I made a Federation Klingon Tac officer specialized for melee combat for some bat'leth fun. While creating him I realized and was quite sad to find that there was no option for the sash like Worf wore.
So, fellow Klingon Outcasts! Let me hear your support if you want to have your sash as part of your uniform, adorned with a house insignia and all.
Ie. are Bat'leths Klingon race exclusive? Do they get any extra costume options? I've been trying to find out all week.
IMHO, if the sash (admittedly a 3D asset that may be intensive to design for multiple uniforms) is too much, I'd at least like to see them get a hybridized Klingon/Federation uniform. Y'know, a mix of combadge and shoulderpads or the option to use Klingon boots and gauntlets or something. I just can't see dropping the CP otherwise since the racials are passive and I can get Klingon-like racials and a perfectly Klingon appearance as an unknown "Alien".
I was under the impression the sash was available for Klingons in the Klingon faction, I see no reason why Cryptic can't add it to the Federation Klingons. Hopefully they will soon.
You can have our sashes when they give us some actual costume options in return. You guys have enough without stealing like one the 3 things available to the Klingon characters.
I was under the impression the sash was available for Klingons in the Klingon faction, I see no reason why Cryptic can't add it to the Federation Klingons. Hopefully they will soon.
Agreed. I certainly hope so. My Klingon just looks...off without it.
You can have our sashes when they give us some actual costume options in return. You guys have enough without stealing like one the 3 things available to the Klingon characters.
Easy there. A Klingon has the right to have his sash, regardless of faction, I say.
Easy there. A Klingon has the right to have his sash, regardless of faction, I say.
A klingon Sash signifies membership in a Noble House. A Klingon fighting for the enemy during a time of war is a blood traitor, and would suffer discommendation. Federation Klingons have no need for the sashes as they cannot be members of functioning noble houses.
I really, really, really want my Vulcan tac officer to square off with swordmaster using a lirpa... now THAT would be entirely too much fun.
I'm all for some more melee weapon options. My main motivation behind my Klingon character is it made more sense to have one wielding a bat'leth and be better trained it.
My traits wound up being:
Honorable
Warrior
Lucky
Peak Health
A klingon Sash signifies membership in a Noble House. A Klingon fighting for the enemy during a time of war is a blood traitor, and would suffer discommendation. Federation Klingons have no need for the sashes as they cannot be members of functioning noble houses.
I don't really see some Klingons following in the footsteps of the Kuvah-magh as being traitors. Hopefully, that would count for something.
A klingon Sash signifies membership in a Noble House. A Klingon fighting for the enemy during a time of war is a blood traitor, and would suffer discommendation. Federation Klingons have no need for the sashes as they cannot be members of functioning noble houses.
A blood traitor? Was Worf TRULY a blood traitor? No.
It's entirely possible the Klingons in question disagreed with the reasoning for war or had their House fall out of favor with the High Council for one of any number of political reasons.
Wearing the sash honors your ancestry and your family. They have every right to be proud of those things, regardless of their standing in Klingon society.
A klingon Sash signifies membership in a Noble House. A Klingon fighting for the enemy during a time of war is a blood traitor, and would suffer discommendation. Federation Klingons have no need for the sashes as they cannot be members of functioning noble houses.
Worf wore his sash while dishonored.
And he was raised by humans, for that matter, in addition to coming from a house that was dishonored more than once.
And he was raised by humans, for that matter, in addition to coming from a house that was dishonored more than once.
Worf was a special case. He had ties to the High Council, multiple Klingon Chancellors, had a secret pact with said High Council as the official Klingon fall guy for Khitomer and was a member of multiple noble houses, Mogh then Martok. In short he was a Klingon Mary Sue and is not a standard by which to judge anyone, klingon or otherwise. Maybe you should follow the story of his brother Kurn, instead.
Also, yes, Worf was a blood traitor by klingon standards. The House of Mogh was unsalvageable because of it, its why he joined the house of Martok instead of re-establishing it.
Worf was a special case. He had ties to the High Council, multiple Klingon Chancellors, had a secret pact with said High Council as the official Klingon fall guy for Khitomer and was a member of multiple noble houses, Mogh then Martok. In short he was a Klingon Mary Sue and is not a standard by which to judge anyone, klingon or otherwise. Maybe you should follow the story of his brother Kurn, instead.
Also, yes, Worf was a blood traitor by klingon standards. The House of Mogh was unsalvageable because of it, its why he joined the house of Martok instead of re-establishing it.
Long before Worf became the official "fall guy" to hold the Empire together he wore a sash adorned with a House emblem. Who is to say your character wouldn't have ties to a House or the High Council?
Your logic doesn't work in this case.
Honestly you need to present a more reasonable case because at the moment you just sound like someone screaming "Noooo!! It's mine they can't have it!"
Since this thread got kicked off the front pages relatively quickly, I'm going to give it a bump. I'd like to see more in this debate for/against sashes for Federation Klingons.
Bottom line for me: I fail to see how playing a custom "Alien" Klingon looks or feels different.
Playing a Starfleet Orion or Klingon Vulcan would "feel" different even without unique cosmetics because they have active racial traits.
Klingons have passives and passives similar in nature to what you can get with custom "Alien" traits. You won't really "feel" the difference except when you or another player do an inspect on your Klingon and see the word "Klingon" instead of "Alien".
If Cryptic takes Klingon traits out of the custom editor, they diminish a lot of fun or interesting choices. Taking Klingons out of the custom option is a bad idea.
Giving Starfleet Klingons some unique visual is a better idea. If not a sash then maybe a tweaked "Starfleet uniform deco" version of the gauntlets and shoulderpads look. A hybrid of Starfleet sensibility and battle armor. Or maybe just give Fed Klingons full access to both sets of uniforms.
Then maybe introduce "Marquis Defector" captains for the Klingons who have sided with the Klingons, who have promised them the return of the Badlands from the treacherous cowards in the Cardassian and Federation factions. A Marquis could also theoretically have access to a choice of Klingon or Starfleet uniforms.
I'm all for more options and diversity. I'm not against having Klingon parts in the "alien" setup. I just had some extra cpoints so i grabbed the Klingon race and was sad when I couldn't add a sash to the costume.
A klingon Sash signifies membership in a Noble House. A Klingon fighting for the enemy during a time of war is a blood traitor, and would suffer discommendation. Federation Klingons have no need for the sashes as they cannot be members of functioning noble houses.
^this^
Canonically, when the Federation and the Empire are gearing up for war (and apparently have been for a while), Federation Klingons would not be wearing sashes, whether it's because the Empire doesn't award them to blood traitors or because the character himself chose not to wear it (because he is a member of the Federation and pledged to fight his people). I just don't see it.
That being said, I did argue for the colorful weapons too... so that might not work so well.
And if you're a traitor under these circumstances, I'd think you'd refuse to recognize your own dishonor and choose to view the EMPIRE as the dishonorable cowards and refuse to recognize their authority on issues like honor the way Worf did.
I made a Federation Klingon Tac officer specialized for melee combat for some bat'leth fun. While creating him I realized and was quite sad to find that there was no option for the sash like Worf wore.
So, fellow Klingon Outcasts! Let me hear your support if you want to have your sash as part of your uniform, adorned with a house insignia and all.
Qapla'!
Wearing the baldric would denote some kind of loyalty to the Klingon Empire. Since these are times of war, that would not make much sense.
And if you're a traitor under these circumstances, I'd think you'd refuse to recognize your own dishonor and choose to view the EMPIRE as the dishonorable cowards and refuse to recognize their authority on issues like honor the way Worf did.
Wholeheartedly agree. Just because you fight under another banner for your own reasons or beliefs doesn't necessarily make you a traitor. Also I believe that it makes sense for a Klingon "turncoat" as it were to show pride in their culture if they're fighting against their people to restore it to what they think it should be.
As we have all seen, Klingon politics are not as cut and dry and honorable as one would like to believe. Just because you fight against your own people doesn't mean you don't respect or honor them. But it could mean you disagree with their current path.
Wearing the baldric would denote some kind of loyalty to the Klingon Empire. Since these are times of war, that would not make much sense.
:cool:
Not quite. It could show respect for one's heritage and House. Worf said on many occasions he was a Starfleet officer first. Yes he was "dishonored" but he still believed in his people, his father's innocence, and a better way for the Klingon Empire.
Wholeheartedly agree. Just because you fight under another banner for your own reasons or beliefs doesn't necessarily make you a traitor. Also I believe that it makes sense for a Klingon "turncoat" as it were to show pride in their culture if they're fighting against their people to restore it to what they think it should be.
As we have all seen, Klingon politics are not as cut and dry and honorable as one would like to believe. Just because you fight against your own people doesn't mean you don't respect or honor them. But it could mean you disagree with their current path.
Particularly since not all Fed Klingons would necessarily be a Worf-type who respect the Empire's leadership but would likely have a chance to be Martok loyalists.
Martok was not afraid to call out leadership, to the death, and disagree with their notions of honor. He inspired Worf to stop respecting every decision the Empire made about honor or dishonor and attempted to subvert the idea that the Empire gets to decide what's honorable.
With Martok dead at the hands of the current leader, I'd think there's a very good chance (as an option anyway) that a Starfleet Klingon might have felt that serving Starfleet was the more honorable path and that remaining loyal to the Empire was dishonorable, particularly when the approach after Martok became one where the Empire attacked weakened enemies like the Romulans.
In that scenario, you might want to to flaunt your contempt for the empire and belief that true Klingons oppose the Empire with your sash.
Worf might not wear a sash under the current circumstances but I think we're seeing a scenario where someone closer to Martok might join Starfleet and wear the sash as a means of flaunting the idea that you believe you are a true Klingon and the Empire's loyalists are the traitors.
I made a Federation Klingon Tac officer specialized for melee combat for some bat'leth fun. While creating him I realized and was quite sad to find that there was no option for the sash like Worf wore.
So, fellow Klingon Outcasts! Let me hear your support if you want to have your sash as part of your uniform, adorned with a house insignia and all.
Qapla'!
you can get a sash, tho not the same as Worfs, from a tailor on Gandala Station. got one last night, and there are 3 diff styles
Particularly since not all Fed Klingons would necessarily be a Worf-type who respect the Empire's leadership but would likely have a chance to be Martok loyalists.
Martok was not afraid to call out leadership, to the death, and disagree with their notions of honor. He inspired Worf to stop respecting every decision the Empire made about honor or dishonor and attempted to subvert the idea that the Empire gets to decide what's honorable.
With Martok dead at the hands of the current leader, I'd think there's a very good chance (as an option anyway) that a Starfleet Klingon might have felt that serving Starfleet was the more honorable path and that remaining loyal to the Empire was dishonorable, particularly when the approach after Martok became one where the Empire attacked weakened enemies like the Romulans.
In that scenario, you might want to to flaunt your contempt for the empire and belief that true Klingons oppose the Empire with your sash.
Worf might not wear a sash under the current circumstances but I think we're seeing a scenario where someone closer to Martok might join Starfleet and wear the sash as a means of flaunting the idea that you believe you are a true Klingon and the Empire's loyalists are the traitors.
Comments
Ie. are Bat'leths Klingon race exclusive? Do they get any extra costume options? I've been trying to find out all week.
IMHO, if the sash (admittedly a 3D asset that may be intensive to design for multiple uniforms) is too much, I'd at least like to see them get a hybridized Klingon/Federation uniform. Y'know, a mix of combadge and shoulderpads or the option to use Klingon boots and gauntlets or something. I just can't see dropping the CP otherwise since the racials are passive and I can get Klingon-like racials and a perfectly Klingon appearance as an unknown "Alien".
However there are no additional options for Federation Klingons that I saw. Whatever uniforms you've got are the choices available.
Easy there. A Klingon has the right to have his sash, regardless of faction, I say.
LCMR KE Lindemann
Captain
USS Bismarck NCC 91941
Battle Squadron 11
A klingon Sash signifies membership in a Noble House. A Klingon fighting for the enemy during a time of war is a blood traitor, and would suffer discommendation. Federation Klingons have no need for the sashes as they cannot be members of functioning noble houses.
I'm all for some more melee weapon options. My main motivation behind my Klingon character is it made more sense to have one wielding a bat'leth and be better trained it.
My traits wound up being:
Honorable
Warrior
Lucky
Peak Health
They really need to add Federation melee weapons soon. I'd like to see the Lirpa, Ushaan-tor, maybe some human melee weapons, in particular a Katana.
Also, they need to add the Mek'leth and some of the Klingon daggers for the Klingon faction.
I don't really see some Klingons following in the footsteps of the Kuvah-magh as being traitors. Hopefully, that would count for something.
A blood traitor? Was Worf TRULY a blood traitor? No.
It's entirely possible the Klingons in question disagreed with the reasoning for war or had their House fall out of favor with the High Council for one of any number of political reasons.
Wearing the sash honors your ancestry and your family. They have every right to be proud of those things, regardless of their standing in Klingon society.
Worf wore his sash while dishonored.
And he was raised by humans, for that matter, in addition to coming from a house that was dishonored more than once.
Worf was a special case. He had ties to the High Council, multiple Klingon Chancellors, had a secret pact with said High Council as the official Klingon fall guy for Khitomer and was a member of multiple noble houses, Mogh then Martok. In short he was a Klingon Mary Sue and is not a standard by which to judge anyone, klingon or otherwise. Maybe you should follow the story of his brother Kurn, instead.
Also, yes, Worf was a blood traitor by klingon standards. The House of Mogh was unsalvageable because of it, its why he joined the house of Martok instead of re-establishing it.
Long before Worf became the official "fall guy" to hold the Empire together he wore a sash adorned with a House emblem. Who is to say your character wouldn't have ties to a House or the High Council?
Your logic doesn't work in this case.
Honestly you need to present a more reasonable case because at the moment you just sound like someone screaming "Noooo!! It's mine they can't have it!"
Playing a Starfleet Orion or Klingon Vulcan would "feel" different even without unique cosmetics because they have active racial traits.
Klingons have passives and passives similar in nature to what you can get with custom "Alien" traits. You won't really "feel" the difference except when you or another player do an inspect on your Klingon and see the word "Klingon" instead of "Alien".
If Cryptic takes Klingon traits out of the custom editor, they diminish a lot of fun or interesting choices. Taking Klingons out of the custom option is a bad idea.
Giving Starfleet Klingons some unique visual is a better idea. If not a sash then maybe a tweaked "Starfleet uniform deco" version of the gauntlets and shoulderpads look. A hybrid of Starfleet sensibility and battle armor. Or maybe just give Fed Klingons full access to both sets of uniforms.
Then maybe introduce "Marquis Defector" captains for the Klingons who have sided with the Klingons, who have promised them the return of the Badlands from the treacherous cowards in the Cardassian and Federation factions. A Marquis could also theoretically have access to a choice of Klingon or Starfleet uniforms.
Alts with both sides' costumes could be fun.
But I think the sash makes the most sense.
^this^
Canonically, when the Federation and the Empire are gearing up for war (and apparently have been for a while), Federation Klingons would not be wearing sashes, whether it's because the Empire doesn't award them to blood traitors or because the character himself chose not to wear it (because he is a member of the Federation and pledged to fight his people). I just don't see it.
That being said, I did argue for the colorful weapons too... so that might not work so well.
Wearing the baldric would denote some kind of loyalty to the Klingon Empire. Since these are times of war, that would not make much sense.
:cool:
Wholeheartedly agree. Just because you fight under another banner for your own reasons or beliefs doesn't necessarily make you a traitor. Also I believe that it makes sense for a Klingon "turncoat" as it were to show pride in their culture if they're fighting against their people to restore it to what they think it should be.
As we have all seen, Klingon politics are not as cut and dry and honorable as one would like to believe. Just because you fight against your own people doesn't mean you don't respect or honor them. But it could mean you disagree with their current path.
Not quite. It could show respect for one's heritage and House. Worf said on many occasions he was a Starfleet officer first. Yes he was "dishonored" but he still believed in his people, his father's innocence, and a better way for the Klingon Empire.
He wore a baldric.
Also,
Thank you for the correct term.
Particularly since not all Fed Klingons would necessarily be a Worf-type who respect the Empire's leadership but would likely have a chance to be Martok loyalists.
Martok was not afraid to call out leadership, to the death, and disagree with their notions of honor. He inspired Worf to stop respecting every decision the Empire made about honor or dishonor and attempted to subvert the idea that the Empire gets to decide what's honorable.
With Martok dead at the hands of the current leader, I'd think there's a very good chance (as an option anyway) that a Starfleet Klingon might have felt that serving Starfleet was the more honorable path and that remaining loyal to the Empire was dishonorable, particularly when the approach after Martok became one where the Empire attacked weakened enemies like the Romulans.
In that scenario, you might want to to flaunt your contempt for the empire and belief that true Klingons oppose the Empire with your sash.
Worf might not wear a sash under the current circumstances but I think we're seeing a scenario where someone closer to Martok might join Starfleet and wear the sash as a means of flaunting the idea that you believe you are a true Klingon and the Empire's loyalists are the traitors.
you can get a sash, tho not the same as Worfs, from a tailor on Gandala Station. got one last night, and there are 3 diff styles
An interesting take on it and one I agree with.