Dead at this point imo. I doubt anyone
ANYONE other than ppl who already have, will pay for a half finished game that you cant even lof into without waiting in Q for hours on end
There's a lot of explosions and fires so far, but do you all believe it'll be better by March? What else do you think will have happened by March?
Yes i completely believe its going to be better in march and better in april and better in may... This would be because this is how all MMO's launch.. They will fix it
Yes i completely believe its going to be better in march and better in april and better in may... This would be because this is how all MMO's launch.. They will fix it
apparently thats how O.o Ive seen hopeful ppl before but not THAT blind of faith in the evidence of catastrophic fail
Oh I get it! HA! epic troll
We've seen an example of an A+ IP with very similar performance problems in Age of Conan when it released and look at it now. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same with the customer base here if the game continues in it's current state.
We've seen an example of an A+ IP with very similar performance problems in Age of Conan when it released and look at it now. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect the same with the customer base here if the game continues in it's current state.
AOC's problem was the game was only about 1/3rd finished, ie: they had no content past level 20 or so.
STO is in much better shape than that, although they don't have very much Klingon content except PVP which is a mistake.
STO's problem is a server design that won't scale, and/or code that won't scale to the users they have.
Clearly they need to either delay the release, take it back to beta for a month, work on it, or else open up multiple servers, at least 2-3 US ones, and 2-3 EU ones.
It won't have a subscriber base by March if they can't keep the server running.
Note to the moron: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems, you are indeed an obligatory moron.
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us know this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
I can only hope that over the next few weeks, as the servers die and are slowly improved, that the moron-base of whiny kids like you will cancel and leave the game a much better place. Do you part for humanity, save some carbon credits by using your PC to spout moronic dumbisms and go plant a tree today!
With my foot in one of Atari's Executive's behind.. And, having 30 Corpsmen trying to pull it out at next shareholder meeting. Atari you have Trekkie's as shareholders, remember that. Be prepare to fume our anger at next shareholder meeting if things do not improve.
AOC's problem was the game was only about 1/3rd finished, ie: they had no content past level 20 or so.
STO is in much better shape than that, although they don't have very much Klingon content except PVP which is a mistake.
STO's problem is a server design that won't scale, and/or code that won't scale to the users they have.
Clearly they need to either delay the release, take it back to beta for a month, work on it, or else open up multiple servers, at least 2-3 US ones, and 2-3 EU ones.
And, you have no clue what you're talking about. Stay in school kiddo Learn what a server cluster is, how they're routed, how the token key network works that routes the data between them.
Just because you only see 1 "server" doesn't mean diddly TRIBBLE. A server cluster is comprised of anywhere from 2 to 10,000 servers (google's server cluster is over 40,000 server banks tied into 1). This is the architecture this game is built upon.
And, don't get me started on code. I love it when morons try to sound smart. Code scaling? That's rich bud.
Note to the moron: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems, you are indeed an obligatory moron.
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us know this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
I can only hope that over the next few weeks, as the servers die and are slowly improved, that the moron-base of whiny kids like you will cancel and leave the game a much better place. Do you part for humanity, save some carbon credits by using your PC to spout moronic dumbisms and go plant a tree today!
Flame on, blind fanboi. I'm used to dealing with them. The NGE and SOE still have fanbois, proving that even a pile of excrement, if released to the internet will gather a few dozen fanbois.
I happen to like this game very much. Which is why I paid for a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION. Have you?
I just happen to be justifiably ****ed off that it's down almost as much as it's up.
Flame on, blind fanboi. I'm used to dealing with them. The NGE and SOE still have fanbois, proving that even a pile of excrement, if released to the internet will gather a few dozen fanbois.
I happen to like this game very much. Which is why I paid for a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION. Have you?
I just happen to be justifiably ****ed off that it's down almost as much as it's up.
I'm not a fanboi. I just live in reality. If you seriously thought a new MMO wouldn't be down more than it was up...
And, you have no clue what you're talking about. Stay in school kiddo Learn what a server cluster is, how they're routed, how the token key network works that routes the data between them.
Just because you only see 1 "server" doesn't mean diddly TRIBBLE. A server cluster is comprised of anywhere from 2 to 10,000 servers (google's server cluster is over 40,000 server banks tied into 1). This is the architecture this game is built upon.
And, don't get me started on code. I love it when morons try to sound smart.
I happen to run servers for a living. I am a network and systems engineer and run a WAN and multiple application servers for 20 sites across the Eastern USA.
I know how servers work. Probably much better than YOU do. You design your server based on the load of the application and the number of users you expect to have. Clearly, Cryptic has failed at this, when they had no reason to, given they knew how many beta keys they gave out, and they know how many pre-orders they sold...
You talk like a 16yr old who took a single computer class in votech.
If you knew anything whatsoever about WANs you would know that it takes years to troubleshoot new information systems that have a userbase of 300,000+ users.
Now, given your intimate knowledge on said subject matter, enlighten me. How do you stress test an information system like this?
You know what, I'll tell you. You can't stress test it. Period, end of story. You can load test it to a certain point, like with beta testing here. But you can't get an accurate estimate of stability from a pool of users 1/100th the size expected on actual launch day. In the corporate world, we go about these things by months and months of incremental load testing and debugging while using automated error checking tools and the like. Still, MMOs are unique in the tech world and their issues don't really translate well into corporate language.
This is because MMOs route users from all over the world into 1, sometimes multiple, but usually 1 local server bank. Some games like WoW use micro clusters of "servers" to house 1 game server. This game is more like EVE which utilizes hundreds of blade servers housed in racks to cluster into a singular visible server to the end users.
The problem with these types of servers is that increased load can drain the entire cluster. So, if the login queues are slow, the cluster usually will route bandwidth from say, certain operational servers (IE, in STO the zone servers) to cover for the failing login servers.
What you get now, is somewhat laggy login coupled with extremely slow load times in the game world itself. The cluster will continue routing data until the bottleneck is resolved, or, in cases like we are experiencing, it will get worse and worse until the load limits are exceeded and things start rebooting.
Now, what causes this? I seriously doubt it is a hardware limitation as far as load is concerned. What is more likely are faulty switches or bad cabling...config problems etc. Problems like these won't crop up in beta for MMOs because beta loads simply don't tax a large information system that MMOs run on to a degree to cause degredation to this extent. This is why most MMOs in the first few days fail. There is just no way to tell if you have a bad switch or a bad blade server until it is actually switched on and used. Then, if one or two key components fail, you start getting what I described above.
Now, one more prediction from me: I am willing to bet that right now, Cryptic is still running a background debugger that is slowing the system down. Things like this are usually removed on launch day, but right now they are heuristically scanning and checking their system. It sucks for us, but in the end, processes like this will tell them where their vulnerabilities are so they can try and remedy them for launch day upcoming.
Ya it is a shame that the consumers are asking for the product they paid for...
Xlyander needs to get a life. It is NOT unreasonable to ask for a finished product. Just because companies are lazy, good for nothing greedy *******s doesn't make it "ok" for them to be that way. MMO's is one of the only industries where consumers rights go out the window...and whats worse is it justified by all the fanbois who love to think they know more then everyone else out there.
The problem with STO is nothing short of greedy business men in suits not giving a **** about who PAYING THEM TO BE RICH. They try to skirt by with a launch while spending as little money as possible for a semi-stable release, then just for good measure reducing the funding even more.
I dont blame the developers. No dev wants to release a **** product with there name on it (unless is SOE of course). In fact for the most part the game is great. No its the publisher that needs to get off there TRIBBLE and allow Cryptic to spend the money on better hardware, take more time to iron out bugs, and prepare for a solid launch.
Oh and by the way Xylander... YOU are the ****ing moron.
Closed beta was to fix bugs, Open beta was to fix more bugs and stress test the hardware....the 4 days of headstart are NOT to do any of this ****ing ****. And if you think anything will be better by Tuesday you are horribly mistaken TRIBBLE. IF WILL ONLY BE WORSE!!!!!!!!!! Of course you failed basic math in school if you cant realize that there will be more people flooding the servers on Tuesday, then EVEN MORE on the 5th when international sales open. This my friend is the best it wil be for weeks or months to come.
AND JUST BECAUSE IT ALWAYS HAPPENS DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT SO STOP USING THAT BS EXCUSE.
People back pre-civil war used that excuse when people began asking why slavery was ok "because thats how its always been done"........
Ya it is a shame that the consumers are asking for the product they paid for...
Xlyander needs to get a life. It is NOT unreasonable to ask for a finished product. Just because companies are lazy, good for nothing greedy *******s doesn't make it "ok" for them to be that way. MMO's is one of the only industries where consumers rights go out the window...and whats worse is it justified by all the fanbois who love to think they know more then everyone else out there.
The problem with STO is nothing short of greedy business men in suits not giving a **** about who PAYING THEM TO BE RICH. They try to skirt by with a launch while spending as little money as possible for a semi-stable release, then just for good measure reducing the funding even more.
I dont blame the developers. No dev wants to release a **** product with there name on it (unless is SOE of course). In fact for the most part the game is great. No its the publisher that needs to get off there TRIBBLE and allow Cryptic to spend the money on better hardware, take more time to iron out bugs, and prepare for a solid launch.
Note: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems...
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us knew this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
Note: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems...
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us knew this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
Note: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems...
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us knew this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
Ok i've read every one of your posts here Xylander and i am sick and tired of your self important bs.
Just who the hell do you think you are?
"Every MMO has extensive downtime"?, no **** sherlock, its part of the MMO parody that the servers go down alot in the first few days/weeks, we get that so dont use it as a arguement. What we dont get is a veteran MMO company like Crypic TRIBBLE the pooch on a liscence that they KNEW was going to generate alot of players.
If they had even considered for one micron of a second of the number of players, fans or not, who would scramble to this game for whatever reason, they'd be ready for it.
And before you open your mouth about me being some kid, or someone with no experience off MMO's out, or the lovely insults you've thrown at people who dont agree with you, here is some reading for you..
I am a veteran of Dark Ages, Star Wars Galaxies, City Of Heros, World of Warcraft and Age of Conan, i took part in the Closed Beta and Open Beta on Galaxies AND Age of Conan and the early start on Star Wars Galaxies (given to Closed Beta testers for the hell we went through) and Age of Conan.
NONE of these games had the lackluster start that Star Trek Online has had, in Beta for Galaxies we went down for 2 months!, when it came back it was running smoother, still had its issues. Conan was the same, come early start for Galaxies, servers were up 20 hours a day with 4 hours of downtime, Conan was the same after a single day of stop-starts.
Come release for Conan there were issues with server loads, these were fixed in EARLY ACCESS within a day. World of Warcraft had a week of issues due to it being the first MMO title for that developer.
In Star Trek Online, we've had server issues, crashes and downtime during the open beta (and i am sure during the closed beta), but the big difference is that the other titles didnt have as many massive issues as this game has got, so close to store release...This is unacceptable for a veteran MMO developer like Cryptic.
We're officially (by date) only 3 days into the early start program, and already things have gone from bad to worse when it comes to the servers stability.
Are people angry about that? You bet your backside they are.
Are people angry at the lack of communication from the Developers/Mods? You bet your backside they are!
And are people sick and tired of folks like you putting them down for sharing they're opinions and feeling?
You bet your backside they are!
Alot of folks here have pre-paid for a product that isnt ready for launch, no matter which way you slice it people have the right to be angry. Those who've paid for lifetime subscriptions to this game want to to work, those who've paid for twelve month subscriptions want it to work, and those who have paid just for the game itself want it to work...
The only things we dont want are to be left in the dark about the current state of the game....and to be told by people like you that "all MMO's are like this" when clearly, many have not been.
Thats all from this tired old man, sick of little kids telling others what to think and do....
Comments
It won't have a subscriber base by March if they can't keep the server running.
ANYONE other than ppl who already have, will pay for a half finished game that you cant even lof into without waiting in Q for hours on end
Yes i completely believe its going to be better in march and better in april and better in may... This would be because this is how all MMO's launch.. They will fix it
apparently thats how O.o Ive seen hopeful ppl before but not THAT blind of faith in the evidence of catastrophic fail
Oh I get it! HA! epic troll
Obviously the forums work like the queue.
Hey know what's more awesome than a queue?
a broken queue! that only goes up or kicks you out repeatedly only to get back in to even higher numbers.
Catastrophic failure doesn't even begin to describe what this game is.
How did you manage to post that reply before the op posted themselves...
I see me at position 600 in the queue from 1000 if I am being optimistic.
I see crashes daily with nothing but streams of complaints in the forums.
I see a steady decline of players over the next 30 days and then a sudden drop
I see the servers eventually finding a balance point where enough people have left that it remains stable
I see the server and game shutting because Cryptic pull the plug due to lack of subscribers
Finally, I see the death of any chance of an STO MMO being made for several years
AOC's problem was the game was only about 1/3rd finished, ie: they had no content past level 20 or so.
STO is in much better shape than that, although they don't have very much Klingon content except PVP which is a mistake.
STO's problem is a server design that won't scale, and/or code that won't scale to the users they have.
Clearly they need to either delay the release, take it back to beta for a month, work on it, or else open up multiple servers, at least 2-3 US ones, and 2-3 EU ones.
Note to the moron: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems, you are indeed an obligatory moron.
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us know this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
I can only hope that over the next few weeks, as the servers die and are slowly improved, that the moron-base of whiny kids like you will cancel and leave the game a much better place. Do you part for humanity, save some carbon credits by using your PC to spout moronic dumbisms and go plant a tree today!
And, you have no clue what you're talking about. Stay in school kiddo
Just because you only see 1 "server" doesn't mean diddly TRIBBLE. A server cluster is comprised of anywhere from 2 to 10,000 servers (google's server cluster is over 40,000 server banks tied into 1). This is the architecture this game is built upon.
And, don't get me started on code. I love it when morons try to sound smart. Code scaling? That's rich bud.
Flame on, blind fanboi. I'm used to dealing with them. The NGE and SOE still have fanbois, proving that even a pile of excrement, if released to the internet will gather a few dozen fanbois.
I happen to like this game very much. Which is why I paid for a LIFETIME SUBSCRIPTION. Have you?
I just happen to be justifiably ****ed off that it's down almost as much as it's up.
I'm not a fanboi. I just live in reality. If you seriously thought a new MMO wouldn't be down more than it was up...
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Dionaea
I happen to run servers for a living. I am a network and systems engineer and run a WAN and multiple application servers for 20 sites across the Eastern USA.
I know how servers work. Probably much better than YOU do. You design your server based on the load of the application and the number of users you expect to have. Clearly, Cryptic has failed at this, when they had no reason to, given they knew how many beta keys they gave out, and they know how many pre-orders they sold...
Maybe they should hire me?
Awwwww, how sad for them that customers are actually asking them to stay on the ball.
You talk like a 16yr old who took a single computer class in votech.
If you knew anything whatsoever about WANs you would know that it takes years to troubleshoot new information systems that have a userbase of 300,000+ users.
Now, given your intimate knowledge on said subject matter, enlighten me. How do you stress test an information system like this?
You know what, I'll tell you. You can't stress test it. Period, end of story. You can load test it to a certain point, like with beta testing here. But you can't get an accurate estimate of stability from a pool of users 1/100th the size expected on actual launch day. In the corporate world, we go about these things by months and months of incremental load testing and debugging while using automated error checking tools and the like. Still, MMOs are unique in the tech world and their issues don't really translate well into corporate language.
This is because MMOs route users from all over the world into 1, sometimes multiple, but usually 1 local server bank. Some games like WoW use micro clusters of "servers" to house 1 game server. This game is more like EVE which utilizes hundreds of blade servers housed in racks to cluster into a singular visible server to the end users.
The problem with these types of servers is that increased load can drain the entire cluster. So, if the login queues are slow, the cluster usually will route bandwidth from say, certain operational servers (IE, in STO the zone servers) to cover for the failing login servers.
What you get now, is somewhat laggy login coupled with extremely slow load times in the game world itself. The cluster will continue routing data until the bottleneck is resolved, or, in cases like we are experiencing, it will get worse and worse until the load limits are exceeded and things start rebooting.
Now, what causes this? I seriously doubt it is a hardware limitation as far as load is concerned. What is more likely are faulty switches or bad cabling...config problems etc. Problems like these won't crop up in beta for MMOs because beta loads simply don't tax a large information system that MMOs run on to a degree to cause degredation to this extent. This is why most MMOs in the first few days fail. There is just no way to tell if you have a bad switch or a bad blade server until it is actually switched on and used. Then, if one or two key components fail, you start getting what I described above.
Now, one more prediction from me: I am willing to bet that right now, Cryptic is still running a background debugger that is slowing the system down. Things like this are usually removed on launch day, but right now they are heuristically scanning and checking their system. It sucks for us, but in the end, processes like this will tell them where their vulnerabilities are so they can try and remedy them for launch day upcoming.
Xlyander needs to get a life. It is NOT unreasonable to ask for a finished product. Just because companies are lazy, good for nothing greedy *******s doesn't make it "ok" for them to be that way. MMO's is one of the only industries where consumers rights go out the window...and whats worse is it justified by all the fanbois who love to think they know more then everyone else out there.
The problem with STO is nothing short of greedy business men in suits not giving a **** about who PAYING THEM TO BE RICH. They try to skirt by with a launch while spending as little money as possible for a semi-stable release, then just for good measure reducing the funding even more.
I dont blame the developers. No dev wants to release a **** product with there name on it (unless is SOE of course). In fact for the most part the game is great. No its the publisher that needs to get off there TRIBBLE and allow Cryptic to spend the money on better hardware, take more time to iron out bugs, and prepare for a solid launch.
Oh and by the way Xylander... YOU are the ****ing moron.
Closed beta was to fix bugs, Open beta was to fix more bugs and stress test the hardware....the 4 days of headstart are NOT to do any of this ****ing ****. And if you think anything will be better by Tuesday you are horribly mistaken TRIBBLE. IF WILL ONLY BE WORSE!!!!!!!!!! Of course you failed basic math in school if you cant realize that there will be more people flooding the servers on Tuesday, then EVEN MORE on the 5th when international sales open. This my friend is the best it wil be for weeks or months to come.
AND JUST BECAUSE IT ALWAYS HAPPENS DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT SO STOP USING THAT BS EXCUSE.
People back pre-civil war used that excuse when people began asking why slavery was ok "because thats how its always been done"........
suck it.
245 of 1054
Note: Launch isn't until Tuesday. If you actually thought buying a preorder/pre-release headstart program and actually thought it wouldn't have problems...
Every MMO has extensive downtime the first 2 months after release. Most of us knew this when we bought the game and signed up for this headstart.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Dionaea
I see this person has great powers of observation and can truly see the future. :eek:
good job an learning how to copy paste. go pick up your fanboi check and leave the real players here alone. thanks bye.
the above seems likely
Ok i've read every one of your posts here Xylander and i am sick and tired of your self important bs.
Just who the hell do you think you are?
"Every MMO has extensive downtime"?, no **** sherlock, its part of the MMO parody that the servers go down alot in the first few days/weeks, we get that so dont use it as a arguement. What we dont get is a veteran MMO company like Crypic TRIBBLE the pooch on a liscence that they KNEW was going to generate alot of players.
If they had even considered for one micron of a second of the number of players, fans or not, who would scramble to this game for whatever reason, they'd be ready for it.
And before you open your mouth about me being some kid, or someone with no experience off MMO's out, or the lovely insults you've thrown at people who dont agree with you, here is some reading for you..
I am a veteran of Dark Ages, Star Wars Galaxies, City Of Heros, World of Warcraft and Age of Conan, i took part in the Closed Beta and Open Beta on Galaxies AND Age of Conan and the early start on Star Wars Galaxies (given to Closed Beta testers for the hell we went through) and Age of Conan.
NONE of these games had the lackluster start that Star Trek Online has had, in Beta for Galaxies we went down for 2 months!, when it came back it was running smoother, still had its issues. Conan was the same, come early start for Galaxies, servers were up 20 hours a day with 4 hours of downtime, Conan was the same after a single day of stop-starts.
Come release for Conan there were issues with server loads, these were fixed in EARLY ACCESS within a day. World of Warcraft had a week of issues due to it being the first MMO title for that developer.
In Star Trek Online, we've had server issues, crashes and downtime during the open beta (and i am sure during the closed beta), but the big difference is that the other titles didnt have as many massive issues as this game has got, so close to store release...This is unacceptable for a veteran MMO developer like Cryptic.
We're officially (by date) only 3 days into the early start program, and already things have gone from bad to worse when it comes to the servers stability.
Are people angry about that? You bet your backside they are.
Are people angry at the lack of communication from the Developers/Mods? You bet your backside they are!
And are people sick and tired of folks like you putting them down for sharing they're opinions and feeling?
You bet your backside they are!
Alot of folks here have pre-paid for a product that isnt ready for launch, no matter which way you slice it people have the right to be angry. Those who've paid for lifetime subscriptions to this game want to to work, those who've paid for twelve month subscriptions want it to work, and those who have paid just for the game itself want it to work...
The only things we dont want are to be left in the dark about the current state of the game....and to be told by people like you that "all MMO's are like this" when clearly, many have not been.
Thats all from this tired old man, sick of little kids telling others what to think and do....
Oh, and 846 of 1866....god i feel old...
432567854245 out of 54098723976238650645
/nod
This is getting into silly territory now.
And i kind of fear for Cryptic lol