem different. There's also zero feeling of exploration to discover new worlds and new creatures, which is a major part of the whole Star Trek universe. Unlike most mmorpg releases where I have to pry myself away from the game each day for the first month or so at least, in STO I find myself playing in much smaller doses (unless I'm close to getting a new ship).
So I could see someone that is at the top rank not having much patience. It's not like other games that even when newly released still have a bunch of neat content to go through as you level up before you run into lack of content at high levels and endgame.
I'm sticking around because even with the huge pile of problems, I can see that the core game is actually a decent foundation. I could see a great game being built from it, so I just hope they can make enough of the necessary changes before they lose too much of the subscription base. For instance, revamped AI alone would greatly improve the combat aspects of the game. Not just enemies but our bridge officers as well. I grow weary of having one officer die right away because he ran deep into the room full of enemies instead of staying back with us and use his ranged weapon to fire.. you know.. at range.
Very true. Last character I levelled in WoW (A paladin), while min/maxing, using XP boosting trinkets and heirlooms, ignoring crafting, I managed an average 1.75 hours per level. If I were truely rushing in STO I could easilly do 1 level every hour, even at captain level. By grinding Exploration Cluster missions.
Precisely, personally if I was Cryptic, I would:
Leave Lt level rate as it is (to make sure people get to their respective class ships).
Players at Cmdr level should then begin experiencing a noticable slow down (40 hours).
The Captain rank should take a looong time to get through (lets say 80 hours)
Therefore, Admiral should take a player at least a couple of months playtime from the tutorials to hit.
they are the same people who play call of duty and make the max level in 2 days. Then they claim they are bored and there is nothing to do. Not enough maps, not enough this or not enough that.
What it comes down to is that the current generation of gamers are all about instant gratification. They don't know how to play games for fun anymore. It's something gaming lost awhile ago. If the proverbial "ding" stops then the game is no longer "fun" to them and they look for the next "ding".
I am still Lieutennant 5. Havent played since last weekend sue to tother things happening but its been good. I am looking forward to playing again this weekend and getting back into it.
Didnt want to rush through the game and like that there is the lvl 43+ content available for me now so that when I hit that there will be no "waiting" for the new content.
they are the same people who play call of duty and make the max level in 2 days. Then they claim they are bored and there is nothing to do. Not enough maps, not enough this or not enough that.
What it comes down to is that the current generation of gamers are all about instant gratification. They don't know how to play games for fun anymore. It's something gaming lost awhile ago. If the proverbial "ding" stops then the game is no longer "fun" to them and they look for the next "ding".
Sorry, but I have to call BS on this one. You're just generalising without any proof.
The MMO company is as much to blame for players hitting max so soon, as the players themselves are. Yes, players have a duty to enjoy all that a game offers, that much is true. However MMO companies also have a duty to ensure that a "reasonable" (a word commonly used in law) amount of gameplay is provided for an "average" gameplayer.
One of the big reasons why older MMOs took so long was the lack of an full quest system and thus a lot more emphasis was placed on "grinding". The likes of WoW introduced a quest system that allowed people to level quicker than those who just ground everything. The quest system itself is needed. But some games fail to compensate accordingly and thus reward players with more "XP" than is necessary. Thus they level very quickly.
Leave Lt level rate as it is (to make sure people get to their respective class ships).
Players at Cmdr level should then begin experiencing a noticable slow down (40 hours).
The Captain rank should take a looong time to get through (lets say 80 hours)
Therefore, Admiral should take a player at least a couple of months playtime from the tutorials to hit.
I think that an MMO should have a 4 day /played for it's initial start as the power-levelling minimum time, and a /played of 8-10 days for regular players. If someone plays 2hrs per night then that's 90-120 days (3 to 4 months) to hit level cap
STO has a power level of about 2 days /played and a casual of 5-6 days /played - it's seriously short.
Granted, 48 hours of gameplay for the price of the game is excellent value imo, just a little bit lacking in terms of an MMO.
I think that an MMO should have a 4 day /played for it's initial start as the power-levelling minimum time, and a /played of 8-10 days for regular players. If someone plays 2hrs per night then that's 90-120 days (3 to 4 months) to hit level cap
STO has a power level of about 2 days /played and a casual of 5-6 days /played - it's seriously short.
Granted, 48 hours of gameplay for the price of the game is excellent value imo, just a little bit lacking in terms of an MMO.
2 days played = 48 hours
6 days player = 144 hours
Now Cryptic said that this game should take an average of 80 hours. Based on 6 hours per day, thats just 14 days (rounded up). 2 weeks. For an MMO that wants people to continually pay a subscription, that is definately not long enough.
I'd say that ALL MMO's should be basing their gameplay on those who are, lets say, more "intense" than others. For instance, lets say that the definition of an "average" player is someone who has the opportunity to play the game for 6 hours per day. As a dev, I would want that gameplay to last for a minimum of 20 days. Now this definition of an "average" gameplayer means that they are intentionally faster at playing than the usual player. That way, I can ensure that there is a reasonable amount of gameplay for everyone.
This means that my "average" player needs roughly about 120 hours worth of game play.
And thus, for those who like to take longer, then so much the better for them.
In terms of STO, this means that the amount of gameplay required to hit max should take approximately 50% longer than it does now.
Of course, the devs have to have the necessary resources AND time to implement enough content to cover than amount of gameplay. Something tells me this wasnt the case with Cryptic.
Lets look at the facts: 3 x "Defend the ....Sector" missions (thats the ones where you kill 10 squads in Enemy Encounters) will get you one grade at ANY level in the game. 3 missions. That is it. Look how far you get with the "Patrol the....Sector" missions. Again, you get boosted through the grades in no time at all.
I hit Admiral 1 the night before last, would have hit it sooner but I had to twiddle my thumbs through headstart because my joined Trill was not available yet. And here it is just over 24 hours later and I've already played through most of the borg content.
I think the boredom factor is alot easier to peg than simply being max level. In STO, like alot of other games, the "content" they do have is extremely repeatative. It's really just a different coat of paint on the tutorial. Even the supposed "end game" borg stuff is really the same old stuff that you've done dozens of times to get to that point.
On a more personal level I am what most people would consider a "power gamer". Personally I absolutely hate the leveling process of any game. I get no enjoyment out of grinding missions or quests (and when they are as repeatative as STO, it definately IS a grind). I don't typically have much fun until I've gotten to that max level and begun collecting my end-game gear.
Now about the people who suggest slowing the xp down, I absolutely disagree with that. If anything it needs to be increased. What needs to be done is to offer choices for the player in how they gain that xp. As has been said there needs to be a real crafting system, a real exploration system. Not simply the same thing over and over and over.
2 of the ships i cherished growing up, was the B'rel Bird of Prey and the K't'inga Battlecruiser. Almost ALL of my time has been playing those 2, with the least the T2 Bird of Prey. I loved playing my BOP, and will still keep that ship for sentimental value. Right now, im playing my second favourite ship, and im loving fighting battles in it, even though its not accurately depicted in the game.
Just an hour ago, i was in the Borg Cube area, when a team mate was having trouble with a sphere pounding on him. I FI'd all the way in, popped THY in flight and fired right at 10k, slowing me to normal battle speeds, as i whipped around the cube firing off my disrupters adding my own firepower to my team mates. The sphere exploding and my team mate survived with a small percentage of health remaining. It was exhilirating, yet i did not recieve anything from it. No skill points, nothing.
Ive been playing at a slower pace than i do with normal mmos, part of that is due to a landslide of fantastic console games all hitting in the first few months of 2010 but also because i dont feel like ill be any worse off for taking my time. Im plodding through slowly, taking in the sights and enjoying my progression, unlike other games of this type i dont feel like i have to be lvl X or ill not be able to keep up with everyone else.
Basing the leveling curve around people who play 6 hours a day would be a mistake. Most people do not play that much -- only a small percentage of the playerbase does.
Ten Ton Hammer: How long do you expect it will take the average player to get to the endgame?
Zeke: Its roughly about 80 hours I think for the average player.
Thats about the same as a single-player game; as STO does play like a single player game with its heavily instanced lobby-system, third-person shooter design. There is only 80 hours of content, at an averageplayer pace, and with the slow pace at Cryptic might add content, there is going to be some substantial lag-time (months) before more refreshing content is added.
Most have already run out of content and are subjected to repeatedly doing the same static maps and missions over and over again.
Comments
and exploring sector space also seems kinda dull ...
oh, and the reason why people quit is simply because there is no content ... sure, you can make up stuff and pretend your a starfleet explorer but really, you dont need to pay a monthly sub to do that, just buy x3 and get a space game thats actually motivational and gives you stuff to do.
I'm like the OP. I'm smelling the roses as I go. Taking my time. But then again, I also don't have a ton of time to play to make level quicker. Otherwise, I would probably have leveled up quickly as well. Still trying to smell the occasional rose along the way. lol.
not rushing to be mr/mrs big cheese.
Look at me as an example, I play about 6 hours at night. I don't touch the game during the day, and yet I've hit Captain 8. I didn't rush by ANY standard and have no actual intentions to get the RA5 quickly. I read every quest and enjoy it. And yet, the leveling process in the game is such that the player is actually propelled very quickly through the levels in comparison to other games. Even WoW isn't THIS quick for leveling.
Now, some could say that this was Cryptics intentions, in that they don't want people the "average" player to hang around very long at the lower levels. We dont know what their mindset is on this. Just as we don't know what their mindset was in terms of what they define as an "average" player.
Suffice it to say that the leveling in this game is very quick in comparison to other, and not everyone is actually TRYING to rush through the game. Nevertheless, people are hitting Admiral very quickly and they aren't necessarily to blame for that.
Very true. Last character I levelled in WoW (A paladin), while min/maxing, using XP boosting trinkets and heirlooms, ignoring crafting, I managed an average 1.75 hours per level. If I were truely rushing in STO I could easilly do 1 level every hour, even at captain level. By grinding Exploration Cluster missions.
The thing is, that in WoW there were distractions.Crafting, exploring (proper exploring), travelling from town to town etc, that STO just doesn't have, so more people will be levelling up faster than normal.
I'm not saying increase travel time (god no) but adding a proper crafting system and proper exploration would be nice.
Mini games too, like the gambling machines or chess, or kal'toh or whatever other alien board games are out there.
People are different, some may enjoy a slow detailed ride others may like the race. Some may only have an hour or two a day, others may be insomniacs. How fast one levels shouldn't be a matter of harsh judgement, or any judgement at all really.
Now complaining that there isn't more to do should be alieviated a bit with the borg content having opened up, but a customer paying for a game could very easily expect that the content just released should have been in the game from day one of live.
Reasonable folks probably would give Cryptic an easier time than some have here. Not everyone in this world is reasonable though and that's just how the world is in every endeavor humans partake in.
I'm already an Admiral. I didn't rush. I'm an insomniac so I've probably logged more hours than you in a shorter span of time. When you reach Admiral I'd suspect your hours played will be similar to mine (try /played). Please don't make asumptions and assign them to classes of people. This leads to bigotry and fosters ignorance.
If you don't like bellyaching in the forums try just haveing a chuckle at the poster and skip that thread if it bothers you.
So I could see someone that is at the top rank not having much patience. It's not like other games that even when newly released still have a bunch of neat content to go through as you level up before you run into lack of content at high levels and endgame.
I'm sticking around because even with the huge pile of problems, I can see that the core game is actually a decent foundation. I could see a great game being built from it, so I just hope they can make enough of the necessary changes before they lose too much of the subscription base. For instance, revamped AI alone would greatly improve the combat aspects of the game. Not just enemies but our bridge officers as well. I grow weary of having one officer die right away because he ran deep into the room full of enemies instead of staying back with us and use his ranged weapon to fire.. you know.. at range.
Precisely, personally if I was Cryptic, I would:
Leave Lt level rate as it is (to make sure people get to their respective class ships).
Players at Cmdr level should then begin experiencing a noticable slow down (40 hours).
The Captain rank should take a looong time to get through (lets say 80 hours)
Therefore, Admiral should take a player at least a couple of months playtime from the tutorials to hit.
What it comes down to is that the current generation of gamers are all about instant gratification. They don't know how to play games for fun anymore. It's something gaming lost awhile ago. If the proverbial "ding" stops then the game is no longer "fun" to them and they look for the next "ding".
Didnt want to rush through the game and like that there is the lvl 43+ content available for me now so that when I hit that there will be no "waiting" for the new content.
Sorry, but I have to call BS on this one. You're just generalising without any proof.
The MMO company is as much to blame for players hitting max so soon, as the players themselves are. Yes, players have a duty to enjoy all that a game offers, that much is true. However MMO companies also have a duty to ensure that a "reasonable" (a word commonly used in law) amount of gameplay is provided for an "average" gameplayer.
One of the big reasons why older MMOs took so long was the lack of an full quest system and thus a lot more emphasis was placed on "grinding". The likes of WoW introduced a quest system that allowed people to level quicker than those who just ground everything. The quest system itself is needed. But some games fail to compensate accordingly and thus reward players with more "XP" than is necessary. Thus they level very quickly.
I think that an MMO should have a 4 day /played for it's initial start as the power-levelling minimum time, and a /played of 8-10 days for regular players. If someone plays 2hrs per night then that's 90-120 days (3 to 4 months) to hit level cap
STO has a power level of about 2 days /played and a casual of 5-6 days /played - it's seriously short.
Granted, 48 hours of gameplay for the price of the game is excellent value imo, just a little bit lacking in terms of an MMO.
2 days played = 48 hours
6 days player = 144 hours
Now Cryptic said that this game should take an average of 80 hours. Based on 6 hours per day, thats just 14 days (rounded up). 2 weeks. For an MMO that wants people to continually pay a subscription, that is definately not long enough.
I'd say that ALL MMO's should be basing their gameplay on those who are, lets say, more "intense" than others. For instance, lets say that the definition of an "average" player is someone who has the opportunity to play the game for 6 hours per day. As a dev, I would want that gameplay to last for a minimum of 20 days. Now this definition of an "average" gameplayer means that they are intentionally faster at playing than the usual player. That way, I can ensure that there is a reasonable amount of gameplay for everyone.
This means that my "average" player needs roughly about 120 hours worth of game play.
And thus, for those who like to take longer, then so much the better for them.
In terms of STO, this means that the amount of gameplay required to hit max should take approximately 50% longer than it does now.
Of course, the devs have to have the necessary resources AND time to implement enough content to cover than amount of gameplay. Something tells me this wasnt the case with Cryptic.
Lets look at the facts: 3 x "Defend the ....Sector" missions (thats the ones where you kill 10 squads in Enemy Encounters) will get you one grade at ANY level in the game. 3 missions. That is it. Look how far you get with the "Patrol the....Sector" missions. Again, you get boosted through the grades in no time at all.
I think the boredom factor is alot easier to peg than simply being max level. In STO, like alot of other games, the "content" they do have is extremely repeatative. It's really just a different coat of paint on the tutorial. Even the supposed "end game" borg stuff is really the same old stuff that you've done dozens of times to get to that point.
On a more personal level I am what most people would consider a "power gamer". Personally I absolutely hate the leveling process of any game. I get no enjoyment out of grinding missions or quests (and when they are as repeatative as STO, it definately IS a grind). I don't typically have much fun until I've gotten to that max level and begun collecting my end-game gear.
Now about the people who suggest slowing the xp down, I absolutely disagree with that. If anything it needs to be increased. What needs to be done is to offer choices for the player in how they gain that xp. As has been said there needs to be a real crafting system, a real exploration system. Not simply the same thing over and over and over.
Just an hour ago, i was in the Borg Cube area, when a team mate was having trouble with a sphere pounding on him. I FI'd all the way in, popped THY in flight and fired right at 10k, slowing me to normal battle speeds, as i whipped around the cube firing off my disrupters adding my own firepower to my team mates. The sphere exploding and my team mate survived with a small percentage of health remaining. It was exhilirating, yet i did not recieve anything from it. No skill points, nothing.
Compared to the asia grinders I used to play it's stupidly easy.
Well, time to start a Klingon!
Made me chuckle, lol.
Thats because this game is designed with little content.
http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/79456/page/2
Ten Ton Hammer: How long do you expect it will take the average player to get to the endgame?
Zeke: Its roughly about 80 hours I think for the average player.
Thats about the same as a single-player game; as STO does play like a single player game with its heavily instanced lobby-system, third-person shooter design. There is only 80 hours of content, at an averageplayer pace, and with the slow pace at Cryptic might add content, there is going to be some substantial lag-time (months) before more refreshing content is added.
Most have already run out of content and are subjected to repeatedly doing the same static maps and missions over and over again.